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[Ruthiebell]

Hello! I’m new to the group but have found discussions so helpful- thank you all. It can feel lonely navigating the changes in my body and brain and I am so sorry to see I’m not alone! I’m lucky that my GP is lovely and recommended I start HRT for many menopause symptoms, lots and feel like my body has been taken over by an alien some days. I’m 50 and on the progesterone only pill so do not bleed, so can’t tell if I would have a period or not which makes it tricky! I really wanted to try to manage without HRT if possible. I have recently acquired (as part of it all I think!) really awful health anxiety so I worry that the faffing with my hormones may cause even more problems than actual menopause and trigger me into more of state. From what I’m reading it doesn’t sound very straightforward in terms of HRT really working/ being successful enough? Would welcome opinions and also love advice from those who are choosing not to go down the HRT route as I really would like to try without and for any hints and tips. Thank you 😊

[bombsh3ll]

There are no medals or prizes for suffering, even the way you phrase the question in terms of "managing without" implies sacrifice or self denial.

If you have visited your GP with menopause symptoms and they have offered you treatment, why would anyone not take that?

Anxiety itself can be a symptom of loss of gonadal hormones.

It's also not just about your quality of life now but in the future too - estrogen also helps protect against osteoporosis as well as helping to maintain cardiometabolic, skin, joint, brain and urogenital health.

It would be a real shame to miss out on potentially beneficial treatment without even trying it. Unless you give it a go you cannot really make an informed choice between being treated and untreated as you have only experienced one. If you start it and it isn't for you, just stop it, what have you lost?

[CrispyChick]

Hey, I can totally understand your concern.

It's very difficult to know which way to go. Unfortunately I'm probably in the opposite camp. I've literally tried everything to stabilise my hormones over the last few years and it's all made me worse.

I wish I'd given up sooner. I now believe my messing has made me worse.

I can understand the health anxiety issue. I am now suffering from terrible mental health - traumatised by all my trials.

That said, it would be very easy to try HRT once. You don't need to slog on and on, changing formats or brands if you dont want to. If the first one doesn't work you can simply stop. No more trials.

I just kept thinking my answer was out there. But it hasn't been. But yours might be. X

What symptoms are you experiencing?

[jaypo]

Welcome  to the forum   

I've managed without HRT  and that's not me blowing my own trumpet,some women,sadly,symptoms are just too much to cope without it, I'm not going to tell you my journey was easy,it certainly wasn't,with low mood,anxiety and nausea being the worst, I did seriously consider it and sometimes wish I'd tried but I'm through the worst of it now.
We're all very different,so the choice really has to be yours,good luck with whatever you decide x

[Ayesha]

Only you can decide which route you want to take as all our experiences will be different and unless you try you will never know how you will get on because it can be a minefield.
I was about 50 when I went on HRT to relieve hot flushes which were making me completely exhausted and I stayed on it for five years and was glad to come of it, I felt it gave me back my freedom, freedom from constant blood pressure checks, visits to the breast clinic because of lumps caused by the extra oestrogen and visits to the gynae dept because of side effects. Five years was enough for me and I was lucky to have a good menopause thereafter.

It’s important to live a healthy lifestyle as you age, I am 75 now with no health issues apart from the occasional aches which come with old age, that’s natural and no amount of HRT will help that. Taking HRT does not guarantee you will be protected from serious health issues in the future, its more to do with living a healthy lifestyle, smoking and excessive drinking can be catastrophic on the body, I’ve seen the results of that and it’s not nice.

[SundayGirl]

From the tone of your post it seems that you really don't want to use HRT. If this is the case then you don't have to.

I have tried several types of HRT and every single one of them has caused a huge increase in anxiety and did nothing else for me (except sore boobs and hair loss). I know this as my anxiety levels massively reduced as soon as I stopped using HRT. It was like a weight had been lifted from my shoulders.

I think everyone suffers with health anxiety at some stage in their life. It's not just around menopause so no-one can say for definite that it's due to a reduction in hormones. Even men suffer from it and they don't go through menopause. There are many things that can trigger anxiety. It's all about finding the cause and addressing that rather than throwing something at it with crossed fingers.

