Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Menopause Matters magazine ISSUE 81 out now. (Autumn issue, September 2025)

media

Pages: 1 [2] 3

Author Topic: Too much or too little oesteogen?  (Read 11041 times)

Wrensong

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2234
Re: Too much or too little oesteogen?
« Reply #15 on: November 27, 2017, 06:45:09 PM »

Hi Sunnydays - well that could explain a few things, as you say.   Perhaps a bit of a relief too, as it should hopefully mean that after the antibiotics & once the cold has gone, you should start to feel a whole lot better.  Take the best care of yourself - the bug will have really taken its toll & antibiotics, though a necessary evil, can take a little getting over as you'll know. 

Do you take probiotics at all?  I find these help me with long-standing gastritis & IBS, but always advise anyone new to them to be vigilant if they do want to try them.  I believe they have great potential, with effects throughout the body not just in the digestive tract, but that a lot more research needs doing, as the field is huge.  They can give rise to some pretty unpleasant die-off symptoms at first, so this is something to bear in mind.  Apologies if you know all this already!   :)
Logged

Sunnydays

  • Guest
Re: Too much or too little oesteogen?
« Reply #16 on: November 27, 2017, 10:13:54 PM »

No I don't take them wrensong but had planned to after the antibiotics. I do enjoy live yoghurt usually but not so much in cold weather! Im rather interested in kafir! Have you ever tried it? It's supposed to be good for you.
Logged

Wrensong

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2234
Re: Too much or too little oesteogen?
« Reply #17 on: November 28, 2017, 10:24:48 AM »

Hi Sunnydays - yes have had Kefir, but it can be hard to find in the sticks where I live.  Biona do one in small jars but the health food shop I used to get it from has recently closed down & even there they had to order it for me.  I've had a Polish brand from Tesco in a huge bottle a few years ago - thin & far cheaper, but not that pleasant tasting & actually felt inflammatory, so I didn't finish it!  The latest I tried was from Sainsbury's, having failed to find any elsewhere, but it was in a tiny bottle that only lasted 2-3 days, so gets expensive if you want to take it daily.  Can't remember the brand, but think it was a Dorset based co & it was by far the most pleasant tasting I've tried.  They seem generally a bit more zingy than yoghurt, but the Dorset one was milder in flavour.  Hoping a wider range will become available in more outlets soon - surprised the supermarkets seem so slow to catch on, given it's had TV coverage.  Looked into making my own a few years ago, but needs babysitting when you go on hols & seemed like too much of a faff tbh! 

Have made yoghurt which is dead easy with an Easiyo maker.  Never bought their own starters - experimented with different shop bought natural yoghurts as starters & this worked well, produced some lovely tasting yoghurt & can be a cheap way of ensuring a good supply.  It does make quite a large quantity in one go though, so suitability might depend on how many in the house will eat it, though with just 2 of us eating some every day it kept well enough.  Lakeland Plastics sometimes have the makers on special offer if there's one near you & you fancy making your own.

Hope you feel so much better after the antibiotics & that any probiotics you decide to try will help your immunity for the future as well as keeping your tummy in good health.  There is some very interesting research if you have time & inclination to google it.  Optibac website has research links as well as customer reviews, but I've also used probiotics from Biocare, Nature's Best & Quest, among others.  Quest's probiotic L Plantarum has some encouraging research relating to gut health & healing is apparently a strain often found in kefir.  It's a topic I find fascinating as I had a very good friend who was a Microbiology PhD working in the field & who introduced me to probiotics 30 years ago when they were really just in their infancy here in terms of medicinal promotion.   Anyway, take care.  Wx
Logged

Sunnydays

  • Guest
Re: Too much or too little oesteogen?
« Reply #18 on: November 28, 2017, 05:12:24 PM »

Thanks for your informative reply. I'll certainly look them up. I drink goats, rather than cows milk. (Drink as in use it in hot drinks, cereal etc) and i discovered from a friend that  a company called the chuckling goat makes goats kefir. All handmade. She swears by it. I might try it but for some reason the word kefir seems to conjure up sour/ off cream in my mind!
Logged

Wrensong

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2234
Re: Too much or too little oesteogen?
« Reply #19 on: November 28, 2017, 05:31:44 PM »

I used only goat milk for a couple of years & even made yoghurt with it as I don't like the commercial goat milk yoghurt much.  Hope you like the goat milk kefir - cows' milk kefir is really not like sour cream - more like a tangy yoghurt - sort of fizzy even!  Never had goat milk kefir though, so would be interested to know whether you like it.  :)
Logged

Kathleen

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4945
Re: Too much or too little oesteogen?
« Reply #20 on: November 28, 2017, 06:08:44 PM »

Hello ladies.

