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[Petra]

Hi Ladies, nothing new in this post but just interested if anyone has any thoughts about my dilemma. On Utrogestan (100mg) I sleep like a baby. I LOVE how well I sleep. But I was starting to have quite a few days where I felt tired, sometimes dizzy, zero energy; and after certain kinds of meals (too fatty), bad stomach reaction. It sucked.

I decided to switch to Provera. Great for 4 weeks, better energy during the day and to my surprise, my sleep was OK. (I've always been prone to insomnia, which terrifies me.) Three nights in a row now, insomnia. Fall asleep for an hour or two, wake up and...that's it. We all know what long nights awake are like, terrifying.

I feel now like I just have to go back on the Utro just to sleep again. But I'm torn. (I'm on 50mcg Estradot patches, am 62, been on HRT for over a decade...due to terrible sleep destroying night sweats!)

I'd welcome any comments, even just hand holding. I feel pathetic that I want to cave after 3 nights of no sleep, but insomnia just terrifies me. (I can take Zopiclone, which works, but obviously that's not a longterm solution.)

[Joaniepat]

I wonder if the symptoms of dizziness and lassitude indicate that you now need more oestrogen. A 50 mcg patch is a low/medium dose - how about switching back to Utrogestan for the sleep, and trying a 75 mcg patch?

JP x

[Petra]

Interesting idea @Joaniepat. I tried a 75 mcg patch about a year ago and it felt like too much, though I'm not sure what I mean by that, haha, and I probably didn't give it long enough to settle in. I didn't know that lassitude etc could be symptoms of not enough estrogen, so thanks for the intel. I got my estrogen levels tested about 18 mmonths ago, when I was on just 25 mcg patches, it was very low and the doc upped my dose. Maybe my levels have gone way back down again.

HRT seems like trying to level a table by sawing off the legs. Thanks for your response.

[Uma17]

Hi Petra, like you when I take Utrogestan I feel very lethargic. I am now taking it vaginally and the lethargy has gone and sleep seems similar than when taking it orally. It’s only early days for me so waiting to see what happens.

I think we all have different reactions to Utrogestan (etc). I don’t need Utrogestan as I had a hysterectomy but wanted to try it for the sleep benefits. I had tried the mirena coil (12 years ago) but stopped after 3 months as I had a few aura migraines, felt a bit uncomfortable having something so permanent as I had bad experiences on the Pill. BUT I remember that I had the best sleep then. Knowing what I know now about mirena, it takes about 6 months to settle rather than 3.

I tried Utrogestan last year orally for 2 weeks and gave up as I felt so lethargic on it and felt foggy. On a forum someone said that it really improved after 6 weeks (a long time to feel unwell…) or some even longer. I decided to try again 2 weeks ago, did one week orally, started to feel lethargic after 5 days and now been 6 days vaginally. So really early days. I read that some women have reactions when they take it vaginally but it’s been fine so far.  I also use ovestin twice a week.

[sheila99]

My insomnia was from oestrogen deficiency. It was the same patern as yours, no problem getting to sleep but awake un the early hours and no chance of getting back to sleep. Perhaps you could try increasing your oestrogen? If 75 is too much you can cut a piece off and increase it gradually.

[Petra]

Hi Petra, like you when I take Utrogestan I feel very lethargic. I am now taking it vaginally and the lethargy has gone and sleep seems similar than when taking it orally. It’s only early days for me so waiting to see what happens.

I think we all have different reactions to Utrogestan (etc). I don’t need Utrogestan as I had a hysterectomy but wanted to try it for the sleep benefits. I had tried the mirena coil (12 years ago) but stopped after 3 months as I had a few aura migraines, felt a bit uncomfortable having something so permanent as I had bad experiences on the Pill. BUT I remember that I had the best sleep then. Knowing what I know now about mirena, it takes about 6 months to settle rather than 3.

