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[mac]

Hi ladies

I'm not sure where to start with this as I am so confused and feeling very sad.  As you know I stopped my HRT on the 16th May thinking I was worse on it.  That was because I started having severe migranes and floaters and constant loose stools, more so when i changed to patches, I also at times had underlying anxiety but i could cope with that.  When my last bloods showed a change in my thyroxine levels i was told to increase my thyroxine to 150mcg. OMG did i feel ill.  Agitated, going to the toliet constantly did'nt know which way to turn.  I blamed the hrt patch, which i possibly shouldn't have and took it off.  When i went back to the GP (unfortunately not the one I usually see who is very supportive) she said they had made a mistake and i shouldn't have been told to increase my thyroxine dose!!!!  She feels i am extremely sensitive to medicines at the moment.
Since stopping the HRT and reducing my thyroxine to what it was 125mcg I am having more bad days than good.
They're unwilling to take further bloods to check my hormones until they are sure that the oestrogen i was taking is out of my system and they have said that could take 2 weeks.
Yesterday had a good day but today really bad with anxiety and have had to take propanalol, which the GP gave me for anxiety, I have been prescribed 40mg 3 times a day but have only had to take it once since being prescribed it as I am trying to cope, I cut them in half as well as i am to scared to take the 40.
So now i don't know what to do the GP I saw said they wouldn't consider HRT again for me because of my symptoms but i know they'll try AD's.

I have also read that if your on patches and taking thyroxine, the oestrogen does'nt allow the thyroxine to convert properly?  have you ladies heard of this, and that you should take hrt tabs only.

The doc also said i that i did not need to take the propanalol all the time but as i needed it???

My mood is all over the palce, with my poor daughter commenting that i should be back on the patches!! I feel so guilty.

I have now signed myself off work as I am not really coping.  Night time and morning time seem to be worst.
I feel as if I am about to start a period but nothing so far

I think if i could control the anxiety and sadness i could cope better with all the other symtoms.

Mac

[Bette]

Hi Mac
First of all, have a    - it sounds as if you need it. This is from the menu on the left (no mention fo which type of HRT is best):-
Thyroid disease
Hyperthyroidism, due to either overactive thyroid gland or over-replacement of thyroxine in under active thyroid disease, leads to an increased risk of osteoporosis due to excess bone loss. Consideration should therefore be given to screening for osteoporosis in postmenopausal women who have a history of hyperthyroidism and offering bone protective measures. HRT does not worsen thyroid disease and in fact may be particularly helpful because of the bone protective effect. However, patients taking thyroxine should be monitored by having thyroid function rechecked 3 months after starting HRT since the thyroxine dose may need to be adjusted. Similarly, thyroxine requirements may alter if HRT is stopped and thyroid function should be rechecked 3 months after stopping HRT.
There are several ladies on here on both thyroxine and HRT, so hopefully they'll be along to advise you. It's very confusing and annoying when you get conflicting advice from different gps; you may well find that your usual gp will be happy for you to try HRT again if that's what you want.
Bette x

[Lucky Stone]

There's a lot here I can't comment on Mac but I am sure someone else will be along to help. What I want to say is not to worry too much about the propanolol, which I also was given by my doc. I had it in 10mg tablets and was told to take up to 40mg three times a day as and when needed and I used to vary the dose although I'm not sure I ever took the maximum. But I think I came close. There's a school of thought that says that 'as and when' doesn't work but as it is given to people nervous about going on stage (actors and musicians) I can't see that can be true. It sort of helped me, it slows your heart down and made me a bit calmer, although too much can make you dopey and a bit cold in the winter. I also tried the slow release ones which actually have 180mg in them but I didn't get along with those as they made me feel really strange.

I'm sorry you are having such a rough time and you really shouldn't feel guilty, although us women do, don't we? I think the anxiety symptoms are the worst part of this meno lark, and although mine are better than they were (I am on HRT), I do have not so good days (like today, actually). I'm hoping that time will resolve things and that sometime in the future, I will be back to my 'old self' or indeed a 'new self' - one that doesn't have to fight off the panic in the supermarket and can cope with a shop full of demanding customers. 

Anyway, this posting is more about saying 'chin up', you are far from alone, us girls must stick together and I am sending you some hugs, although as I can't remember how to do that on here, they will have to be virtual ones. I see while I have been typing this, Bette has been on (hello Bette) - and she can do the hugs 

[mac]

Hi Bette
Thank you.  I'm now in floods of tears
This is so hard, i think its even worst today because hubby is on duty tonight.

Mac

[Bette]

Let it out, I howled my eyes out all day the other day when OH had gone away and Mum was in hospital.  Felt awful at the time but I'm sure that it helped.
I'd agree with Lucky Stone (hi there!  ) that it's worth trying the propanolol.
Try to do something to keep your mind occupied; watch tv, work your way through the "Funnies" on here, catch up on threads you haven't read and maybe post a few things. Remember that you're not alone in all this. 
Bette x

[Lucky Stone]

Crying is always good, you just howl - sometimes it's the only way. You are not alone, just keep thinking that. We are all on here supporting each other.

[Smokey]

Hi mac,

I'm sorry your not feeling good t the moment, it's a bit worrying about the HRT patches and the oestrogen not allowing the thyroxin to convert properly if your on them, I have been on the patches for eight months now and have just been diagnoised with under active thyroid,and am on day three of my thyroxin 25mg, surley my gp would have said if there was a problem with the patches, I would hope!  I kept trying to tell my gp that I had thyroid problem for about a year now, but every blood test came back normal or borderline,
But this time thankfully they indicated I was under active, thank god I can hope to feel better soon, I had all the symptoms too, cold hands and feet, cold most of the time, dry skin,exhaustion,tingling lips,put on weight, and oh yes the big one constipation!

