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[hanbanan]

I haven't posted here in a while but I'm really struggling at present and feeling very low. On 25th July I'll be two years post op (having had my hysterectomy for endometriosis and PMDD, at the age of 35). It's been a rollercoaster ride and took me 15 months to feel any semblance of normal. I had real problems with absorbing HRT initially (tried gels, patches and tablets) and eventually settled on oestradiol and testosterone implants. I had a period of about six weeks where I felt well - good energy, clear head, no low e symptoms such as palpitations etc, but then my levels started to drop and the headaches, exhaustion and bone aches started again. This is towards the end of last year. I decided to make a real effort with lifestyle changes and made a commitment to exercising regularly, which I have kept up all year. I have lost a stone in weight and am definitely fitter and look better (so others tell me) than I have in a long time. The exercise has also helped with energy levels. However, it wasn't quite enough and I opted to have implants reinserted towards the end of April. I had been topping up my oestradiol with sandrena prior to this and had felt relatively stable, but my testosterone had bottomed out and I felt dog-tired. Anyway, since having the implants I have felt pretty awful - very sedated with a very fuzzy head. I have had intermittent insomnia, palpitations and burning hot feet (anyone else get this??). I had my levels tested at 2 weeks post implant and they were sky high - e 1967 pmol/L and t 14.5 nmol/L. I have just had them checked again and they have fallen: e 1300, t 7. So, they're still high but the drop in levels has just been awful - in fact my symptoms are getting worse, not better. I'm so physically and mentally exhausted I haven't been able to get into work today and my brain just doesn't seem to be functioning at all. I'm genuinely worried that I'm developing some kind of early dementia. My short term memory is shot and I find myself slurring my words when I'm even more exhausted at the end of the day. I have just bought myself some magnesium malate to take at night and have started taking Vit D3 again in the mornings. My diet is already pretty healthy (largely vegetarian, with some fish but very little dairy) and I have forced myself to the gym this week (but it's getting harder). I've no idea what else to do to help myself and I'm beginning to panic. I have a very demanding job and professional exams coming up. I need to be on form. I can't believe I'm feeling this bad two years on. I feel like I'm going mad, and can't make sense of my symptoms. Palpitations and constipation are rearing their heads, but these -  for me - usually happen when I'm hormonally low, which I'm obviously not. Any thoughts or suggestions gratefully received. Thank you.

[CLKD]

If you are vegetarian, how likely are you to be anaemic?

I had a friend who had been vegetarian since age 11, when she reached menopause she craved meat and as an almost last resort, began eating chicken and beef.  She felt better within weeks and never looked back!  Her body had probably been craving 'something' for years 

Meno brain fog is 'normal' for many of us!  Your own hormones may be over-riding the implants, were the readings taken before you opted for further implants?

[hanbanan]

Thank you so much for your reply.

I'm not vegetarian as I do eat fish. I don't think I'm anaemic - I haven't checked recently, but my haemoglobin and iron have actually been better since my hysterectomy (I've always been low end of normal though). However, if I don't feel better very soon I will see if I can get my FBC & thyroid rechecked even though I suspect they're fine (I've done it so often on this journey and they're always ok). I do crave meat sometimes but would only really consider eating it if I knew exactly how and where the animals were raised and where they were slaughtered and was happy that their welfare was the best it could be. It's a rate limiting step!

Re hormones - I don't have my ovaries so I have no cycle. I know the adrenals produce a small amount but it's minimal. The levels I posted above were post implant. Just prior to insertion, my e was around 700 (I think) and my t was 0.3. I only had a 25mg e implant this time as my consultant didn't want me going too high. He acknowledges this has now happened but says I just have to wait it out. However, I only spoke to him about it after the first bloods I had done. He has no idea I'm feeling worse than ever now. I don't think there's any point me contacting him as I'm not sure what he can do.

[CLKD]

I would let him know, nonetheless.

I can understand a reluctance to eat meat unless one knows how it is cared for although I've never taken that route, being raised in the Fens where arable and animals were all around.  DH and I did raise our own chickens/quails for eggs and large rabbits for the table and DH goes fishing often - though I'm not keen on fish  .

Could you have a chat with your local Vets who are in and out of farms in your area to see if they have any advice - or do as we do, go to your local butcher and ask if they raise and produce their own.  Certainly ours do, they can almost tell me the name of the beast which is too much info for me  .  The other route to go is the Rare Breeds Society who produce breeds which were commonly seen across England but went out of fashion for various reasons.  Goat products too, local breeders might be able to give you ideas as to whether their care is up to your expectations; although I find that goat products smell of well, goat    …..

Do you eat eggs?  Drink milk?  I don't like either much but DH does a Very Good Pancake  …….. listen to your body, perhaps ask around about meat production so that when you have a 'craving' ……… also, starting with dairy will protect your bones from osteoporosis as well as the exercise regime you have started.    on continuing - I have good intentions, a cycle, good walking boots, but the thing I find suits me best is gardening.  (have you read our section on birds etc.?).

