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[shoppingqueen]

Hi

I have recently changed from Kliofem to 75mg estradiol patch (Femseven) and 100mg  utrogestan 2 days ago taken orally. I was due to do 25 days at 100mg at night. I'm not coping with it-  I like the sedated feeling (and the complete night's sleep, and not getting up to pee continually throughout night as I was doing on Kliofem), but I feel like I've been hit by a sledgehammer all day! Very sluggish on waking, foggy head, can barely remember my own name, cannot be bothered doing ANYTHING. A total space cadet! Also some nausea/ loss of apetite etc. Now I've been off work for two days thankfully so been welded to the sofa so being spaced out and disconnected been ok, but due back at work tomorrow and I'm not wanting to take it tonight. I've popped to doctor for routine check up today and she  suggested sticking with it. I have done this with previous preparations as I realise takes time to adjust , but not sure I can function in work. Loathed to do v route as have bladder problems anyway.
The doctor has given me Provera 10mg to take as alternative if I can't cope with the utro. I had MPA previously as part of Premique and it helped with sleep and wasn't too bad so thought it would be good to try. No instructions issued by pharmacist and I want to do sequential, so googled it and it say to take for 14 days of the cycle, but if I'm switching, should I drop the Utro and just have my estro patch for 14 days before starting the Provera? Or start straight away with the Provera?
Previous to this I was on continual so not had any bleed as went straight onto patch/ utro.
Any advice would be great.
Thanks
SQ x

[Peacegirl]

I really feel for you on this - it's all very well the doctor saying 'stick with it' but I was like you as in - it was like when you take a sleeping tablet - and my partner said i looked 'out of it' so I couldn't have turned up for work looking like that. I'm afraid I took the law into my own hands so to speak and took it alternate days and that helped but has risks (not strong enough to oppose the estrogen) and most docs here don't sanction that usage. I know you're committed to changing to Provera but I wonder if it's worth investigating lower dosage  of Utro? There are others on here who use it differently i.e. 10 days every other month but this depends on how much oestrogen you're using.  Please don't go on what I'm doing as it may be 'wrong' for you or indeed risky but I just wanted to say look into it maybe. Having said all that I'm just about to switch to provera due to hair loss which I'm almost certain is down to utrogestan. The specialist told me to just drop the 100 mg utro and replace it with 5mg Provera daily but I'm considering using it sequentially as you've suggested. If I do that I think I'll go straight into 14 days Provera (and estrogel) and hope for the best. Let me know what you decide and how you get on and good luck, it's hellish at times isn't it?

[shoppingqueen]

Hi Peacegirl

Thanks so much for your reply- I just couldn't bring myself to take it last night- like you, I felt totally out of it and think I even looked a bit wild about the eyes! Not a good look for work  If I wasn't working I might have been tempted by the alternates- I didn't start with provera last night as wanted a day to get the utro from my system and it's lifted a bit today, still a bit zonked out but not feeling like you said like I'd just taken sleeping tablet. So annoying as I could do with solid sleep more than anything but that's too high a price for me. Such a shame there's no lower dose.
My plan now is to do the provera tonight but am going to do 5mg and split tablet to see how I tolerate it- I'd had 5mg previously in premique continual tablets so hoping it'll suit. So my thinking is maybe this cycle keep it every night at 5mg continual no bleed and next cycle stop for 14 days and do 10mg at night for last 14. I've not done anything sequential as doc said he thought I was post meno as no period for year prior to HRT but had been in mini pill for ages which stopped my periods anyway so who knows??
It is bloody hellish switching, isn't it? Like all of us on here, I just want to feel normal but it's that long since I have I can't remember what me used to feel like.
I'm off for long break at end of July and wish I'd started the utrogestan then but in all honestly, I couldn't see my body adjusting having such an extreme reaction. I'll keep you posted on the provera.   
You using gel- how's that going? Let me know how you get on with the 10 mg  provera- let's be hopeful as it seems lots have good outcomes with it.
Fingers crossed xx SQ

[shoppingqueen]

Ps Peacegirl
Meant to ask how long you did the alternates and did you feel you could manage/ function on the reduced symptoms? I'm on 75 patch- previously had 2mg in kliofem tablet. I'm not sure it might be bit high but will stick it out to see if I adjust. And anyway, have had to change my femseven patch 3 times as keeps peeling off so am sure I'm not getting full hit. Have requested estradot from docs instead so will see if they'll agree a new script next week. Happy days, eh?
Did you try patches before gel?
SQ x

[TinaOptimist]

I started on HRT recently - sequential. I started the Utrogestan 200mg on Day 15 and it was terrible. Sore boobs, flushed cheeks, bladder pressure. So went back to gp and asked for Provera and she gave me it in 5mg tablets to try. It was fine. No side effects at all. I used it to Day 26 but my period started that day anyway. Doctor thinks it was break through bleeding but it was at Day 28 since my last period so all ok in terms of no build up of womb lining. Am going to keep at 5mg to see what happens next month. Will get a scan of wom lining if necessary to stay on this dose.
Good luck with Provera if you try it. I know it's not bio-identical but it felt a lot kinder.