On the subject of homemade probiotics I've been making my own sauerkraut for a while and love the taste.
There is a lot of information online about the benefits of eating fermented foods and how to make them, there are plenty of books on the subject as well. As I'm sure you know ladies only fresh 'chilled' products contain live bacteria.

Take care all.

K.
Logged

Sunnydays

  • Guest
Re: Too much or too little oesteogen?
« Reply #21 on: November 28, 2017, 07:14:19 PM »

Thanks for this Kathleen. Maybe we ought to start a thread on probiotics! I've just looked up sauerkraut and it looks so easy to make!
Question: these fermented foods and yoghurts arenhey as beneficial as simply taking a good probiotic?
Caution fermented: internet search the fermentation means they contain higher sodium so  not to overeat it! This is I guess what gives yoghurts and probiotics an advantage maybe...
Logged

Wrensong

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2234
Re: Too much or too little oesteogen?
« Reply #22 on: November 29, 2017, 10:44:27 AM »

Kathleen, that's interesting!  Have you noticed any health benefits since making your own sauerkraut?  I've never been able to find fresh sauerkraut hereabouts - the only stuff is in a jar & likely long dead!

Sunnydays - I think there have been previous threads on probiotics, so you could search if you're interested.  The question of whether probiotic capsules are more effective than live fermented foods is controversial!  I eat loads of live yoghurt & sometimes kefir, but also take capsules as I need all the help I can get & don't think anyone yet knows the answer for sure!  The capsules do seem to keep my gastritis under better control that any medication has.

I think a lot depends on whether the bacteria from either foods or supplements reach the relevant sections of the gut alive & how long they are able to survive there.  Some are said to be transient, but exert a beneficial effect on their way through, some are said to be able to colonise & replace less desirable organisms.  Some people think that taking capsules represents a tiny drop in the ocean compared to the huge numbers of resident bacteria in the gut & therefore can't possibly have much effect.

Tbh I think it's a huge field and a lot more research probably needs to be done before we are sure how the many different strains affect us, either singly or when combined.  I wonder whether there may also be differences between the sexes!  There is also the question of safety for certain groups who are not in good health (immuno-compromised, pancreatic disease, serious gut disorders, immediately post-op etc).  There's much written about how good for us probiotics are but you have to dig deeper to uncover articles that are more cautious, so I think we all need to bear this in mind & be vigilant, as with any other supplements we choose to take.   Given they are said to exert widespread effects from influencing mental health to immune function, there seems a lot that could go wrong!

The probiotics industry would have us believe we cannot get anywhere near as many beneficial bacteria from fermented foods as we can from buying their expensive capsules, but there's a lot to be said for getting as many nutrients as we can from natural foodstuffs.  Some of the commercial probiotics only contain one or 2 strains of bacteria, but the marketing suggests these are proven to promote gut health.  They also sometimes make the claim that bacterial cultures used to make commercial yoghurt are chosen to make the yoghurt taste good rather than specifically to benefit gut health! 

If we eat a variety of foods including live, fermented ones I think we can't go far wrong.  Eating a range of complex carbs, fruit & veg, nut & seeds is said to supply the PREbiotic substances that feed good bugs in the gut & some people think this is the best way to influence what thrives there. 


I think really it comes down to whether you feel happier getting all your nutrients from foods or like to see whether you feel any better cautiously trying capsules on top of a good diet. :)
Logged

Kathleen

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4945
Re: Too much or too little oesteogen?
« Reply #23 on: November 29, 2017, 05:50:06 PM »

Hello ladies.

