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[coldlittleheart]

I've tried Kliovance in the past, it worked well and helped with hot flashes and low mood, anxiety, but after a bout 5 weeks, I started shedding more hair than I cared to. That undid all the mood improvements. My doctor changed my hrt to femoston and that did nothing at all, I just had stomach upsets and my hair kept on shedding, anxiety and low mood remained, hot flashes returned. I stopped taking it.

I spoke to another doctor at my surgery today because I have been overwhelmed with symtoms again, really low mood, anger, anxiety, debilitating fatigue (I have FMS/CFS as well) and I started struggling with my weight in the past 6 months or so. I asked about estrogel and utrogestan, he has agreed to let me try estradiol 2mg and micronised progesterone capsules. I am hoping they will help, but I am worried about losing hair again, and about nausea/vomiting (phobic). So should I read the whole support thread for the estrogel/utro combo? Is it the same thing? I am just so tired of not being able to cope with anything at the moment, everything and anything upsets me, every little thing is a huge effort. I am not having a good time of it right now.

[JayJay]

Hi
Just happened upon your post today, as I am having similar symptoms and don't know which road to follow.
Things are not terrible for me (today!) but I could feel better, and have had hair shedding for the past couple of months, which is my main concern, to be honest.
How are you getting on?
Take care
Jay

[Sammiejane]

Jay jay

Are u on Estrogel ?

I do believe this hasn't helped my hair loss but my hair starting shedding initially 5 weeks into taking Vagifem which I have stopped but certainly has got thinner since dec last year on Estrogel my estrogen levels are low but I think hormone imbalance plays a roll

[JayJay]

Hi SJ
I think I have already answered you on another thread - did I also mention short term memory problems ?
I am on the oestrogel + Utrog, but thinking of changing to an oestrogen patch, as my hair has been thinning in the past couple of month.
Have asked Hurdity if there is an HRT which is more 'hair friendly' (also, please, one which will make me tall, slim, have good skin and a smaller nose).
Actually, I could do with a housekeeper as well.  And a small Lottery win.  Small to Medium.
Have a good Saturday night girls
Jay

[Hurdity]

JayJay I don't know where you asked me that!! Sorry! I'm afraid many recent posts on here are talking about hair-shedding whatever the original thread which is getting very confusing  - well I'm confused as I can't remember who I've spoken to about what and where!!! (short-term memory problems.... well I am older than a lot of you   ).  How about a grand new thread about hair shedding to pull it all together and then all the discussion could be in one place!!!

On that subject - I'm sure I've said this already elsewhere but you just need to avoid the HRT types with testosterone derived progestogens if you want to minimise hair-shedding and other androgenic effects. They are all listed here:

https://www.menopausematters.co.uk/perimeno.php

Progestogens which can be used cyclically are of 3 main types:

    Testosterone derived - Norgestrel, Norethisterone acetate and Levonorgestrel.
    Less testosterone related - Medroxyprogesterone acetate(MPA).
    Least testosterone related - Dydrogesterone and Micronised progesterone (Utrogestan).

Side effects are often experienced during the progestogen phase of treatment and can be reduced by using a product containing a different type or route of progestogen.


Check the ingredients of all the oestrogen preparations in case whatever is added to them (the patch adhesives , gel constituents etc) in case some of these can cause hair-shedding.

Check for everything else - thyroid, iron, vits etc

Estradiol itself isn't going to cause shedding - rememeber in pregnancy our hair is most luxuriant and we have very high levels of oestrogen (and also progesterone).

After that - and in any case you do need expert advice and there are other hair-shedders on here who have posted in the past - maybe do a search (perhaps search for trichologist, or telogen or something like that?)

 

Hurdity x

[JayJay]

Hi Hurdity
Thank you for your reply.
I am Utro prog, so it is reassuring to know that part of it is the best possible, in terms of being hair friendly.

I apologise if I posted on the wrong thread - this is my first venture into internet forums.
Regards
Jay Jay

[Mogster71]

Norethisterone really upset me - palpitations, adrenaline, poo jokes, the lot. During the one month I took that version of HRT I was really distressed by the amount of hair in the bottom of the bath after I had had a shower!!

Moved to dydrogesterone last month but again even that upset my tummy, personally I have decided to not use HRT again for the time being as I dont' feel my symptoms are bad enough, but if I was looking to pursue it I think I would ask to try gel this time as it is mean to be easier on the tummy. I am also a real vomit phobe so I feel your pain there.

