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[Kathleen]

Hello ladies.

I have started to experience a lot of vaginal itchiness etc in the evening and at night. Just recently it has been waking me up at about 2 am and preventing me from getting back to sleep. As a consequence I am very tired during the day even though I am not having night sweats.

I have recently reduced my Sandrena gel and I was expecting some return of symptoms but this has taken me by surprise.

Any advice ladies? I am 68 and very post menopausal but I have never done well on HRT and I would love to be free of it completely. I have never used topical oestrogen either, mainly because my symptoms were mild but perhaps I do need to consider that now?

I look forward to hearing from you lovely ladies and I appreciate you reading my post.

Take care.

K.

[Minusminnie]

I'd start with washing any underwear/pj bottoms without the wash powder that you use just to see if that makes a difference. You say evening and night and it has been hot lately so it might be irritation from a wash powder during the day. 

I use nothing just water or a very very small amount and rinse twice.

Other than that with the fact you have reduced the gel and now experiencing symptoms then a localised oestrogen which i think you realise anyway.

If you want to try something yourself first rather than go to the GP there is Ovesse cream or Gina to buy from the chemist.

[Kathleen]

Hello Minusminnie and thank you for your response.

I take your point about washing powder and irritation etc. Actually last night I wore a nightie instead of my usual pyjamas incase the trousers rode up during the night and rubbed!

I think I will need to speak to my nurse practitioner about a topical treatment. I have already asked in Boots about Gina but the Pharmacist wouldn't sell it to me without a prescription from my GP. Apparently if my GP agrees I can carry on buying Gina but the Pharmacist will be able to review every six months.

I have been having more and more problems since I reduced the gel and now I am so tired I am running on fumes so something needs to change.

Thanks again for taking the time to reply and I wish you well.

K.

[Minusminnie]

I’ve bought Ovesse cream in Boots without any trouble. Not the pharmacist who served me though.

I thought the whole idea of Gina was so that you could buy it yourself OTC at a certain age.

You should be able to get Vagifem (which is Gina) or a generic on prescription for free as you are 68.

If you are itching in the vulva area estriol cream may help you more as you can rub some there.

Watch what you are washing down below with as well eg scented soaps etc. Yes products include an intimate foam wash which I find good.

[bombsh3ll]

There's absolutely no need to be suffering with that, if you don't want to take systemic estrogen then I would phone your GP tomorrow and request vaginal estrogen cream and pessaries, and use them liberally, titrated to symptom relief.

I was going to say tell them it's unbearable and that you can't sleep, but even better tell them you can't have penetrative intercourse - the prescription will be at your chosen pharmacy by lunchtime!

[Ayesha]

It sounds like you are at the start of VA and you shouldn't have any problems getting it prescribed from your GP.
Pessaries or cream, or both. Some of us need both on a daily basis with also a moisturiser, it's all a very individualised condition and should be treated as such.

Be aware that many medics/pharmacists know very little about VA (GSM) they think all HRT is the same, a regime of topical oestrogen is the equivalent of one systemic HRT tablet a year. I never fail to tell them this to shut them up.

Boots I believe are franchises, I think you may have been unlucky with yours, you should have been able to purchase Gina or Ovesse without the second degree
cross examination, it's so frustrating having a horrible condition and then having to fight your way through it, at least I hope you don't have to.

[Kathleen]

Hello again ladies.

Thank you all for your sensible advice. I will get in touch with my GP surgery asap.

When I asked in Boots for Gina the sales assistant asked me to speak to the pharmacist and  he had never heard of the product! I told him that is was on the shelf behind the counter and when he read the information on the box he said that I couldn't begin using Gina unless a GP had said that I could have it, in other words I was referred to my GP!

Thanks again ladies and I wish you all well.

K.

[Ayesha]

Such is the ignorance that we have to put up with, we really have to educate ourselves to pass the message on.
I would straight away print out a copy of this document and hand it over to that particular pharmacist.
https://bssm.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2023/02/GSM-BSSM.pdf

I think one of the ladies here a while ago did mention that Boots don't always stock it because customers are not asking for it, its too expensive, yes it certainly is!

[Minusminnie]

Hello again ladies.

Thank you all for your sensible advice. I will get in touch with my GP surgery asap.

When I asked in Boots for Gina the sales assistant asked me to speak to the pharmacist and  he had never heard of the product! I told him that is was on the shelf behind the counter and when he read the information on the box he said that I couldn't begin using Gina unless a GP had said that I could have it, in other words I was referred to my GP!

Thanks again ladies and I wish you all well.

K.

Too much signposting with many things nowadays.

Don’t let the GP send you back to Boots to buy it Kathleen ! get it prescribed for free which you are entitled to.

[SundayGirl]

Hello again ladies.

Thank you all for your sensible advice. I will get in touch with my GP surgery asap.

When I asked in Boots for Gina the sales assistant asked me to speak to the pharmacist and  he had never heard of the product! I told him that is was on the shelf behind the counter and when he read the information on the box he said that I couldn't begin using Gina unless a GP had said that I could have it, in other words I was referred to my GP!

Thanks again ladies and I wish you all well.

K.

Oh my god!! How ridiculous. Something that's on the shelf to purchase, but you're not allowed to purchase this non-prescription item without a prescription from your GP?
Pharmacists are getting as bad as the dragons on reception at the surgery. They all think they know your body better than you do.

[Minusminnie]

Hello again ladies.

Thank you all for your sensible advice. I will get in touch with my GP surgery asap.

When I asked in Boots for Gina the sales assistant asked me to speak to the pharmacist and  he had never heard of the product! I told him that is was on the shelf behind the counter and when he read the information on the box he said that I couldn't begin using Gina unless a GP had said that I could have it, in other words I was referred to my GP!

Thanks again ladies and I wish you all well.

K.

Here's the information on the Gina website.  Which says that a pharmacist should let you buy it and review every 3 months if it is working for you.

https://www.mygina.co.uk/gina/

[Terri123]

I agree with what others have said about obtaining suitable treatment on prescription.  You shouldn't have to fund this yourself.

FWIW, I've obtained Replens and Yes applicators on prescription for years. Worth a thought if, like me, you need products to be hormone-free and also prefer paraben-free.

[Borchesterlass]

Superdrug online also does Gina . I have found it easier to buy online from Superdrug and boots . Less questions asked .

[Ayesha]

The cross examinations can wear you down, I've had so many confrontations because I need daily Vagifem and Estriol cream, tired of always having to explain myself.
Because of that I like to keep under the radar and I've just ordered Gina from Superdrug because of a flare up I am having and I want to use two pessaries daily until it all calms down. 

I wish they wouldn't lump topical oestrogen in with systemic oestrogen, it causes a lot of angst having to explain the difference all the time.
If it wasn't safe you would not be able to buy it over the counter, especially in the UK where the tight regulations on drugs are off the scale.

[Minusminnie]

Others may disagree but when Vagifem was a 25mcg tablet used for two weeks initially then followed by 2x a week there wasn’t the struggle that so many have now on this forum.

Your daily routine gives 70mcg a week Ayesha it would have been 50mcg a week before in old money at a minimum use level.

Twice a day use will be short by 35mcg a week of a what would have been a reload done on the old 25mcg tablet.

Where’s the research on how the 10mcg tablet is really working ?