I'm sure if you see another doc in your surgery,you should be able to go back on HRT , just go in and be firm and say you have decided this is what you want, I'm not sure the patches would be causing the migraines as they are recommended for people who suffer from them,
Could your high level of thyroxin cause these migraines? I'm new to thyroid side effects,but everyone is effected differently.

I hope you get to feel better soon.

[saladgirl]

Hi Mac
I was prescribed propranalol over 12 years ago for a really bad episode of my first ever panic attacks - ~I took it twice a day for 3 years and eventually weaned myself off it and havent been b ack on it since - I now take Trazadone at night but the sie effects are giving me side effects but I dont know if its them or the peri-meonapuse - tingling in fingers and legs,dry and sore eyes sudden episodes of breathlessness and palpitations - I try not to take the Trazadone as I take vagifem too so am full of chemicals!!! 
Anyway the propranalol are good and they really help with anxiety and the side effects vary but aren't that bad - you need ot trust your Gp for a couple o fweeks and see if it helps - I empathise with you cos am struggling with sleep and work and stress with hubbby so the chemicals are a good thing!!!
Things do get better - just give yourself time and go with it
cry when you want to aswell - it helps!!!!! xxxx

[mac]

Hi

Thank you all for your support.  Todays been a better day but still not good haven't taken an propanalol.

Smokey not sure whats going on with my thyroxine.  Doc that's been supportive has asked to see me to discuss blood results and the last ones I had done were my cholestrol and thyroxine but will let you know what the outcome is and if theres any truth in the oestrogen and thyroxine theory.
I felt well when they increased my dose to the 125mcg in Feb so will wait and see and from what i can remember(memo brain) I didn't expereince any side effects.

Saladgirl thank you for tell me of your expereince with propanalol its really helpful.  Can I ask why you stopped them?

I wish i new what to expect with all of this whether its my thyroid or the menopause then i think i could cope better.

Hope you all have a good week I'm going to take the rest of the week off as I feel totally exhausted.

Take care.

Mac

[CLKD]

First of all: 

I was advised to take Propranolol nightly.  At first it was 80mg but was cut down after 3 weeks to 40mg that was oh at least 9 years ago and I can't be without it.  If I am facing an event I up it to 40mg in the morning too. 

Anti-depressant medications can and do help other conditions 

[mac]

Hi CLKD

Do you find that the propanalol works for you?  Last november a GP prescribed prozac for me but I couldn't tolerate it   I don't know where I am at the moment but I am planning on seeing my GP tomorrow and i was going to ask what other drugs!! I can take.  Any advice on anti depressants would be a great help.

Macxxx

[CLKD]

I have cyclic depression: so get so bad I can't get out of bed, take ADs, mood lifts, I begin to cope then feel better so stop the medication  it took years to realise that I need a low-maintenance dose.  Panic attacks still controlled my Life until the GP prescribed beta-blockas which mean that Hubby and I have a Life together again.  I have gradually been able to resume shopping trips, eating out, visiting friends with much less worry.  I don't do theatres, tried and panic took over  but everything else: after years of believing that I would eventually be house bound for ever ........

Remember that most medications have side effects so several may need to be trialled to see what suits you.  Remember too that you may not need medication for ever but if something helps you see the wood for the trees and you generally feel better  but don't expect to feel well overnight.  Management is the word!

[paisley]

Hope you feel better soon. I am too an advocate of propopanol and take it on a need basis. I find it really useful.
It is one of the few things that I don't find addictive.

[mac]

Hi All
Have had really bad days since the weekend but I suppose now i know they are to do with my hormones more than my thyroid. All the symptoms that went away with HRT are back, waking during the night, bad dreams, hot flashes but only occasionally, i feel like I'm having a surge of hormones, aching joints but not all the time and an overwhelming feeling of saddness and headaches, feeling like my head has got a lot of pressure in it.
Woke up this morning feeling fine then by 11 i was ready to kill my husband over a jaffa cake!! and then this almighty panic attack so took my propanalol.  So frightening, went to the emergency surgery at 12 saw a GP that was very sympathetic and told me to take the propanol regularly and said I should definately be on HRT as it was clear from my results that I was perimenopausal.  He did say I needed to give it time to work at least another 2 months and if after that time i still had problems they could change it.  He also said to take the propanalol with it.  He did say not to start for another week to see if my diarhoea settled.  I told him I was expecting a period this week but nothing so far but he said that because I was peri it might not happen. I stopped the hrt on the 16th May 2 days after i had put my oestrogen patch on.

I'm thinking should I just go back on the patches now or wait another week or wait for my period so I don't upset my own cycle to much.  I should be starting my progestrone patch today. I'm on Femseven sequi.

Any advice greatly received.

Mac

[CLKD]

Sorry this didn't show on my 'unread posts' button 

You have a sympathetic GP, not many around.     I know you want to feel better now but listen to what he suggests and wait until the runny tummy settles a bit, hormones can cause 'the runs'. 

I had several instances of sudden rage last week ............ Himself really annoyed me by butting into one of my ideas 

I get bad dreams occasionally otherwise they are long, involved, busy