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[Kelrob12]

Hi everyone,
Been trying for 18 months to feel normal! Was on 50mg estraderm and 200mg cyclic progesterone, the LN clinic said estroges was way too low (Im 41 no ovaries) so upped with estradot to 100mg and continuous progesterone(because I thought I felt better with a balance of progesterone).
So my estrogen levels on 50mg estraderm were 171 pmol/L and now on 100mg estradot are 211 pmol/L and progesterone 8nmol/L.

So before my results I was sure the increase of estrogen made me feel crap - my groin aches, I just fee rubbish, the estrogen seems to makes me anxious. I really just wanted to protect my bones, now I feel like stopping it all and starting fresh!
Could it be estraderm was a better delivery? I know they say is should be the same but Ive tries evorel and they definitely for me don't absorb the same. Could it be the progesterone? Im literally wanting to protect by bones, get the right ratio f hormones just to not feel acmes and sore and not anxious and crappy! But suppose that's what we are all doing really haha

Kellyx

[Hurdity]

Hi kelly.louise

Personally in your position I would want to be taking oestrogen cyclically as you were doing. You are still young and would have been having normal periods. At least give it a try - some women feel rubbish on continuous progesterone - it is a sedative after all, even though you say you feel better on conti. Remember periods? We got used to the ups and downs of hormones. Of course no need to have periods if you don't need to but the important things is to feel well. Some women feel it's better to have the ups and downs and feel good for part of the time than continuously feeling below par. I am one of those.

The other things you could try taking the progesterone vaginally rather than orally although as you are young and if in a relationship this may not be ideal for 12 days per month....

Your oestrogen is still low for someone of your age although probably just about OK to protect your bones. It also depends when during your patch change week your levels were measured. I was shocked how different mine wwere when I was due to change my patch compared with half-way through the patch's life.

Yes they are the same mode of delivery but the patches are a different size. It is surprising that there appears little difference between the two doses in your case but like I said it depends when the blood was taken. One off blood tests are not especially accurate and how you feel is more important, once you have reached a decent absolute level to help prevent osteoporosis.

I used Estradot for years and swore by it, but when the shortages hit I was changed to estraderm which I hated (think rustly plastic bag on butt!) and was then given Elleste Solo 80  but unfortunately doesn't come any higher  than this. You could try that or possibly have another go at Evorel which many women seem to like?

I think your answer may be first to change back to sequi HRT if you can - for a few cycles. See how you feel and then if still not improved then think of changing to a different brand of patch.

Another alternative is to have a Mirena coil and you would have no bleeds once your body had acclimatised although there is still some sytemic absorption of the progestogen.

Hope this helps?

Hurdity x

[Kelrob12]

Thanks Hurdity,

Yeah I agree, I actually didn't take my progesterone last night, so will start cyclic again and write a daily diary for how I feel. Then like you say I may try the evorel.

They always talk about optimising your estrogen - how does anyone know when they have reached this level? At 50mg patch I had no hot flushes but started testosterone which seemed to convert to estrogen, hence why I upped my patch. I know if I go back to LN they will just up it again and I have to pay another £90 to be told this so holding off till I feel its best.

Its shame - if I had know how hard it was to level hormones Id have taken bloods the week I felt best before they took my ovaries 😂.

x

[Hurdity]

Hi there - you know you have optimised your oestrogen if you feel fine at a particular dose. If you need  a certain level for oesteoporosis protection then that should be a minimum guide. You would not be able to determine what your levels should be from just the one reading ( before your ovaries were removed) as this depends very much on where you were in your cycle. If for example you were at your oestrogen peak of say 1200 pmol /l of oestrogen - it is not generally considered desirable to maintain these sorts of high levels all the time.

Generally speaking if you are young then you would aim for a higher average level than if you were older because you would naturally be experiencing higher levels - so you don't want to just aimn for elimination of symptoms but feeling reasonable good for most of the time.

What is LN? You should not have to pay for tests ( if in UK)

Hurdity x

[Mary G]

kelly.louise, 211 pmol is way too low and you should be getting more than that from a 100 mcg patch.  I'm using pump of Oestrogel every day and my oestrogen levels are consistently around 300 pmol.   I'm very post menopause and not producing any of my own oestrogen so this is a reliable reading.

If you are post menopause it is a good idea to have blood tests because it's the only way to find out how well you are absorbing your HRT - it's even more important if you need HRT for bone protection.  Even allowing for fluctuations, you are not going to get a low reading like 211 pmol if you are absorbing the oestrogen properly.

Have the Newson Clinic suggested Oestrogel?   You might find you absorb it better.

Re the progesterone, to give you an idea, I'm taking 50mg progesterone every day and my level is between 15 and 18 nmol although I had to convert it because it was measured in ng/mL!   Locking back at my results, my progesterone level is consistently between 4.90 and 5.72 ng/mL so I'm wondering if your levels are low? 

I hope that helps.

[Kelrob12]

kelly.louise, 211 pmol is way too low and you should be getting more than that from a 100 mcg patch.  I'm using pump of Oestrogel every day and my oestrogen levels are consistently around 300 pmol.   I'm very post menopause and not producing any of my own oestrogen so this is a reliable reading.

If you are post menopause it is a good idea to have blood tests because it's the only way to find out how well you are absorbing your HRT - it's even more important if you need HRT for bone protection.  Even allowing for fluctuations, you are not going to get a low reading like 211 pmol if you are absorbing the oestrogen properly.

Have the Newson Clinic suggested Oestrogel?   You might find you absorb it better.

Re the progesterone, to give you an idea, I'm taking 50mg progesterone every day and my level is between 15 and 18 nmol although I had to convert it because it was measured in ng/mL!   Locking back at my results, my progesterone level is consistently between 4.90 and 5.72 ng/mL so I'm wondering if your levels are low? 

I hope that helps.

Hi Mary,
I know it doesn't make sense to me - \I know when there was the patch shortage they gave me evorel from estraderm and it wasn't the same like I absorb different. I think I absorb less on estradot too!
I haven't been back to the Newson clinic, if Im honesty it cost me so much last time I was hoping it would have been sorted as you have to keep paying(obviously I knew this) every time and with covid and my work and husbands work - we are both self employed, it was just difficult. I'm due to speak to an Nhs specialist 7th November so want to get all the queries I need and info from the great help here so I don't miss anything!
The gel worries me as Im so sensitive to slight estrogen increases that if I don't apply the exact amount the same each time I worried about the side effects. I get tingling/cold arms and legs its very weird! Maybe its worth a try though?
x