Hope you can find something that suits you X

[JayJay]

Thank you.
Hopefully will be booking a blood test tomorrow, if I can convince gp !
JJ

[TaylorJ]

Hiya, I'm 47 and peri and was getting along nicely with the Evorel Sequi patches ( evorel 50/evorel conti) for the last 4 months . These are now not available until at least middle of 2020    I was at my GP yesterday and she has gave me an alternative of Estradiol 50micrograms patches and Utrogestan 100mg (micronised and orally) twice daily on days 14-28 . I really don't want to change as I've found the side effects of Evorel Sequi not bad at all ...I hate taking tablets at the best of times it heightens my anxiety in case of any side effects, whereas patches I can just take off if I don't feel okay  . Has any other Ladies been given these or had any experience with Estradiol/Utrogestan. I don't want to end up back square one and think should I just come off HRT altogether and try to go through it on my own !!!

Thank you x

[JayJay]

Hi TJ
I am three years into my meno journey and can assure you that I am no expert.
This forum has been exceptionally helpful, because there is a broad spectrum of opinion with many different experiences coming through, so it is worth sticking around to see if any advice may be helpful to you.
I have also bought several books, none of which were particularly helpful!
The one thing that stands out is that 'we are all different'.
I would add to that, our bodies do change.  Personally I was good (ish) on oestrogel on utro three years ago, but it is not cutting it for me now so I am looking to change.
It is possible that I am not absorbing (the gel) it as well as previously, as I am now shedding hair and putting on weight, with no other obvious culprit to blame.
It could be that my natural hormone production is reducing.
There are also supply issues with some form of hrt.
So, trial and error. 
Hopefully we will reach our 'sweet spot', as someone on here said.
Regards
J

[coldlittleheart]

Hi
Just happened upon your post today, as I am having similar symptoms and don't know which road to follow.
Things are not terrible for me (today!) but I could feel better, and have had hair shedding for the past couple of months, which is my main concern, to be honest.
How are you getting on?
Take care
Jay

Hey Jay I only saw today that there was a conversation on here, I didn't get notifications, so apologies for being late to the party.

I have switched from Progynova to Oestrogel since my original post, last week actually. My hair is still shedding a little, but my mood seems better, less down, less anxious, less crazy all round. But I am floored by extra fatigue, on top of the fibro/cfs fatigue. Today is particularly bad. So that total lack of energy is not helping with weight issues. I spoke to the doctor about the utro and we'll see what she says about the possibility of doing sequential rather than conti despite being post-meno. I am 57 so it would be weird to have periods again, but if that's the price to pay to feel more human, I think it would be a small trade off.

I see in later posts you said about thinking of changing, have you? How is it working out for you?

[Ladybt28]

I found that when I started my testosterone it helped stop the fatigue.  Some women need it together with the other two hormones.  It helped with libido (which was non-existent), fatigue and made my brain sharper.  It also helped with the insomnia although that's a weird one and not a common thing to get with T but I think I slept better because I could do more!

I am 57 coldlittleheart and I use it sequentially and have a bleed.

[coldlittleheart]

Ladybt thanks for that, it's useful info too. Although I am not sure my GP would agree with adding testosterone to my regime, they are a little iffy about using utro vaginally. Did you have blood tests to check your testosterone levels?

Also does it cause hair loss? It is a problem I am experiencing, it started - several years - before I started hrt, and then it settled, my hair started growing a little thicker again, then when I tried HRT for the first time last year, within 4-5 weeks, I started shedding loads of hair and apparently it was because the progesterone in my combo hrt, norethisterone, was more 'male' because it's testosterone derived (??) and that can cause hair loss. I changed to a different hrt (femoston) but that didn't work at all and my hair kept shedding, I stopped taking it, my symptoms returned as did my hair. It's just recently, in the summer, I was really miserable so I asked to try oestrogel and utro. I am feeling a bit better mentally, but I am floored by fatigue.

[Ladybt28]

Nope I have never had any blood tests ever in 10 years for any of the hormones. GP goes on the basis of "controlling symptoms" and so did my meno consultant who I saw at an NHS clinic only once.  I asked for testosterone and got given what I asked for which I thought was a flaming miracle, I certainly wasn't expecting to get what I asked for  I have had some hair shedding on an off but have not been able to work out which bit causes it or how to stop it really but because my symptoms were the worst you could imagine, it is a small price to pay for feeling better.  I was reading in another thread that whatever triggers the shedding happens around 8 to 12 weeks before the shedding starts so if you change your regime or up or drop or whatever, your doses or the kind of hrt you are taking then the shedding may happen 8 - 12 weeks after.  Its hard to work out which imbalance causes it as we are all so different.

I tried to drop my dose of oestrogel to 3 pumps instead of 4 a while back and I think that's what kicked off a bit of hair shedding for me.  I reckon that was about 12 weeks ago.  I have upped them again and also added in another pump of testosterone, I was only using 2 and I have noticed that there is wispy hair growing back on my temples, so fingers crossed.
I couldn't take femeston gave me headaches.  The testosterone made a huge difference and I got given it 6 months after I started my gel and utrogestan, I just asked at the clinic and they sent a letter to my GP.