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Author Topic: Nas  (Read 58921 times)

Wrensong

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Re: Nas
« Reply #225 on: January 12, 2024, 08:43:19 AM »

Hi Ana21, a friend living in France was prescribed Serelys alongside her HRT.  Thank you for posting about it here.  The research is very interesting.

I'm looking for additional means of managing night time vasomotor symptoms that are proving frustratingly resistant to HRT.  I see the night time version containing melatonin & magnesium is not advised in women with autoimmune disease (I have Hashimoto's hypothyroidism) but as far as I can see from a quick trawl this morning that's not flagged up for the basic product.  Will be very interested to know if anyone here tries Femal & how they get on with it.  Can i ask have you tried it?
Wx
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Ana21

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Re: Nas
« Reply #226 on: January 15, 2024, 12:03:42 AM »

Hi Wrensong!

Sorry to hear you're still not sleeping.  You have my deepest sympathy.  During my Estrogel experiment, I was waking several times a night with night sweats. It became a struggle to function.

No, I haven't tried Femal yet.  I'm back on oral estradiol but using it sequentially this time around.  My new doctor wants to see how well it controls my symptoms, so I can't take anything else at the moment.   

I'm patiently waiting for estetrol (E4) to reach the menopause market.  It's already been approved for use in oral contraceptives so it shouldn't be long now.
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Wrensong

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Re: Nas
« Reply #227 on: January 15, 2024, 08:25:04 AM »

Hi Ana21, thank you for your empathy - the relentless sleep issue is close to making me lose my mind, but I'm sorry to know you have also been suffering badly with vasomptor symptoms.

So you are taking oral ostradiol with a progestogen sequentially now?  Have you been able to assess how that's affecting your symptoms yet or is it too early?  I'm sorry I can't remember whether you are pre or postmenopause, presumably post if you were previously on continuous HRT?

I'm progesterone intolerant & recently underwent hysterectomy for that & other reasons, but oestrogen alone is not controlling my night time vasomotor symptoms though I don't suffer much from flushing by day.  Like you I find Oestrogel especially bad for night time awakening & I assumed that was because of the once/twice a day application method leading to less steady hormone levels than with patch administration, but I don't know for sure.  I am interested in the association between oestrogen supplementation & cortisol, especailly the cortisol awakening response which I suspect is gong badly awry with me.

The overheating at night has worsened since hysterectomy last year but I had already had both ovaries removed some years ago so it's not the loss of any residual ovarian function causing the more recent worsening.  I am better for not being obliged to take any form of progesterone which was horrendous for my sleep, but much less well on HRT than I was some years ago.


Like you I am very interested in Estetrol but can't find any indication of when it might be available as a menopause treatment.  Do you know?

Sorry for taking this thread off track, but it's so helpful to talk to others in a similar situation.   Please PM me if you feel that's more appropriate.
Wx
« Last Edit: January 15, 2024, 08:26:42 AM by Wrensong »
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Ana21

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Re: Nas
« Reply #228 on: January 18, 2024, 05:34:25 AM »

Hi Wrensong!

Yes, I'm now taking oral estradiol 2mg and Prometrium/Utro 200 mg x 12 days per month.  Symptoms improving rapidly.  It will take me a few months to stabilize and I expect that will bring an end to the night sweats.  My vasomotor symptoms are definitely associated with cortisol level, so they're at their worst in the morning, starting with night sweats in the early hours and continuing with occasional hot flashes and everything that comes with elevated cortisol.  As the day progresses and my cortisol level falls, my symptoms dissipate.  I don't have hot flashes once the sun goes down and I feel better as the evening progresses.  I'm a true night owl.  I feel my best late in the evening.  It's a very productive time for me.  My body cools down in the evening and I often curl up with a book and a heating pad at bedtime.

I know you don't sweat.  I sweat profusely so it cools me down and hot flashes pass quickly.  It's not distressing, only inconvenient, and less inconvenient now that I have a sweat-proof wardrobe.  I feel the physical symptoms of morning anxiety but I know it's elevated cortisol so I don't experience it as anxiety. That helps, I think.

I've read that hot flash bother tended to be associated with higher overall cortisol levels and higher baseline levels of plasma norepinephrine. Night sweat bother, on the other hand, was associated with higher overall cortisol levels and tended to be associated with higher interleukin-6.

