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[Elizabethrose]

Hey Sparkle

Haha, listen to us! It's such a monumental bore isn't it!

The sleep thing is the worst thing. I could cope with the flushes which were coming every 20 mins but I was getting 5-6 sweats a night which left me awake for at least half an hour each time. I was thoroughly whacked in the mornings. I can feel gentle heat surges but they are not savage yet. I think I'll get as much sleep as I can before armageddon strikes!

I do hope your acid reflux calms, it's just so uncomfortable for you.

March is good - maybe you're really on the home run now! Hahaha, don't count your chickens though, maybe you can join Machair and me in the Guinness Book of records. If you don't laugh you'll cry!! x

[Machair]

Hi Ladies,

Well my last period was on holiday in late May early June- it was very light though and only lasted a few days. Since then I had a tinge of pink at the height of a high oestrogen surge a couple of weeks ago, and now more pmt. Have you had this tinge of pink at all with no period? My friend was telling me she had it as well- then nothing either. I seem to remember both of you mentioning this happening to you- any idea what causes this?

[Elizabethrose]

I've had the pink tinge at ovulation since starting my periods at thirteen, always with cramps in whichever ovary is ovulating. I don't seem to get it with anovulatory cycles and suspect the pain is caused by the rupture of the follicle. I have discussed this in the past with various medics who have indicated that some women experience this (it had an official name!). This is typical of my sensitivity to hormone change etc etc, I've always been able to read my body like a book. Did your cervical mucus continue after the slight pink show? I think I experienced a slight pink show in April accompanied by period type aches, swelling etc but it didn't then build into a period. I think that was when I might have expected a period and it just hadn't built.

Migraines have just continued bubbling away. Some days fierce and I'm forced to my bed but others I'm able to stay up after meds, sometimes forced to take it easy, others I can get on and achieve something. It's an absolute lottery at the moment, I honestly don't know whether I'm coming or going. HOWEVER, it is still so much better than it was so I just rejoice in that! When I had, what I thought was going to be my final period in Dec (much gnashing of teeth here!!!!), the migraines swung in with a vengeance and Dec, Jan and Feb were pretty grim. Everything then started to calm and the flushes and sweats kicked in hard. If my hormone levels plateau for a while, the migs seem to calm. The roller coaster highs and lows just trigger them and they keep rebounding for a while after.

I think I should set up a pelvic floor exercise regime and stick it in a prominent place (haha for all to see!) to remind me to stick to it. I had a labour from hell with my first which caused immense damage and am therefore a prime candidate for urinary incontinence. It's only been a problem when I have a period though, really weird! Normally I would stop and 'clutch' the muscles if I'm going to sneeze or cough or lift etc but not so that it would cause a big problem. I think the problem is exacerbated as before a bleed I bloat ridiculously and obviously that stored fluid is expelled when the oestrogen suddenly drops. I think I have the bladder the size of a peanut and when having a period I must have to pee a thousand times a day. Oh the joys!!!

Sparkle, lots of my friends experienced acid reflux and increased gastrointestinal problems when peri which mostly calmed after meno. I really really hope all will settle with you too when this is finally over.  xx

[Machair]

Only seem to have the pink spotting if there is very fertile looking mucus so not very often. I haven't got the stress incontinence yet, but I had large babies- one over 10lbs so watch this space! I don't think we are going to make records yet! I believe some women are very late fifties before it is all over.

[Elizabethrose]

Sparkle, I hope your day is bearable tomorrow and that the migraine doesn't build. Even if you're not hungry, eat something like a banana, hunger can exacerbate the pesky headache.

We three do seem remarkably alike; perimeno sisters 

Machair I'll be a minimum age of 58, I think that's late fifties enough! Please, please don't let me pass 60!

[Machair]

You know I think that late menopause happens when certain women produce more oestrogen than others for longer. It could be genetic, it could be to do with cycle length in adulthood, diet, weight, or other as yet unknown factors. I don't think I am ovulating any more, but am still making plenty of oestrogen in a haphazard sun flare sort of situation with some quiet periods, and then all hell breaks through with high oestrogen symptoms. I know that oestrogen doesn't fall to a flat level until 1-2 years after the last period, and for us that may well be some time away.

When I am having oestrogen surges it is just like having PMT, which is why I think I am going to have a period, but then it stops abruptly overnight and calm days return. All a mystery, but probably why my great gran had 14 children, one of which was born at aged 49 I believe.I feel like I am hovering just below the threshold where ovulation would occur.

I also wonder if there is a relationship between those suffering with severe PMT and late menopause, as I had this all my life. I really was a mess in the days leading up to a period, so my body is very sensitive to hormone changes leading to migraine and bloating to mention but two of the miseries that resulted.

I still feel very blessed however, and very much aware of the sadness caused by the opposite- early menopause, which is so tragic for women who want a family or who go onto suffer with post symptoms so severely.

[Elizabethrose]

Food for thought! I have been deliberating this.

I've had two bleeds since November 2015, both anovulatory, but soaring oestrogen levels on a very regular basis. One lasted for 6 weeks. My body seems very able at expelling any endometrial build up, so at this rate, if the oestrogen highs continue, I will continue to have anovulatory bleeds until the oestrogen levels eventually calm. But here's the dilemma: meno is measured a full year after the last bleed, but oestrogen can continue to soar up till about 2 years after meno (or so I've been told by endocrinologists). This seems like a chicken and egg situation to me.