Please don't be swayed in your choice by posts that mention all the future potential benefits. No-one can say that you'll definitely suffer from heart disease, osteoporosis or dementia if you don't use HRT. Conversely, no-one can guarantee that you definitely won't suffer from these things if you do.

I'm not trying to persuade you one way or another as other posters may try to do. Only you can decide what is best for your body.

Also, have you had a full health MOT to check vitamin levels and thyroid function? Many ladies find out at this age that they're lacking in one or more vitamins and their thyroid is struggling. Low vitamins and thyroid dysfunction can cause symptoms that many assume to be menopause related.

Oh, and welcome to the forum

[Ruthiebell]

Thank you for replies, really helpful and fully appreciate it is my choice, just to clarify I am not self sacrificing just really welcome of the discussion, main symptoms anxiety (health) night sweats, occasional low mood, palpitations, frozen shoulder (but physio and exercise are helping) I am lucky to say I have have an mot and all is well. I think that is why I’m leaning towards non HRT as don’t want to run the risk of potentially naffing anything up (probably over thinking I know!) If anyone has any info about helpful stuff  re herbal etc I could try that would be ace please. I certainly won’t rule out trying HRT if symptoms get any worse too. Thank you

[bombsh3ll]

There is absolutely no shortage of over the counter remedies claiming to help with menopausal symptoms, there is just very little evidence of clinical effectiveness or in some cases safety - for example black cohosh can cause liver toxicity.

My advice if you buy anything is to check what is actually in it - often it is something you could have bought for a lot less without the menopause marketing, such as a vitamin D supplement or a moisturizer.

Also check that whatever the active ingredient is doesn't interfere with any prescription medication you take.

Finally I would point out that taking a synthetic progestin as birth control you are already manipulating your own hormones and adding something that is not naturally found in your body - I have nothing against that and take a combined pill myself - it just seems unusual that someone would be ok taking a highly potent synthetic hormone for contraception but not a low dose of body identical hormones for their own quality of life, in case this helps you see it differently.

[Ruthiebell]

Thanks bombsh3ll - true,  I do take the the mini pill, but the progesterone in this is only 75 micrograms as opposed to 100mg in the pill as part of the treatment which is a significant difference in dosage. I will look carefully at the herbal route as I’m aware of inter-indications. It just seems that a lot of women I speak with and some people on the forum don’t seem very happy with their hormone treatment and have are still having difficulties. Would have loved it if that route was overwhelmingly positive but it doesn’t seem to be and sounds stressful trying different ones etc. there is no right or wrong answer, and it is hard - I just wanted to explore discussion about ways without using more medical intervention.

[Suziemc]

... It just seems that a lot of women I speak with and some people on the forum don’t seem very happy with their hormone treatment and have are still having difficulties. Would have loved it if that route was overwhelmingly positive but it doesn’t seem to be and sounds stressful trying different ones etc....

In addition to the fantastic advice and opinions you've already had in response, don't forget that forum members only tend to post on here when they have problems. There are lots and lots of us who very quickly found the right combination of HRT that alleviates our symptoms but because we don't need help you don't read about us.

You are obviously weighing this up very carefully for yourself, quite rightly so, but try not to be put off too much by the horrible experience some forum members have had trying to find the right treatment for them.

Good luck with your considerations

Suzie

[CrispyChick]

Jaypo - I wonder if you could give us more details to your story???

You say you're through the worst of it now - so I'm assuming you found peri toughest and are now stabilising a bit post meno???

I do think we could all benefit from hearing some non HRT stories and how they pan out.

If you feel like sharing. 

[Ruthiebell]

Thank you Suziemc sorry I’m a newbie it makes sense issues/ problems are mentioned more, really appreciate your comments, also crispychick thank you for great comments, all great food for thought and yes it would be great to hear from you jaypo if you would like to share. Thanks again all for all your replies 😊

[bombsh3ll]

Thanks bombsh3ll - true,  I do take the the mini pill, but the progesterone in this is only 75 micrograms as opposed to 100mg in the pill

That's because desogestrel as a chemically modified pharmaceutical is hundreds of times more potent than micronised progesterone.

