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[Clovie]

So cross!!

Had an appt with gynae consultant today.
Backstory - I'm 59 and i truly believe I am still having periods.
My periods have never stopped. I get regular 6ish day bleeds, (on a 21 to 26 day cycle) all the usual PMT symptoms beforehand and bleeds take the pattern of a period.
Been on HRT for 10 years now due to hot flushes, never been able to sync HRT due to short menstrual cycle. So was having my own periods and withdrawal bleeds.
I was found to be anaemic - hence lots of appts....
In the meantime advised to start continuous HRT instead of sequential.

I had a scan.
The sonographer told me lining was thin (good)
Womb of a still menstruating woman (good)
No fibroids/irregularities etc (good)



Follow up with consultant today.
He thinks they could not be periods???
talked about me coming off HRT soon as I've been on it a long time and it could be causing 'irregular bleeding'

I've been on continuous utrogestan for 3 months and 'periods' still regular.

Scared he was threating to stop my HRT?
So cross and scared!!

Please, any opinions?




.

[Flossieteacake]

So sorry to hear you are going through this Clovie. Others will know more then me but one thing I do know is, HRT can be taken for life and research has shown it can help protect bones as well as help the brain.

Your scan sounds great so I cannot think why they would suggest you stopping HRT. Women can have periods at 59 and it seems really odd for a gynae not to know that. I never really trust them when it comes to HRT as they do not know as much as a menopause clinic.

You are entitled to carry on with the HRT. It is shocking for a professional not to know women can have periods at 59!

[Mary G]

Clovie, this consultant should know that some women bleed at different intervals on continuous combined HRT.

I was told the following by a gynaecologist. 

Progesterone works like a kind of regulator on the womb lining so if you are taking a high dose of progesterone and a lowish dose of oestrogen you will never bleed,.  If you take a high dose of oestrogen and a fairly low dose of progesterone and the womb lining starts the build up, you will bleed.  Both scenarios are based on using oestrogen and progesterone on a continuous combined basis.

Obviously it you use oestrogen but never take any progesterone, your womb lining will either build up to a dangerous level or you will have erratic bleeding.

Your scan was normal so there is no reason why you should stop using HRT.  If this consultant refuses to prescribe it I would find somebody else who can or alternatively I would buy it from an online pharmacy.

What type/dose of HRT are you using?

[Dotty]

The up to date guidance is that you can stay on HRT for as long as you need it. There is no age when you have to stop it .

[Kathleen]

Hello ladies.

The Consultant I saw last week said that he believed HRT, especially high amounts of Oestrogen were causing many problems. He then said something about sending out a message to medics about  over prescribing.

We didn't dwell on the subject but I wonder if some hospitals and doctors are trying to reduce the number of women on HRT?

The Consultant also said that the private clinics were adding to the problem by prescribing very high doses of Oestrogen.

I wonder if change is in the air and if so women need to be alert to it and prepared to argue their case.

I don't want to alarm anyone but forewarned is forearmed.

Take care ladies.

K.

[Clovie]

Hello ladies.

The Consultant I saw last week said that he believed HRT, especially high amounts of Oestrogen were causing many problems. He then said something about sending out a message to medics about  over prescribing.

We didn't dwell on the subject but I wonder if some hospitals and doctors are trying to reduce the number of women on HRT?

The Consultant also said that the private clinics were adding to the problem by prescribing very high doses of Oestrogen.

I wonder if change is in the air and if so women need to be alert to it and prepared to argue their case.

I don't want to alarm anyone but forewarned is forearmed.

Take care ladies.

K.

Thanks for this Kathleen, interesting.
I only use x2 pumps of gel per day. i told him this. Would this be considered a high dose?

Thanks x

[Dotty]

2 pumps is a medium dose and is within prescribing limits.

 The latest articles relate to doctors who are prescribing outside licensed doses.

Licensed doses are up to 4 pumps of gel; 100 patch; 2mg oral and 3 sprays of Lenzetto.  x

[Clovie]

2 pumps is a medium dose and is within prescribing limits.

 The latest articles relate to doctors who are prescribing outside licensed doses.

Licensed doses are up to 4 pumps of gel; 100 patch; 2mg oral and 3 sprays of Lenzetto.  x

Thanks, Dotty 

[sheila99]

There are many stories like yours and it makes me so cross. You don't need to 'truly believe', you know your own body better than anyone else and you know when it's a period. There seems to be textbook that says everyone is post meno by 54 and sadly many doctors seem to believe it. I was told by a specialist that at 57 (pre hrt) I couldn't possibly still have my own periods. Then aged 60 discussed lack of hrt induced bleeds with gp and mentioned the 2 recent periods I'd had. Panic and urgent referral for 'unexplained bleeding' which of course showed nothing.  Search for late menopause on here for a thread where there are many of us with late menopause. Some women aren't meno until their early 60s.
As above, there is now no age limit for hrt though it used to be 60 so perhaps your gp is out of date (NICE guidelines) . I was on gel/utro so varied the cycle according to my own hormones (some can tell when they ovulate but I get sore boobs on prog so start it then), perhaps this is an option for you if you find conti doesn't suit you. IMO conti should be prescribed when the meno timeline is right not because of age.

