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Author Topic: utrogestan/estrogel support group  (Read 711123 times)

Ladybt28

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1380 on: October 31, 2018, 03:14:26 PM »

Hi jojo99 - I don't think there is a specific applicator - I use one which came with Canestan thrush meds I bought in Boots.  They include an applicator for the pessaries so I use that.  Most ladies use their finger!  You could ask at a chemist if they have a pessaries applicator that you could have - explain and I am sure they will help.
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Kimdg

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1381 on: October 31, 2018, 03:43:40 PM »

Hi jojo99

I use an applicator that came with YES lubricant.  I tried my fingers but always felt not sure it was high enough. Hope this helps
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Hurdity

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1382 on: October 31, 2018, 08:16:33 PM »

I use my fingers and never had a problem - also have very small hands!

Hurdity x
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Hurdity

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1383 on: October 31, 2018, 08:23:47 PM »

Thank you so much, Hurdity, for the reply.

I did try lowering the dose to 100mg last week. I did 4 days on that, and plummeted into a horrible depression. Scared myself actually because I genuinely felt suicidal. I put the dose back up to 200mg and felt better within 48 hours. I don't know 100% that it was the progesterone drop that caused that, but it certainly tied in time-wise. I keep reading about progesterone causing depression though - can it in fact do the opposite in some women I wonder?!

With regards to breakthrough bleeding, I still have a Mirena (been there 4.5 years) so I wasn't having any bleeding anyway, and I'm still not. In fact I only found out that I was menopausal by mistake - had blood tests done and found that my FSH was high and my estrogen was almost zero. I wasn't having any symptoms at all. I'm 46 by the way.

I just have no idea if what I'm doing is the right thing and I'm worrying myself sick thinking about it all the time, and googling, etc. As the 200mg daily of progesterone is causing no adverse effects I would assume I should keep going with it, BUT I just keep reading everywhere that 200 is the cyclical dose, and I should be taking only 100mg on continuous. I can't help thinking that taking double the dose constantly might have some adverse affect later on or something.

Agh I hate this whole getting older thing  :'(

Whaat - you still have a Mirena AND all that extra progesterone? For HRT purposes Mirena should be changed every 4 years although in practise it will still be giving out some progestogen after that. If this is the case then 200 mg Utro is way too much and I'm surprised you are able to function!! You would be better off changing the Mirena and not taking the utrogestan at all.

One reason for your change in mood after reducing the dose is a typical pmt symptoms and is caused by protgesterone withdrawal. Most women experience this every month as part of pms ( the drop in oestrogen also causes symptoms) - but the progesterone withdrawal is very typical - and can give headaches, irritability, and typical anxiety and tension. However it doesn't mean to say that you need to have progesterone to avoid this. Most of us get progesterone withdrawal symptoms,  - it is like withdrawing from a drug, and once the progesterone has cleared from your system you should feel normal and actually better! In your case the drop from 200 mg to 100 mg could cause similar symptoms and the time frame for your feeling better is about right - and could be nothing to do with the increase again to 200 mg?

By the way when I said far too much  prog I didn't mean it was dangerous! So - summarising - either get the Mirena removed and just take te prog or get it replaced and don't take the utrogestan. If you tolerated the Mirena well then this is your best option as it will protect your womb better and is like continuous progestogen - because it is released continuously - and can be used for contraception and both when yu are perimenopausal or post-menopause so no need to worry about cyclical or continuous regime.

Hurdity x
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lisauk

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1384 on: October 31, 2018, 09:18:07 PM »

The doctor I see for HRT says that we need Progesterone for far more than just protecting the womb - she believes it's imperative for mood and that it's the feel-good hormone. It seems that there are lots of different views, which is terribly confusing. Maybe I'll go back down to 100mg again then  :-\
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Ladybt28

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1385 on: November 01, 2018, 12:40:46 AM »

Hey Hurdity, I'm glad you jumped in and said what I was thinking - a mirena and 200mg progesterone???  I thought it was a lot but after 4.5 years maybe the mirena's not dispensing much progesterone any more?  Dr says "progesterone is a feel good hormone"- I know we need it and we should have balance but I though the oestrogen was the feel good and the testosterone converts to oestrogen (when we are fertile) and provides the energy and get up and go!

lisauk - your body has probably adjusted to all that progesterone and dropping it will cause some sort of withdrawal but then it should balance again.  Like Hurdity says 200mg is not actually dangerous its just those of us who can barely tolerate progesterone at all (and there are a fair few) can't really get our heads round how you can tolerate that much  ;) ;) :lol:  My life would be so much easier if I could tolerate the right amount continuously like I am supposed to take - What is it they say - its like a stock phrase...."I was behind the door when (then you substitute what it is you think someone has got) the tolerance to progesterone... was given out!! - I think you got what I should have had!!

I would say don't get too hung up and worried about what others take or what we are "supposed" to take...lots of us here do a "variation of a theme" when it comes to hrt.  Personally I think that your body will adjust to slightly lower dose and Hurdity is right - try and get that mirena changed and then drop the dose a bit.  I think the generally accepted stance is you need the mirena really for contraception purposes as well as dispensing the progesterone to protect the womb or so they say "just in case" right up past 50.  I knew pretty much I was post meno at 54/55 but my doctor still insisted I needed a mirena or to use condoms!  Better safe than sorry...she said!!! She was sure I didn't want another baby!!!  she said!!!  ...my youngest was 21 this month!! too right I didn't want another baby.  I was traumatised by the first two!
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EnglishRose

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1386 on: November 08, 2018, 02:35:30 PM »

Hi

I have been using Cyclogest (progesterone natural) at 500mg but now at 400mg for many years every day. I have not used oestrogen.

