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[Wilks]

From my other topic of “how to accept the menopause”, I realise that the main thing that bothers me is that this is it for the rest of my life. However, some say that it gets better once you “get through the other side” and your oestrogen stops fluctuating. But it's my understanding that although hot flushes and mood swings will eventually pass, nothing else will. Am I right?
The itchy dry skin, VA, increased risk of heart disease, loss of bone density, spare tyre, hair thinning, lack of energy, loss of libido, brain fog, etc are with you forever unless you take HRT forever?

[CLKD]

Why?

My grannies had no access to HRT and both lived into their 80s. [have we had this conversation already  ]
My Mum is 91 and has never taken HRT - her skin is great, she's up and at it!  Late MinL didn't mention menopause at all.

Vaginal atrophy can be troublesome for ever.  Personally I don't need to use the Ovestin as often, I recognise the signs of dryness so do a 3-night 'load' and it sorts itself.  Some ladies have to use something every night, others as suggested ..........

Why is there an increased risk of heart disease?  If one exercises there should be no increased loss of bone density ........ one can request a scan which should be taken from pelvis and hips as this is the dentist densest bone, the report will give a base-line. I was advised years ago to up my fruit and veg intake and to eat home cooked foods: which I already did  .  10 mins. walking 3 times a week in the sunshine will help a lot.

Spare tyre - mine is due to the laxity of muscles as osteotrn ?  levels dropped.  My apron suddenly drooped, over 3/4 days.  From above I look fat, from side on OK.  Fortunately my hair has remained well.  Brain fog initially, I'm used to it now [see doing stupid things thread?  .  Also 'the strange woman in my house .... ]. 

Each journey is individual.  A friend of mine has had hot flushes but no other symptoms, not enough to take HRT but at age 80, still gets them.


Mood swings should not be put down to The Change.  There may be other reasons.

--
Edit by Emma
confusing typo corrected

[Wilks]

I'm not sure what you mean by “why”? All of those things I listed are caused by low oestrogen. The “spare tyre” we develop is because low oestrogen causes redistribution of body fat. Low oestrogen also weakens your bones and increases your risk of heart disease.
I'm happy that your grannies lived til their 80s but that doesn't answer my question because every woman has a different experience.

Yes I have mentioned this before but I didn't get a clear answer, because people still keep talking about things “getting better once you're through the menopause” but I don't understand why they say that.

[dangermouse]

If you take a wider perspective, most women do not take HRT and are absolutely fine. The uptake fell massively after the research that over predicted risk and most still seem to be quite wary of it now.

I have only heard (endless) stories of women who struggled, some worse that others, in their 40s and felt great in their 50s once they were through menopause, all without HRT.

A lot of what we read are individuals experiences and opinion. Some experts actually don't put all those things down to low oestrogen and, as far as I know, none of that has been proven. Hot flushes are still a mystery to the medical experts, oestrogen or progesterone (and probably thyroxine) improve them but the cause is much more complex.

Please don't feel disheartened or afraid that if you don't take HRT that you are going to be at risk of heart and bone problems, this is not inconclusive!

Take what you need to get you through the volatile times and then get on with your life, eat as best as you can, do gentle exercise and look after your thoughts and you'll be fine.

[CLKD]

Oestrogen causes lack of elasticity.  Hence the sagging arms, belly droop [mine  ] ......... but women continue to live well even with lower levels of oestrogen.  Women are living longer .......... so the body can exist with lower levels of oestrogen.  Where do you get your info from? 

Also - as an aside, some countries have no access to pain relief or other medications, including HRT.  Does this equate to living a shorter life 

I am not on HRT other than for VA.  Now in my mid-60s.  Period free from 2002.  My symptoms of itchy skin across my back after my evening bath went away after 8/9 months.  My periods had long gone by then by probably 2/3 years.  I knew it was The Change and took each symptom as it arrived.  Each fortunately went, the VA is under control thus far, once the repeated urine infection-type symptoms were diagnosed as VA rather than infection.

Occaisonally I get really itchy skin ............ insteps are the biggest area as soon as I remove socks at night.  No problem in the day.

What bothers you the most? [I'm not sure why 'why' either ...... ]

[Kathleen]

Hello Wilks.

I am no expert obviously ( just  a long time sufferer ! ) but my trusty meno book lists the following:-

Peri menopause from 45 to 55
Irregular menstruation from 42 to 58
Hot flushes, night sweats and emotional symptoms from 42 to 60
Sleeping disturbances from 45 to 60
Emotional and intellectual symptoms from 45 to early 60s
Dry skin from 50
Urgent, frequent or uncomfortable urination from 50
Back pain and possibly bone fractures from 57
Palpitations and chest pain from 55
Prolapse from 53

The author assumed that the menopause began at the average age of 51 and states
 that not every woman experiences all of the above so that's a comfort isn't it!

I think possible heart problems and altered fat distribution are due to our androgens having a greater influence as oestrogen declines and  it's been shown that a post menopausel women has the same risk of heart disease as men because the protective effects of oestrogen have been lost.

I was told recently by a Consultant that hormonal symptoms fade  in the early 60s  for 80 per cent of women but for 20 per cent they do not. Unfortunately she said that it was impossible to predict which group you are likely to be in.

I hope this information helps you and apologies for the depressing content!

Take care.

K.