Crashing fatigue is part of The Change sadly …….

[honeybun]

Have you had your bloods done. Thyroid in particular. It might be worth getting everything checked out to make sure all is ok.

Honeyb
X

[hanbanan]

Section on birds?! Nope, not seen that...!

Thank you for your suggestions. I have researched it all thoroughly before and I do know somewhere I can get "ethical" meat from but logistically it's a bit tricky and I can't work out if my cravings are really my body telling me something or if it's just my tastebuds. I don't like eggs or milk (and there are a host of animal welfare issues there which bother me too, but - don't worry - I won't go into it here!) but I like yoghurt & cheese. However, there's quite a bit of literature out there now, including a paper in the Lancet, saying that lots of dairy may actually be detrimental to bone health & there's evidence showing that populations that are traditionally dairy-free e.g. SE Asia have a far lower fracture rate than us in the west. It's all a minefield!

Yes, I know crashing fatigue is associated with menopause. It's just so frustrating and debilitating though. And I don't know why it comes out of the blue like this. I know that high oestrogen can cause sedative feelings and fluctuations in levels can cause all manner of symptoms. Perhaps I just have to ride it out and consider an alternative HRT (but what??!).

Honeybun - thank you. Thyroid has always been fine & my hunch is it's related to oestrogen, but will definitely get checked out if things don't improve soon xx

PS am I the only person who gets burning feet?? They're driving me mad!!

[peri]

Hi hanbanan

I get burning feet, have you tried a chillow pillow you can get them on Amazon and they really work, also they're good if you get hot flushes in the night.

[Dancinggirl]

hanbanan - it really sounds to me as though you are low on B12 and iron.  I am a life vegetarian and know I have to take some B12 regularly because I don't eat red meat.  I eat a lot of eggs as they are good for iron.   My friend who hated anything dairy but had a very healthy diet in every other way has now got advanced stage osteoporosis and is forcing herself to eat more diary now to help reduce further bone loss - I must to add that she comes from a family full of people in the medical profession.  Lack of Vitamin D is another thing that can cause fatigue, lack of absorption of calcium and many other problems. 
I do wonder if you are on too high a dose of oestrogen??? I find that high amounts of oestrogen can make me feel awful - headaches, flushes, agitation etc.
Hope you feel better soon.  DG x

[Annie0710]

Bless your heart
I echo Dancinggirls advice, either get your b12 checked (ranges in UK aren't very kind though) or go on Amazon and buy Jarrows sublingual tablets, they're high dose, and what your body doesn't need/use will be excreted naturally

I hardly eat red meat and my appetite is awful (as in not wanting to face healthy foods) and 3 years ago my symptoms were what prompted GP to test b12, many symptoms overlap meno symptoms

I've started feeling pretty c&@p again and realised I'd not been taking my supplements for a couple of weeks

I think during meno your thyroid levels can play up so maybe a good test result last time might not mean a good one this time

Sending hugs
Annie xx

[lancashirelass]

I have implants.  What dose.did they give.you and how long did you top up with gel for afterwards.  Low ferritin can make you feel rubbish.

[hanbanan]

Thank you Peri. I'll take a look.

Thank you Dancinggirl & Annie. I occasionally take a bercocca but I need to be more diligent. Perhaps I'll hunt down those sublingual tablets you've suggested. I need to do something. And, yes, I will think about thyroid again. Just sick of blood tests and I feel like a hypochondriac.

Yes, I think my oestrogen is too high and that that along with the drop is part of the problem. I need a decent level of oestrogen (but not too much!) that is stable to feel well. It feels elusive at the moment.

Lancashirelass - I had a 25mg oestrogen implant and a 50mg testosterone one. I didn't top up as my levels were already decent before insertion (other than the t which had bottomed out). My consultant said implants can keep secreting for up to two years and you can get unexpectedly high levels. Perhaps that's what's happened.

Thank you all so much x

[hanbanan]

Just been to the GP as was still feeling dreadful this morning. She thinks it's all hormonal but we are getting bloods including FBC and thyroid done, just in case.

Oh, and Lancashirelass, I was wrong about my T implant - it was 100mg, not 50mg. How do you feel on implants? How long have you been on them?

[CLKD]

I get a lot of itchy feet when I get into the bath, on my insteps  …….. used to keep me awake but fortunately that problem has now gone.

I am tired today.  Tend to make less than useful decisions when I'm tired as the brain fog increases  oh Joy: not!

[lancashirelass]

A 25 oestrogen is nowhere near strong enough.  You may also find 100 test too high i did.  I have a 50 oestrogen and 50 test.  I find the e wears off about 4.5 months in so i top up with gel but get.my implant done every six months on the dot.  Who did them for.you my chap would never use a 25 unless i was.v.high and symptomatic still

[lancashirelass]

Also i would.get your levels tested i think you are.probably too low.