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[heavenlyblue]

No problems heavenlyblue- glad to be a little help if I can - but really just my thinking aloud thoughts!

How did you get on with the BP monitor? It will be quite interesting to see how you get on with a change in progestogen and presumably she just wants to change one thing at a time? Pity you have to pay for each input but I suppose with e-mail being so easy docs would get inundated with Qs all the time. i would have thought interpretation of results along with sending them would be standard though!

re the tesosterone - it;s not so bad paying for that as if you are given a box it will last over a year depending how much you use - provided they give you enough for men. That was why I didn;t mind hvaing to pay for a private prescrption initially (but thids was 2015 before nICE Guidelines), as my actual prescription meds were relatively cheap....still too costly for some though

Haha re the sanitary products - that's what I feel - who gives a s*** what other people think eh as long as we feel well!!!

Hurdity x

Morning Hurdity x

Update.   Saw my NHS GP.  He said my BP was 140/89 unfortunately, even though that had gone down from the reading when I saw the private GP a couple of weeks ago.  He suggest I get an At Home Monitor, take 2 readings a day over a week, then come and see him.  I have one arriving tomorrow.   I gave him the letter from my private GP with the hormone results to keep him up to date.  He seemed quite happy with what she had prescribed.   

The Chemist cannot give me a date for the Evoril 50mcg so my private GP is sending me a script for Oestrogel. Said I should take 2 pumps a day.  I'm assuming that equates to 50mcg.  Haven't used a gel before, will be nice not wearing a patch for a change!  Will be so tempting to up my oestrogen a little myself.......it is frustrating knowing a higher dose of Oestogen could really help me feel better, but it can't be increased until my BP goes down....but I have to be patient and getting my BP down is important.  :-)

So  I will be at least starting the new bio regime of Oestrogel and Utrogestan soon.  And I am starting the Testogel tomorrow.   I have a three month supply to begin with.


 

[heavenlyblue]

For me, bleeding and sanitary products are not part of feeling well.

Furthermore, any hrt regime which produces such profound side effects, is not a balanced regime.

Hi KC

I completely understand what you are saying.  I think it obviously depends on the individual.

I had quite heavy periods, and last couple of years before peri-meno, they made me feel nauseous.  So yes, if going cyclical brings back heavy bleeding and nausea, then I will have to look at my options again.  But if it is just a normal bleed and I don't feel unwell, then it would be a small price to pay for how I have been feeling the past 3 years.  I almost cannot remember who I was before that.  I have lost myself.

So I am open to all suggestions and hopefully I will find the right thing for me :-) x

[KiltedCupid]

Heavenlyblue - of course it depends on the individual, it's just my opinion and I still believe that women past the age of a very late menopause shouldn't be artificially inducing bleeds, they're not fertile, there's no need to build up a womb lining and it seems to cause a lot of angst and quick referral scanning if the balance isn't right. When I had a polyp removed last year, although benign, they can tell from the biopsy that it was hrt induced and they told me that. That was enough info for me to reduce my dose and take conti hrt. My womb has done its bit for me and doesn't need further stress.

I genuinely hope you find your perfect balance and a resolution to your problems.

[Hurdity]

Morning Hurdity x

Update.   Saw my NHS GP.  He said my BP was 140/89 unfortunately, even though that had gone down from the reading when I saw the private GP a couple of weeks ago.  He suggest I get an At Home Monitor, take 2 readings a day over a week, then come and see him.  I have one arriving tomorrow.   I gave him the letter from my private GP with the hormone results to keep him up to date.  He seemed quite happy with what she had prescribed.   

The Chemist cannot give me a date for the Evoril 50mcg so my private GP is sending me a script for Oestrogel. Said I should take 2 pumps a day.  I'm assuming that equates to 50mcg.  Haven't used a gel before, will be nice not wearing a patch for a change!  Will be so tempting to up my oestrogen a little myself.......it is frustrating knowing a higher dose of Oestogen could really help me feel better, but it can't be increased until my BP goes down....but I have to be patient and getting my BP down is important.  :-)

So  I will be at least starting the new bio regime of Oestrogel and Utrogestan soon.  And I am starting the Testogel tomorrow.   I have a three month supply to begin with.

