Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Not a Forum member? You can still subscribe to our Free Newsletter

media

Author Topic: New member...  (Read 1622 times)

AJacynM

  • Guest
New member...
« on: October 08, 2018, 10:38:38 PM »

Hi there,
I'm totally new to this but not to the menopause!! I hope I'm posting in the right section though as not sure!
Just need advice as really struggling with HRT.
I started around a year ago on Evorel sequi which when I used the dual patches gave me very bad side effects. The doc decided it was the progesterone in the patches so I switched to Femseven sequi... these were ok but just would not stay on for the length of time needed and kept falling off! So... I'm now using evorel oestrogen only patches continually and adding in utrogestran caps, two at night for the last 14 days - only I just can't stand the side effects and stop at 12 days.
At the mo I'm on month 4 and day 6 of the utrogestran and feel like death... I have terrible tummy cramps, shivers, nausea, extreme fatigue, I ache like crazy and just can't think straight.
I really need advice on what to do next as I'm not getting much help from my doctor. I have a pharmacist friend who is lovely and calling me tomorrow to discuss but I'm not sure she knows what to do now as I seem a lost cause regarding progesterone.
The oestrogen makes my symptoms so much better but I need to take the dreaded progesterone too. 
Sorry for the lengthy post. If any of you lovely ladies has advice I'd love to hear it, thank you in advance.
AJ. xx
« Last Edit: October 09, 2018, 08:29:34 AM by AJacynM »
Logged

Ladybt28

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1422
Re: New member...
« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2018, 12:13:50 AM »

 :welcomemm:  AJacynM  Have a check around the forum, searching progesterone intolerance - there are plenty of posts - it is a common theme. Under utrogestan and/or progesterone intolerance there are posts about cycles how they work and short cycles and about Professor Studd a meno consultant who deals with ladies requiring short progesterone cycles.  It causes a bit of a controversy here on the forum, some people think it is a bit dangerous but with the proper supervision there are ladies who do it because it is the only way they can manage.  You are not a lost cause to progesterone, you just have to manage it differently than the usual prescribed way.

There are plenty of ladies putting up posts just like yours - have a route about and find the answers.  Plenty on here dont use it the convential way.  Dancinggirl has posted about this and a lady called MaryG.  Tell us more about yourself - how old you are, where in the meno journey etc and then you will find they explain their circumstances.  I posted myself on the subject - take a look under my name in the members bar and you can see what each person has posted.  Try Mary G - she helped me.
Logged

NorthArm

  • Guest
Re: New member...
« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2018, 06:42:42 AM »

Hi AJacynM

Are you taking it orally at night? I pushed through the 14 days this time, so have finished the pack. For the next cycle I'm going to trial norethisterone 2.5mg again.

Some ladies don't do well taking Utrogestan orally, and use it vaginally instead, as per Professor Studd. Why not see this course through for the twelve days (swap to taking it at night if you don't already do so), and with your doctor's approval, give vaginally a go next cycle?

Some ladies find they don't get on with it even then, and opt to have a Mirena coil fitted and use a patch.

Anyway, I'm sure one of the more knowledgeable ladies will be along soon to help you out xx
Logged

AJacynM

  • Guest
Re: New member...
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2018, 08:12:37 AM »

Thank you LadyBT28 and NorthArm...
I'll have a route round on this site as you suggest as I wasn't quite sure how to navigate it but I'll try and find posts that relate.
I'm from the UK, am 46 and have been peri menopausal for years from about 40'ish... then nearly two years ago I hadn't had a period for a year and had many symptoms, the worst being really bad aching, no memory, total foggy thinking, exhaustion... because I was quite young to go through it the doc suggested HRT. I agreed as long as I could use patches. Fast forward to now with the info I gave below and that's where I am presently... before the menopause I was so happy, active and loved life. Now I struggle to get through the day!
I have two children, one still quite young and I want to be the mother I was 😢.

