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Author Topic: Desperate for advice  (Read 6459 times)

jobeckett

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Desperate for advice
« on: August 15, 2016, 01:00:58 PM »

Hello,

I am new to this forum (actually it's the first forum I've written on).  I'm 49 and going through chronic peri-menopausal symptoms.  They started with insomnia 5 years ago which left me sleep deprived for 5 months.  I started taking melatonin at night which helped for a while.  Then came the worst morning anxiety and panic attacks I have ever experienced (I've been treated for depression for 18 years with AD's) but this new level of crippling fear completely took over any help that my drugs were (and had been for 18 years) was offering me and diminished immediately.  My blood pressure went up and I agreed to start taking meds for this.

I then saw my doctor at 47 yrs, who wouldn't entertain the thought of peri-m as I was still regularly bleeding.  I asked to change AD's (Paroxetene) as I thought they had perhaps stopped working for me.  Instead I was advised to up my dose to 40 mg per day and was given Propranolol and Valium to ease the attacks, along with Zopiclone for insomnia.  For a while this helped, along with the BP meds but fairly soon it was evident that this morning anxiety wasn't going anywhere.  And the uptake of Paroxetene made me zombified. 

I asked to change AD's again - this time my GP put me on Venlafaxine - didn't agree with me at all so we stopped that after 6 weeks and I was put onto Citalopram.  I also had to change BP meds a few times and now take Losartan, Propranolol and Clonidine.  I am still suffering every morning with a waking fear that is completely irrational.  It has destroyed my self confidence, had a major impact on my working ability, and for the most part I can't see a reason to carry on - this is not life, it's HELL.  I can't carry on like this for much longer.

My GP is now suggesting HRT - I am really nervous about this (I'm a smoker, albeit only about 5 per day). I am not suffering with flushes or night sweats very much but I am absolutely desperate to find a solution to the anx and depression.

I wondered whether any ladies out there have experienced the same kind of symptoms and whether you have found a solution / starting taking HRT and found it to ease this discomfort?  I would love to do biodentical HRT but it's too expensive at this moment in time. 

I read a lot that HRT is primarily used to control the flushes - as I don't really suffer from this (yet), so I'm interested whether anyone has had the same nightmarish anxiety and found relief from HRT?

Any advice would be extremely welcomed and I thank you in advance for reading my plight.  I just feel like I'm taking layers of drugs that have taken away my personality and I'm scared and unsure what to do (I can't think straight either) so these decisions feel monumental for me to make.

Thank you
Jo x
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CLKD

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Re: Desperate for advice
« Reply #1 on: August 15, 2016, 01:16:44 PM »

 :welcomemm:

Forget what you have read about HRT being primarily for hot flushes, many ladies don't get those: some GPs will prescribe if flushes are the single symptom …….. some won't prescribe if a lady doesn't get them  ::).  Some find keeping a symptom/mood/food diary helpful to chart feelings as we can easily forget on our 'better' days  ::).

Browse round.  Make notes.

R U outside the UK? as you mention the cost.

I have Betablockas, ADs and an emergency tablet to take when anxiety floors me.  Some ADs can ease anxiety symptoms.  You'll see that ladies go to Yoga, pilates; cycle, walk, swim …..

Let us know how you get on!
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Elizabethrose

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Re: Desperate for advice
« Reply #2 on: August 15, 2016, 01:34:23 PM »

Hello Jo, welcome to the forum!

I'm so sorry to read how you are struggling at the moment, peri can really throw up all sorts of horrors for us. Whilst I've had to try to manage lots of peri symptoms, I haven't experienced anxiety, mood swings and depression with it so really can't advise you in that area. There are however, lots of lovely ladies here who I know have similar experiences and who I know will be along soon to try to help. It helps us all enormously just knowing that there are people out there in 'Forum Land' who we can 'talk' to, can support us, who've experienced similar issues and who won't be judgemental.

Did your GP try to work out what's causing your high BP before meds were prescribed? Sometimes little changes in our life styles and diets can help enormously. My mother's renal consultant considered salt the enemy with BP, though mum still now has to take meds to manage it.

HRT can help with a wide range of peri symptoms: did you ever recognise that your anxiety and depression linked in with your menstrual cycles? Again I can't help with HRT advice but there are some very informed women here who will no doubt be along shortly to help.

Sorry I'm unable to help specifically but I just wanted to welcome you to the site.

I really wish you well. x
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jobeckett

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Re: Desperate for advice
« Reply #3 on: August 15, 2016, 02:47:29 PM »

Hi Elizabethrose,

Thank you so much for your warm welcome, it's lovely to feel part of a like minded group who have their own individual struggles.

