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[Gilla999]

Hi all - I switched to Estradot from Lenzetto at the start of the year. I was on 3 sprays of Lenzetto, and initially switched to a 37.5mg patch, then 25mg, then cut to 18.75mg and I'm now only on 7mm (!!) of a 25mg patch for the last 3 months (so approx 8.75mg!!). I completely realise this sounds ridiculous to most, but I have learnt through trial and error over the last 3 years that I absorb a LOT transdermally (both Estrogen and Progesterone) - I know from experiments that I get approx 200 pmol from just this 7mm of a 25mg patch, which is way over the average in the tests. I must have super absorbant skin 

The problem is, over the last 3 months I've really started to feel that I'm not getting equal doses from the patches, despite religiously measuring when cutting - sometimes after a patch switch I get a rush of Estrogen type feelings, others I get the tell tale signs of withdrawal from it, like I do whenever my E level drops.

The reports I've read online seem to suggest that they ARE stable to cut that small, but I wondered if there are any other women out there who cut patches who have any good/bad experiences to share? At the moment I'm considering going back to Lenzetto, but it's always such an upheaval swapping with working out dose equivalents (and also Lenzetto had started giving me a rash on my arms) so im keen to avoid it unless i have to - maybe I'm wrong and I am getting the same?

Just curious to hear feedback / experiences either way of others who cut patches!

Xx

[Flossieteacake]

I have always felt okay with cutting patches. I know it can be hard to be precise but I was lucky not to have any ill effects.

[Shorty Pants]

HI Gilla999.  I'm currently in the process of cutting down my patches, with the intention of hopefully coming off them altogether. (GP appointment to discuss today, so wish me luck!) 

Like you, I seem to be very sensitive to even slight changes in type and dose.  Thanks to lovely people like Ermin2Trude on here, I've finally managed to work that out!

I'm currently down to a 1/4 of evorel 25, but any less than that last little bit is giving me horrible symptoms of headache, flushes, anxiety and not sleeping.  Worse than I had before I started HRT 18 months ago.

Like you, I seem to have good and bad days though, which don't really make sense.  I do wonder if it's my natural oestrogen levels still trying to assert themselves.  The other thing I've wondered, but not being able to measure accurately, is that the 3 days/4 days regime might need to be more frequent to maintain lower doses and replace these every other day?  Doesn't really make sense, but at least you're not on your own with your confusion! 

[Gilla999]

Flossie, thank you - it's helpful to hear feedback from others as I've learnt over the years it's really easy to make assumptions and attribute things to something which might not actually be the case.

Shorty really great to hear from someone in the same situation! I actually thought about a switch to Evorel patches as they're bigger than Estradot, but when I looked at the patch I couldn't work out how you'd accurately cut it into quarters - do you cut diagonally? Interesting theory on the 3 days/4 days too. The trouble is, the times when I experience side effects of either an increase or decrease in Estrogen (I am incredibly sensitive to even the slightest change in HRT and am well versed in my tell tale signs of either increase or decrease by now) it seems to be the day of or the day after I've switched a patch, rather than 3 or 4 days down the line.

It sounds as though you're very sensitive like me, and it is interesting because when I did a lot of online research, the scientific trials seem to suggest that on average you'd get about 90 pmol of Estrogen from a 25mcg patch, so in theory the actual Estrogen we'd be getting from 1/4 would be so tiny.... but as I mentioned earlier, from my own experiments and testing I know that I'm getting at least 200 pmol from this patch still - maybe you absorb a lot like me, and so like me you feel a small reduction that others might not?

[Shorty Pants]

That's made me think about cutting my evorel patches... I never thought to do them diagonally! #menobrain  And you're definitely the first person to describe me as 'sensitive'!

There are actually little dots along the side of the evorel patches though, which indicate 10ths, so I go by these.  I'd be a bit wary about just changing though, as evorel are soy derived, whereas estradot are from yams.  Theoretically they're the same, but I just couldn't get on with estradot at all and they felt much 'stronger'.  I had huge boobs within about 4 days of swapping!    That said, there are others who just can't get on with evorel and love estradot.

That's really interesting about the dosage in theory.  Like you, there's definitely some absorption going on that's making a difference, but I'm beyond trying to understand...    I'd be interested to see any links, etc. you have about this though.

[Gilla999]

I only asked about diagonally as I read online that was the recommendation - but any which way I tried to cut Evorel I felt like I wasn't able to cut them evenly! I've heard about the yam/soya thing and also read multiple people here saying that they felt Estradot was stronger than Evorel, so you're definitely not alone! I think Evorel not being as strong would be a bonus for me, if I could only find a way to cut them evenly and also know what was an "equal" dose/cut to switch across to... switching products is always such an upheaval 

There are quite a lot of studies out there and you sometimes have to convert from pg/ml to pmol (there are online converters) but here's a couple:

Evorel - https://www.medicines.org.uk/emc/product/10931/smpc#gref (under Pharmological properties section 5.2)

Estradot - https://www.medicines.org.uk/emc/product/3869/smpc#gref (under Pharmological properties section 5.2)

Another Estradot - https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0378512203001907

[Shorty Pants]

I only asked about diagonally as I read online that was the recommendation - but any which way I tried to cut Evorel I felt like I wasn't able to cut them evenly! I've heard about the yam/soya thing and also read multiple people here saying that they felt Estradot was stronger than Evorel, so you're definitely not alone! I think Evorel not being as strong would be a bonus for me, if I could only find a way to cut them evenly and also know what was an "equal" dose/cut to switch across to... switching products is always such an upheaval 

There are quite a lot of studies out there and you sometimes have to convert from pg/ml to pmol (there are online converters) but here's a couple:

Evorel - https://www.medicines.org.uk/emc/product/10931/smpc#gref (under Pharmological properties section 5.2)

Estradot - https://www.medicines.org.uk/emc/product/3869/smpc#gref (under Pharmological properties section 5.2)

Another Estradot - https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0378512203001907

Thanks so much for the links.  I'll definitely check these out. 

I've just come off a call with my GP re: cutting down my patches with a view to coming off them, so watch this space... 

[Gilla999]

Do keep me posted - would love to hear how you get on!