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[MrsMitch]

Hi there 
I've just joined and unfortunately I'm here because I have problems.
I'm just about to turn 55 and after horrendous endometriosis from age 12 which left me unable to have children, I hoped I'd sail through the menopause like my mum did. Ha, no chance! Everything started almost as soon as the 1st lock down happened so once I realised what was going on, there was no way to see a GP for advice.
A customer told me as I sat in her garden bathed in sweat, that she had success with agnus cactus so I tried it and it really helped for a few months. Then as it's effectiveness wore off, I added in sage and red clover, again helpfull for a few months. Once they no longer worked, by now I was getting a period once every 4 months, I tired bio identical HRT which did nothing.
My main issues are hot flushes, chills, night sweats and an inability to stay asleep for longer than an hour at a time, all night, every night.
So about 12 months ago I called the GP she didn't see me, didn't ask about family health history, just gave me HRT tablets. I can't remember which ones they were but because friends we telling me all the health horror stories of HRT constantly, they stayed in the drawer. Then one night after standing barefoot in the snow I'm my garden at 3am, I thought ' these friends have not had the struggles I'm having so I'll try HRT. Took it for 3 months and I was beginning to get more sleep and only feeling a bit warm at times.
Then I was told there was a shortage of the tablets I was taking so I was given others, then they were unavailable so I was given Evorel Sequi patches. They gave me dreadful rashes and after a few months, my symptoms were returning. Then I was given Oestragel & Utrogestan and now I'm nearing the end of month 4 my symptoms are gradually returning. I'm about 8 months with no bleeds so i believe that governs my type of HRT. Symptoms never go totally, but certainly improve to the point I can tolerate them. But the lack of deep sleep, waking every morning exhausted, is just dreadful.
So ladies, I'm sure you're all much worse than me and I'm complaining about nothing, but I'm glad this forum is here.
Looking forward to getting to know you.

[CLKD]

Try not to judge yourself against what others might tell you or what you may read anywhere ;-)

   some find that keeping a mood/food/symptom diary.  Some HRT requires hiking occasionally to get a comfortable regime. 

Some 'alternatives' help for a short while B4 the effects wear off.  None should be taken for too long without a break. 

My periods waxed and waned until suddenly I realised they had gone.  I would miss months then they would return fairly regularly; then gone again  . To be menopausal we have count 12 months without a bleed, however; Nature can throw in a curved ball so we need to begin counting again 

Browse round. Ask away.

[Flossieteacake]

Hello MrsMitch and welcome to the forum. You have nothing to apologise for. It is helpful your post is detailed as it enables members to understand your situation.

I have found with HRT that it needs tweaking now and again so do not worry about that happening to you. Patches can cause skin irritation due to the glue. It sounds like you may just need an increase in the Oestragel to me but I am sure other members will have other ideas.

[MrsMitch]

Thank you so much for you're replies and warm welcome. Just reading your posts gave me a boost. I'm sure you all know that in the depths of a sleepless night or when struggling on everyday with your symptoms it can feel like an isolating experience.  It's so good to know you're all here and understand. 

[discogirl]

  mrs mitch

im on the gel started on patches intially then moved to gel in nov. i personally much prefer the gel.

i sort of skipped through peri until everything went pear shaped last yr. im post meno.

id always slept well but amongst my other symptoms was insomnia and its awful.

the gel helps but it does need tweaking and patience.

i put the gel on inner thighs and i alternate to upper outer arms. besins have stated that it is important to alternate site of application to avoid skin being over saturated.

its a great forum with lots of help x

[Zoe]

Well it sounds like you have been having a horrendous time, MrsMitch! Lack of sleep is just the worst.

Some questions...

How many pumps of oestrogel are you on? As Flossieteacake says, it certainly sounds like you could do with an increase.

Does the utrogestan make you sleepy at all at bedtime? Doesn't sound like it.

8 months with no bleeds will have some impact on the HRT regime, many doctors preferring a sequi regime but others will say it is fine to go to a continuous regime if you have been on HRT for over a year (seems you might have been since you have had various types). But you would need some medical advice.

Are you confident that your GP is prescribing confidently? You may well be. Or you might want to be referred to a menopause specialist.

Agnus castus - I used that in early days too and it was really useful but not strong enough as things developed. Sadly.

[MrsMitch]

Yaay what a lovely bunch of ladies you are 🙂 lots of helpful replies.

Jaypo:
I've not tried Benadryl but I have had a short course of other prescription sleeping tabs.  The thing is, I can fall asleep at the drop of a hat, it's staying asleep that's the problem. Then I have to pee. But as soon as I get back into bed and the hot flush passes I drop off straight away, only to wake again within the hour. Repeat hourly. Even on the sleeping tabs, it was the same. They just didn't keep me asleep.

Discogirl:
I'm on 2 pumps and thanks for the tip of rotating the application site, I haven't done that so will now.

Zoe:
2 pumps
The 1st 2 nights I took utrogestan I went out like a light. I only woke up twice which for me would be a normal night and I felt so rested. Since then there has been no effect. I'm careful not to eat (I make sure 3 hours before I take them)
I haven't been taking HRT for a year yet as I hesitated taking it initially.

I have no confidence in my GP what so ever. I get a different one each time and she has to go and ask another GP what to prescribe me.

