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Author Topic: utrogestan/estrogel support group  (Read 711697 times)

foreign body

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1365 on: October 18, 2018, 06:12:03 AM »

hi Hurdity, yes i am post-menopausal. For months i had wondered whether i was building up a tolerance to estrogel because i was no longer bleeding after the utro cycle and started suffering from menopausal symptoms. The uterine lining scan confirmed it. I also suspect that being very thin has something to do with lower estrogen levels, as this hormone binds with receptors on the surface of fat cells. Fat cells, especially in the abdomen, can store estrogen, which may help increase the effect of the gel in some women.
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Shelby

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1366 on: October 21, 2018, 03:13:15 PM »

Hi I have been taking 200g of Utrogestan and one pump of estrogel for three months as prescribed by doctor. I was supposed to take the Utrogestan for first 14 days of each calendar month. Anyway I never managed the 14 days as I had a bleed each month starting day 10.
Doctor did a review a few weeks ago and increased the estrogel to two pumps, I feelloads better in general on the two pumps, however I took The Utrogestan ( I take it vaginally) for 12 days ( I didn't do the full 14 as trying to avoid a bleed while on holiday next month) .
I finished the Utrogestan 10 days ago but still no bleed ....any idea why this could be? And what should I do next month? I am a bit confused as doctors instructions are not the same as the leaflet in the Utrogestan pack.... I think I am still peri, but hard to know as I have been on several different HRT for the ast three years (I am 53)..
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monsterfromid

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1367 on: October 26, 2018, 06:15:30 PM »

Hello! Used to hang about here but it's been so long I needed to log in all over again. I have questions. I use estrogel (3 pumps). I'd had a Mirena coil in situ for years but wanted to try a more body identical prog so I asked for/was prescribed oral utrogestan 100, to be used continuously unless there were problems then we'd reassess. According to the info on here I CAN use the oral capsules vaginally, so that's exactly what I did last night, using an applicator to get it right up there. Today I've felt terrible. Awful anxiety and exhaustion. Is this normal? Will it get better if i continue with the new regimen? Anxiously awaiting your replies.

I should add that I had the Mirena removed before embarking on the estrogel/ustrogestan voyage.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2018, 06:21:53 PM by monsterfromid »
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SueLW

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1368 on: October 27, 2018, 11:02:16 AM »

According to the info on here I CAN use the oral capsules vaginally, so that's exactly what I did last night, using an applicator to get it right up there. Today I've felt terrible. Awful anxiety and exhaustion. Is this normal? Will it get better if i continue with the new regimen? Anxiously awaiting your replies.

I should add that I had the Mirena removed before embarking on the estrogel/ustrogestan voyage.

Hello

I think that sound pretty much how starting Utrogestan, or any progesterone, felt for me.  Receptors that have been underwhelmed by the hormone for a long time suddenly get overwhelmed.  For me it passed.  I do have to be on enough gel, but you said you use 3 pumps so it's probably going to be OK.  If the symptoms remain for more than a couple of weeks I'd perhaps recommend you increase to 4 pumps and see how you feel.

For now, back off and use the capsules every other night for a week or two and then when symptoms have gone, go back to every night.  You might get some bleeding but plough on regardless. 

I use it vaginally.  I just use my middle finger to push it up high.  Keep on with it even if you bleed.  I keep a box of wet wipes by the bed so that I can insert and then wipe my hands.

The first time I tried Utro I was only on 2 pumps a day, that wasn't enough and the tiredness won out.  I'm on 3.5 now and doing a lot better.
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monsterfromid

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1369 on: October 27, 2018, 10:23:38 PM »

Hi SueLW! Thanks for the reply.
The good news is that I opted to take it orally last night and the change was remarkable. Firstly I slept like a baby when for months beforehand I'd suffered from terrible insomnia. Then when I woke up I felt remarkably calm and my usual morning anxiety had completely dissappeared. The exhaustion of the day before has also completely gone and I felt wonderfully energetic. Lastly, my mood was vastly improved. I almost feel like my old self again.

I opted to take it with 1 pump of estrogel at night applied to the inner thighs. The next morning I apply the other 2 pumps to outer arms up to the shoulders.

However, I'm still uncertain about the oral/vaginal options. Someone else here said it was bad to take utro vaginally for long periods of time. When I saw my NHS meno doctor and I mentioned the advice given on here about using the oral capsules vaginally, she gave me a very disapproving speech. When I asked her where she'd got her information from she just said that the oral capsules were designed to be taken orally and that's all there was to it. So who is correct? I'm inclined to believe it's the marvellous women on here rather than doctors.
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Hurdity

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1370 on: October 29, 2018, 05:29:53 PM »

Hi monsterfromid - your doctor is wrong about the Utrogestan caspules. They are manufactured in France where they can be used either orally or vaginally - and in fact the instructions on the French database of medicines (equivalent to our eMC) describes them as: "UTROGESTAN 100 mg, capsule molle orale ou vaginale". ie soft oral or vaginal capsules, so no worries on that score. They are just not licensed for vaginal use as part of HRT in UK although the same 200 mg caspules ARE licensed for fertility treatment vaginally in UK. Bizarre eh? No real reason but yes they are one and the same. Some women may not want to use them vaginally long term and every day as they may possibly act as an irritant but I don't know of any research that suggests that they cannot be used long term in this way and indeed would not be licensed as such on the continent if it were deemed harmful?

