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[Lisa1966]

I did one cycle of provera,just before I had the mirena and it was ok,if I don't get on with mirena I would definitely go back to provera xx

[Kathleen]

Hello  Cassie and Connolly and thank you for your comments.

Cassie - I'm pleased that your regime works well and it's certainly worth thinking about.

Conolly -  I am fortunate that I don't have any physical problems with the meno. My ' lady parts'  have changed beyond recognition but I don't have any pain. I was diagnosed with an inflammatory disease in the same month that I had my last period but I haven't had any flare ups for years and all my tests are normal.
My main meno symptoms are the emotional ones but I still have flushes as well. Infact  today  I've been flushing and sweating all afternoon! I have always had signs of hormonal surges and plunges and I was hoping that HRTwould at least sort that out but so far it hasn't.
 Once again I'm moaning, so sorry, it's the frustration talking. Thanks again for your post, I do appreciate it.

Take care ladies.

K.

[Conolly]

We're all moaning 😂 maybe that's another menopause symptom? Or ageing... 😫


I don't have the sweating, thank goodness, although I'm afraid this can be another symptom that something is not quite right because I practically never sweat unless I'm terribly ill. Anxiety also plays a role in all this, don't you think? I'm much better now than I was during perimenopause but I can't feel relaxed enough, it feels like my muscles are always under stress even though I don't feel particularly stressed about anything. Mindfulness helps a bit though.


How long have you been trying HRT since you have started again? Sorry if you have already mentioned it... Maybe it's just a matter of time until your body gets used to it?


I'm sorry you're not feeling great but I do enjoy your posts 😁


Conolly X

[Kathleen]

Hello Conolly.

Thank you for responding and I'm glad you like my posts!

Like you I struggle to relax these days. I understand that we carry our tension in different muscles, my husband gets a bad back and the spasms pull his spine into an ‘s‘ shape, exactly like his mother. Some people notice a tightening in their chest but for me my stomach shrinks and I lose my appetite.   Although the anxiety is s problem  I feel I would cope better if I didn't have the flushes and sweats as well. I'm sure one feeds the other.

I had my last period at 54 so became post meno a 55. I had a lot of symptoms, including the above but as my children had left home and I didn't need to work I thought I was in a good position to power through it all. After three years of worsening symptoms I decided to try HRT at the age of 57. I've continued to experiment with variations of pills and patches and I've given each regime plenty of time to work but I've never had the full relief that some ladies seem to get. I now wish I had tried HRT earlier in my journey as I might have got a better result and my hormones would not have become so depleted.  Hindsight eh!

Sorry to go on but like you I would love to feel relaxed and content instead of tense for no reason.  I will  just have to  turn to drink lol!

Wishing you well.

K.

[Conolly]

I'll drink to that 


You had a late menopause, I guess it wouldn't matter if you started HRT earlier. Well, maybe it would but we'll never know.


What about alternative methods? Have you tried anything? Are you receptive to trying them? I have bought a Chillmax pillow that does help me go back to sleep right away after a hot flush. £10 well spent 😁


There are some menopause experts trying to change the way hot flushes are seen by doctors and society. They prefer to call them neurovascular motor symptoms, something a bit more appropriate for something that disrupts sleep and can turn our lives upside down. They don't think they are just a natural menopause symptom, but rather a sign of an underlying problem.


As a side note, since I have been experiencing peripheral neuropathy symptoms (burning skin, weakness, numbness), my perspective has changed about the dreaded hot flushes... they're nothing compared to that. The brain works in mysterious ways 🤔


Conolly X

[Lanzalover]

Good morning Kathleen

If your consultant isn't happy with long cycle could you use the Utrogestan for 12 out of 28 days which is the licensed amount.
It would mean you having a withdrawal bleed but it may help you in trying to figure out what's causing you all the problems, although I am sure the continuous progesterone is part of the problem and more than likely the Utrogestan.

Hope today is better day for you.

Lanzalover x

[Kathleen]

Hello Conolly and Lanzalover and thank you for your comments.


