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[abbyH]

It comes and then goes.. On day 3 of the patch I feel worse.. but by day 4 I feel fine... I want to see if things settle down on a tolerable dose of E.. perhaps just sticking to the 50 patch for now and seeing how that goes.. The increase (to 75) seemed to make me feel worse...

[CLKD]

HORMONES    but if you feel suicidal you need to tell your GP!

[abbyH]

Ok.. I will do.. I am due to see her soon...

Abby x

[Nikki180515]

Hi Abby

I had a total hysterectomy and ovaries removed 18 months ago.  I too work in education.  I did similar time off to you, went back for the last 2 weeks then had the summer off, but like you worked most of the way through it and while I was off for the 6 weeks after my op!!!

Went back in September and as its a stressful job the hormones went mad! Ended up having a total breakdown and being put on antidepressants! Which at the time I needed as it was a 3 month waiting list to see the menopause specialist.  Was off work for 4 months waiting for appointments and finally getting them,.  The meno specialist told me that some women suffered more emotionally and some suffered more physical symptoms, I was on the emotional sign and she recommended that I stayed on the low dose of anti depressants and tried testosterone.

Wish I knew all this prior to my op as none of this explained to me and if its wasn't for the great info and advise in this forum I would never have known.

My headteacher was initially supportive but then obviously lost her patience with me and basically wanted me out.  I managed 6 weeks where I was made to feel useless and the worst teacher ever but no support given,  so eventually defeated I threw the towel in and resigned.  After talking to my union I found out this was a mistake as once I had resigned there was nothing more they could do.  But I couldn't stay a moment longer so had to resign, but this is how these headteacher a get away with it!!!

The legal team of my Union were useless too, asking me why did I want to drag this up, just forget it and move on with my life!!! Not sure why we pay a subscription for them!!

Anyway I wrote a letter to the HR department as I had kept a record of all the incidents I had encountered.  But again nothing from them.

Anyway after starting testosterone never felt better and now have a new job at a fab school where I am appreciated and have a very supportive staff and headteacher.  So there is light at the end of the tunnel I hope for you.

Take care

Nikki xxxx

[Tempest]

I have these feelings too Abby, on and off. I can't discount that this is now a mental health issue as well as being tied up with my hormones for me, as much as I struggle to accept this at times. I feel in my case it's because it's all been so traumatic fighting to be heard and treated after surgery, so eventually I just cracked under the strain of it all (and mid life issues that have cropped up in general)!

I now see a Psychiatrist, who is so much better for me to deal with with these issues than my GP! It's nothing to be ashamed of and please DO ask for help like CLKD says. I'm off to see him again on Thursday actually, to speak about possibly starting drug treatment in the New Year (it's not a definite - we may try therapy instead or as well as drug treatment. This is the beauty of being referred to a Psychiatrist at your local CMHT as they have more options available to better suit your needs).

And NEVER be afraid of trying crisis services - I have learned that I need to pick up the phone and use my local one (a great service called First Crisis, you will have similar in your area or there are national ones) when I get very low. I've used them a lot over the last few months (they help me get through the days when I'm not on here very much - this is when you can bank on it that I'm having a really tough time. I can't usually do forums when I'm very anxious or feeling low. So now you know where I go to)!

Sending you so many hugs - please know that you're not alone in how you feel. I may have been joking around a little earlier but that is rather rare for me! CLKD will tell you that a few months back, I needed extra hand holding to cope even when Hubby was away for the night and she was one of the lovely ladies who stepped up to help me out then. You deserve all the help you need right now, so that you can start to feel better about life again. So do reach out and see your GP.....promise? xxxxx

I too feel like I'm 'drowning in it' right now, so I can thoroughly relate. It just goes round and round in your head doesn't it, desperately trying to find answers to fix yourself! This wears you down and this is why I have finally admitted that I need extra help and support right now

[Tempest]

Hi, Nikki!