I have to say that the anxiety I've been getting (every morning without fail) doesn't seem to link in with my erratic cycles (the spacing between bleeds can vary from 1 month to 4 months apart so it's really hard to predict when one is coming along as I've never suffered with PMS before).

I've been keeping salt & caffeine out of my diet as much as possible, along with drastically reducing the amount of alcohol I drink since going on the meds.  I've always had slightly high BP but even with the meds and avoiding certain foods, it hasn't helped that much.  GP thinks it could all be related, but to be honest, I'm a bit tired of hearing the old NHS 'speak' as they just don't recognise menopause properly or adrenal fatigue either.  A pill for this, and a pill for that and that is as far as they can go with these areas.

Anyway thank you again for your welcome  ;D
Jo x
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CLKD

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Re: Desperate for advice
« Reply #4 on: August 15, 2016, 02:49:09 PM »

Be warned! about cutting out salt  -  doing so almost killed my M in L  :o
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jobeckett

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Re: Desperate for advice
« Reply #5 on: August 15, 2016, 02:57:42 PM »

Hi CLKD,

Thanks for your reply, I am London based and also take betablockers, AD's and Valium for the really bad mornings (which are 5 out of 7 each week).  It's the cost of seeing a private 'biodentical hormone replacement therapist' that's expensive (sadly) - they need to do specific blood tests to gauge all of your hormone levels, not just oestrogen and progesterone, and they make up compounds dependent upon which hormones you are lacking.  As every woman is individual there is no 'one size fits all'.  I'm trying Wellsprings Serenity cream (natural progesterone cream which I bought online after reading some great reviews) but I don't feel much different.

Thanks for your words though, much appreciated.  I just feel like I'm walking in the wilderness  :'(

Jo x


:welcomemm:

Forget what you have read about HRT being primarily for hot flushes, many ladies don't get those: some GPs will prescribe if flushes are the single symptom …….. some won't prescribe if a lady doesn't get them  ::).  Some find keeping a symptom/mood/food diary helpful to chart feelings as we can easily forget on our 'better' days  ::).

Browse round.  Make notes.

R U outside the UK? as you mention the cost.

I have Betablockas, ADs and an emergency tablet to take when anxiety floors me.  Some ADs can ease anxiety symptoms.  You'll see that ladies go to Yoga, pilates; cycle, walk, swim …..

Let us know how you get on!
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CLKD

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Re: Desperate for advice
« Reply #6 on: August 15, 2016, 03:05:42 PM »

Do they: need to do lots of blood tests  :-\  - of course, if it's a private consult, they probably will do  ::) but these should be available via a Menopause Clinic or a Gyae who is au fait with menopause problems!  You could send Hurdity a private e-mail for confirmation of what you have been told  :-\.

My Gynae won't do blood tests, he prescribes on symptoms.  As hormone levels alter every moment of every day throughout the month, results are reliably un-reliable!!!

I thought that bio-identical were available outside of private clinics, maybe if you do a 'search' you will find out …….. [am off out so no time, sorry ]

Have you browsed our Altnerative room?  You may find details about Serenity cream, however: although some find symptoms ease with alternatives once their hormones kick in, benefits may fade  :sigh:
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Elizabethrose

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Re: Desperate for advice
« Reply #7 on: August 15, 2016, 03:06:17 PM »

Thanks for your response Jo.

Honestly hang on Jo, someone will be along soon. It's holiday season so some women are away whilst others will be working. There really is a wealth of knowledge here and it will be valuable for you to tap into it! x
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jobeckett

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Re: Desperate for advice
« Reply #8 on: August 15, 2016, 03:37:48 PM »

Hi CLKD,

Yes you're right, a private practitioner will always try to get as much money as possible from a patient - of that I have no doubt.  Thank you for your tip re: Meno clinic - I will look into this.  I'm aware that our hormone levels fluctuate hourly so it's probably fairly hard to get an accurate reading.

I will speak to my GP about getting biodentical through the NHS although having mentioned it briefly to her before, she is of the mind that these clinics are not FDA recognised and just take your money.  I will persevere!!

Thank you x
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Freckles

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Re: Desperate for advice
« Reply #9 on: August 15, 2016, 08:20:48 PM »

Hi Jo
Welcome!
I had symptoms of anxiety and depression when I was peri-menopausal and was originally out on HRT tablets (Femoston 1/10) which worked okay for the first six months (this was five years ago) but over time didn't and for the past two years had horrible psychological symptoms but no hot sweats. I finally worked out it was probably low oestrogen levels as I had all the symptoms, asked my GP for an increase; she refused, saying I needed to be weaned off HRT, and wanted me to go on AD's which I didn't want to do. My oestrogen levels were 72, which is lower than most men's!
Long story short, I saw Professor John Studd privately in April this year and have done really well on his regime and feel better than I have done for years.

