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[JC06]

Thank you stellajane...yet again that is much more information/advice than i have been given by any of the doctors i have seen through this new experience   
I've seen comments about taking these tablets vaginally rather than orally...Is that a better option? Whichever way limits the "down" effect of the progesterone would suit me better as I always seem more like myself for the first 2 weeks on the patches
Thanks

[JC06]

Food for thought...thank you for your advice. I really appreciate it. I feel like it's been an ongoing battle, with availability of patches & lack of GP knowledge, to get me through the last couple of years. Just when I feel things are settling the availability curveball reappears. Will see how I get on with gel & tablets & keep an ear out for patches coming back into circulation. My husband has suggested I go cold turkey until patches are available but not sure that's a good idea during lockdown. 

[JC06]

That's settled it....2 pumps it is 

[heavenlyblue]

Heavenlyblue it could have been me that wrote that last post! I sympathise with everything you said and feel exactly the same. Its such a struggle to find out what is the best thing to do!

I'm 63 and since last October when I saw a gynaecologist at my local Menopause clinic have been using 2 pumps estrogel, 100mg Utrogestan daily at night and use 1 pump Tostran gel every 3rd night. I haven't felt well for a long time (I have no major illness though) and thought HRT might do the trick to restore my get up and go but my bones and muscles seem to ache more - especially my hips, knees and feet, my anxiety hasn't gone, I am tired and achy, have breast pain, reflux and generally feel like my body is seizing up!
The only positive thing I can say for HRT is the hot flushes which were a nightmare have gone now, and a slight improvement with VA (am on Vagifem every 3rd night for that too).

I haven't had a hormone level test done as he didn't suggest it, but am thinking of getting one done privately and paying for it just to see if it is my levels or just that I feel rubbish anyway! I agree with you about reading stories of HRT miracles and wish I felt like that too!! I have tried increasing gel dose to 3 pumps on his suggestion but that made my breasts even more sore and he said maybe that was too much for me. Have thought about just stopping everything but unsure of what to do for the best.

Thank you Hurdity for your advice on the Utrogestan, I'm wondering if I am intolerant?

Yes, the world is crazily scary just now and it is very hard not to worry about how it will all be in the future, it's nice to be able to discuss our worries on here and share stories. I wish everyone the very best to stay safe and well and let's keep talking! xxx

Thank you so much for replying.  Apologies for my delay in coming back on here, have not been feeling very well.

My hot flushes have rapidly decreased and I only get the occasional migraine so I have to be happy with that!  But it's the exhaustion and the aching joints, I feel about 100 when I wake up in the morning! 

I am going to take another hormone test in about a week and the results will be emailed to my private doc.

I may change where I put the gel, it's on outer thighs at the moment.  I also need to try only taking Utrogestan for only 2 weeks of the month and doubling up with it the other 2 weeks.  Need to see if I feel any different.  Just feel frustrated, it's been 3 1/2 years since symptoms started, I thought I would be sorted by now, especially as I am now going private.  I guess I still have to be patient.

I wish you improved symptoms and hope that things get better for you, whichever course of action you decide to take x

[heavenlyblue]

heavenly blue

have you tried applying gel to outer arms

i used to use on my inner thighs but didn't obsorb took a break as felt awful this time round 9 weeks now i apply on outer arms and although my arms have fatterned up a bit from the gel i?m obsorbing loads better 435 pmol as opposed to 113 pmol on inner thighs x

Thank you for replying.  I did start with outer arms when I was on 3 pumps but my first hormone results did not improve so I went to 4 x pumps & swapped to outer thighs.  I will be doing another hormone test in a week, be interesting to see if the extra pump has improved my levels at all, even though my exhaustion and aching joints are still bad.

[Hurdity]

Hi heavenlyblue

Sorry to hear you're feeling rough. I can't remember your story completely but could you try going completely to cyclical Utrogestan rather than 100 mg for half the month and 200 mg for the rest, to see how you feel once you've got it out of your system? (Unless you have endometriosis that is in which case you probably do need it all the time).

Also have you had thyroid tests and could it be testosterone you need depending on your age?

Hurdity x

[Julia Dizzy]

Hi heavenly blue, sorry to hear you've not been well, hope you will be soon improving and feeling a bit better as time goes on? Its just horrible feeling crappy most of the time! HRT is the only thing that gets rid of my hot flushes too, although some mornings I still wake up and think oh-oh I'm having a mild flush and no, they've not gone yet, but then don't have any more for the rest of the day? Weird!
It definitely isn't a quick miracle cure, I'm now 7 months down the line and still hopeful. I decided to stick with the HRT and see how it goes. My follow up Meno clinic appointment with my local BMI hospital was for June but that has now been cancelled of course, so will have to stick with it.

We can only try different places to apply the gel, I've used outer arms and inner thighs so far but still don't know which is best? I've stopped the Tostran gel as was getting more hairs on my face??!!