Thank you again for getting back to me and for your kind words.
Have a good day.
AJ. xx

Logged

Dancinggirl

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 7091
Re: New member...
« Reply #4 on: October 09, 2018, 10:38:36 AM »

Hi and welcome to MM AJacynM

You are young, so you need HRT.  I didn't get on with Utrogestan at all well particularly on a conti basis.  Many do better with a sequential regime and use the Utrogestan vaginally to reduce side effects - I hint you can get away with using only 100mg vaginally as well as it is being delivered more directly to the uterus.  Unfortunately I couldn't use Utrogestan vaginally as it irritated my urogenital atrophy(burning and soreness). 
You should probably ask for a referral to a specialist gynaecologist or menopause clinic so you can be monitored better and they might let you try a longer cycle to reduce the progesterone side effects - although when I tried a longer cycle I got more cramps and erratic bleeding.

Prior to trying Utrogestan, I had the Mirena with Oestrogen, which I had found really quite good, so I would suggest you consider this. The Mirena has the same progesterone was the Femseven patches you tried and found OK (if only they had stuck!) - so I'm thinking the Mirena could be the answer to you problems???  The Mirena allows you to use oestrogen as pills, patch or gel and at any dose that you need to keep flushes etc under control - so in many ways it can work really well.

I am 62 now, had a premature menopause so tried just about every HRT going over 25 years of hormonal treatment. I never got on well with conti HRTs but through my 40s I had Oestrogel with separate progesterone for 10 days each month which was also ok at the time but it did mean monthly bleeds which gave me bad cramps.  I got very little cramping with the Mirena and no bleeding after the first few weeks (apart from a bit of spotting now and again) over the 4 years I had it.

Here is the info on the Mirena:
Mirena is a levonorgestrel (type of progestogen) releasing system which sits inside the womb, gradually releasing the progestogen into the womb. It is licensed in the UK and Ireland as a contraceptive agent, for treatment of heavy periods and, from August 2004, also for the progestogen component of HRT. It can be used in both the perimenopause and postmenopause and it is particularly useful for:

Persistent progestogenic side effects from systemic HRT despite changes in type and route of progestogen.
When contraception is required along with HRT in the perimenopause.
When withdrawal bleeds on sequential HRT are heavy, after investigation if indicated. (see WHEN TO BE REFERRED )
With Mirena in place, systemic estrogen alone can be taken as the Mirena provides adequate protection of the womb lining and the estrogen dose and route can be tailored to meet the individual's needs.

Progestogenic absorption throughout the body is minimal so reducing progestogenic side effects. The effect of Mirena on the womb lining can significantly reduce bleeding and when used as part of an HRT regimen, in time, 30 to 60% of women have no bleeding at all. Although Mirena used for contraception is licensed for 5 years, the license for use for the progestogen part of HRT is currently 4 years.


No HRT will be prefect.  Hope my thought are helpful. Dg x
Logged

AJacynM

  • Guest
Re: New member...
« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2018, 11:55:35 AM »

Hi Dancing girl,
Thank you so much for the info.
My doctor isn't particularly helpful and doesn't see the need to refer me and won't do bloods as apparently they work 'symptoms, signs /side effects' to monitor rather than take bloods to check things
I have thought about the mirena but wasn't sure I wanted a coil but after your thoughts I may discuss it again with them as I hadn't realised it was the same progesterone as femseven either... I've also just read about tegaderm patches and how some women are using them to keep the femseven on? So that's another option to maybe try too. One thing for sure, I can't go on using utrogestran, I do take 2 at night at the mo for supposedly 14 nights and feel just dreadful (I've only ever got to day 12 in previous months).
Thank you so much again, you've given me hope that eventually I will hopefully get it right and feel human again.
AJ. xx
Logged

AJacynM

  • Guest
Re: New member...
« Reply #6 on: October 09, 2018, 11:58:50 AM »

Sorry, meant to also put that I'll check out the utrogestran pessaries too.
AJ. xx
Logged

Ladybt28

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1422
Re: New member...
« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2018, 12:24:36 PM »

Hey Dancinggirl  your info is interesting to me as I am still struggling with the gel and utrogesten so the more info I have about others circumstances the better.  The meno clinic had Indivina on the list for me  You say you have used loads of HRT over the years, have you ever been given this?  I cant seem to find anyone to give me a review or tell me how they got on compared to other hrt?
Logged

Dancinggirl

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 7091
Re: New member...
« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2018, 12:52:37 PM »

AJcynM

Indivina has MPA(medroxyprogesterone) in it  - I don't think this is a progesterone I have had - I tried so many I lost track in the end.    Way back in my 40s I think I had Dydrogesterone (which is in Femoston) alongside Oestrogel, as this was available in pill form on it's own - sadly now discontinued unless part of combined HRT( Femoston).