I am one of those women who find Progesterone calming and helps with my sleep however I have hit a low point with physical and mental symptoms so have been advised to come off Cyclogest and start on Estrogel ( I also have Utrogestan 200mg to be taken on day 15)

Blood tests in may showed Oestrogen <18 and FHS 70 so within meno range but I still have cycles.

The prescriber (private) said to gradually reduce Cyclogest which I have already started whilst I am using the above but I am wondering if it would be a much better albeit longer transition to come off Cyclogest before I start with the above as mixing all three I wont know what symptom is caused by what. I was advised to try 1 to 2 pumps.

I reduced my Cyclogest by another 100mg last night and from previous withdrawals it takes approx 2 weeks before I feel the dreaded PMS symptoms so it will take me about 3 months to be totally free from Cyclogest.

I just feel thats the most sensible way to move forwards.

I did apply a pump of Oestrogel last night and all was well but today after the second pump I am experiencing a tight chest and jitters, I feel "stimulated" physically almost like I have taken some drug like speed a bit. Jittery I guess is the word. It passed after five hours

Interestingly I tried everol 25 patch 2 weeks ago and didn't notice anything like I'm having now.
Perhaps start with 1 pump see how I feel ...increase to 1.5 once I'm sure 1 pump not causing side effects and gradually increase (?)

Thing is, I'm due on atm too and this is following the worst month of anxiety stress and depression which as we know cracks up the pms so I've had insomnia a lot these last 2 weeks more than I've ever had in my life...cortisone levels are high possibly.

I'm feeling more rational and calmer now I've had a pelvic exam as my anxiety was linked to health anxiety. I now accept my symptoms although unusual are hormonal and am almost at peace with them for the first time. Started walking my dogs doing a bit of work etc.

I know its VERY early but I am coming off one type of HRT as I am starting something I have never used before and I think it might be all too much and confusing

It's going to be tough enough coming off such a high dose long term Progesterone

Attack one battle at once ?


Thoughts?

Thank You :)
« Last Edit: November 08, 2018, 11:55:57 PM by roseenglish »
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Trufflecat

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1387 on: November 23, 2018, 05:56:30 PM »

Does anyone else feel that a lot of utrogestan leaks out? I insert it at night but by the morning there's a lot of localised dampness as if it's been escaping whilst I'm lying down.
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SueLW

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1388 on: November 23, 2018, 06:01:23 PM »

Does anyone else feel that a lot of utrogestan leaks out? I insert it at night but by the morning there's a lot of localised dampness as if it's been escaping whilst I'm lying down.

I think it's just the remnants of the capsule.  If you push it up as far as you can you will be fine.

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Trufflecat

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1389 on: November 23, 2018, 06:17:25 PM »

OK.  Thanks
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Hurdity

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1390 on: November 24, 2018, 04:26:21 PM »

Does anyone else feel that a lot of utrogestan leaks out? I insert it at night but by the morning there's a lot of localised dampness as if it's been escaping whilst I'm lying down.

It will be the fluid (micronised progesterone in suspension oil) that is leaking out as well as the dissolved outer casing. However a decent amount will have diffused through the cervix and into the uterine cavity overnight where it will do its job. As it is taken daily there is no need to worry about not getting enough - the capsules contain a very high amount for this reason - and are designed to be used orally or vaginally (though in UK only licensed for vaginal use for fertility for some weird reason!).

Hurdity x
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HappyHooker

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1391 on: November 25, 2018, 07:21:20 PM »

Hi folks - forgive me if this appears in the wrong place - I've never posted on a forum before! Have enjoyed reading it though.

My query is if anyone has had an issue with dizziness using oestrogen gel?

I was on FEmaeven Sequi but don't think I was absorbing them - had a month on femoston 1 mg before the HRT clinic agreed to go for gel and utrogestan.

Have been using two pumps of gel for just over a week and am dizzy and a bit queasy. Am having problems working out how much gel equates to what a tablet contained.

I'm 53 - still on cyclical hrt as my own cycle has caused bleeding with combined.

Thoughts welcome!
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Hurdity

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1392 on: November 26, 2018, 06:26:31 PM »

Hi Happyhooker

 :welcomemm:

Not in the wrong place at all although you would be more likely to get replies if you started a new thread either in this section or new members to introduce yourself! However I can try to answer.

It is normal to experience nausea when increasing oestrogen - just like in pregnancy and this should settle once your body has aclimatised to the hormone being added in this way. Maybe you absorb it very well, in which case you could try a lower dose - often the advice with transdermal ( or other HRT) is to start low and slow and gradually build up to the level at which you find best deals with your symptoms overall for most of the time, without side effects.

What were your periods doing in the few months before starting HRT? Were you skipping many and were they few and far between, or were they still more or less regular-ish?

I hope the dizziness and queasiness eases but in terms of the dizziness, if this does not settle do consult your doc.

Hurdity x
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Cath Laycock

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1393 on: December 03, 2018, 10:20:48 PM »

When taking utrogestan vaginally, do you use the oral tablet or the pessary that they have for fertility treatment?
Had PMS always, and now seem to be intolerant to utrogestan orally with my oestrogel. I don't want to risk mirena coil, and I doubt they'd do a hysterectomy.
I really want to try testosterone as well but my GP won't prescribe it.
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Hurdity

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1394 on: December 04, 2018, 04:24:17 PM »

Hi Cath Laycock

Exactly the same product. The oral one is only available now in 100 mg capsules for HRT, but it can be used orally or vaginally - as per the French "base donnees..." their list of medications. It's only in UK that it is not licensed to be used vaginally for HRT for some unfathomable reason since there has been research done about this!!! I have never taken it orally.

Taken vaginally there are fewer metabolites - which are often what cause the side effects, although actually systemic concentration of progesterone itself is greater - according to one research study I saw.

Hurdity x
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