I mention that because "IL6 has substantial impact on thyroid function, particularly in patients with autoimmune thyroid disease."  In a study to investigate the potential association between serum inflammatory cytokine levels and thyroxine replacement dose in patients with Hashimoto disease, thyroxine replacement dose showed significant positive linear correlation with serum IL-6.  Dose per kilogram of body weight was also positively correlated with serum IL-6. You may be aware of this already, but thought it worth mentioning.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1043466606002262

https://academic.oup.com/endo/article/149/6/3062/2455199

I don't have thyroid issues and stumbled on the association while reading about IL-6.  I wonder if that's playing a role in your VMS.  With the stressful year you've had, it's not surprising that your cortisol has gone up and impacted your estrogen levels.  Lisa Mosconi puts it this way: "Stress can literally steal your estrogens. And that's because cortisol, which is the main stress hormone, works in balance with our estrogens. So if cortisol goes up, your estrogens go down; your cortisol goes down, your estrogens go back up."

Exercise is the one thing that works for me consistently to improve VMS and quality of sleep.  I need to exercise daily.  If that isn't possible, I notice the impact right away.  It might not work for everyone, but it works for me.  Even when my estrogen is rock bottom (undetectable on blood test), it helps.  For me, taiji is the best medicine for high morning cortisol.  It brings immediate relief.  It's a great stress reliever.  For me, it combines the benefits of meditation and exercise.  I aim for 30 min of cardio per day.  On a bad day, when I'm struggling with hot flashes, working up a good sweat will reset my thermostat.  When the day comes that I can no longer take estrogen, I'll still have taiji.

My doctor doesn't think we'll have to wait too long for estetrol to be approved for menopause treatment, since it was approved for use as an oral contraceptive in 2021. No idea whether it will be offered as a combined tablet or on its own. 




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Ana21

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Re: Nas
« Reply #229 on: January 19, 2024, 04:10:23 PM »

Just wanted to correct something I wrote in my prev post.  Referring to exercise, I wrote:  "Even when my estrogen is rock bottom (undetectable on blood test), it helps."  I was referring to Estradiol (E2) only.  When using transdermal estrogen, my E2 is so low that test results show "<40 pmol/L", so anywhere between 0 and 39 pmol/L.  I will still have other estrogens in my body.  At least where I am, there is no test for estrone, so I have no idea how oral estrogen affects my estrone levels or what my body produces.  That would be interesting to know.  And then there's also brain-derived estrogens, etc.

My apologies for side-tracking this thread.  I wanted to respond to Wrensong.  I should have sent her a PM instead.



Hi Nas!  I hope the sertraline and GABA tea help.  Curious about the GABA tea.
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Wrensong

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Re: Nas
« Reply #230 on: January 22, 2024, 11:03:11 AM »

Ana21, thank you so much for taking the time to reply so helpfully & at length.  I'm not on the forum much at the mo so I have copied out your reply & will look into the IL-6 association later as this is something I have not looked at before.

It's good to know you are able to manage your vasomotor symptoms adequately & I hope once you stabilise on your latest HRT regimen you will be rid of sleep disturbances, as you expect.

I hope your doctor is right about Estetrol as we could all do with as many options for menopause treatments as possible.
Wx

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Penguin

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Re: Nas
« Reply #231 on: January 22, 2024, 11:26:09 AM »

Just wanted to correct something I wrote in my prev post.  Referring to exercise, I wrote:  "Even when my estrogen is rock bottom (undetectable on blood test), it helps."  I was referring to Estradiol (E2) only.  When using transdermal estrogen, my E2 is so low that test results show "<40 pmol/L", so anywhere between 0 and 39 pmol/L.  I will still have other estrogens in my body.  At least where I am, there is no test for estrone, so I have no idea how oral estrogen affects my estrone levels or what my body produces.  That would be interesting to know.  And then there's also brain-derived estrogens, etc.

My apologies for side-tracking this thread.  I wanted to respond to Wrensong.  I should have sent her a PM instead.



Hi Nas!  I hope the sertraline and GABA tea help.  Curious about the GABA tea.