 He prescribed oestrogen (Estrogel) gel continuously (transdermal oestrogen gels or patches are a far safer and far more effective option than HRT tablets), a very tiny daily dose of Testim (testosterone) and micronised progesterone (Utrogestan) tablets which I take at 100mg for 7 days each months (in order to get the necessary withdrawal bleed).

It cost me £300 to see him for the initial assessment and there is follow up at 3 months and then every 12 months after that.  I got my hormone tests done on the NHS which he accepted so I did not need to pay for his private blood tests (which from memory, was about £300 and included everything from vitamins levels to hormones).  I also get all my HRT prescribed on the NHS as he wrote to my GP, although his  private prescription for 3 months of HRT is about £70 to £90 in total to get dispensed.
Studd also goes by symptoms and medical history, as well as hormone levels and he certainly did not insist on having unnecessary blood tests at additional expense to me

It's a shame I had to pay to see him, but I had no other option as clearly my GP wasn't interested. 

I'm not entirely clear about what you mean by "bio-identical hormones" as that term seems to be used in different ways by different clinicians. Certainly from all the formal clinical research I have read, Studd's treatment regime is considered "bio-identical" and also the use of progesterone creams have limited, if any clinical efficacy. I think they and other alternatives seem to work because hormonal levels fluctuate when you are peri-menopausal  so some women think they are effective when in fact it's their natural hormones kicking in, not the herb or cream.
He also suggests that peri-menopausal women with a history of what he calls "reproductive depression" (i.e. hormone responsive depression, such as history of depression being worse before a period, PMS, PND, feeling fine during pregnancy, PMS returning as periods return, recurrent cyclical depression, react badly to progesterone whether oral or depot,  etc.) need HRT and not AD's as the latter as likely to be ineffective in treating the underlying hormonal cause

He argues that peri-menopausal women often recognise they have hormonal depression but because their oestradiol and FSH fall within a "normal range",  GP's often brush them off and prescribe AD's.  When AD's often fail, usually they will be given a second AD, at a higher dose and are often misdiagnosed as having  conditions such as Bi-Polar Disorder, recurrent depressive disorder, generalised anxiety disorder, borderline personality disorder, etc.
He also says that diagnosis should be made on history, and not blood tests and that HRT is usually has a better response to depression/anxiety rather than AD's.
 
As you'll gather,  I am a fan of Studd's treatment regime, as are many other women on here who have either seen him or got the same treatment via the NHS.  Personally I've found his treatment regime to be  life changing. I feel better now after 4 months than I have for years and for me it worth every penny to see him.  Ideally it  should be available on the NHS, whether via a GP or Menopause Clinic, but from many of the posts on here, sadly that is not always the case. 

HRT should be the right hormones, at the right amount and the right format of delivery for the individual but often it's a "one size fits all" approach in the NHS, which I think leaves some women giving up on HRT as they are given the wrong treatment and feel worse on it as a result.
 
Look around on the forum and read previous posts and views to get as much info as possible.

I knew very little about HRT before deciding to see Studd  and the whole range of options , but after lots (masses!) of research, feel I made the right choice.
If you want any more information and/or clinical articles do PM me and I'll be happy to forward them on.

Sorry for the long post!
Good luck.
Freckles x
« Last Edit: August 16, 2016, 01:13:40 AM by Freckles »
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CLKD

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Re: Desperate for advice
« Reply #10 on: August 15, 2016, 08:33:50 PM »

 :thankyou:

FDA means ……….  :-\
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Freckles

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Re: Desperate for advice
« Reply #11 on: August 15, 2016, 08:37:50 PM »

FDA means "Food and Drug Administration".  It's a US government body and not a UK one.
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CLKD

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Re: Desperate for advice
« Reply #12 on: August 15, 2016, 08:41:16 PM »

Gosh you know a lot  ;D - it crossed my mind that it's US-based which is why I made the enquiry.

As an aside - what's your background ? you may have said already but meno-brain here with 1 eye on Mark Cavendish  :-*  ;)
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Freckles

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Re: Desperate for advice
« Reply #13 on: August 15, 2016, 08:46:39 PM »

CKLD -I  work as a Consultant Clinical Psychologist. 
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CLKD

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Re: Desperate for advice
« Reply #14 on: August 15, 2016, 08:47:47 PM »

Thank you - another skill to add to the list ;-).  (Have you read 'that woman' thread?)
« Last Edit: August 15, 2016, 09:03:02 PM by CLKD »
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