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[Old Frumpy]

Firstly some background.

As some may remember I started Vagifem after 8 weeks of vaginal soreness and repeat UTI (which were negative) this was a result of starting BP meds.  They literally ripped any moisture from me - I was raw down below!  They were stopped and next try lasted 2 weeks and pottasioum went low and told to stop them.

I took two weeks BP readings and heard nothing - till 8.20 am this morning and senior GP rang ( near fell of chair) I explained all to him - he seemed to have no background anyway I explained I had lost 11 kilo on a NHS local well being scheme which was to have also had physio supported excersise class following dietican but I was not allowed to do exercise due to BP issues.

You can imagine me as one of 12 folks sitting in diet class and then others went to exercise and I went home. 

Anyway to my question can vagifem increase my Blood Pressure.  I am tinkering on the brink BP range and GP mentioned Amlodopine this morning - and I shuddered as when I saw lymphodema nurse she warned me about them.  So basically he has left it as keep up the healthy lifestyle and he is " not reaching for his pen at the moment"

So I have spent the last half hour in panic.  Talk about raising BP

So I need help and reassutrance. Sorry so long a thread but the thought of starting with soreness and pinching pain and need to urinate has said me sideways.

Thanks

[bombsh3ll]

No vaginal estrogen cannot increase your blood pressure (other than the through the constant stress and hassle of battling for prescriptions which some women experience with all types of hormone therapy).

It sounds as if you have been given very poor advice around your blood pressure - on the one hand you have been led to believe it is so dangerously elevated that you cannot exercise, yet you are on no medication for it!

These two situations should be mutually exclusive.

Exercise is highly beneficial for a multitude of reasons but additionally lowering high blood pressure. It doesn't have to be running but even if you walk to the shops or hoover your living room, you are already exercising. There are very few people who can't take a gentle swim, or a beginners yoga class for example.

It sounds like you were given a diuretic initially if it dried you out - a reasonable thing to try with lymphoedema, and that you are concerned about swelling with amlodipine - some do experience mild ankle swelling but like any side effects the majority have none, and in any case there are other agents like ace inhibitors, ARBs, alpha and beta blockers, so it's not like you have no options.

What is your average home blood pressure?

[Old Frumpy]

Bombshell - thank you for that glad to hear  think the GP raised it more!! t

Firstly I did take an ARB Losarten 25mg which kept causes UTI/thrush like syptoms which were always negative.  As I have asthma things like propanalol and Ace Inhibitors some options were out.
My intial high BP was found by physio assesment for the exercise and diet programme.  Hence only going on diet part then last week at review she took my BP which was !st 140 over 80 then less second time sorry can't recall that.  Then on weighing me she was delighted at my 12 week weight loss(as am I) but said now my BMI was too low for excersise part of programme.  In my area you need to be on a pathway for certain referrals hence the programme

She has suggested a referral to a gym programme on machines etc.  But 2 month waiting list for assesment.

At present I have increased my walking with my little dog twice daily and cut out salt and really cut back on caffeine(downfall is too much coffee) plus the healthy eating programme was very useful.  At moment my wonky knee is also behaving.

I would try aqua robics but honestly in past chloring in hot tubs has caused burning down below!!  But I have found a chair based yoga class which I hope to attend.

I think my main worry is the nightmare that the BP meds brought, mad as it sounds I believe it is related to urogynaecology - something that wasn't around 15 or more years ago when I saw gynie and was first told I had VA and irrated bladder lining.
One of the main irratants for that being pottasium.

So trying to walk more loose a bit more and eat better....

Thank you.

[CLKD]

Usually 1 cannot feel a high BP, until 1 suffers a stroke. Low BP however can be noticed, i.e. when standing from a sitting position = light headed.

VA treatment is unlikely to impact on the rest of the body as it's such a localised application. 

Don't cut out all salt as this may make U feel worse.  MinL's GP kept telling her to cut out salt and use 'lo-salt' due to cramping and she refused to believe that by upping her salt intake, the cramping would improve.  When she was rushed into Hospital the Consultant couldn't understand how she was still able to stand due to her low sodium levels!

