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[Stella2]

I hope someone can help. I have just read the thread about symptoms of high and low estrogen and I am confused.
I have now been taking 1mg Sandrena and one Utrogestan daily for 4 months. My main symptom for years have been numerous hot flushes. I still have some night sweats, in the last month tender breasts and mood swings appeared and some heart palpitations that I never had before. I feel sometimes hotter during the day too. A month ago i spoke to my GP and she offered estrogen patch assuming that that might give better coverage and said that Sandrena cannot be increased. She hasn't offered a blood test.

My concern is that changing from gel to patch could cause bleeding - i have cervical stenosis so this might be a problem. I haven't experienced bleeding on this regime.

Also, could my symptoms actually mean that my estrogen is too high?
Hopefull for any advice.

[Nik2502]

Hi Stella

I don’t see why you can’t increase the Sandrena. Many of us are on higher doses.

Your symptoms are similar to mine and I’ve just reduced my gel and am feeling slightly better. I’ve found you just have to ‘fiddle’ with the doses to see what suits best.

I’ve never bled with a change of regime but we are all different so I can’t comment on that.

Nik x

[Stella2]

Thank you Nik! Maybe I should reduce too, rather than increase. Glad to hear that about bleeding. X

[Floradora]

Hi Stella2. Unfortunately symptoms of high/low estrogen are often similar. In my case, when my estrogen dose was too high I did have heart palpitations and felt generally hot most of the time. Different to a hot flush which comes on and passes. Tender breasts and bloating can also be a sign of too much estrogen. Unfortunately everyone is different and there’s no ‘one size fits all’.  With me the tender breasts and hot feeling went away about 3 days after reducing dose so that might be worth a shot. If that’s the problem it should be apparent reasonably quickly x

[Stella2]

Hi Floradora,
Thank you,  I feel the same as you, I should try reducing Sandrena, a bit difficult as it comes in sachets. X

[Floradora]

ah yes I’ve not used Sandrena gel so not sure how you do that. Maybe just take a bit off with a tissue so not so much is absorbed?

[Kathleen]

Hello Stella2


I am currently experimenting with lowering my Sandrena gel dose. I don't have any physical symptoms  but my mood swings are really bothering me.

In the last six months I have reduced from three sachets to two and a half by bending a sachet so that only half of the gel comes out. I then used two sachets and in the past two  days I have changed to one and three quarters, again by bending or otherwise marking the sachet and squeezing out a smaller amount. I think this technique is working reasonably well so far but I am sure there are other ways to do it.
The benefit of keeping the remainder of the gel in the sachet means that it can be used next time and there is no wastage. I especially noticed this when on the two and a half dose because I closed the half empty sachet with a paper clip and used it the next day.

Hopefully other ladies will be along soon  with more ideas.

Take care.

K.

[Stella2]

Thank you for your advice Kathleen and Floradora, I will try to do so. Did you taper off slowly?

[Kathleen]

Hello again Stella2.

Last year, after about five months on three sachets I noticed definite signs of too much Oestrogen as my breasts were becoming more and more tender. I then had some brown spotting followed by a heavy bleed. This prompted me to  lower my dose  to two and a half sachets and the sore breasts quickly resolved and the bleeding stopped.

I stayed with two and a half but in Feb/March I reduced again to two sachets. In the last few days I have gone down to one and three quarters.  I am basically playing this by ear but I reason that at least there is no harm in reducing Oestrogen and if my symptoms become intolerable I can increase again. A post meno  friend of mine who is a little older than me but much taller and heavier is doing well on one pump of Oestrogel  which equates to half a sachet of Sandrena. This also makes  me wonder if my mood instability is being fed by too much Oestrogen for my age, size and meno status.

I have a meno clinic appointment in June and I will talk to my doctor then, in the meantime I will continue to titrate down to see if things improve. Watch this space lol!

Wishing you well.

K.

[Stella2]

Thank you Kathleen for this, I will try to decrease tomorrow and see how I feel.  I do hope you will find the best dose for you, as you said it depends so much on individual circumstances. I am quite small and 3 years post menopausal so I don't think I need as much.
All the best!
Stella

[Gnatty]

I'm not sure it works like that, thinner people actually tend to need more as they have far fewer fat cells in their body that store oestrogen.

[Kathleen]

Hello again ladies.

Gnatty - I have also heard that women with more fat create more of their own oestrogen however Louise Newson points out that it is a very weak form of the hormone.

To add to the confusion the researchers on Tim Spector's   Zoe site note  a trend of fewer menopausal symptoms in women with a lower BMI.

Clearly no one really knows the answer but at least some data is being collected on the subject which is a good thing.

 As I am roughly the same age and years post meno as my friend I think that I may do better on an oestrogen dose similar to hers. The NHS consultant I spoke to also suggested a lower dose so I'm giving that a try.

Wishing you well.

K.

[Stella2]

That is so interesting, all my colleagues were around the same age and l had the worst hot flushes being the thinnest. I also thought that I haven't had enough fat to produce my own estrogen. However I have always been anxious and I wonder if that also contributed to that.

[Stella2]

Just a little update, after your advice i have been reducing Sandrena, and my breasts feel much better, the pain is nearly fully gone. Also the heart palpitations ceased.

I booked an appointment with a GP to see if I can get a blood test, but that will take 3 weeks so I thought to start reducing and see if this will help. I wasn't sure if to go from 1 mg to 0.5 straight away so i decided just to take about 1/4 off the full sachet with a tissue after I squeezed it out and use the remainder.

Maybe I could even do with 0.5 now but I will wait for couple of months to reduce, I think that the recommendations are to taper off slowly. Permitting that the other symptoms do not return.

I am very grateful for your advice 

[Stella2]

Unfortunately as soon as I posted the last message I started experiencing feeling more hot, suspecting that hot flushes are returning. I wonder if it's ok to go back to full Sandrena sachet or if I have to do it slowly.
 I have been taking 3/4 of the sachet for 10 days to see if my estrogen was too high. It helped with breast tenderness and heart palpitations but I don't want hot flushes back.