Hi again heavenlyblue - officially yes the standard medium dose of oestrogel is two pumps and for a patch it's 50 mcg - but don't worry too much as you might be one who absorbs better with gel than a patch so you may give yourself a slightly increased dose anyway. There is a huge difference in absorption between different women. Also to some extent depends on your body size (height), weight/BMI (just like with pets!). So - I wouldn't do more than 2 pumps to start with - just see how you get on with it for a few weeks.

Sorry I can't remember if there was a reason for your high BP - are you overweight (hope you don't mind my asking?) or lacking in exercise etc? There are lots of ways to reduce BP as well as meds as I'm sure you know. Reducing salt, alcohol. smoking, fats in diet (?), reducing weight, taking more exercise etc. Do hope it (BP) decreases soon! Maybe once you are taking readings yourself it will be lower. This happened with my husband - was high at the surgery but normal when we bought a monitor and he did it at home.

Hi KC

I completely understand what you are saying.  I think it obviously depends on the individual.

I had quite heavy periods, and last couple of years before peri-meno, they made me feel nauseous.  So yes, if going cyclical brings back heavy bleeding and nausea, then I will have to look at my options again.  But if it is just a normal bleed and I don't feel unwell, then it would be a small price to pay for how I have been feeling the past 3 years.  I almost cannot remember who I was before that.  I have lost myself.

So I am open to all suggestions and hopefully I will find the right thing for me :-) x

Quite so - there is no right or wrong in this - whatever works for you that makes you feel better - weighing up the risks and benefits to your health and your well-being, comfort or otherwise (which is what we do too!)

Heavenlyblue - of course it depends on the individual, it's just my opinion and I still believe that women past the age of a very late menopause shouldn't be artificially inducing bleeds, they're not fertile, there's no need to build up a womb lining and it seems to cause a lot of angst and quick referral scanning if the balance isn't right. When I had a polyp removed last year, although benign, they can tell from the biopsy that it was hrt induced and they told me that. That was enough info for me to reduce my dose and take conti hrt. My womb has done its bit for me and doesn't need further stress.

I genuinely hope you find your perfect balance and a resolution to your problems.

Well good job noone is asking you to do it kilted Cupid! If it's not right for you then fine. However it is right for many women for the reasons I gave in my previous post when you made the same points with jokes about tampons. It is clearly an issue for you but there are women on here for whom the choice (to induce a bleed) is the least worst of the different options - and no-one will say that they actually enjoy having to do this - but oh the joys of the weeks on oestrogen only!

Like I said in my previous post - aside from the side effects of continuous progesterone, there is still the question mark over (synthetic) progestogens and breast cancer, and a friend from another group also in her 60's says her private consultant is happier for her to be taking hRT cyclically to minimise progestogenic exposure.

Many of us do not want to take synthetic progestogens at all - I certainly don't into the long term, and put up with the awful business of maintaining a cycle to minimise the exposure even to body-identical progesterone (partly due to side effects) . If dydrogesterone were available separately I might give it a try.

This is actually not a trivial issue either - like I said with many women living into their 90's and current medical thinking saying that we can take HRT as long as possible.

Maintaining the right balance is an issue for all post-menopausal women and in fact it is probably easier with cyclical HRT than continuous combined....

Keep us posted heavenlyblue!

Hurdity x

[KiltedCupid]

Morning Hurdity x

Update.   Saw my NHS GP.  He said my BP was 140/89 unfortunately, even though that had gone down from the reading when I saw the private GP a couple of weeks ago.  He suggest I get an At Home Monitor, take 2 readings a day over a week, then come and see him.  I have one arriving tomorrow.   I gave him the letter from my private GP with the hormone results to keep him up to date.  He seemed quite happy with what she had prescribed.   

The Chemist cannot give me a date for the Evoril 50mcg so my private GP is sending me a script for Oestrogel. Said I should take 2 pumps a day.  I'm assuming that equates to 50mcg.  Haven't used a gel before, will be nice not wearing a patch for a change!  Will be so tempting to up my oestrogen a little myself.......it is frustrating knowing a higher dose of Oestogen could really help me feel better, but it can't be increased until my BP goes down....but I have to be patient and getting my BP down is important.  :-)

So  I will be at least starting the new bio regime of Oestrogel and Utrogestan soon.  And I am starting the Testogel tomorrow.   I have a three month supply to begin with.