She was also on a diuretic which would flush out the other essential minerals through urine.

Gynaecologists often don't know much more about VA than GPs seem to: getting a referral to a dedicated menopause clinic may B the way to proceed. 

VA is due to loss of oestrogen when the whole body may become dry: inside and out.  Regular treatment internally as well as caring for the skin becomes a necessity for many of us.

[bombsh3ll]

If 140/80 was your clinic BP this is borderline for treatment and in no way precludes you from exercise.

If you haven't got one already I would buy a home BP machine - you are likely to be pleasantly surprised as your unstressed readings will be lower.

Were you using vaginal estrogen whilst on the ARB because those are also symptoms of GSM and sadly are often attributed to other causes which may simply be an innocent bystander.

In any case I would be inclined to use lifestyle measures first, in particular weight loss, exercise and an anti inflammatory diet.

Beetroot juice is a good natural way to lower high BP, you could have a look into the scientific evidence for this.

I take fludrocortisone for low BP and if I occasionally end up too high this is what I use as I would never tolerate pharmacological BP lowering.

[Old Frumpy]

Thank you both...CLKD  the salt thing really came home to me when I was on the second med...2 week blood test and phone call from GP to stop taking them and I must introduce salt....also must phone 111 and explain blood test finding if ill during night (cramps and stomach pain)hubby sent of to Asda for salted crisps.  Blood test and appt 4 days later all back to normal.  These BP meds are a nightmare first cut back on salt and don't take Brufen on Losartan....then with the Indapamide salt was needed!!!

I do have BP machine and took BP twice daily for 2 weeks.  Bombshell....no I was off Vag estrogen and had been for several years -  the Arb brought on the UTI/bad thrush like episodes that I told GP was like intial period before VA and irrated bladder was suggested by Gynie.  Because of my post cancer history she was reluctant to give it me - then next time I saw her she had looked into it and said there was no problem.  She is middle aged and she really does get everything you say unlike some.  But only with surgery part time sadly.

Beetroot...what can I say - but yes it has sits in the fridge and have daily - love it, I all so got hibiscus tea but it really burns my mouth.  I have started having fresh chopped parsley and adding it on top of my food and salads as that is said to be good.

So keep on doing what I can to stay off the stuff.

[CLKD]

Morning.   In the 1980s/90s/ GPs got 'low with the salt' idea to the determent of many patients, instead of finding out what the real problem might be.  Salt and sugar are important parts of our diet. 

A varied diet can help enormously as well as keeping hydrated.  I never had any problems when on propranolol and it has never been suggested that I alter my intake/diet.  I also take Ibuprofen when necessary, my Pharmacist friend told me it becomes a problem with some meds if 1 is using 'too much', i.e. every day - without seeking advice.  Paracetamol doesn't touch pain for me.

Letting the body settle is often the way to approach issues, or we may never know exactly what might be causing X, Y, Z .  As for having had treatment for breast disease, these days I never think about what I should/not take.  Quality of Life ;-)

[Old Frumpy]

You know the thing that threw me was this general knowledge that BP good levels were normal at 120/80 and on the threshold if 140/90.  Americans seems to aim for the good levels even when older.....but when I was working certainly up to 2015 I would have thought great BP but I wouldn't have judge me at late 60's as having high BP at 140/90 ( although I might have said the 90 was a bit high)

So in my old money mind I would have done the old thing of adding the age bit on.  Discussing this with my friend a nurse who till she retired worked as a company health care nurse agreed with me.  I even had a discussion with my former colleague who works for health charity and glad to say she cleared it up for me.....apparently new and lower guide lines came out around 2017 which advised levels which were lower for better management in the US and later brought out here.

Just sipping my beetroot juice - love it but have to watch the sugar rush

[bombsh3ll]

I think tighter BP control has to be balanced against quality of life and side effects of multiple medications, and should always be individualised rather than rigidly applying a blanket cut off for everyone.

Lifestyle measures and stress are also often overlooked, particularly in the US as they are time consuming and don't make any money, whereas getting large numbers of people on lifelong medication is both easy and lucrative.