Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[GypsyRoseLee]

Hello

A very brief backstory. After years of dreadful perimenopausal mood swings + anxiety Prof Studd managed to largely suppress my crazed cycle with his regime of 4 pumps + Utrogestan + Testogel. I also take a low dose AD too. It took a long while to fully kick in but in the last year I've only had 3 'episodes' where my mood has really dipped again, and the dips only lasted 10 days.

Interestingly, each of those episodes started around the 25th of the month, which used to be the day my natural period used to start, prior to HRT. Coincidence?

Last month, I had a light bleed which started on the 27th, before I started Utrogestan on March 1st. The bleed finished on March 2nd and the Utrogestan didn't cause a withdrawal bleed.

Then exactly 14 days after my bleed started my mood really dipped and I had quite a bit of creamy discharge (so ovulation?) and I have felt very flat and horrible since, just like I used to. I also feel draggingly tired and could sleep standing up.

Do you think that somehow I have actually managed to ovulate, despite my high dose of oestrogen? And I'm now just suffering the fall out as my own oestrogen is falling?

I'm so confused that this could be happening to me. Can anyone explain it to me, or does my explanation make sense to you?

[GypsyRoseLee]

Thank you Stellajane.

I've followed your advice on the other thread and I have booked another scan just to check my endometrium is still nice and thin.

[Hurdity]

Hi GypsyRoseLee

Sorry to hear you've started to get some mood dips again. I don't think there is any science that can explain what is happening to you specifically. As you say the high dose of oestrogen is intended to suppress your cycle so to me the likely explanation for your mood changes is variability in absorption or lack of complete suppression of your cycle?

Even if you had ovulated the high oestrogen dose should prevent you experiencing the same dramatic oestrogen dip as before you started the HRT, because your base level should be higher - but as you are very sensitive to changes in hormone levels maybe this is what is happening? Are you still with the Studd clinic and can you contact someone there to ask?

Sorry I can't help further and I do hope this is only a temporary blip for you?

Hurdity x

[CLKD]

   bugga .............. HORMONES 

[GypsyRoseLee]

Thank you, and hello Hurdity.

These dips are nowhere near as bad as they used to be prior to Studd's regime, thank goodness. So, as you say, the 4 pumps must keep my baseline much higher in comparison. But, I'm just aghast that occasionally my own hormones can still affect me like this! Honestly, you'd think they'd give up the ghost by now!

I haven't seen Prof Studd for 3 years, as my GP is happy to prescribe his regime. I do have regular uterine scans though and my lining is nice and thin. The fact my withdrawal bleeds are nice and light is proof that my own cycle is being successfully suppressed (according to Prof Studd) though my real periods prior to HRT had become very light anyway.

I am very loathe to tinker with this regime, but I am wondering if increasing to say 5 pumps when these dips happen might be effective?

[GypsyRoseLee]

Hi CLKD

I feel so annoyed that my hormones can still do this to me!

[pepperminty]

Hi GRL,

If the dips are not so severe, then I would wait and see if it happens again, it may be that for some reason your absorption varied? A blip? I would research 5 pumps as that does seem a lot.

 Wow great to see how good things are compared with the dark days. 

PMX

[MIS71MUM]

Hi GRL

Just a thought, could you ask your GP for a blood test for oestrogen? Maybe then you could find out whether the gel is still effective, ie giving you good levels of hormones in your system? Or maybe ask for a progesterone test to see if you are still ovulating?

I'm on 5 pumps of gel now but have been told to go to 6!!!

[GypsyRoseLee]

Hi Mis71Mum, how lovely to see you.

That might be a good idea, though I won't have anything to compare the oestrogen level to because it hasn't been tested since the start of this regime. I have just checked back in my diary and the episodes I had last year all lasted 14 days, so I still have several more days to wait to see if this episode lifts as per usual.

I'm still curious if increasing my pumps during these episodes might help? But I'm so scared of rocking the boat when I feel so much better overall.

Can I ask how you felt in 5 pumps and why you're increasing to 6?

[CLKD]

How R U today? 

[MIS71MUM]

Hi GRL
Yes lovely to hear from you too but sorry you are still getting dips.

I've noticed that when my dips come, they come on certain dates, 25th onwards and last 10 ish days.

I'm coming to the conclusion that it's either my cycle in the background, had hysterectomy but kept ovaries, so don't have bleeds, or I'm just not getting enough oestrogen.

I got referred to a NHS gynaecologist- who tested my bloods. To be honest, my mood was good on the day, but was flushing like mad. The estradiol came back as 91 pmol and test was 0.3!

Although I'm still on 5 pumps now, ive never applied my gel all in one go. I now do 3 in a morning and 2 at night. However I can feel both doses wearing off.  Even on 3 in a morning, I can start flushing 4-5 hours later.

So I suppose I need to decide whether to actually apply all doses together or try something new. I was on 100 mg patch before, sometimes it made me sleep and sometimes it mades me really anxious which would mean my cycle is still in the background.
 

There is a member on here who applies 6 pumps in one go - her name will come to me at some point and her levels have really increased in doing this.

Thinking about blood tests, maybe the progesterone one may be more beneficial. I'm sure the ranges for different phases of your cycle change  a lot and could prove you are still having a cycle.

Wishing you well - surely we can't be going through this much longer xxxx

[GypsyRoseLee]

Yes, I am the same as you in that my dips always seem to occur on, or around, the 25th of the month according to my calendar. And yes, they also seem to last 10-12 days. Back in the day the 25th used to be the day my period always started, so it surely can't be coincidence?

Like you say, I think it must be our own cycle sometimes flaring up in the background (why? why?) and somehow depleting our oestrogen for those 10 days.

I can't believe how low your oestrogen and T levels were despite HRT! My T level was 0.7 before starting Testogel and Prof Studd told me that was much too low.

I've been thinking about how you apply your gel in 2 separate doses a day. I've been reading a very good website called 'How to survive surgical menopause' and they talk at length about how the gel is first absorbed and then stored in the subdermal level of your skin. The subdermal builds up a reservoir of the oestrogen which is then slowly released over the day. They also talk about the benefits of applying ALL the gel dose in one go and spreading it over a large area e.g. the whole of your arms, including the undersides + shoulders, because the thinner it is spread the more of it is absorbed, so more if it reaches the subdermal layer, and creates bigger reservoir for your body to draw on.

Soooooo, maybe try and apply 5 pumps in one go and over larger area?