I tried Utrogestan last year orally for 2 weeks and gave up as I felt so lethargic on it and felt foggy. On a forum someone said that it really improved after 6 weeks (a long time to feel unwell…) or some even longer. I decided to try again 2 weeks ago, did one week orally, started to feel lethargic after 5 days and now been 6 days vaginally. So really early days. I read that some women have reactions when they take it vaginally but it’s been fine so far.  I also use ovestin twice a week.

I tried Utro vaginally for a while, too. It helped with the stomach issues I was having on it, but not with the lack of energy. I'd been on it for nearly two years when I stopped in January. Good luck, and thanks for the information.

[Petra]

My insomnia was from oestrogen deficiency. It was the same patern as yours, no problem getting to sleep but awake un the early hours and no chance of getting back to sleep. Perhaps you could try increasing your oestrogen? If 75 is too much you can cut a piece off and increase it gradually.

How did you find out it was from oestrogen deficiency? Was it trial and error, as in, when you upped the dose you slept better? Are you on 75mcg patches?

[Uma17]

Hi Petra, insomnia is a pain. Have a look at the sleepyhead programme, I did it for 6 months and it has helped no end with sleep anxiety and my sleep. It’s a tough programme but it works.

Maybe give provera a bit longer, it is still early days and every night perfect sleep does not exist. If I don’t sleep well for a couple of nights now, I don’t mind, I know that I will sleep well on the 3rd night (with anxiety I would have stayed awake). .

You could indeed try to add some estrogen, maybe ask for gel to add to your patch? It will need time to settle so another 3 months to wait.

There is also cyclogest, an alternative to Utrogestan. Were you on 100 Utrogestan? I think cyclogest is 200 or 400 but not sure.

[sheila99]

My insomnia was from oestrogen deficiency. It was the same patern as yours, no problem getting to sleep but awake un the early hours and no chance of getting back to sleep. Perhaps you could try increasing your oestrogen? If 75 is too much you can cut a piece off and increase it gradually.

How did you find out it was from oestrogen deficiency? Was it trial and error, as in, when you upped the dose you slept better? Are you on 75mcg patches?

Insomnia and anxiety were my main peri symptoms and they went with hrt (50mcg at the time, 2 increases since because of returning symptoms). I was on sequi so it's  easier to see which is oestrogen and which progesterone. I find utro makes me dopey in the day roo, it's the main reason I'm staying with a sequi regime. Insomnia is awful, you just can't function without sleep. The way I see it you have nothing to lose by trying an increase in oestrogen. If it doesn't help you can always reduce again but you might get the good sleep and better energy.

[Petra]

Hi Petra, insomnia is a pain. Have a look at the sleepyhead programme, I did it for 6 months and it has helped no end with sleep anxiety and my sleep. It’s a tough programme but it works.

Maybe give provera a bit longer, it is still early days and every night perfect sleep does not exist. If I don’t sleep well for a couple of nights now, I don’t mind, I know that I will sleep well on the 3rd night (with anxiety I would have stayed awake). .

You could indeed try to add some estrogen, maybe ask for gel to add to your patch? It will need time to settle so another 3 months to wait.

There is also cyclogest, an alternative to Utrogestan. Were you on 100 Utrogestan? I think cyclogest is 200 or 400 but not sure.

Thanks for the encouragement. I haven't caved and gone back on Utro yet, and actually feel like I'm having a bit of a sleep breakthrough. I've been meditating every morning for a few years, and tend to get into a bit of a zone, and have been able to find that zone at night lately and fall asleep -- and fall back to sleep in the night. The main great thing about this is that the 'I'll never be able to sleep on Provera' catastrophic thinking doesn't apply anymore. So it's just a case of the usual good and bad sleep periods in life, not "Provera"!!! Never want to say I've cracked the sleep issue, but big progress!!! Yay!!

[Uma17]

Great news!
On my front, I’ve started having night sweats again since I added utro. 🤦🏼‍♀️