Wikipedia has some useful information on equivalent potencies.

Obviously any treatment is a personal choice with advantages and disadvantages but it's important to have a good understanding of what you are taking.

[Banjo1973]

Hi,

I'm no expert, but can you not just stivk with the progesterone you are on and just trial some oestrogen?

For me progesterone is the worst part, the orstrogen part is glorious!!

Good luck x

[joziel]

Ruthiebell, whilst I'm all for women making their own decisions about whether to take HRT, that should be an *informed* decision - and there are a few errors or common misunderstandings behind a few things you say....

Firstly, women on a forum like this do not represent the average woman on HRT. Women on a forum like this are self-selecting as complex cases frequently needing more help, advice and guidance than the average. The average woman goes on HRT, feels dramatically better, has her menopause symptoms fixed and experiences a reduced risk of many diseases associated with aging. She does not need to seek out help on an online forum like this. So what you are reading, here, and the people whose experiences and accounts you are coming across, are not representative of most women on HRT and should not really be used to help you decide whether to take it or not.

Secondly, like bombshell says, anxiety is an extremely extremely common symptom of low sex hormones. You can google or ChatGPT that for yourself.

Thirdly, you say on the one hand you've had an MOT and have a full bill or health, then on the other hand say that you're experiencing night sweats and palpitations and frozen shoulder - and more besides. I'm not sure how those 2 statements tally. Because those are not negligible issues. Night sweats alone are linked to a higher risk of dementia, in later life. Palpitations are happening because your heart needs estrogen and without it, you are at greater risk of cardiovascular disease. These are communications from your body which you can heed... They are not things to weather and get through, because they are the first warning signs of risk factors.

Fourthly, you make assumptions which are incorrect when you say that you take the mini pill " but the progesterone in this is only 75 micrograms as opposed to 100mg in the pill as part of the treatment". I'm not sure what you mean by 'the pill, as part of the treatment' but am guessing you mean the 100mg utrogestan progesterone for HRT...? You do realise you can't compare the synthetic progestin of 75mcg with 100mg of body identical natural progesterone?? I mean, I could say to you 'I only took 1mg of cyanide as compared to 500mg of sodium' and I think you'd get the point.

A progestin is a synthetic hormone which your body has never produced and which increases your risk of breast cancer, stops your own ovarian function and suppresses your own progesterone and testosterone and estradiol as a result - and may well be responsible for the low mood you are currently feeling, since research shows that progestins cause low mood and depression - and the other is a hormone your body has produced naturally every time you've ovulated and which strengthens your bones and improves your own immune function... and which your own body has naturally produced the equivalent of probably 1000mgs of during each menstrual cycle. (I currently take 600mg of utrogestan/day for example.) Arguably more progesterone is better for many women - not worse.

Fifthly, when women can't take HRT, they tend to make it A Very Good Thing or Just As Well, that they can't. Cognitive dissonance is a bummer. Not many people can hack it, so they resolve it by I Don't Care Anyway, It's Better Like This - or any other number of psychological approaches to resolution. That doesn't mean you should base your decision on their accounts. Think of where they are coming from...

As for my own experience, without HRT I had severe joint pain, migraines, zero libido, vaginal atrophy, incontinence, inner tremors through the night, palpitations, hypnic jerks as I began to fall asleep, insomnia, night sweats - I could go on. Almost all of this has totally gone and I've got my life back. You are not going to come to a forum like this and read multiple accounts of people saying how lovely everything is, because people tend to join when they have a problem...

You might want to read the website Balance-Menopause.com or listen to Dr Louise Newson's podcast to learn more so you can make an informed decision about whether to increase your risk of many diseases by not taking HRT. This is not just about symptom resolution.

PS Sorry, one more point... Many women have not been on the right type and dose of HRT for them and due to the ignorance of their doctors, they just give up... They don't realise that if they persevered and got the right balance of hormones and dose and type, things could have been great.