Can anyone advise which patch is equivalent to my regime of 2 pumps estrogel and 100mg Utrogestan daily? My consultant initially suggested FemSeven conti, but I know they are not yet available until quarter 4 2020. I would like to try patches whenever I can to see if there's a difference?
Thanks xx

[Nairn]

Hi all, just a wee update from me.  I tried and failed miserably on the utrogestan/estrogel combo - felt absolutely terrible most of the time and everything was dry, huge water retention, migraines and slightly crazy & very emotional - really disappointed as I had hope that this would be the gold standard for me as it works well for so many ladies.  Gave it nearly 5 months, supported by lovely meno consultant, trying to avoid tablets due to the health risk, however Meno was worse so had to have help and mirena previously tried and failed.  Changed 2.5  months ago to femoston conti (different prog) on the higher dose and an amazing difference - feel so much better,  still not enough oestrogen so also taking vagifem daily supplemented by YES daily water based moisturiser (in the little tubes).  Hope that is useful information

[tbett]

I have posted on this thread before and just trying to fine tune things! I am 45, peri, got osteoporosis, on two pumps oestrogel and was on 200mg utrogestan prog day 14-25, felt like an exhausted anxious lunatic with the prog phase so changed to vaginally, managed a few days like that but still struggled so reduced dose to 100mg this month. When taking the utro orally I didn't bleed but I have had 3 day bleed with last two cycles when taking vaginally. I have noticed acne with the prog phase this month and my VA has got worse. Hot flushes controlled, energy up and down, libido poor. Is the acne to do with the utro? Is it a high enough dose? The hrt nurse didn't want me to take it vaginally as unlicensed. The endocrinologist who I see for the osteoporosis said fiddle around but didn't know much about it herself!
Considering seeing Tim Hillard privately as hrt clinic nurse is lovely but won't go off licence.
Anyone seen him or know of him?
I have always been prog sensitive in the past. Any other thoughts appreciated

[Pinksara]

Good morning everyone- it's been a while and a host of different 'treatments? since I last posted 🥴

I would be really grateful is anyone could help/share their experiences. I have been on 2 pumps of Estrogel for around three months now and it has been great for sorting out my foggy head and the night time flushes; hence sleeping MUCH better!

However over the last couple of weeks I have bloated up BIG TIME! Major discomfort, trapped gas, gas pains in my back, generally feeling really bloated and yuk. Any advice to help with this? I've just ordered some peppermint oil capsules and some probiotics capsules as I really don't want to come off Estrogel and go back to no sleep 😞

Thanks in advance

[itsmejojo]

Hello again!
I've been referred to Oxford Menopause Clinic by my GP due to heavy withdrawal bleeds, return of symptoms and non existent libido.  After first phone apt back in March I was advised to continue on 4 pumps of Oestrogel (patches not available) and switch to continuous Utrogestan in order to stop bleeds. This didn't go well, irregular bleeding was awful so reverted back to cyclical regime. My next apt is 24 June, in the meantime I've had blood tests and results sent to Menopause Clinic. Readings were Serum oestradiol 340, SHBG 52, Testosterone 0.9.  Can anyone relate to these? Is 340 considered low if on 4 pumps? Is 0.9 a low testosterone level? Really fed up, my HRT journey had been mostly great for 12 months but in the last 6 months it feels like the wheels are falling off again! Also had ACL reconstruction surgery in November last year and rehab has been tough. 😤

[Katia]

Cassie, why only 60?  When I saw the meno specialist he said he had women in hrt way in their 80s

[Brenda Shalvey]

Hello! I am brand new to Menopause Matters and sooo relieved to find that there is a special estrogel support group as I am having real problems getting the levels right and pretty much zero support from my GP to guide me. I am currently on 5 pumps of estrogel a day (2 in the morning and 3 a night) which I know is already higher than the average 2-4 pumps a day. However, my husband is constantly telling me I look tired and so I was considering stepping up the levels - possibly 6 or more. I was wondering if anyone out there is on the above average levels of oestrogen and, if so, what their experiences are? Would also love to know what kind of advice/support you get from your GP when changing levels. Thanks so much and look forward to hearing from you!!

[sheila99]

What symptoms do you have apart from tiredness? There are many causes of tiredness and if that is your only symptom it may have nothing to do with meno. As you say 5 pumps is already a high dose, I'm not sure it's a good idea to increase further without the support of you doc. Perhaps ask for a referral to a menopause clinic so you can see a specialist? What progesterone do you use and is it continues or cyclical? Utrogestan is well known for causing tiredness.

[Ali51]

Hi I'm new on here and hoping someone will be able to help. Quick background: started HRT patches (estrodot) in jan and after 3 months, tests showed I'd not been absorbing much oestrogen (hadn't felt much symptom relief) so was swapped to oestrogel and ultrogestan. Been taking 2 pumps for a month and just introduced the ultrogestan a week ago (following instructions from gynaecologist) She suggested I could experiment with 3 pumps to see how it felt after the first month so I've had a go. Felt pretty jangly yesterday so tried with just an extra half today. The problem is I just don't feel right! So far there hasn't been any real uplift in my mood or energy levels, if anything I've been feeling more down and tearful the past few days. Also weird aches and pains I'd hoped would have gone by now haven't.... sometimes wondering if I'm having a heart attack.....my breasts have got bigger and feel tender (especially round the nipples) Am I going through something normal and need to stick at it? I thought I would be back to ?normal? by now but instead I still feel stuck in the grey bog I've been in for months. I thought more oestrogen would help, but initial reaction to increased dose not been particularly great...Has anyone else experienced similar issues and come through the other side? I'm not due a follow up until the end of June, but wondering if I should try for an earlier one?