[shoppingqueen]

Hi Tina
That's interesting- so you did 5mg for 26 days and did you break then for two days when period came? Or carry on taking continually?
Great news you settling on it- gives me hope😀Xx

[TinaOptimist]

Oh sorry- no. Maybe I explained it wrong. I used Estradot 50mg patch everyday and on Day 15 I tried the 200mg Utrogestan but it was awful. Made GP appointment and asked for Provera instead. Then continued with 5mg of that until Day 26 which makes the 12 days I needed to be on a progesterone tablet. Then I started my period. Bit earlier than expected as I think it's the withdrawal of the progesterone that makes you have a period. But this was my first month of using and I had my own natural period the month before. So I think my own cycle broke through as the period was actually 28 days since my last one. Hope that explains it. Just saying really that I found Provera a much nicer progesterone even if it is synthetic. I'd rather use it even if it isn't bio identical because my bladder went haywire with Utrogestan.

[shoppingqueen]

That's great Tina thanks! I've been given 10mg and there wasn't anything on the pharmacist leaflet re meno, but think doc said to take in last 14 days of cycle. My thinking was that I'd had 5mg of it as part of continual premique and obviously no bleed so decided to adjust I'd split tablet to 5mg each day for first month continual just to adjust. Am assuming this will keep
Lining down but estradiol patch different to premique horse estrogen, can't find dosage for 5mg on line anywhere just 10mg for sequential. I'd go sequential for this month but am bit worried as never done 14 days estrogen only and as have felt so bad adjusting to patches and horrid experience with utrogestan didn't want to go mad!! Am thinking maybe should bite bullet and do 10mg for 14 days and just see. God what a minefield😁 Good news is I agree re provera as being kinder than utrogestan. I'd wish it had suited as loved the full sleep but didn't want that for rest of the bloody day 😁😁

[TinaOptimist]

My doc will want me to increase to the proper dose of 10mg but was happy for me to be tentative this month as Utrogestan had proved too much for me. I will see how I get on with that much next month but may ease myself into it. Good luck anyway.

[Peacegirl]

Shopping queen, I think that's sensible, I have also done every 3 days on the utrogestan and found it still helped me sleep so it will stay in your system a little while. Did you say you were using it orally or vaginally? I had less drowsiness with the vaginal route? I think what Tina says about being tentative and then upping the provera dose makes sense. You're not going to get thickening of your lining in one month! Regarding the alternate days of utrogestan, it worked a treat, I felt good on that regime which I did for 3 months. It's just that half way in I started getting the same extreme hair loss as I have previously experienced with evorel conti. (Not that many get it with utrogestan think if that was the I was just unlucky). I'm picking up my provera mo day - I've got 5mg prescribed and I think the estrogel at 2 pumps is roughly the equivalent of 50 rather than 75 patch. But as I've learned on here, you can't really compare dosage across different hrt types, it's kind of trial and error. But I was previously on a 50 patch of evorel twice a week. I'm guessing I got enough utrogestan because if the estrogen was ruling I would have got insomnia and spotting and stomach cramps. But it's also pointed out on here that it's risky not to take the correct dose but some on here do follow a lower utrogestan regime so I guess it's up to every woman on here to weigh up all the info and make an informed choice. I honestly do like the utrogestan - it's not perfect, it's the best I've had and if it wasn't for the hair loss....
Oh and like many on here, I love the estrogel so I just need to find a progesterone regime that will work!

Good luck and let us know how it all goes xx

[shoppingqueen]

Thanks Tina
Yes tentative sounds like a good plan! Let me know how you get on. I agree I'll also need to up to 10mg eventually as well.
Peacegirl, I took the utro orally- if I ever was to try again I'd go the v route to see if this helps re reducing side effects it's just I already have a weak bladder and some say that it irritates this.
 It's such a shame re the hair loss reaction for you as it suited! It just doesn't seem fair. I've noticed that it's all a bargaining game- one treatment is better for x y z but doesn't help with b. Whereas another helps b and y but not x and z.... if you know what I mean? No wonder we get confused/ frustrated as you're then left thinking which is best to settle on. I felt super calm on the utro and great sleep, my breathing felt easier too, but unable to focus so no good for work. Grrr!
I'm very interested in the gel and do think I'd try this if patches don't stick. I'm so glad this is working for you.

Keep me posted on the provera both  I'd be interested to know how you get on xxx

[Peacegirl]

Hi, I have a 'weak' bladder too and it didn't seem to get worse with vaginal use. I have started with vagifem though and with pelvic floor work which has been really difficult to do but is starting to work again this helps with that awful problem. Yes the bargaining thing, I know!!  I am investigating wigs (in case the Provera doesn't work out) but they will have to be bloody good and natural before I venture out in one!

[shoppingqueen]

That's good news re not affecting bladder v route- I'm prepared to give utro another go if provera doesn't work well as I'll be running out of options- it'll be when I'm off work though in case I get the spaced out feeling again! J really hope the hair loss abates with provera for you! We don't deserve all this do we? Xx

[Katia]

Utrogestan is not working for me either. I've blown up like a ballon to where it's so uncomfortable. My GP said to take it every other day, which I have been doing and I still have fluid retention but not as bad.  The consultant has now said it's not safe to take it every other day as it's not enough to clear the lining. I'm dreading taking it tonight as I know I'll be going to work with big puffy eyes. I'm wondering if I should ask for provera. How are you finding it? 

[Katia]

Peace girl, I'd read Utrogestan was supposed to be the best for hairless, but funny my hair has gone bad on it. Gestodene in Femodene pill was the best for me for hair loss. I do t know if it's available for HRT