[Clovie]

There are many stories like yours and it makes me so cross. You don't need to 'truly believe', you know your own body better than anyone else and you know when it's a period. There seems to be textbook that says everyone is post meno by 54 and sadly many doctors seem to believe it. I was told by a specialist that at 57 (pre hrt) I couldn't possibly still have my own periods. Then aged 60 discussed lack of hrt induced bleeds with gp and mentioned the 2 recent periods I'd had. Panic and urgent referral for 'unexplained bleeding' which of course showed nothing.  Search for late menopause on here for a thread where there are many of us with late menopause. Some women aren't meno until their early 60s.
As above, there is now no age limit for hrt though it used to be 60 so perhaps your gp is out of date (NICE guidelines) . I was on gel/utro so varied the cycle according to my own hormones (some can tell when they ovulate but I get sore boobs on prog so start it then), perhaps this is an option for you if you find conti doesn't suit you. IMO conti should be prescribed when the meno timeline is right not because of age.

Thanks Sheila.
It's like some Drs WANT to find something wrong no matter what results show
I have no pain
I have no spotting
I have no dryness down below
No bleeding after sex


I've been left feeling like a total and utter freak.

He has taken more blood to see if my blood count has gone up.
Now I have another week of stress waiting for THAT result although I feel much better (less faint) than I did

I feel like a trapped animal  ...

[Claire MM]

Just to comment on the question about age and HRT, I recently looked at the BMS guidelines and they say there should be no arbitrary limit placed on the age of someone being prescribed HRT it might be worth looking at their info, also it is worth looking at the NICE shared decision making guidelines. I have had experience of this lately with menopause clinic/gp surgery so I understand how it feels (not the same just struggles over HRT, not listening). This is your medical care and you have a say in it, particularly as there are no concerns regarding the lining of the womb. How has the bleeding been since going continuous? You can also point out to him that intermittant bleeding is common on a continuous regime for 6-9 months anyway. I hope you are on a good iron supplement and I'm sorry you are dealing with this. It's so important for medical people to listen to women and respect that it is their body xx

[sheila99]

I've been left feeling like a total and utter freak.

Unique possibly  , freak definitely not. The problem is his ignorance, it isn't you. I look on it as a positive, we've had our own protection for heart and bones longer than most.

[Hurdity]

Hi clovie

So sorry to hear about your difficult experiences with medics over HRT and your situation.

Before commenting further just to say regarding periods - whether they are or they are not, without certain types of investigation which are not usually carried out, once you are on HRT it is impossible to say definitively whether your periods are natural or not. The only way to find out whether a woman is truly menopausal is to be off HRT for at least 12 months and see if a period occurs. The other way I gather is to take a scan of the ovaries and look at the eggs etc - I'm not familiar with the details. However that is not to say that you are not having natural periods ie you could well be - though this is very much on the minority end of the scale...but someone has to be!! Also some docs are wrong if they think everyone is post-meno at 54, I think the stats (which probably will be based on studies of Western women not on HRT) say approx 80%? That is a big number who won't be!!!

However, that being said - the consultant was doing the right thing in investigating whether or not the bleeding was abnormal or normal but having looked into it and the health of your womb, and pronounced it healthy - then that should be an indication that all is well and no reason to stop!! As others have said - it is your body and your decision, provided everything has been looked into and there is no arbitrary age limit on HRT.

Have you thought of taking the utrogestan cyclically again - maybe a higher dose (sorry don't know what dose of oestrogen and prog you are using) but if the lining is being shed, and there are no abnormalities - then there should be no worries. The only thing is they should keep an eye on it, because it is more worrying the older one gets, just in case.....and your body's response to HRT may change as mine has ( ie lining thickened when it didn't do so in the past...).

I hope you manage to resolve this soon so that you can continue taking the HRT you need without hassle

Hurdity x

[CLKD]

Gynaecologists often have little idea about menopause etc..  Could you see a specific menopause specliast ? 

If everything is 'within normal limits' for you, then there isn't any reason to stop a regime that is working. 

[HellsBells]

There is such a thing as late onset menopause. This can happen in your 60s. It's a common and simple phenomenon. Your doctor needs to read a book or two. There are, however, significant supply chain problems relating to HRT, and there is a growing reluctance to prescribe where another explanation or drug route is possible. I can't prove that the two are linked but it is coincidental.

Menopause is under researched and women's problems are often low down the priority.

Many doctors are behind the researchers too. I know that the health crisis that is dementia has led to research and proposals to give women HRT for life due to the protective benefits.