Hi again heavenlyblue - officially yes the standard medium dose of oestrogel is two pumps and for a patch it's 50 mcg - but don't worry too much as you might be one who absorbs better with gel than a patch so you may give yourself a slightly increased dose anyway. There is a huge difference in absorption between different women. Also to some extent depends on your body size (height), weight/BMI (just like with pets!). So - I wouldn't do more than 2 pumps to start with - just see how you get on with it for a few weeks.

Sorry I can't remember if there was a reason for your high BP - are you overweight (hope you don't mind my asking?) or lacking in exercise etc? There are lots of ways to reduce BP as well as meds as I'm sure you know. Reducing salt, alcohol. smoking, fats in diet (?), reducing weight, taking more exercise etc. Do hope it (BP) decreases soon! Maybe once you are taking readings yourself it will be lower. This happened with my husband - was high at the surgery but normal when we bought a monitor and he did it at home.

Hi KC

I completely understand what you are saying.  I think it obviously depends on the individual.

I had quite heavy periods, and last couple of years before peri-meno, they made me feel nauseous.  So yes, if going cyclical brings back heavy bleeding and nausea, then I will have to look at my options again.  But if it is just a normal bleed and I don't feel unwell, then it would be a small price to pay for how I have been feeling the past 3 years.  I almost cannot remember who I was before that.  I have lost myself.

So I am open to all suggestions and hopefully I will find the right thing for me :-) x

Quite so - there is no right or wrong in this - whatever works for you that makes you feel better - weighing up the risks and benefits to your health and your well-being, comfort or otherwise (which is what we do too!)

Heavenlyblue - of course it depends on the individual, it's just my opinion and I still believe that women past the age of a very late menopause shouldn't be artificially inducing bleeds, they're not fertile, there's no need to build up a womb lining and it seems to cause a lot of angst and quick referral scanning if the balance isn't right. When I had a polyp removed last year, although benign, they can tell from the biopsy that it was hrt induced and they told me that. That was enough info for me to reduce my dose and take conti hrt. My womb has done its bit for me and doesn't need further stress.

I genuinely hope you find your perfect balance and a resolution to your problems.

Well good job noone is asking you to do it kilted Cupid! If it's not right for you then fine. However it is right for many women for the reasons I gave in my previous post when you made the same points with jokes about tampons. It is clearly an issue for you but there are women on here for whom the choice (to induce a bleed) is the least worst of the different options - and no-one will say that they actually enjoy having to do this - but oh the joys of the weeks on oestrogen only!

Like I said in my previous post - aside from the side effects of continuous progesterone, there is still the question mark over (synthetic) progestogens and breast cancer, and a friend from another group also in her 60's says her private consultant is happier for her to be taking hRT cyclically to minimise progestogenic exposure.

Many of us do not want to take synthetic progestogens at all - I certainly don't into the long term, and put up with the awful business of maintaining a cycle to minimise the exposure even to body-identical progesterone (partly due to side effects) . If dydrogesterone were available separately I might give it a try.

This is actually not a trivial issue either - like I said with many women living into their 90's and current medical thinking saying that we can take HRT as long as possible.

Maintaining the right balance is an issue for all post-menopausal women and in fact it is probably easier with cyclical HRT than continuous combined....

Keep us posted heavenlyblue!

Hurdity x

If that's the case, why does the medical profession prefer that post meno women use conti?
You can pluck friends out of the air and give examples as you wish, the post meno endo does not need to bleed. I don't care what progestin is used, if you're post meno, find one that suits or your risking bleeds, fibroids and polyps. That's from a consultants mouth.

[dangermouse]

[quote author=KiltedCupid
Reminds me of a fabulous sketch by the late Joan Rivers where she was ripping women who ‘accidentally' drop a tampon from their bag in an attempt to appear younger than they are. Sad, really.
[/quote]

Ha! Sad indeed, although I can imagine that kind of carry on in the LA ‘Housewives' circles.