Conolly - I am open to trying alternatives and although I don't use a Chillmax I do have a very cool bedroom and a wool pillow which helps. So sorry to hear about your neuropathy, my mil had a lot of that so I know how horrible it can make you feel.

Lanzalover - I will ask my consultant about a different progesterone cycle when I see her. This morning  my spotting is turning into a bit of a bleed, my flushes have increased and my breasts are still tender, what fun eh!

Wishing you well ladies.

K.

[warwick01]

Hi Kathleen

Just to add.... The more oestrogel I use the more sweats I have and I feel wired /anxious, was running out of shops due to anxiety . Currently I am using 1.5 pumps or some times 2 pumps of Oestrogel at night. I feel better not 100% but better than a couple of years ago. I also use 2.5 Northisteone for 7 days every 6 weeks which gives me a 5 day bleed.

Why not try 2 pumps at night and see if the anxiety settles. Also could not tolerate Utrogesterone, made me more wired and pump in sweat.....

Wx

[Kathleen]

Hello warwick01.

Thank you so much for commenting.

I was wondering if the oestrogen was adding to my anxiety, I think I'll go back to two pumps for a while and see how it goes. I note that you are another lady who uses minimal progesterone and has a withdrawal bleed on a long cycle. When I suggested this to my consultant she said she didn't agree with it but it seems she is behind the times so  I will mention it again when I see her.

Take care and wishing you well.

K.

[jillydoll]

Just a quick thought Kathleen,
Have you had your thyroid checked out?
I know that can cause a lot of problems..

Hope you get there soon,
Thinking of you,

Jd xx

[Kathleen]

Hello jillydoll.

Thank you for your suggestion. I need to make an appointment with my GP so will ask about Thyroid blood tests.

Many thanks and take care.

K.

[TNM45689]

Hi Kathleen

I am 46 and on the same as you - daily utrogestan conti and 50mg x Estradot - it has been over three months since I started - I have had terrible bloating since I began and whilst I did feel less hormonal initially I am no going back to how I was before. I am not sleeping any better so tbh I am not sure what next.

My GP said he couldnt hep me as not his area and I do not have an appointment at Menopause CLinic til Sept - I did call then and rather than tweak what I am on now they said switch to norethisterone which also has its complications. I am really at a loss too.

Sorry I cannot help more - I do not feel I can just switch to a sequi or change to vaginal route without a specialist telling me that is OK - I am also worried about all of these changes without a scan (my mum died of womb cancer) - it is all so hard and so complicated.

Big hugs
Txx

[Tempest]

I'm bowing out of the forum now, Kathleen but wanted to just leave you this:

https://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2012-01/sicp-tio010912.php

Estrogen's effects are complex and every individual - their psychological makeup and biochemistry - behaves differently. For some, estrogen can lift depression but for others (as mentioned in this article) it can actually increase feelings of fear.

We really are all different, and this is one of the reasons that i'm leaving again as I believe that there are quite a few women who pass through here who will not benefit from the 'cookie cutter' advice of increasing estrogen, and for these women it can make them feel despairing if they are not responding  to treatments as others are.

As you know, I've been doing this menopause thing for quite a while now, and I probably have quite a way to go too. In my travels, I have met women who do brilliantly on good doses of estrogen, others who find it sends them bonkers. Some who simply can't stand any fluctuation no matter how small on any HRT regime, and others who can actually forget to apply a patch or gel with minimal discomfort. I've also met women who love progesterone - and some who do brilliantly on progestogens and love a conti regime.

Also there are those who have very low estrogen levels, take nothing at all and are doing very well indeed (yes - it's true. I've actually met them in the flesh)!

We really are all that diverse!

If I could say one thing, it would be listen to what your body is telling you and work with a consultant or GP who knows your history and can see you face to face to monitor your progress. Forums are handy and can be brilliant for support, but I don't think they are the place to receive advice from 'lay experts' on what to put into your body. That's what the real professionals are for!

