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[racjen]

Can anyone tell me how long the symptoms of withdrawal from utrogestan are likely to last? I've been taking 100mg vaginally for about 3 months without a break, stopped about a week ago and I still seem to be feeling terrible - depressed, anxious, tearful, achey...Is this likely to still be withdrawal, or is something else going on? I'm so tired of feeling awful, I really need something to work soon  .

[CLKD]

Have a 

[peri]

Sounds like classic progesterone withdrawal to me racjen.  It takes a couple of days to leave my system but then I only take it for 7/10 depending on how long I can keep going on it.  If you've been taking it  continually for 3 months it stands to reason it will take longer, hang on in there it should get better x

[Hurdity]

Also you might be getting a bleed coming too? Are you postmeno or peri? Mine usually clears within a few days but then I feel a bit rough due to the bleed. I feel wonderful (comparatively speaking) for the remaining 4 weeks or so. What is your oestrogen dose?

Hurdity x

[racjen]

Yes I've got the bleed  , shame, had been enjoying no periods any more. I'm post-meno due to chemotherapy so no periods for just over a year. The last 6 months since recovering from cancer treatment have been worse than the treatment itself - gradually worsening depression, anxiety, insomnia, and struggling to find anyone who would  listen because "you're bound to be depressed after going through cancer". Am now on Evorel 100 but my estradiol level 3 weeks ago was <44 pmol so i think it's going to take a while to get the level anywhere near healthy. In the meantime I feel so dreadful I can't work, feels like my life has ground to a halt.

[dangermouse]

I have found that progesterone affects my cycle for about 4 weeks after the last dose.

[racjen]

Good grief, that long? How often do you take it Dangermouse?

[dangermouse]

I've been taking progesterone cream (a very high absorption one) for 7-10 days at a time (as have very high oestrogen) and I think it leaves the system quite quickly but it will have an affect on the next cycle and seems about 4 weeks in my case before the affects stop.

My symptoms are very specific so easy to feel it! It throws out the oestrogen so makes me feel rough/amazing at various points in the cycle depending on how much oestrogen it's needed to throw out.

As the rough has been very rough (migraine dizziness and nausea) the last 2 cycles, I'm just trying the Micronor mini-pill from yesterday as read this was better for migraines as less potent.

I've not tried the Utrogestan as my endocrinologist said it would cause higher oestrogen in me. I don't know it she meant as so potent it throws more oestrogen out (which makes more sense as it reduces the built up lining from oestrogen HRT use) or another mechanism.

[Hurdity]

I've never heard of progesterone causing high oestrogen I must say! I can't see how this would be possible. I think many of us would be lapping it up if this were the case  . Please can you explain further?

Hurdity x

[racjen]

Yes I must admit this post has really confused me, and I was confused enough already!

[dangermouse]

I don't know what she meant exactly so my take on it is that it rebalances (reduces) high oestrogen levels and, in the process, those sensitive to oestrogen feel it as it re-enters the system on its way out.

I know when the excess oestrogen has left as I suddenly get fast bowels for an hour or so and then it all comes out and everything calms down. The same happens after ovulation.

If you haven't suffered from high oestrogen its not relevant though. The 4 week effect is the only part those with low oestrogen may find of interest.

[Hurdity]

Dangermouse - what she is saying sounds very unscientific to me. If you can point me to some links which discuss this I would be interested. The whole issue with receptors etc and what actually happens is fascinating - but I'm not sure if there is much info out there?

racjen - I think as dangermouse suggests it's a bit of a red herring in most women's situation and not sure what it even means in terms of a mechanistic explanation.  Hopefully you've had an answer to your question?

Hurdity x

[dangermouse]

It can be difficult to understand if you've not experienced it, although I think my theory of homeostasis is pretty simple. One thing I've learnt as a psychotherapist is that the simplest hypothesis is usually the most likely!

No there was no science mentioned, she just said Utrogestan could raise my oestrogen levels and double-checked (with a worried look on her face) I hadn't been taking it. It's what she prescribes for women taking Oestrogel but said would be lethal for me. She's an expert in her field so I trust she knows what she's talking about.

I told her I had read in this forum that progesterone creams did not absorb well but she said this was ‘absolutely not the case!' They've come a long way and are highly absorbed now when paired with the right carrier (for when taking alone to increase prog levels).

Transdermal can be better than oral but it's been a bit too potent for me.

If only we did have research already carried out for all the perimenopausal women suffering from high oestrogen, which can be very dangerous (I already have liver growths), but it's probably too volatile to study.

I reckon for most exogenous hormones, you should wait one clear cycle after stopping before effects should be less noticeable.

[racjen]

To be honest Hurdity, I think the only real answer to my original question is "how long is a piece of string"! I'm reassured though that it appears to be plausible to still be getting some withdrawal symptoms after 10 days .

[Hurdity]

In your case racjen, your symptoms since stopping the utrogestan could well be a combination of - progesterone withdrawal (which should have eased by now), the bleed, and the low oestrogen you reported from your last blood test. What dose patch were you on before the test which gave your oestrogen level at less than 40 pmol/l? Also you may well need testosterone if your ovaries are no longer functioning ( is this permanent?). If your libido is very low and you lack the appropriate response coupled with feeling tired, lethargic, muscle aches etc - this could be the reason - but low oestrogen can also cause many of these symptoms.

Hurdity x