I remember a young guy working in Boots becoming overtly flirty with me not long ago when I was browsing the sanitary aisle. It made me wonder if he requested to hang out there, excited by the fertile pheromones of all the unsuspecting women on the blob.

Yes, indeed, having all that hormonal turmoil of stopping and starting prog for HRT users is beyond unnecessary. Why the Utro manufactures haven't brought out a 50mg prog for meno, rather than only offering the fertility dosage is unfathomable. It would be a whole new income stream for them. It's great that you can get it via private docs now though for those who'd rather forsake their hard earned money for quality of life.

Guess it all comes back to the NHS being concerned more with illness than health.

[Hurdity]

If that's the case, why does the medical profession prefer that post meno women use conti?
You can pluck friends out of the air and give examples as you wish, the post meno endo does not need to bleed. I don't care what progestin is used, if you're post meno, find one that suits or your risking bleeds, fibroids and polyps. That's from a consultants mouth.

The medical profession prefers women to use continuous combined HRT firstly because it reduces the risk and incidence of endometrial cancer, secondly because it allows a steady dose of hormones which help to keep moods even, and last but not least because most women (all?) DO NOT WANT TO BLEED - including me and the others who continue to do so!!!!! I'm not sure why you keep arguing about this because all the women who have chosen to continue with a cycle do so reluctantly and I repeat as the least worst of all the options. I have given the reasons why many time so do not need to go into them again. There are risks inherent in everything we do - if we don't take hRT we may risk cardiovascular disease and osteoporosis for example earlier than we would have done, and there are risks associated with every combo of HRT - depending on type dose, duration etc but every individual weighs up these risks and decides on the best option for them.

Regarding the examples of consultants and my friend - I was giving this to demonstrate that there is no consensus about this issue even amongst the learned medical profession ( ie expert gynaecologists) - ie the breast cancer issue.

As for your comment "You can pluck friends out of the air" - this is insulting and I really don't know why you continue to talk in this aggressive and confrortational manner towards me (I'm referring here to several of your posts) - you have been doing it for a couple of weeks now and on several posts which has been noticed by other members.  It shows lack of respect for the members who start these posts as well as me. Please be a bit more friendly or if you want to disagree (which is fine) do so in a neutral manner eg if it is an information post (which are less chatty!).

Sincerely apologies heavenlyblue for saying this on your thread....

Hurdity x

[KiltedCupid]

Dangermouse - it really is baffling that utro can't be produced in smaller doses. It must, as usual, be a case of cost vs demand. It is after all, produced primarily to support pregnancies and perhaps the greatest number of users are in that group. That said, I've just started an alt day conti utro regime, and am hoping I can tolerate it as I'm running out of track!

[Wrensong]

Hi Heavenlyblue, just to second what's been said about the difference in absorption between the different methods.  You may well find you absorb well from the 2 pumps of gel even though considered roughly equivalent to the 50mcg oestradiol in the Evorel Conti you seem to have absorbed so poorly.  Bloods showed I had similar probs with absorption on EC but from oestrogenic side effects when Sandrena (gel) was added I had the impression I was absorbing the gel, though bloods were not repeated to confirm this.  Like you, I had taken EC for some time - 2 years - before bloods finally confirmed poor absorption, though I already was pretty sure of that from persistent symptoms.  I do hope you find this new regimen suits you better - as a fellow migraineur since late teens, I know only too well how debilitating & disrupting a condition it is. 

KC

If that's the case, why does the medical profession prefer that post meno women use conti?
You can pluck friends out of the air and give examples as you wish, the post meno endo does not need to bleed. I don't care what progestin is used, if you're post meno, find one that suits or your risking bleeds, fibroids and polyps.

To add to what Hurdity said about some consultants favouring a sequi regimen for women well postmenopause - although I'm late 50's & 7 years postmenopause, two consultants from different specialties responsible for my care have recommended a sequi regimen to minimise breast risk from progestogen exposure.  Though I would also prefer not to have bleeds at this age, it's a compromise I know I have to accept if I need the benefits of HRT for decent QOL.

