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[katyh75]

I've seen it LC1962.

Yes, the anxiety is hellish. It's not my worst symptom though - I get poisioned from high estrogen. My own. It's awful.

By all means speak to your GP. But just remember you have found something that works. If they offer you alternatives - you'll need to weigh it up. Personally I'd keep buying from France. But then, I've been through 2 years of prog trials and still not sorted. And, as gnatty highlights, she's taking utro in a random fashion.

100mg utro in one hit tends to be too big. Certainly was for me.

And, unfortunately, I've found the NHS, including specialist meno clinic absolutely in the dark about low prog. Instead they just encourage me to take more estrogen 😞. I've had to pay a lot of money to a bhrt clinic to learn about this.

Mary G takes Prog gel as part of her hrt. She might be along with some info. Not sure if it's the same one.

I am so pleased if you. You're story sounds horrific and, if I'm being honest, very similar to my own. Just left to get on with it because conventional hrt (E with P) doesn't fit.

It's definitely more common in parts of Europe and the US to treat with just progesterone. Through all my research, it looks pretty safe. Certainly safer than estrogen.

Keep us updated. X

The oestrogen pushing is real! I once ended up on four pumps of gel (very briefly) and I was INSANE.

[katyh75]

I am so glad I’ve found this thread. I haven’t posted on here for a while as feeling like I have nothing to add but I’m always reading.

I’ve been on HRT various doses for almost 2 years and just feel like nothing is helping. My main symptom being depression, just feel cloaked in black mist on far too many days. Oh god yes and the morning dread, it usually gets better through the day but sometimes doesn’t.

I’m on 150mg of Sertraline (AD) and have been for ages and I feel like I may as well be taking sugar pills as they have no affect. I’ve given up asking my GP for advice as they have been no help so I research the hell out of everything and try different things. I take so many vitamins and I’ve been on high does of oestrogen and low and nothing is helping. I take 100mg Utrogestan every night. Thinking back to when I first started HRT I was on Evorel Conti patches and I always felt better on the progesterone part in the latter 2 weeks. I couldn’t find anyone else who felt the same so thought I was just imagining things.

I was literally just googling and looking into whether I may need more progesterone and came across this thread and actually feel some hope. It did cross my mind whether I could take 200mg of Utro a night, I am currently on 3 pumps of oestrogel.

Anyway I’m waffling on now, but wondering if I should try this progesterone gel as well as continuing with 100mg utro a night. Any advice would be gratefully received. I’m having such a rough few days and just need some hope xx

I take 200mg a day and my specialist was fine with that. I don't tolerate 100mg at all.

[CrispyChick]

Hi Katyh

Wow. Thanks so much for that info. So are you saying you only take 200mg utro??? No estrogen??? Do you take utro all month with no breaks?

Yes, I've read Lara's take on low versus high dose - and those in-between. But I've been at this so long, I've tried both low dose and high dose 🙄

What type of specialist do you see??

This is very interesting. I'm currently back on bhrt progesterone cream. It helps my symptoms of low prog - like pms and migraines. But I'm sooooo aggitated and anxious. All month. 

Yet, I do recall when previously taking this same cream, at 50mg I was very calm.

So it's in the back of my mind that i need 50mg.

But. The big but is, the more progesterone I take the more my estrogen pumps out. Out of tissues, receptors become more sensitive, or p coverts - I've no idea. But it's horrific. I'm really bad at the moment, along with the anxiety on top. So I was going to ride at 30mg for consistency as there is a narrative that this initial stimulation should calm with consistent dosing. I assumed you did not experience this?

So I will continue as I am into my second cycle. But I really appreciate your comments as I was wondering how the lady that started this post is on about 20mg and nice and calm, yet I'm a jittery mess at 30mg.

Unfortunately utrogestan is not for me. Tried it. Far too severe sedation. Tried vaginally too...caused immense stomach distress.

Xx

[katyh75]

I've been on just a 200mg progesterone daily before but it just made me very flat so I came off it after a couple of months.

I'm now in induced menopause for extreme sensitivity to fluctuations so I need to take some oestrogen but can only tolerate 50.

I'm losing hope!

[AngelaH]

I don't like Utrogestan and I don't think it is a well tolerated form of progesterone and it's the most debated problem on here by far.  God knows what it is but there is something horrible about that stuff and it's worth noting that you don't have to be progesterone intolerant to have problems with it.

My advice is to find something else.  I like the Darstin gel but that is only suitable for women on a low dose of oestrogen post menopause.  There is Cyclogest which is better tolerated or Crinone vaginal gel or you might need to take the compounded route.

Hello Mary G

Yesterday I asked my GP change Utrogestan for any other progesterone and she refused to do that, just because in my age not possible to prescribe me synthetic progesterone, it’s too risky, utrogestan is the only micronised progesterone available from NHS, I felt too fed up and asked her to refer me to meno clinic, so she did.

[AngelaH]

Mary G and AngelaH, there is a good US group on Facebook called Estrogen Dominance Group if you haven't come across it before.  It has a very large following, you will be believed on there. I left a few years ago, but one progesterone product they recommended was a natural one called Onas. I found the group very helpful.

Hello Penguin,

Thank you for info. I have ordered some product, I am afraid NHS left me with no choice but use unlicensed product until I can get appointment with meno clinic.

[LC1962]

LC1962, your progesterone gel sounds similar to the Darstin progesterone gel that I buy from the pharmacy in Spain. It's very good stuff.

Would you telling telling us more about your gel like the strength etc?

My apologies.  I have been away for a few days and have not been on the forum.

The gel I get is from France.  Progestogel 1mg. Each 2.5g of gel contains 0.025g of progesterone.  It looks like your Darstin gel is 10mg? So the one I use is very weak

[LC1962]

Great info Mary

What would the dose be that LC1962 is taking that has calmed her anxiety???

