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[pepperminty]

I had the same,

ask the GP to write to the local menopause clinic specialist for confirmation that it is safe to use the medications . I would email and ask them why they are refusing you treatment and that you know the risks and benefits and it i your choice etc. I would read up on the  literature - Louise newson has a load and quote the relevant evidence based information. Then thank them for reading your email and ask them to reconsider -- If it is in writing they can't gas light you so easily.  You can use vagifem and estriol which is the weaker one daily inside and outside if required - as long as it is helping.

Ps - VA is cured it is managed - so stopping treatment that is  working may have consequences.

PMXX

[Hurdity]

Sorry to hear this Ayesha. I have both (Vagirux and the weaker 0.01% estriol cream) - not even had to be prescribed by private gynae - just regular NHS GP, as well as systemic HRT.  And I wouldn't think of stopping any of it at the moment and I'm in 70's. I use the estriol cream as and when to relieve dryness and itching because Vagifem/Vagirux alone doesn't work  for me on these external areas. I hope you are successful.

Hurdity x

[Ayesha]

Thanks for all the very helpful comments ladies (ammunition) which I have taken on board.
Its difficult to comprehend it all on how this condition is treated and with a statement of "its very rare to need both treatments" the fight continues. 

[CLKD]

A word with the Practice Manager ?

[MrsMitch]

Its difficult to comprehend it all on how this condition is treated and with a statement of "its very rare to need both treatments" the fight continues.

Well obviously it isn't! Just a read through this thread makes it clear we often need both if not usually.
I did email my GP Ayesha and although I included my email from Dr Currie with her recommendatios, my GP was far more attentive. I told her I absolutely cannot go on if I don't gave estradiol daily. It worked.
I think maybe them having to sit and read it changes things. It's worth a go.

[joziel]

It's so ridiculous. I feel like what menopause forums and facebook groups seem to spend more of the time is helping women navigate the shite healthcare services we have so that they can get what they need.....

I had the same thing, my NHS GP wouldn't give both Vagifem and Ovestin. I just got Ovestin from my Newson Health doctor who was happy for me to have as much as I wanted. Had to pay for it of course. It's great for your face as well

[MrsMitch]

. It's great for your face as well

You can use it on your face??? What for wrinkles? I'm intrigued.

[Minusminnie]

Thanks for all the very helpful comments ladies (ammunition) which I have taken on board.
Its difficult to comprehend it all on how this condition is treated and with a statement of "its very rare to need both treatments" the fight continues.

As a newly registered patient with this practice i would ask for a face to face appointment with the doctor who you are now registered with.

We moved home four and a half years ago.  I thought it normal practice to be asked to see the new doctor that i was newly registered with. Maybe old fashioned thinking on my part. When nothing was forthcoming i asked to see her.  It meant that she read my previous notes, she checked me out and i had a conversation with her.  She is a senior partner at the practice and i've since seen other more junior GPs there but have in some instances been able to refer back to seeing her initally.

Realise face to face appointments are now difficult to get at some practices but might be worth a try and not such an unreasonable ask as a new patient.

[joziel]

One of the reasons I stay with (expensive) Newson Clinic is that I just don't trust the NHS to prescribe me what I need for HRT. Not to suddenly decide I can't have X and Y or 10 pumps of gel or 300mg of utrogestan, and just to be at the mercy of whatever crap a particular doctor decides to implement...

Anyway, yes - for wrinkles. Estriol is what's in Ovestin, so it stays local to where it's applied and doesn't go systemic and it's great for the skin. (That's why we put it on our vags to make them plump and moisturised! It will do the same elsewhere!) I also use the tiny amount of gel which gets left in each pump bottle when I finish. It's not enough for full measured doses but rather than throw it out, I put it on my face.

[joziel]

Well putting Ovestin on your face is as safe as putting it on your vagina. Your skin is your skin is your skin..... wherever it is. And there are creams available in the US with estriol in them for the face.

As for putting the gel (estradiol) on your face, it probably depends how much you absorb from it, what dosage of progesterone you're on and that kind of thing. As I am on 10 pumps of gel a day and absorb it not very well, and am well protected with 300mg of utrogestan a night, putting a small amount on my face really doesn't do much for me systemically.

[pepperminty]

Well putting Ovestin on your face is as safe as putting it on your vagina. Your skin is your skin is your skin..... wherever it is. And there are creams available in the US with estriol in them for the face.

As for putting the gel (estradiol) on your face, it probably depends how much you absorb from it, what dosage of progesterone you're on and that kind of thing. As I am on 10 pumps of gel a day and absorb it not very well, and am well protected with 300mg of utrogestan a night, putting a small amount on my face really doesn't do much for me systemically.

Hi, has it made a difference to your skin on the face?

PMxx

[CLKD]

Skin = skin - it isn't the same  .  Hopefully your vaginal skin isn't the same as that on your heels.   

I go to the reception desk at our Surgery and ask to see our GP face2face.  I may need to wait 3 weeks but have not been denied, despite Covid restrictions.  Some GPs simply don't have the Staff to cover as many sessions hence seeing Nurse Practitioners when necessary.  Plus with all the new builds across the UK, there aren't enough GP Surgeries to cover the influx.  Sad state of affairs 

Reading an article yesterday it seems that due to government pressures which take GPs away from face2face appts because they have to fill in so many forms etc., means that GPs are leaving in droves or ending their lives  . As with education, governments of the day should keep out of telling GPs etc. what to do!

[joziel]

I don't mean skin everywhere is exactly the same, I mean that in the same way that estrogen benefits vaginal skin (moistens it, plumps it), so it does the same to facial skin. (And all skin.) That's why one of the symptoms of menopause is dry skin - not just in your vagina, but everywhere - and often itchy as a result.

If you google 'estriol cream for the face', you'll get up multiple products. Estriol isn't absorbed systemically, there is research which shows that. It's why women with histories of breast cancer can have local estrogen in the vagina.

The only thing I'd say about estradiol (Oestrogel) on the face, is the alcohol in it can be quite drying so needs to be well moisturised afterwards. As I am basically bathing in gel every day, putting a bit extra on my face doesn't really make any difference. But if someone was on a very low dose or very sensitive, Oestrogel on the face might well not be a good idea. Estriol, on the other hand (Ovestin) should be totally fine because it's not systemic.

[Ayesha]

Update:  After my explanation of how I use the Estriol cream and the fact a tube will last me 3 to 4 months the GP approved my prescription. The confusion came when he assumed I was using it the same as you would without another form of treatment, for instance Vagifem.

Its been 4 days without applying Estriol and I haven't noticed any difference, usually the first sign would be the constant need to pee but the Vagifem alone is doing a great job so far.  I feel now after nearly 3 years of treatment I can be more flexible on usage, but its a wait and see situation.
Needless to say I am very happy to have both treatments and not have to worry when flare ups arrive as they sometimes do.

Thanks all for the great advice and support ladies but don't think I will be using any on my face, far too late for that 

[CLKD]

Tnx for the update. 

My face thus far hasn't required anything, both Grandmas had beautifully soft skin