Mary G

your oestrogen levels are very low and I wonder if that could be why your blood pressure is raised.   Low oestrogen often leads to high blood pressure, it happened to my aunt and my mother post menopause.

Crumbs Mary - that's interesting - I'd thought oestrogen replacement was considered to raise BP if anything, hence BP being monitored regularly for women on HRT & their being taken off it if BP goes too high?  Have I misunderstood?  Mine has gone up alarmingly postmenopause (admittedly in white coat situations), nearly 20 points higher than I'd expect when done yesterday & I have mostly been on ineffective or no HRT - as at present - during that time.  I am very slim, don't smoke or drink, I exercise & have a healthy diet with lots & fruit & veg, white & oily fish, little meat & drink mostly plain water & plenty of it, so no apparent reason for the rise, other than age & stress when taken in a hospital environment  .  Would  be very interested in any research you know of that shows low oestrogen causes raised BP. 

[Mary G]

Like heavenlyblue, I suffer with migraines and the migraine specialist I consulted recommended a continuous combined HRT regime.  My gynaecologist also prefers hormone stability and the doctor who prescribed my bespoke progesterone (who also works at an NHS menopause clinic in London) was dead against older women bleeding.  She said 'do you really want to be bleeding for the rest of your life?'.  She also agreed that the cyclical regime was causing migraines.

I think too many women are making the best of a bad job because much of the progesterone used in HRT preparations is not tolerated well by many.  Problems with the progesterone part of HRT come up on here time and time again.  I know there are women who get on well with bog standard HRT medication but there are many who do not and bear in mind, most women don't use HRT at all.

Body identical progesterone does not increase the risk of breast cancer, it is synthetic progesterone that can cause breast cancer.

HRT needs a complete overhaul and work is desperately needed on the progesterone component.   I thought progesterone was my enemy because of the dreadful side effects of the synthetics and Utrogestan but it is in fact my friend when administered at the right dose in the right way and alongside oestrogen.   Periods made me feel ill and the hormone fluctuations of a cyclical regime and the unstable progesterone hit were causing my silent migraines.  I think that hormones fluctuations and periods are much harder to cope with when you get older.

[heavenlyblue]

Morning Hurdity x

Update.   Saw my NHS GP.  He said my BP was 140/89 unfortunately, even though that had gone down from the reading when I saw the private GP a couple of weeks ago.  He suggest I get an At Home Monitor, take 2 readings a day over a week, then come and see him.  I have one arriving tomorrow.   I gave him the letter from my private GP with the hormone results to keep him up to date.  He seemed quite happy with what she had prescribed.   

The Chemist cannot give me a date for the Evoril 50mcg so my private GP is sending me a script for Oestrogel. Said I should take 2 pumps a day.  I'm assuming that equates to 50mcg.  Haven't used a gel before, will be nice not wearing a patch for a change!  Will be so tempting to up my oestrogen a little myself.......it is frustrating knowing a higher dose of Oestogen could really help me feel better, but it can't be increased until my BP goes down....but I have to be patient and getting my BP down is important.  :-)

So  I will be at least starting the new bio regime of Oestrogel and Utrogestan soon.  And I am starting the Testogel tomorrow.   I have a three month supply to begin with.

Hi again heavenlyblue - officially yes the standard medium dose of oestrogel is two pumps and for a patch it's 50 mcg - but don't worry too much as you might be one who absorbs better with gel than a patch so you may give yourself a slightly increased dose anyway. There is a huge difference in absorption between different women. Also to some extent depends on your body size (height), weight/BMI (just like with pets!). So - I wouldn't do more than 2 pumps to start with - just see how you get on with it for a few weeks.

Sorry I can't remember if there was a reason for your high BP - are you overweight (hope you don't mind my asking?) or lacking in exercise etc? There are lots of ways to reduce BP as well as meds as I'm sure you know. Reducing salt, alcohol. smoking, fats in diet (?), reducing weight, taking more exercise etc. Do hope it (BP) decreases soon! Maybe once you are taking readings yourself it will be lower. This happened with my husband - was high at the surgery but normal when we bought a monitor and he did it at home.

Hi KC

I completely understand what you are saying.  I think it obviously depends on the individual.

