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[Witchinghour]

Hi ladies,

I increased my oestrogel dosage from 2 to 3 pumps about 1.5 weeks ago and was intending to be on 3 pumps in the week before and during my period to give me more energy and lift my mood during that time but last night whilst falling asleep I had a sensation that my body was vibrating.

I’ve seen a few posts about it on here and other ladies have associated it with lower oestrogen and anxiety yet I have increased my oestrogen and am feeling less anxious if anything. I have seen a post suggesting it is due to high blood pressure which concerns me. Does anyone know if increasing your oestrogel can cause an increase in blood pressure. I don’t remember feeling that the vibrating was distressing but it does worry me that it could be an indication of something serious.

OP, have you had your B12 levels checked? Low B12 causes internal tremors.

[Katherine]

Hi witchinghour

I haven’t had my b12 levels checked but I take a b12 spray every day as it improves my concentration. If it keeps happening I will go to my gp and get checked.

[Joodle]

Hi all,
Very comforted to see other women with my weird symptom. Last year I had a mirena put in to help reduce heavier bleeding (has always been heavy) and improve iron levels. After that from time to time I began to notice what I thought was tiny little earth tremors as we had had a mild earthquake and I thought they were after effects though strange they lasted so long. I asked my friends if they noticed them. The Mirena caused continual bleeding. I took tranexamic acid to stop the bleeding. It worked and then restarted. I did not connect the tremors to the mirena. 5 months later the mirena came out. I had shocking back pain for 3 days. Ultrasound showed it was sitting in my cervix. The gp removed it. Ever since then I’ve had such powerful inner vibrations that I cannot sleep without 500 mg gabapentin per night. Even then there’s a bit of residual vibration. Has anyone rise had the connection to the mirena? Any options that work apart from HRT? Anyone try Chinese Med/acupuncture? I am so very tired…

[joziel]

How old are you? It sounds like you might need some HRT.... The Mirena thing could just be a coincidence.

There are many causes of internal vibrations and it's good to get them all checked out but starting some HRT in the meantime is a good option too.

Causes include:

B12 deficiency
D3 deficiency
Thyroid problems (including high rT3 which I had)
Low calcium
Low potassium
Electrolyte imbalances
Withdrawal or Side effects from neurological drugs (inc gabapentin)
Side effects of antibiotics
Long Covid
Mold
And of course - low estrogen or fluctuating estrogen

And probably more I've left out.

[Joodle]

Thank you Joziel, that doesn’t narrow it down much! 😆I’m 54. I don’t think the Mirena was coincidental at all. I think that’s when all of the vibration issues started. Before that yes very tired etc but the vibes only started after it was inserted and then very dramatically much more strongly  after the Mirena was removed so to me that’s a direct correlation. Which makes sense bc it changes our hormone levels.  Regardless I think I’ll try hrt. If it reduces it I’ll be eternally grateful as I’m living a half life and it’s a struggle. I can’t retire as I’m single and it’s hard when you just have no choice but to keep going to work, even when you feel dreadful and can’t perform as well.

[Joodle]

Joziel, Ive tested some of these things which are normal. My thyroid is all normal except I have slightly low reverse t3 @101pmol/litre.
I do have some mould on the roof of my bathroom but I’m too tired to clean it(also have arthritis)and too challenged budgetarily to pay to get it cleaned. It’s nowhere else.
I feel like I’ve got the flu any time I stay up a little later when I have to get prep done for school next day and can’t just go to bed. It can be caused by inflammation so probably related to arthritis. Arthritis worse this year and I think that’s perimenopsuse. Has anyone had arthritis symptoms reduced by HRT? The specialist said it often helps. 

[joziel]

Yes, one of my original symptoms was joint pain. I had bloods done for arthritis and they were all negative, including some cyclic peptide specialist test done...

Gradually the symptoms went when I started HRT and I'm now totally fine. But I also learnt I was iron deficient and started to take iron. (Low iron can also cause joint pain.) So I'm not sure which it was...

Low reverse T3 is GOOD. Are you sure you mean rT3 and not free T3? Low free T3 wouldn't be good - that is the active thyroid hormone. Low reverse T3 is a good thing. (Mine was high, which was the problem.)

With the Mirena, it could be that it changed hormones but... 1) it's not supposed to have a systemic effect, any hormonal effect is supposed to stay localised to the uterus. Whilst some people insist it does affect them in other ways, they are in the minority and must be extremely sensitive. Plus you've now removed your Mirena and are still getting the vibrations. And 2) Sometimes physical things can cause inner vibrations. For eg, neck injuries or pain, slipped discs anywhere, nerve damage for any reason... If your Mirena was sitting in your cervix and not in the right place, and if it caused back pain for you, it may have damaged a nerve somewhere round there... I mean, there could be a physical and not hormonal cause to your vibrations. Hopefully the nerve will recover now the Mirena has been removed. But it can take a while.

But HRT would be a good thing to try... for all the health benefits if nothing else.

[Joodle]

Thanks, Joziel, yes it's definitely low reverse 3 - below the recommended range- and my other levels are all within range. I have been to a neurologist and he says my nerves are all working well and they are not responsible for the vibration. I've had MRIs and yes I do have disc bulges but physio, neurologist and GP say these are not responsible for the vibration. My meno specialist is a gynacologist and I told her about the mirena. I have had ultrasounds and no damage is visible. So I think it's the hormone levels. The vibration was very minor prior to the mirena being removed, then very intense after it was removed. It is very weird. Perhaps it was induced by all of the stress I went through last year and then this happened on top of it all. Will try HRT. Artritis is an inflammatory kind and I have had it for some time but wasn't aware. I have had flare ups for years but it has amped up especially on days when I don't sleep well.

