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[Pippa52]

Hi All, I have been slowly increasing my Estradot patch dose as advised by the Meno consultant and for the last 2 weeks have been on around 69 having been advised to go up to a 75 patch.  For the last 2 weeks I have felt really tired and washed out although some nights not sleeping particularly well, slightly weak, jittery, achey muscles and joints, dizzy, bloating, itchy skin and grotty headache and generally pretty meh.  Has anyone else suffered similar symptoms going up on a dose?  I am really hoping that it will level out before long but am very sensitive to doses of any drugs etc so wonder if maybe this is too high a dose for me. I still have to change the patch every 3 days or just under as I can certainly spot signs of low oestrogen too when the patch is clearly running out.  My last blood test a few weeks ago when I was on a dose of just over 50 was 144 which has gone up from the one before when it was only 53.  Just beginning to get totally fed up and disheartened and feeling pretty rubbish. Would be very grateful for any similar experiences or advice. xx

[CLKD]

MayB don't use the 'extra' amount every night?  3 times a week might help initially.  Some find that keeping a mood/food/syptom diary of use.

[Gnatty]

They sound like symptoms of low oestrogen and/ or low testosterone. Your level is still very low too isn't it? I can't think it's too much oestrogen based on that, so I guess your symptoms are either settling in ones and they will gradually improve or you will need to go still further. Out of interest where are you putting the gel and are you a spreader or a rubber? You could try doing the opposite to what you are doing now and see if you get better absorption that way. For some, rubbing in seems better and for others just spreading. Outer arms aren't so good, but inner thighs are good where the skin is thinner. Some women like to do inner forearms where skin is again thinner. As always so many variables. If only there was just one correct way!

[Gnatty]

Please ignore that message, I see you are on patches!!

[Pippa52]

HI Gnatty thanks so much for your reply.  I am on Estradot patches and not the gel.  Unfortunately I did not absorb Oestrogel at all which is when my blood level was only 53.  I am really hoping that it will all level out before too long.  PS No worry re your second post I am really grateful for all help and advice on here from all the knowledgeable ladies xx

[Pippa52]

MayB don't use the 'extra' amount every night?  3 times a week might help initially.  Some find that keeping a mood/food/syptom diary of use.

Hi CLKD I change the patch every 3 days which the Meno consult said was ok.  Occasionally I can tell the patch has worn right out and that is the only time I will put on the patch a few hours early or at the most at  2 /1/2 days in but to be fair that has got much less now.x

[Gilla999]

Pippa I don't have any words of wisdom to offer you but I do think the symptoms you describe can equally be from too much or too little Estrogen. I recognise everything you describe as what I experience when it's too much. The levels people need to feel well or which trigger off symptoms of either too high or too low appear to vary massively from person to person, so I wouldn't read too much into that on its own. If my level was 153 I'd have left this world  but that may well be OK for you.

Would it be possible to back dose and see if that helps? What dose did you go to 69 from? And remind me what Progesterone you use? Progesterone balances Estrogenoc symptoms so it could equally be that the levels aren't balanced as opposed to the E being too high as a stand alone thing.

When was the last time you had a blood test for both E and P?

Sorry for all the questions xx

[Pippa52]

Hi Gilla999 and thanks so much for your reply which I really appreciate.  I have in fact dropped my dose back to 62 from last night.  I do not need to take progesterone as I had a full hysterectomy  many years ago.  Its really interesting that you say that you recognise the symptoms as high oestrogen as I think that for me that is what they were too.  I was increasing on advice from the Meno consultant but I honestly now know that that dose and upwards was just too much for me.  Today thankfully the headache is diminishing and I don't feel quite as spaced out just completely wiped out.  I so hope that the lower dose will be a better option for me.  I am using a 37.5 patch plus as 25 one so no cutting involved either.  I had a blood test a month or so ago and have today booked another for the week after next.  On my last blood test (144) I was only on a 50 patch so maybe the little jump up to 62 might help a bit with the level.  I really take on board what you say about blood tests and them not being the most important thing as I would rather feel more human with a lower blood level any day   Thanks again so much for your post. How are you feeling?  Have you had any improvements? xxx

[Gilla999]

I'm glad you've dropped back Pippa, at the very least you'll be able to assess if it helps you or not. It is so confusing that the symptoms of high Estrogen are often the same as low, and I think naturally if one has suffered from one of those, then we assume it must be that for someone else. But it's only through our own trials and tribulations that we eventually get to know our own symptoms. For example for me night sweats and 3am insomnia are my "beacons" of low Estrogen, where as raging anxiety, breathlessness, palpitations and allergy symptoms are my definite high.

I am also discovering that - just like you - even the smallest dose changes can trigger things in either direction. I think others must think I'm mad with that, but you get to know what method works for you and that's all that matters.

If you were on 144 on a 50 patch then fingers crossed you've got a bit more from 62, and even better that there is no cutting involved on that dose, so more accurate. I really hope things settle down a bit - it might take a couple of days to fully right itself.

After a few days of no mast cell / autoimmune issues or depression on a 37.5mg patch, the mast cell stuff has started to creep back last night, which I think is as a result of my Progesterone falling due to the time in my cycle (Progesterone balances out Estrogen, especially when it comes to allergy/mast cell issues). My Estrogen blood test came back at still super high - 890 pmol - and I really need/want to get it down, but like you struggle with dose changes. I have cut a tiny slither off my patch today! Unlike you, I think I am a super absorber though 

Xx

[Pippa52]

Hi Gilla - thanks for your kind words.  I truly could not go on feeling that rubbish so I am hoping so much the slightly lower dose will turn the corner (well I can but hope but as we know this all seems to be a permanent roller coaster!) Yes - just like you - the smallest dose can make a huge difference in symptoms. Gosh your oestrogen level certainly is high but hopefully if you do re-act a lot to even a small dose change then the sliver you have but off might make a difference  for you I so hope it does.   I totally get you when you say that then makes the depression kick in.  Honestly it is just so complex.  I haven't felt so down for ages - it probably is only the hormone issues but it is so hard to deal with that on top of everything else as I know you know only too well.  Hermes hoping your dose reduction will really help you.  Take care xxxx