I had quite heavy periods, and last couple of years before peri-meno, they made me feel nauseous.  So yes, if going cyclical brings back heavy bleeding and nausea, then I will have to look at my options again.  But if it is just a normal bleed and I don't feel unwell, then it would be a small price to pay for how I have been feeling the past 3 years.  I almost cannot remember who I was before that.  I have lost myself.

So I am open to all suggestions and hopefully I will find the right thing for me :-) x

Quite so - there is no right or wrong in this - whatever works for you that makes you feel better - weighing up the risks and benefits to your health and your well-being, comfort or otherwise (which is what we do too!)

Heavenlyblue - of course it depends on the individual, it's just my opinion and I still believe that women past the age of a very late menopause shouldn't be artificially inducing bleeds, they're not fertile, there's no need to build up a womb lining and it seems to cause a lot of angst and quick referral scanning if the balance isn't right. When I had a polyp removed last year, although benign, they can tell from the biopsy that it was hrt induced and they told me that. That was enough info for me to reduce my dose and take conti hrt. My womb has done its bit for me and doesn't need further stress.

I genuinely hope you find your perfect balance and a resolution to your problems.

Well good job noone is asking you to do it kilted Cupid! If it's not right for you then fine. However it is right for many women for the reasons I gave in my previous post when you made the same points with jokes about tampons. It is clearly an issue for you but there are women on here for whom the choice (to induce a bleed) is the least worst of the different options - and no-one will say that they actually enjoy having to do this - but oh the joys of the weeks on oestrogen only!

Like I said in my previous post - aside from the side effects of continuous progesterone, there is still the question mark over (synthetic) progestogens and breast cancer, and a friend from another group also in her 60's says her private consultant is happier for her to be taking hRT cyclically to minimise progestogenic exposure.

Many of us do not want to take synthetic progestogens at all - I certainly don't into the long term, and put up with the awful business of maintaining a cycle to minimise the exposure even to body-identical progesterone (partly due to side effects) . If dydrogesterone were available separately I might give it a try.

This is actually not a trivial issue either - like I said with many women living into their 90's and current medical thinking saying that we can take HRT as long as possible.

Maintaining the right balance is an issue for all post-menopausal women and in fact it is probably easier with cyclical HRT than continuous combined....

Keep us posted heavenlyblue!

Hurdity x

Hi Hurdity

Started the Testogel this morning, put it on my inner thigh, wasn't sure whether to cut top of sachet off or do a pin hole, don't want it drying out over the week.  So did a pin prick.  I at least feel that I am doing something!   Will be interesting when I start the Oestrogel, to see how well I absorb it.  I have a follow up with her in Jan so will make sure I get my hormones tested again, also see what my Testosterone levels are doing.

I don't mind you asking at all,  need all the help I can get.

My weight is actually the only thing I don't need to worry about!

5' 6"
9 Stone 4lbs
Healthy BMI

I don't drink or smoke.  I have a really healthy diet, low salt, low fat, but I include 'good fats' - freshly cooked meals, fruit and veg every day, loads of water every day etc....low sugar....have to be careful with what I eat and drink because of my migraines.  I also take supplements that my friend who is a registered Naturopath/Herbalist recommended.

But I suspect my BP is down to stress and exercise levels dropping over past 20 months.

To cut a long story short...spending a lot of my 40s trying to get pregnant, it didn't happen, so the stress of that, along with thinking I had come to terms with it...….when my symptoms started - it was just the biggest shock ever, I wasn't emotionally prepared for it all. I felt past my sell by date....etc...….and with constant frustration of dealing with NHS GPs and feeling no better, migraines getting worse, throwing up all the time, cancelling appointments constantly, I have been in a constant cycle of worry and pain the past 3 years.

On top of that, had a shoulder injury 20 months ago, NHS physio did not work, said I would need surgery...so went to a private Consultant for a second opinion....had a MRI, injections, spent a fortune, now having more physio....so not been able to do the dance classes, swimming, wasn't even allowed to run because it would jar my shoulder so that has effected my mental state of mind hugely as well.  Let alone my sleep, non existent past 3 years and we all know how vital sleep is.