I'm fully aware I just need to continue 'going with the flow' (no pun intended!) and ultimately it really doesn't make any difference of course if I've gone through meno or not, but this really does seem relentless. My big problem of course is that the hormonal surges and drops trigger the pesky migraine, I really need things to just plateau.

Oestrogen still hasn't risen and my sleep was disturbed twice last night with adrenaline surges (?) and flushes and so the cycle continues.

Machair, you are absolutely right, we are blessed in so many ways having a late meno. I feel desperately for the young women who have premature peri and meno before they've had a chance to have their families. I didn't have my first child until I was 30 after my career was well established but I've friends who left it later and then found themselves unable to have children easily or at all. Maybe young girls need to be better educated about the potential of what lies ahead and that the medical profession may be able to discover an accurate way of determining when woman will hit peri/meno. More research needs to be done here.

As far as a relationship between severe PMT and age of meno is concerned, I've had this discussion with specialists. I was told that severe PMT can indicate that peri/meno will be bad, symptom wise, but doesn't indicate an age for meno. They can see no correlation with this but they do know that smokers tend to go through earlier. There have really been very few studies done over the years and I'm sure we've all seen the results of those that have which of course never give details of what all those women experience who don't follow the norm. We've had that conversation.

[Machair]

Some very good points you have raised.

 I am also curious about average age of menopause, as most women do not visit their doctors about menopause issues, and so actual ages are not always known. In other words where do they get these statistics from regarding expected age of last periods in "normal average women" reaching the menopause? Unless these are truly accurate they are responsible for many of us, myself included, wondering if I am a freak, when actually late menopause is under reported and actually very common. I asked a gynaecologist recently on Webmd and she told me that 56 is not old, and that some of her patients are 58/59. I respect her views as I own one of her books.

[Elizabethrose]

I too wonder how they gather these statistics but gather them they do. Obviously there have been large studies done like the SWAN which will provide stats.

I was told that women experiencing meno after 56 are late menopausers and that is believed to be about 5% of women. I suppose we just have to look around us and analyse our own experience. I don't have a single friend or relative who is still menstruating, I am regarded as an oddity! The GPs at my surgery are surprised at my age and lack of meno as are others I've seen. A close friend who is a consultant in women's health thinks I'm very rare and very rarely sees women my age but she does see them, so we are not complete freaks! Was it Jerilynn Prior at Cemcor you emailed?

As I've said a number of times, I've learnt to just live each day: we can't alter what's happening and also can't know when we'll finally get through. HOWEVER (!!!) my peri has been ridiculously long, really ridiculously long and of course I do have my 'ok I'm really bored with this now' days. But heck, I'm healthy, have a good life and have a lot to be thankful for. The migraines, on the whole, are very much more bearable than they once were and I feel sure they will improve still further once through a natural meno, so at least I have a light at the end of the tunnel.

And as my forth hot flush of the day hits, I'll end here! x

[Machair]

Sounds like you are in a low oestrogen phase!

I spoke to Mary Jane Minkin author of "A Woman's Guide to Menopause and Perimenopause" (Yale University Press Health & Wellness) and clinical professor of obstetrics and gynecology in the US. She is brilliant and answers questions on the Webmd menopause forum and has been so helpful to me personally.

[Elizabethrose]

I don't know her, I'll check her out!

Yes I think so, I'm on a low and subsequently the flushes are building quickly again. Think I might have plateaued as the migs have calmed over the past few days. Just in time for the two day heat wave to hit. Bring out the Evian spray!

On my 16th flush of the day..............

[Elizabethrose]

Hahaha, every 20 mins - all day!! I love my life! xx

[Machair]

Oh dear I think I am in for that in the near future then - and Sparkle too - better be prepared! I wonder if there are any other ladies on her in our age group going through this later than most or are we the only three? 

[Elizabethrose]

Haha, I can feel a song coming on......'Things can only get better'

Same today, every 20 mins but thank goodness I went right through the night until woken at about 5 with what appears to have been the first of the day. Easy to cope with them during the day, I just fan myself like a demented woman. No sleep with night sweats and it's a completely different story!

Exactly this happened in April/May and they just continued building in intensity day and night.

HOWEVER ladies, no PMT and no breasts doing an impersonation of giant throbbing boils!! (Such a lovely image!) xx

[Elizabethrose]

Hi Machair and Sparkle, how are you both, any action?!

I don't quite know what's going on with me at the moment, I just can't read it. The flushes seem to have calmed massively. Only getting about 5 a day and just heat and no obvious 'climbing' from my neck up. The night sweats haven't really caused a problem this session. Migraines are fairly frequent but on the whole are calming after meds, weirdly I'm getting prodrome symptoms I haven't had in years.

I don't know whether the oestrogen has risen very slightly, enough to prevent the flushes becoming an issue but not enough to trigger the usual high symptoms. This is very unusual for me not to know what my body is doing.

I woke with another mig this morning and took meds at about 6.30 but just feel a bit bleurgh today. The meds have calmed everything a little but I suspect it's going to be one of those 'can't achieve anything' days. Weirdly I feel a bit PMT though know I didn't ovulate and that the oestrogen wasn't high enough for long enough to cause an anovulatory bleed. Interestingly it was about a month ago that I had the last bleed so I suppose with my track record anything is possible! There seem to be very few patterns now.

I really hope you are both well and that there have been no pesky periods! x