[joziel]

You can't really have too low reverse T3, so I wouldn't worry about that. It just means your thyroid is working really well and converting T4 to T3 and only minimal is getting converted to the 'waste of time' thing that is rT3. (Well it does have advantages in times of famine or when we need to slow our metabolisms down, but for most people in the modern age it has no useful purpose and can cause a lot of problems.)

The range will just be 'what most normal people are', which seeing they hardly test anyone with rT3 anyway, who knows how many people that sample is based on....

There are many people on FB groups for internal vibrations who've had endless neurologists tell them that the cause isn't disc injury, then miraculously be healed when the disc injury was fixed... so I remain a bit sceptical about totally writing that one off!

[Joodle]

Could you please share one of those groups with me? I’ve been told to be very careful with my neck due to arthritis there and lots of constriction. Told not to get chiro bc it’s too forceful and tbh I don’t like chiro for that reason. I’ve just found a good physio who is working on mobilising my neck through gentle pressure manipulation which I think has freed it up somewhat. As the sensation moves around my body I still tend to think it’s likely related to estrogen, also direct correlation to the mirena which alters our hormones. But who knows! I’m willing to check everything out to get it to stop. Except chiro… 😆

[joziel]

I was ina group called 'Internal Vibrations' but the problem is it was completely unhelpful because there are so many different causes of this symptom, so really it's just a group of people complaining about how bad their symptoms are without much help or direction in fixing it - so I left that one. Same goes with the hypnic jerks FB group. The FB groups which are useful are those with an actual diagnosis in the title rather than a symptom... the problem being we've all no idea what causes this.

I've been so much better with my internal vibrations at night for a few months now, on 4 pumps of gel and on T3 - and for some reason I had a really bad night last night with 3 hours sleep, just like it used to be. It terrified me that I might end up back there again. With the blessing of my Newson dr I've increased my estrogen - she said I could do 5 pumps of gel but I have some patches left over and zero skin to apply gel to, so I decided to add half a 50 patch instead. (On 4 pumps my estrogen was only 283pmol on day 16 of my cycle. Assuming my own body is contributing SOMETHING, even something low like 80, that means I'm maybe getting 200pmol from 4 pumps of gel. Geeze..... I seem to be absorbing testosterone gel just fine, as my T levels are at the top end of the normal range!!)

[Maggiestone5]

I know this is old but Joziel are you actually saying the vibration decreased when you increased your gel? I know you wondered if it was to high in the beginning.  But then you found your gel was actually to low?  I’m currently in a quandary about my patch.  And if it is causing my buzzing or I need to go higher. 

[joziel]

Ha ha, gosh this was a long time ago    I'm now on 11 pumps of gel 

My sleep is getting much better. I increased to 11 pumps last week and I got 7.5 hours last night, which is excellent for me.

I last tested at 6 pumps and was around 330pmol. My Newson doctors say most women need to be 400-600pmol for symptom resolution. I think because during peri you have fluctuations. I would recommend testing during your period if you still have periods, as your own estrogen will be low then so you can see what you are getting from HRT. Whatever you get, it is probably cutting in and out... Mine was around 190-250pmol up to 75 patch or 3 pumps of gel. It was 330pmol at 6 pumps. I would hope it is now around 500 or something... But I need to test again now and get an update on levels.

And the starting T3 thing has been both very interesting and a nightmare. I am now on 50mcg T4 and 45mcg T3 and I feel good as far as thyroid stuff goes - except I don't need to be on thyroid meds. These night time symptoms were estrogen related, not thyroid.

But I am using this time to sort out my metabolism by doing a slow reverse diet and gradually increasing my calories. I can't come off thyroid meds whilst my metabolism is this slow, because there will be a hypo period for a few weeks and it will slow me down even more, which could actually be dangerous if I reduce calories loads so as not to gain weight. It's a metabolic mess. The current plan is to get back up to 2200 calories with a reverse diet and then to come off the thyroid meds. I'm really really anxious about it all.

Starting a low dose of T3 was one thing (15mcg) because it didn't suppress my TSH and just topped me up. But then the doctor I was seeing freaked out because that small amount of T3 dropped my T4 to below range. So then she convinced me I needed 50mcg T4 as well - and boom - my thyroid was suppressed. Then, with a suppressed thyroid, 15mcg T3 wasn't enough and I increased to 30 - still not enough... It's just a slippery slope. I was really desperate to try anything and I don't think I appreciated what it would mean to come off.

Body builders come on and off it all the time, but they are very metabolically flexible.... 

Anyway, I'd suggest you get bloods done during your period and if they are not 400-600pmol, increase... And if you get to 4 pumps of 100 patch and the GP refuses higher, Newson or any private clinic will prescribe higher. And be very very careful about trying thyroid meds.

[Joodle]

I agree with getting levels tested. My estrogen was really high so I’ve cut right back. I think taking progesterone is helping but the biggest things for me are 1 swimming 2/3 times a week and 2 getting enough rest. Also get upon the morning, don’t lounge in bed too long, no matter how tired you are. My buzzing has reduced but worsens when extra fatigued. Good luck, it’s a nightmare.

[Joodle]

Check progesterone levels, I suspect it’s to do with the balance between the hormones. No one knows. So frustrating.