[Optimist]

Omg I'm booking myself into the scrap yard!! Does this seriously last until the 60's maybe more 😱😱😱.
Wilks...I've also wondered if it ends and what happens if/when you do come off hrt. I know some women are taking hrt well into their 70/80's (Louise newsons mum for example!) she looks fantastic btw. Think she's only on oestrogen though. Not sure if it's recommended to continue if having progesterone too.
Maybe symptoms subside and you manage on diet exercise and supplements but I know that without oestrogen at this stage I'd be debilitated with chronic lower back ache that would stop me exercising. This has magically disappeared with hrt. So my question would be would that stop or go back to being bad off hrt ? If so I'll scream for it all the way into my 80/90's 😁😁😁. Why shouldn't we be able to enjoy life at a decent level.
Hope you get some more answers but a tip for you..try mindfulness, helps to live in the present which can sometimes stop those anxious thoughts and allow you to take each day as it comes xx

[Optimist]

Ps also have changed diet further to ensure healthy eating although I always ate healthily (mostly) but I realised a macdonalds sausage and egg McMuffin was only a celebration now...
I'm trying the Mediterranean diet at the moment which is mostly how I've always eaten but cutting out red meat too for a while (not definitely).
Had to increase my exercise as my middle piles on pounds of fat and ive always been a skinny 8-9 stone kind of girl!! Defo not anymore!! I have Botox in a crease in my forehead that resembles a tram line and it makes me look less old and knackered I feel, so money well spent I think, although some may not agree (I don't care . It's defo a struggle at times but on the right hrt combi and enough sleep I feel overall happier than I have for a long while.
You're going through the initial shock and have yet to get to acceptance by the sounds of it, but you will one day. Xx

[Emerald2017]

I can absolutely relate and agree with you Wilks.
I don't find anything natural or acceptable at meno and symptoms are for the rest of our lives for sure. My main concern isn't only about symptoms and quality of life but for the longterm consequences for our health.
For me hrt is the only way to cope and to protect my body. I'm determined to accept the risks and use hrt for life cause there is a life for me without.

[Hurdity]

From my other topic of “how to accept the menopause”, I realise that the main thing that bothers me is that this is it for the rest of my life. However, some say that it gets better once you “get through the other side” and your oestrogen stops fluctuating. But it's my understanding that although hot flushes and mood swings will eventually pass, nothing else will. Am I right?
The itchy dry skin, VA, increased risk of heart disease, loss of bone density, spare tyre, hair thinning, lack of energy, loss of libido, brain fog, etc are with you forever unless you take HRT forever?

Wilks - I haven't read the other thread but I think you are worrying too much about the future and what you might feel. OK this is good to some extent ie what steps do you need to take now to protect your future health but worrying about what symptoms might or might not last is not healthy.

I hope you don't mind if I use my own experience as an example especially as I am well into the next phase of life being long post-meno. I started HRT at just under 54 in late peri-menopause because symptoms were unbearable and I had a full-time job as well as teenage children at home. Now 65 I have taken it almost continuously ever since. I can honestly say I don't get any of those symptoms. Well OK I don't get huge highs and great excitements but I do  get enthusiastic about some things, and I don't get lows either and chug along quite happily with my life doing new things (now retired), keeping active and healthy. I do realise many women have sad and difficult situations which means they can't feel the same but if not - no reason not to continue to take it as long as you can and are healthy.

Yes there are lots of women who live a long time without HRT -  some happy and healthy, but how many other s have problems which are or could be related to oestrogen deficiency such as osteoporosis, VA, cardio-vascular problems, low mood and depression, fatigue, fibromyalgia and I gather possibly even diabetes?

I could worry about what to do when I have to or choose to stop HRT ( I mean having bleeds at my age is not ideal but I prefer this to the possilbe adverse effects of no HRT at the moment), but for the time being I get on with it and don't worry."Worry does not empty tomorrow of its sorrow, it empties today of its strength"

If I stop HRT - maybe my hair will thin, and I'll get to be a fat tired brain-fogged sexless wrinkled old bag/hag - but it's important to make the best of yourself and have as positive outlook as you can (and as life circumstances permit)  whatever age/stage you are at especially as some women are unable to take HRT.

Please try to enjoy your life now as it is without dwelling unduly about the future. For the lucky - their "rest of your life" will be long - because increased life expectancy has given us potentially a longer future post-menopause - but no good if we are miserable and ill, but also what if it is cut short and you spent your time worrying about a future that never comes? Think of the quality of your life now and in the immediate future and focus on enjoying it if you can and making the most of it

Hurdity x

[CLKD]

Don't even consider stopping HRT if it suits?  A diabetic wouldn't consider stopping medication in order to remain well so why should the medical profession think that women need to stop HRT? 

[Emerald2017]

Absolutely agree CLKD.
I guess cause diabetes is considered as an illness and menopause is a stage of the female life and not a disease.

[CLKD]

But one has to consider any benefits?!?

[tika]

I don't post often as I realise I am in the minority here as far as being post menopausal, healthy ( my doctor confirms this) not on any medication and stopped any ERT over two years ago. I did think I would be of help women to women who have gotten through menopause and doing well but realise this is not the case on this forum.

I find this statement could worry some women unnecessarily, and I just don't understand the reasoning behind this. 

"If I stop HRT - maybe my hair will thin, and I'll get to be a fat tired brain-fogged sexless wrinkled old bag/hag"



 

[Abba Fan]

My troubles started when postmenopause, I had flushes during peri but when my periods stopped a bus hit me.