But at least I have some light at the end of the tunnel, need to stay positive that this new regime....or tweaking of it....will get my joie de vivre back and if I can get my shoulder better, I can get back to doing the classes I love at David Lloyds.  At the moment, all I can do up there is walk briskly on a treadmill or sit on a bike without gripping....which is really boring and because I find it boring, I don't do it enough.  Not been able to do weights either so that has worried me re bone health.  We do a lot of walking but in winter tends to only be at the weekend, don't want to do anything after work when I get in, I'm so tired all the time. 

So I have taken control, saw the private GP, and am now, as you know, starting a new regime and I've bought a BP monitor.   Which I will start at the weekend when I am more relaxed.  x

[heavenlyblue]

Hi Heavenlyblue, just to second what's been said about the difference in absorption between the different methods.  You may well find you absorb well from the 2 pumps of gel even though considered roughly equivalent to the 50mcg oestradiol in the Evorel Conti you seem to have absorbed so poorly.  Bloods showed I had similar probs with absorption on EC but from oestrogenic side effects when Sandrena (gel) was added I had the impression I was absorbing the gel, though bloods were not repeated to confirm this.  Like you, I had taken EC for some time - 2 years - before bloods finally confirmed poor absorption, though I already was pretty sure of that from persistent symptoms.  I do hope you find this new regimen suits you better - as a fellow migraineur since late teens, I know only too well how debilitating & disrupting a condition it is. 

KC

If that's the case, why does the medical profession prefer that post meno women use conti?
You can pluck friends out of the air and give examples as you wish, the post meno endo does not need to bleed. I don't care what progestin is used, if you're post meno, find one that suits or your risking bleeds, fibroids and polyps.

To add to what Hurdity said about some consultants favouring a sequi regimen for women well postmenopause - although I'm late 50's & 7 years postmenopause, two consultants from different specialties responsible for my care have recommended a sequi regimen to minimise breast risk from progestogen exposure.  Though I would also prefer not to have bleeds at this age, it's a compromise I know I have to accept if I need the benefits of HRT for decent QOL.

Mary G

your oestrogen levels are very low and I wonder if that could be why your blood pressure is raised.   Low oestrogen often leads to high blood pressure, it happened to my aunt and my mother post menopause.

Crumbs Mary - that's interesting - I'd thought oestrogen replacement was considered to raise BP if anything, hence BP being monitored regularly for women on HRT & their being taken off it if BP goes too high?  Have I misunderstood?  Mine has gone up alarmingly postmenopause (admittedly in white coat situations), nearly 20 points higher than I'd expect when done yesterday & I have mostly been on ineffective or no HRT - as at present - during that time.  I am very slim, don't smoke, I exercise & have a healthy diet, so no apparent reason for the rise other than age & stress when taken in a hospital environment  .  Would  be very interested in any research you know of that shows low oestrogen causes raised BP. 

Thanks Wrensong for replying.  It's interesting how we all absorb differently.  Perhaps 50mcg is the correct level for me but I wasn't absorbing it properly through the patch.  At least I can see how I go on Oestrogel, I will make sure I get tested again when I see her in Jan.   She wants me to take 100mg Utrogestan daily to begin with so all I can do is see how I go.  I cannot imagine I will feel any worse than I have done these past 3 years.  I have just got used to feeling like this.  Thought it was just my lot as the NHS GPs didn't suggest changing anything.  Wasn't until I read more and more on here and spoke to my Counsellor who said I should not be feeling like this on HRT, that I realised I needed to do something about it.   I have missed so many things I wanted to do because of these migraines.  Missed my best mate's 50th surprise do in Cornwall this year because of them.  You cannot gets those memories back :-(   x

[heavenlyblue]

Like heavenlyblue, I suffer with migraines and the migraine specialist I consulted recommended a continuous combined HRT regime.  My gynaecologist also prefers hormone stability and the doctor who prescribed my bespoke progesterone (who also works at an NHS menopause clinic in London) was dead against older women bleeding.  She said 'do you really want to be bleeding for the rest of your life?'.  She also agreed that the cyclical regime was causing migraines.