Speak with your consultant, and lay out your issues plainly. Tell her you're struggling, and mention all and any symptoms and take it from there. In the meantime, do see your GP and tell them how you're struggling with the dreadful anxiety - they are there to help too and will want to support you. Book a double appointment if you think you need to, so that you're not rushed.

I really do wish you all the best, Kathleen - yours has been a long and tough struggle.

Good luck! xxxx

[Hurdity]

Hello Ladies.

Can anyone advise me please.  I am using Oestrogel and Utrogestan but things have taken a turn for the worse and I'm panicking now.

 I had been using two pumps but as I'm still flushing I recently increased this to three. I also started out taking Utrogestan orally but I was concerned about my low mood so I started using it vaginally. In the last few days I've felt awful mood wise and now my breasts are very tender and I've began spotting with a rust coloured discharge ( sorry if tmi). I am still flushing however.

I can't get an appointment with my GP and I don't see the Consultant until late August. I feel full of hormones but they are making me feel worse not better. I have wondered if I'm progesterone intolerant but I've never had it separately from oestrogen so how would I know? I'm so confused atm.

Sorry if I'm repeating myself but clearly my body is telling me I'm doing something wrong.

If any of you lovely ladies have some words of wisdom for me I would be truly grateful.

Wishing you all well.

K.

Hi Kathleen

I have only just seen this thread as I haven't been to this board for a while!

So sorry to hear you are still not sorted re your HRT regime - I did make some comments on your other thread about anxiety meds because of wondering about the possible side effects of some of the HRT you've tried in the past.

I'm going to say what I always say - and Lanzalover and Cassie have already said it - you should really try to take HRT on a cyclical basis if you can!  If you get the right dose of oestrogen and the right type of progestogen on the right cycle - then if there aren't any other issues seriosuly impacting on your emotional and mental health - this may be all you need - no other meds!!

It's no good looking back  (ie your saying it might have been better to start HRT earlier) - because this can lead to regret. As you know I am not a gel user - (although I did try Sandrena) and started HRT at the age you had your last period - or rather just before I was 54  and 5 months since my previous period. Because of that I started on a cyclical regime from the beginning - which you have not yet tried. If you are absorbing the oestrogen well then at your age you probably shouldn't (don't?) need 3 pumps of gel - and as you can see from Cassie's post she happily uses one and I know a woman on another forum in her 60's who also only needs 1.5 pumps gel. Sometimes paradoxically flushes can increase when you increase the oestrogen dose by too much. I wouldn't want to be on a really high dose in my 60's if I was absorbing it well only because a correspondingly higher dose of progesterone is needed.

Have you had a scan at all recently to check the lining thickness and/or condition? If all is OK there is no reason not to try a cycle using the same products - at least try 2 pumps of gel and 200 mg utrogestan (to start with) vaginally for 10-11 days per month. If it seems OK - gets rid of the flushes - take it from there. Who knows you might even be able to reduce the AD eventually?! 

Of course the downside is having a bleed and that's why those of us doing cycles into our 60's do a long cycle....it doesn't have to be much longer - it could be 5 weeks to start with and perhaps stretch to 6. This gives long enough to stabilise on oestrogen only and get rid of the prog from your system. Not for everyone though.

I do sympathise - we are really caught between the devil and the deep blue sea as another member said - continuous prog and bleed free - but putting up with the perpetual depressive side effects - including anxiety, foggy head or headaches - or have a flipping withdrawal bleed in your 60's!

I know we are all unique but I was happily on 50 mcg patch for the whole of the time since I started HRT at approx 54 - I only increased it slightly recently due to also taking testosterone, not because of any recurrent symptoms. I do always hope for the same for you (ie living happily on a medium dose of HRT!).

Anyway I hope you sort things out but please let us know how you are and what you decide - whatever it is and whatever you need

Hurdity x

[Tempest]

Worried about you, Kathleen - if you're reading please just pop in and let us know if you're ok, if you can.

Thinking of you, and sending love. xxxx