If you want, you can get medroxyprogesterone on it's own (Provera) to try instead of Utrogestan.  I have read quite a few posts on this forum from women who didn't get on with Utrogestan and went onto Provera very successfully.
Here is the link that give you the various progesterone options.
https://www.menopausematters.co.uk/to_progestogens.php

I would print this off to show you GP.  DG x
Logged

AJacynM

  • Guest
Re: New member...
« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2018, 01:24:50 PM »

Hi again,
I was wondering about Dydrogesterone but obviously that's a no go on its own now.
Anyway I will look into provera - my surgery are supposedly ringing me today so I have a lots of info to discuss with them now...
Thank you again.
AJ. x
Logged

Hurdity

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 13840
Re: New member...
« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2018, 07:24:50 PM »

Hi AJacynM

 :welcomemm: from me too.

Sorry to hear you are struggling.

Just to point out that 12 days is in fact the licensed regime for utrogestan - not 14 so if you can cope with it for that long then great. That's the first thing! Also re vaginal use - it is exactly the same stuff used vaginally as orally. in UK for HRT there is only the 100 mg version so you use two of them vaginally ( as you have been doing orally). There is a 200 mg pessary used for fertility which some women manage to get prescribed for HRT ( because it's exactly the same) although some formularies in some areas don't seem to allow it!

What dose of patch are you taking? if it is the 50 mcg - as you are young then you could well benefit from a higher dose - most patches come in 75 mcg and 100 mcg. I am in mid 60's for example and on 62.5 (I snip off a bit of 75 mcg!). I suggest you ask for an increase in oestrogen, reduce your progesterone days to 12 in line with the licesned regime, and switch to vaginal use. Depending how your uterus lining reacts you may well eventually be able to take less or for a shorter duration or have a longer time betweemn doses ( as I do - I take it every 6-8 weeks) - but as Ladybt says you will need to do this under medical supervision.

One other thing are you using any vaginal oestrogen like Vagifem? I use this in addition to patches and vaginal Utrogestan, and a week before I start my utro cycle I use extra Vagifem to plump up the tissues in the hope that it might minimise absorption of Utrogestan into the body - seems to have worked this cycle although may just be wishful thinking!

You don't need blood tests although if you want to vary the licensed regime of progesterone you will want the doc to approve this and if necessary agree a regular scan to check all is OK.

There are many different potential side effects from oral use of utrogestan due to the large number and quantity of different metabolites which are not produced with vaginal use - nausea is a classic one. Some women also report a return of sweats when using the prog so again this indicates that more oestrogen might help.

I do hope you are able to sort this - it has all worked well for me - so that you can enjoy life again :)

Hurdity x
Logged

AJacynM

  • Guest
Re: New member...
« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2018, 11:03:48 PM »

 Hi Hurdity,
Thank you for your reply... I am using 50mcg evorel patches at the mo. They did take away my awful aches and pains but haven't done much more to be honest - I'm still very forgetful and foggy minded!! That said the aches were the worst for me so... but again, the utrogestran seem to make me ache too so I will defo look into all you have said.
If I up the oestrogen dosage - is this likely to help with side effects from the utrogestran do you think?
Thank you again... when the surgery phone, (which they said they would today but didn't) I'm well armed with info!
AJ. xx
Logged

AJacynM

  • Guest
Re: New member...
« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2018, 11:11:13 PM »

Hi again..
I've just seen what you posted on the other thread re femseven. If the manufacturer changes the glue that would be great as I didn't seem to have any side effects with those patches... or was that because I didn't get much of the drug as they kept falling off?! 😖
It's all so trial and error until a good regime is found isn't it?
AJ. xx
Logged