I'm retrying compounded P cream, but my anxiety is problematic.

X

Hi.  Currently I am measuring out 2.5g on the little tool that comes with the gel.  (This actually measure 8cm of product).  So that’s 5g daily, not 20g as someone else said.     Each 2.5g contains 0.025g of progesterone. I  then apply one measurement each on the inside of my thighs or arms.  I don’t rub it in completely as it is supposed to soak in naturally if possible. 

I am surprised that such a minimal amount is working…but it really is.  I feel so much better!

I also should add the only other thing I take is a Lions Mane Mushroom supplement (for hair loss) but that isn’t indicated as helpful with anxiety…

 

[ToriiJ]

Thanks all for the support and encouragement!    Oooh,   I didn’t even think perhaps could NOT get this gel in the UK on the NHS.   It’s used in France,  available over the counter for breast pain.  2.5cm gel, it comes with a measuring scoop, so one measurement on the inside of each thigh.  I don’t rub it in well as it’s supposed to work better if naturally absorbed.  It’s called Progestogel, and I found it here. 

https://moncoinsante.com/mcs/en/various-medications/11140-progestogel-1-tube-80g-for-targeted-areas-applicator-3400931314127.html

Hi LC1962. I have received my gel, I bought it from the pharmacy you recommended, I’ve had it for a week now but have been putting off using it (no idea why) I am on 100mg Utro daily but feel it’s not enough so wanted to add the gel in too. Anyway I just wanted to ask when you apply the gel, do you at night or morning? Thanks

[Kathleen]

Hello ladies.

I am following your stories with interest as I have had very little luck with HRT over the years.

I am 67 and very post meno with my problems only really beginning three years after my last period.   As with everyone I was told that I needed more and more Oestrogen and less and less progesterone. I have been on up to six pumps of Oestrogel with 100mcg of Utrogestan vaginally on alternate nights. I also used testosterone for a while. I have had times when I have felt back to normal and completely calm but it never lasts and I then feel panicky and flushy. My moods change as well and I am exhausted from being on this rollercoaster ride.

Currently I am using 1mcg of Sandrena gel every day plus a Cyclogest pessary on alternate nights to provide the progesterone.
Perhaps I have been needing more prog all this time? Who knows? Certainly no one in the medical profession so far.

I would say ladies that a few years ago I came off all HRT and reduced my prog before I reduced my Oestrogen meaning that I was using Oestrogen only for a few weeks before stopping altogether. Several symptoms returned after a few weeks namely night sweats, hot flushes, much increased vaginal dryness and crying spells. My GP suggested a return to HRT so I went back to using the gel.

I mention the above because it may give you an idea of  what can happen in post meno after years of HRT.

Take care ladies and I wish you all well.

K.

 

[ToriiJ]

Hi Kathleen

I was always led to believe that I needed more oestrogen to help with my depression, at one time I was on a Evorel 75 patch and 2 pumps of gel so in total 125, this much sent me spiralling even further so I gradually reduced to 50 (2 pumps) which I’m on now, it doesn’t really help that much, although thankfully not in the state I was in when on a high dose.

I do feel that progesterone is always made out to be the bad hormone but just shows we’re all different.

Thanks for sharing your experience and I wish you well too x

[pastie supper]

While reading this thread I've been wondering about the absorption of the progesterone gel.

If progesterone can be absorbed through the skin, then would it be feasible to cut open a Utrogestan capsule and spread the contents on the thighs, wait the half hour then wash it off again?

With the aim to lessen side effects or to adjust the dose.

I've not tried it, is it thick or waxy inside those capsules? If so then it would be too much trouble, but if it's like a cream?

Anyone tried?

[Sage 🍃]

The progesterone gel is only absorbed locally because it is supposed to act locally (breasts), while to protect the womb you need systemic (oral), or local (vaginal) absorption. Don't ask me if it would protect the womb if rubbed in the skin nearby 
It could be done because the progesterone inside the capsule is dissolved in oil. 

[Hurdity]

While reading this thread I've been wondering about the absorption of the progesterone gel.

If progesterone can be absorbed through the skin, then would it be feasible to cut open a Utrogestan capsule and spread the contents on the thighs, wait the half hour then wash it off again?

With the aim to lessen side effects or to adjust the dose.

I've not tried it, is it thick or waxy inside those capsules? If so then it would be too much trouble, but if it's like a cream?

Anyone tried?

pastiesupper

I'm not sure if you meant to use it for this purpose, but to avoid any confusion for anyone reading this, asbsolutely the micronised progesterone in utrogestan capsules CANNOT be spread on the body to provide the progestogenic protection to the womb. It won't do you any harm but won't do what it is supposed to.

Creams and gels that are applied to the skin are produced so that the active ingredient is contained in specific fillers to aid absorption and the micronised progesterone suspension in utrogestan capsules is designed to be released when the outer layer of the caspule is dissolved either by digestion or by vaginal fluids.

Even progesterone creams that are designed to be applied to the skins, cannot and should not be used for progestogenic protection as part of hRT because firstly the products available on the open market are not standardised or regulated, and also absorption is inconsistent.

Products should only be used in the way they were designed - if they are being used for the purpose for which they were designed.....

Hope this clarifies....

Hurdity x

PS I am just answering this specific post and haven't read the rest of the thread!

[AngelaH]

This Topic is not about the role of progesterone in protecting the womb, but about forgotten by NHS the role of progesterone in general in the women body. Just like estrogen, progesterone is important for the brain, bones, muscle…. Some women need estrogen to fix the problems in their bodies, but some need just progesterone.

I did not try to use Utrogestan on skin, really don’t need to do that because it helps to ease my symptoms by taking it in the way it should be taken.