I hope you continue to feel better - when taken orally progesterone produces a large number of meatabolic by-products which are not present (or maybe only in tiny quantities?) when taken vaginally. Many women find these have a depressive effect but a few find the sedative effect helpful in small doses so looks like you are one of them - so make the most of it and hope it lasts! It has the opposite effect on me - I feel lethargic and sleepy - calm but in a dopey sort of way!

Hurdity x
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lisauk

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1371 on: October 30, 2018, 05:51:21 PM »

Hi, I am on 75mg estrogen patches (changed twice a week) and 200mg of Utrogestan every day (orally). I'm anxious about taking it every day with no breaks because I've read that 200mg is the dose for cycles, and that 100mg is the dose for constant daily use. The doctor I am seeing assures me it's ok (and the best way) to take 200mg every day. But I'm still worried :/ Can anyone please confirm if it's ok? I feel like I must be getting too much.
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Ladybt28

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1372 on: October 30, 2018, 05:55:08 PM »

I'd agree that 100mg is the dose for a continuous cycle not 200mg.  Personally I think the doctor needs to do some reading!
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lisauk

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1373 on: October 30, 2018, 06:29:36 PM »

Oh dear  :(

Is it dangerous though? I mean am I taking too much? Maybe I should go somewhere for a second opinion.
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lisauk

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1374 on: October 30, 2018, 08:40:31 PM »

Is no-one else on 200?  :-\
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Ladybt28

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1375 on: October 30, 2018, 10:18:00 PM »

Don't panic I don't think its dangerous short term.  It may make you have some very unpleasant side effects because a lot of women don't like progesterone at the best of times let alone double the dose.  I have an NHS leaflet on wall which tells you how to take Utrogestan showing the days of the cycle and how you take it if you are taking it daily (days 1 to 25) or on a cycle (days 1-26).  The daily dose clearly says 100mg per day daily and 200mg for days 1-26 cycle.

You can get a second opinion if you like but I'm sure that it should only be 100mg and I am pretty sure that someone else on the forum will agree.
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lisauk

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1376 on: October 30, 2018, 11:01:01 PM »

I'll make an appointment and go somewhere else then. I've been taking this dose for several months - bit worrying  :-\

Thank you for your help.
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Hurdity

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1377 on: October 31, 2018, 08:41:10 AM »

Hi lisauk

 :welcomemm:

Please don't worry - it's not dangerous! You are on a highish dose of oestrogen so maybe this is why the doc has given you a higher dose of progesterone as when taken orally it won't necessarily be sufficient at the licesned dose to protect the womb lining. The thing with utrogestan is that the doses for continuous and sequential use do not vary with the oestrogen dose yet it is known that the amount of protection needed for higher doses of oestrogen requires a higher the dose of progesterone. You might find for example that you get breakthrough bleeding if you only take 100 mg? Utrogestan is very good at protecting the lining when used vaginally (not lcesiend in UK) but can be more variable when taken orally due to variability in digestion and metabolism.

All you need to do is to lower the dose - maybe alternate 100 mg with 200 mg and see how you get on? If not bleeding then mention this to the doc at yoyur next appointment?

It also depends on how you feel too - many women would feel groggy and sedated taking this amount daily all the time as Ladybt says but will tolerate it (to an extent - and varies amongst women - some don't!) taken cyclically.

Hurdity x
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lisauk

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1378 on: October 31, 2018, 12:17:50 PM »

Thank you so much, Hurdity, for the reply.

I did try lowering the dose to 100mg last week. I did 4 days on that, and plummeted into a horrible depression. Scared myself actually because I genuinely felt suicidal. I put the dose back up to 200mg and felt better within 48 hours. I don't know 100% that it was the progesterone drop that caused that, but it certainly tied in time-wise. I keep reading about progesterone causing depression though - can it in fact do the opposite in some women I wonder?!

With regards to breakthrough bleeding, I still have a Mirena (been there 4.5 years) so I wasn't having any bleeding anyway, and I'm still not. In fact I only found out that I was menopausal by mistake - had blood tests done and found that my FSH was high and my estrogen was almost zero. I wasn't having any symptoms at all. I'm 46 by the way.

I just have no idea if what I'm doing is the right thing and I'm worrying myself sick thinking about it all the time, and googling, etc. As the 200mg daily of progesterone is causing no adverse effects I would assume I should keep going with it, BUT I just keep reading everywhere that 200 is the cyclical dose, and I should be taking only 100mg on continuous. I can't help thinking that taking double the dose constantly might have some adverse affect later on or something.

Agh I hate this whole getting older thing  :'(
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jojo999

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Re: utrogestan/estrogel support group
« Reply #1379 on: October 31, 2018, 02:53:37 PM »

Does anyone know where I could buy some vaginal applicators for the 100mg utrogestan capsules. I think the only way I could use properly vaginally would be using an applicator??
Thanks
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