I think too many women are making the best of a bad job because much of the progesterone used in HRT preparations is not tolerated well by many.  Problems with the progesterone part of HRT come up on here time and time again.  I know there are women who get on well with bog standard HRT medication but there are many who do not and bear in mind, most women don't use HRT at all.

Body identical progesterone does not increase the risk of breast cancer, it is synthetic progesterone that can cause breast cancer.

HRT needs a complete overhaul and work is desperately needed on the progesterone component.   I thought progesterone was my enemy because of the dreadful side effects of the synthetics and Utrogestan but it is in fact my friend when administered at the right dose in the right way and alongside oestrogen.   Periods made me feel ill and the hormone fluctuations of a cyclical regime and the unstable progesterone hit were causing my silent migraines.  I think that hormones fluctuations and periods are much harder to cope with when you get older.

Past 3 years, kept telling the NHS GPs that my migraines were hormone related but they just kept saying they needed to be treated separately from my peri-menopausal symptoms. Kept giving me triptans, painkillers, daily preventatives, even a low dose of an anti depressant.  Nothing worked.  Still did not refer me to a Migraine Specialist or a Menopause Specialist.  So that is why I went to a private GP a month ago, could not take it anymore, did not want this to be my life for the foreseeable and low and behold, she said, migraines are really common with hormonal issues.   Why did I put up with 3 years of being fobbed off by GPs who do not have the speciality knowledge. When I went to pick up a BP monitor last week, I showed the nurse my hormone results and she said my Oestrogen and Testosterone were both in normal regions!  Which thank goodness, I now know not to be the case.

I will be starting this new regime - daily 100mg Utrogestan, with Oestrogel and Testogel.    So I will just see how I go.  Seeing her again in Jan.  I have completely forgotten what life was like before these symptoms started.  If I get some semblance of me back, will never take my health for granted again!  x

[Hurdity]

Body identical progesterone does not increase the risk of breast cancer, it is synthetic progesterone that can cause breast cancer.

 I think that hormones fluctuations and periods are much harder to cope with when you get older.

On the whole Mary G I totally agree that micronised progesterone is far safer than synthetic progestogens from the evidence we have - despite its limitations - although I don't know enough about it. However just to be precise, actually the recent review into micronised progesterone (I posted the abstract on the thread on vaginal progesterone) suggests that after 5 years oral preparations may be associated with a slight increase in breast cancer risk ( and I haven't looked in detail at this review recently - just quoting the abstract):

"Postmenopausal women with an intact uterus using estrogen therapy should receive a progestogen for endometrial protection. The debate on bioidentical hormones including micronized progesterone has increased in recent years. Based on a systematic literature review on the impact of menopausal hormone therapy (MHT) containing micronized progesterone on the mammary gland, an international expert panel's recommendations are as follows: (1) estrogens combined with oral (approved) or vaginal (off-label use) micronized progesterone do not increase breast cancer risk for up to 5 years of treatment duration; (2) there is limited evidence that estrogens combined with oral micronized progesterone applied for more than 5 years are associated with an increased breast cancer risk; and (3) counseling on combined MHT should cover breast cancer risk – regardless of the progestogen chosen. Yet, women should also be counseled on other modifiable and non-modifiable breast cancer risk factors in order to balance the impact of combined MHT on the breast."

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/13697137.2017.1421925

I'm not sure also whether the statement that synthetic progesterone can cause cancer is correct either?  I understood it to be increased risk rather than a causal relationship - I thought it was still not exactly clear, but I will stand to be corrected here by someone who is more knowledgeable!

Like I said earlier - those of us who choose to have a bleed do not do so happily but reluctantly - once more - as the least worst option. For me the withdrawal bleed is nothing compared with the bleeds I had during my fertile days, and also I get nothing like the awful pms symptoms from the progesterone withdrawal that I did when in early peri. Certainly at the oestrogen and progesterone doses i take I am very much on an even keel - although have a temporary blip of fogginess and the occasional migraine when on the utro phase, or withdrawal - but the weeks of oestrogen only make up for it.

Hurdity x

[Hurdity]

heavenly blue the blue boxes within boxes are getting out of hand and it takes me ages to edit out the inner boxes! Will post about testosterone on the thread in private lives called "Tesosterone here we go - OK?

Hurdity x