Finally, I'm really really angry at the moment.  After reading around on the site this evening, I've discovered I have vaginally atrophy.  I started with burning pain internally (obviously during sex!) and burning pain at the entrance to my vagina in about 2012. I was caring for my late father at the time and didn't do anything. When he died i saw a GP to no avail and she finally referred me to a gynae in 2015. She said I had vulvadynia. She gave me a steroid injection which made no difference and just couldn't do anything to bring relief. Finally, I asked if she could prescribe local anaesthetic cream so I could be intimate with my husband. She didn't after telling me it wouldn't work as it was nerve pain. We'll it did work and she said she wouldn't see me any more as she couldn't help. I have the majority of the symptoms for VA and it took about 30 mins of reading to find that out, compared to her expertise!!
I do have oestrogen pessaries which I've only tried a couple of times, so at least I know now how to ease my symptoms...not sure about needing to pee so much.
But to see a specialist, be in so much pain and be misdiagnosed makes me angry. I'm sure those of you who have it know the agony of it. I've come home from work in the summer and sat with no underwear and an ice pack between my legs. And she said she couldn't do anything to help!!!
That's also why I have no confidence I my GP, they also don't seem bothered and I haven't seen anyone face to face.
So ladies, thank you, thank you, thank you. Your here, you're full of info and help and know far more than those paid to know more!

[Flossieteacake]

While I was reading your last post and you mention needing to go to the loo all night I was about to mention VA but see you have already realised. I am so sorry you had to go through all that. Sadly, so many GPs do not seem to even know what it is and will suggest all sorts of other things which will never help the condition. You needing to pee a lot is classic VA and it is great you have the oestrogen pessaries. I would use one now so you can start the treatment right away.

I had a bad experience too and even suggested I have VA to my GP who told me I did not have any of the symptoms when I actually had all of them. I totally understand why you feel angry. Have a look at the burning thread in the private lives section as there are lots of tips on there too.

[CLKD]

Get copies of Me and My Menopausal Vagina: read and pass on ;-).  GPs, Practice Nurses, hair dressers, friends ....... written by a member of MM.  Available on Amazon.

Every Student should be given a copy !

[MrsMitch]

Thank you CLKD, I will. I think I could write a book myself, my vagina has been nothing but trouble since I was about 3 yrs old!! Hoped by the time I was this age it'd be getting better, not worse 

[sheila99]

Apart from the local oestrogen for VA I think you'd benefit from increasing to 3 pumps oestrogel as your meno symptoms aren't under control. My worst symptoms were insomnia and anxiety and they went completely after 3 months. I can sympathise, it's impossible to feel well when you can't sleep. It isn't at all unusual to need more as your own production reduces. Are you taking 200mg utro 12 days a month?

[CLKD]

Morning.  Did U get treatment for your vagina/bladder, lots of little girls have problems - but it is rarely spoken about!

[MrsMitch]

Hello Sheila,  I need to get a repeat of my HRT so I will ask to speak to the GP about increasing the dose, thank you.

Jaypo: I've got a box full of pessaries and started last night again but I feel much more knowledgeable about my condition after just one evening on here! I've also just ordered the book CLKD recommended.

CLKD:
Long story with my bits!! My mum did take me to see a couple of GPs but early '70s I don't know if they knew what it was. I used to get stabbing pains inside my vagina. It would come on suddenly and I can remember how painful it was to this day. The GP prescribed various creams but they didn't do anything.  It always happened at night. It stopped when I was about 10 then 2 years later I started my periods and agonising pain from day one! I refused to see a GP (I guess embarrassed at that age) and unfortunately over the counter painkillers back then weren't great. It wasn't until I was 34 that I had a scan for a suspected ovarian cyst that endometriosis was diagnosed. Then at about 40 I noticed a small patch inside my vagina was sore during sex and that developed into VA. Oh the joys of my bits  >: But thank you for asking 

[Zoe]

I am glad you are learning more about your symptoms but not the least surprised by your anger. Hopefully you can find a constructive way of venting it. I admit to having screamed into a pillow on 2 occasions. 

Agree with others on increase in oestrogel. Ideally, get a prescription that allows you to try 3 pumps for 6 weeks but also gives you the freedom to increase to 3.5 then 4 if you feel you need it. Is there a menopause clinic in your area that you can be referred to? Apologies if you already said.

Re the utrogestan. I wouldn't be too concerned about a whole 3 hours after eating thing. If you take it closer to eating then all it does is increase bioavailability. Taking utrogestan with food will make you very drowsy - too drowsy.

If you take it an hour after food then you will be less drowsy than taking it with food, but more drowsy than waiting 3 hours. Hope that makes sense.

Personally, I take it within an hour of food and have never had any problems. Did take it with food once by accident and wouldn't do that again.

Hope you can get started on Vagifem or similar soon for the VA. X

[Kathleen]

Hello Mrs Mitch and welcome to the forum.

You have had a very hard time of it and you have my sympathy.

My only experience of VA was when I came off all HRT a few years ago. Two weeks of no Oestrogen and I began to realise how awful this condition can be. I had never known such a strange burning and itching sensation! I tried  over the counter remedies with varied success and a vaginal moisturiser called Yes was very effective however a return to HRT was the best thing. I have now realised that it only takes a little extra Oestrogen for me to feel comfortable but I still require one bathroom visit every night.

You say that you have some oestrogen pessaries and I wonder were these prescribed by your GP? If you want to find out more you can put the product name into the search box on this forum.

Wishing you well and take care.

K.