I first started making my own sauerkraut about two years ago. I began by eating a tablespoon every day with my salad. On the fourth day I felt a gurgling after dinner and needed the loo. Well, not wishing to be too graphic but I produced a lot of poo, not diarrhoea, all normally formed but lots of it ( sorry if tmi ). I think if anyone had slow transit issues  consuming a substantial quantity of sauerkraut would be the the way to ( pun intended ). After that I did some more research and learned that sauerkraut is so potent that novices are advised to eat very small amounts initially and increase slowly over time. I followed this advice and can now eat large servings daily without problems. I assume I now have all the right bacteria to digest it. I do feel good on it and although I wasn't trying to solve a particular digestive problem at the time I feel at the very least it is a cheap and natural pro biotic, I've also never found it to be too salty.

I stopped making it a while ago, but when I reintroduced it about six weeks ago I felt particularly calm for the time I was eating it. This may be a coincidence but I've just started another batch so we'll see if actually does help.

Wouldn't it be great if we could discover a natural, cheap and  effective medicine that we can make ourselves. Now that ladies is the dream!

Take care all.

K.
Logged

Wrensong

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2234
Re: Too much or too little oesteogen?
« Reply #24 on: November 29, 2017, 07:29:37 PM »

Wow Kathleen, that's really impressive  :o  Not tmi at all - just the sort of thing that might help a lot of us at this time in our lives.  Thank you for passing that on (no pun intended!)  When I looked into making it some time ago I was put off by the vast quantities in the recipe - I couldn't see 2 of us getting through it so didn't attempt to make it.  Can I ask whether your recipe makes lots or just a little at a time?
Logged

Kathleen

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4945
Re: Too much or too little oesteogen?
« Reply #25 on: November 29, 2017, 08:23:45 PM »

Hello Wrensong.

Happy to help. Some people do  make huge quantities in large fermenting pots however it is possible to make much smaller amounts in a kilner jar using just one cabbage and there are plenty of YouTube videos demonstrating how it's done. I also have a book called " Real Food Fermentation " by Alex Lewin that tells you all you need know about  fermenting many different foods.

 When I make sauerkraut I use one white cabbage which fills one large and one small kilner jar. It's ready after four days but can be left for four weeks, depending on  the flavour and crunchiness you want. I usually begin eating mine after four weeks at which point it needs to be kept in the fridge to halt the fermentation process but keep the helpful bacteria alive. It can remain refrigerated for up to six weeks.

I love the taste and so does my son but my husband and daughter think it is disgusting lol. Ah well each to his own I guess!

I hope you find this useful and if you do make some sauerkraut let us know what you think.

Take care.

K.
P. S. Pounding the cabbage is also a good way to vent all that meno anger when you're having a bad day!
Logged

Wrensong

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2234
Re: Too much or too little oesteogen?
« Reply #26 on: November 30, 2017, 11:47:15 AM »

Kathleen, thank you so much for the detail - I have copied it out & will have a go when I get organised enough.  Love the idea of venting menopausal frustration by giving a cabbage a good thumping.  Could be just the therapy I've been missing all these years!  ;D
Logged

Sunnydays

  • Guest
Re: Too much or too little oesteogen?
« Reply #27 on: November 30, 2017, 03:44:02 PM »

Ues thanks for this really useful info. I might try to make some over th Christmas hols :)
Logged

Wrensong

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2234
Re: Too much or too little oesteogen?
« Reply #28 on: December 01, 2017, 05:20:08 PM »

Hi Sunnydays, how are you feeling - any better for the antibiotics yet & has the cold eased up at all?
Logged

Sunnydays

  • Guest
Re: Too much or too little oesteogen?
« Reply #29 on: December 02, 2017, 09:25:39 AM »

HI Wrensong, yes I am feeling much better thank you:) the cold cleared up quickly last weekend - whether that was because I took echinacea drops I don't know.
I still have 2 days of antibiotics to go - they've not been too bad but making me feel a bit sick. I can tell that my stomach is feeling much better though.
I plan to take some good probiotics once course finished. - did you suggest some ina precious post I think?
I've been sure to not over do things but went for a cycle ride this morning :)
Thanks for asking wrensong x
Logged
Pages: 1 [2] 3