The GABA tea is amazing, that shop does both Amber and Ruby. Ruby is about 25% stronger but I've found Amber is always enough. I got it to help me over the withdrawal I get at the end of the utrogestan phase on my sequi regime. You get a dip in GABA then which spirals my anxiety and it worked for that, but I've found it so calming  that one cup (made with a teaspoon of tea) is equivalent to a 2.5mg dose of diazepam  so I now use it all month long, picking time of day depending on how anxious I feel. It calms my body but with a clarity of mind you don't get once you pop a benzo
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fiftyplus

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Re: Nas
« Reply #232 on: January 22, 2024, 11:35:28 AM »

Am I right that gaba, amber and ruby are all teas (sorry I haven't heard of them before) - which one is equivalent of diazepam and where could I buy them? x  :)
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Penguin

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Re: Nas
« Reply #233 on: January 22, 2024, 12:40:31 PM »

Am I right that gaba, amber and ruby are all teas (sorry I haven't heard of them before) - which one is equivalent of diazepam and where could I buy them? x  :)

GABA is a neurotransmitter which calms the nervous system. Certain oolong teas are harvested in a particular way to have high concentrations of it. Meileaf tea company sell both a amber gaba tea, and a Ruby gaba tea. The Ruby gaba has higher gaba in it but I started amd stuck with the Amber. It is immensely calming. I will find you a link to the shop and post below.
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Penguin

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Re: Nas
« Reply #234 on: January 22, 2024, 12:43:43 PM »

Am I right that gaba, amber and ruby are all teas (sorry I haven't heard of them before) - which one is equivalent of diazepam and where could I buy them? x  :)



Just realised they also sell an amethyst one,  I don't know anything about that. But the amber and Ruby were recommended by my acupuncturist/ Chinese medicine practitioner x

One teaspoon in a mug of boiling water, wait 5 mins then scoop the leaves out and drink as is.

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link removed
« Last Edit: January 22, 2024, 01:16:49 PM by Emma »
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fiftyplus

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Re: Nas
« Reply #235 on: January 22, 2024, 12:55:23 PM »

@Penguin, thank you so much - much appreciated x  :)
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discogirl

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Re: Nas
« Reply #236 on: January 22, 2024, 02:53:26 PM »

Am I right that gaba, amber and ruby are all teas (sorry I haven't heard of them before) - which one is equivalent of diazepam and where could I buy them? x  :)



Just realised they also sell an amethyst one,  I don't know anything about that. But the amber and Ruby were recommended by my acupuncturist/ Chinese medicine practitioner x

One teaspoon in a mug of boiling water, wait 5 mins then scoop the leaves out and drink as is.

---------
link removed

Hi Penguin

Sorry to jump in. Could I possibly have the link for that tea as well please xx
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Nas

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Re: Nas
« Reply #237 on: January 22, 2024, 03:48:38 PM »

I love this. We are all on the Gaba tea? ;D

It is indeed very relaxing, I will say that.

My next stop is CBD. Been there before with it, but will re visit.

Hormonal anxiety is horrid today. Literally felt as though I couldn’t breath earlier at the tip. Or it could be a combination of the thought of returning to work, stuff that needs doing in house, meno, getting DS through his GCSES and life itself!

I joined a f/b group the other month. Possibly a bad idea at the moment and may fuel my anxiety further  :-\
« Last Edit: January 22, 2024, 04:39:04 PM by Nas »
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Penguin

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Re: Nas
« Reply #238 on: January 22, 2024, 04:42:04 PM »

Am I right that gaba, amber and ruby are all teas (sorry I haven't heard of them before) - which one is equivalent of diazepam and where could I buy them? x  :)



Just realised they also sell an amethyst one,  I don't know anything about that. But the amber and Ruby were recommended by my acupuncturist/ Chinese medicine practitioner x

One teaspoon in a mug of boiling water, wait 5 mins then scoop the leaves out and drink as is.

---------
link removed

Hi Penguin

Sorry to jump in. Could I possibly have the link for that tea as well please xx

Hi I had an email from Emma to say the link I posted had been removed as we're not allowed to post links to commercial companies.
 Hpwever, the name is meileaf tea so if you google that it should take you to the tearoom and you can order via there. The products are hard to find but if you use the search function for amber gaba it will come up x
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discogirl

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Re: Nas
« Reply #239 on: January 22, 2024, 04:44:36 PM »

Thanks so much x
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