What an awful time you've had with your employer too! Do you know, it has gladdened my heart so much that you've shared that you are now feeling so much better and that you have a new job where you are appreciated (please excuse me, but did I spot your story over at The Hysterectomy Association forum too? It rings a lot of bells)!

I'm also very encouraged that the T has made a big difference to you too. It's an elusive thing (for me and Abby, or so it feels right now), and I think this will probably help both Abby and I too greatly but we need to creep our E up a bit to get there (Abby - don't panic! We WILL get there and I'm having to take it slow too, remember! It's about letting our bodies cope with change a little at a time).

Also Abby - viz. the hair. I'm pretty sure you WILL see an improvement over time as your E levels stabilise and improve. I know when I had my son I lost a LOT of hair when my E dropped suddenly after delivery. It doesn't mean you won't be able to have T. It takes on average 3 months to start seeing improvements in this area on a stable dose of E, so don't go tinkering around too much! I would also speak to your GP about how your hair loss is impacting you mentally and ask if you may have an evaluation with a trichologist as you have lost so much of it. It's worth getting as much input as you can - again, it's OK to ask, you deserve help to start feeling better again in every way.

Let's make a plan together to move forward in 2017, ok? We can support each other as we're pretty much in the same position right now. And take great encouragement too from Nikki's post - it can and WILL get better!!

[Annie0710]

Lovely words from both Nikki and Tempest, you girls really have a way with your words

We REALLY do need a separate section here on the forum I think for a few issues:

Hysterectomy
No ovaries
Hair loss

To name a few, someone with no hair loss and kind of plodding along (again I'm rubbish with words and not taking anything away from menopausal ladies with ovaries and hair) but these losses can and do really knock the stuffing out of us at a time meno is stripping us of so much more alongside it

I visited HysterSisters again last night, the layout of their forum just isn't making it easy for me to navigate round it but I feel connected obviously because of my history, it's a shame , maybe it's because I use my phone


Hi Nikki (forgot to say hi!)
What testosterone are you on ? Testogel or Testim ?

X

[Tempest]

Totally, totally agree Annie! I've asked our Admin. Emma twice for a section for ladies who have experienced hysterectomy/oopherectomy and so far, no joy....... We could certainly do with stickied threads for all 3!

Hystersisters is hellish in layout, I agree! It's hard to navigate and hasn't got the 'warmth' in appearance that MM has. It's all a bit bleak, really! I have to limit my time over there as A) I get frustrated that we don't have some of the options available to us that they do Stateside (and yes, I would pay privately to get some of these) B) I feel terribly for the 'have and have nots' over there in the US as some women are having to choose between filling their HRT prescriptions (the cost of which is astronomical) or feed their families (which reminds us in the UK   how lucky we are really, and therefore kinda cancels out A))and C) there is a LOT of desperation over there (but then again, I have to remind myself that the number of women who have had these operations in the US must number in the millions and this is but a small number who are having a hard time, in the main.

Talking of which, NEVER, EVER be tempted to join or visit an anxiety forum! Nope, never do it!! If you want to come away way, way worse with even greater anxiety, then this is the way to go. Ask me how I know......

[Annie0710]

I looked ironically on Saturday Tempest.  Nipped in and nipped out

What struck me (and scared the life out of me) is that they're still suffering.  Surely they are on medication ? I read some stories on social anxiety and my could I relate 😢

HysterSisters were informative when I needed extra reassurance about this 2nd menopause I'd been told I'm going through plus the disappearing ovaries , it turned out many in there had both too

X

[Tempest]

Oh, indeed! I have read quite a few posts there about the second menopause - it's a widely acknowledged phenomenon there! A typical pattern seems to be that even ladies who have had their ovaries removed pre menopause, did no HRT and we're fine for years or who used HRT, came off it and then did fine for years then went into menopause AGAIN years later (usually at the age when they would have gone through natural menopause).

If you tried to tell your GP/Specialist this one in the UK, they would truly think you were bonkers but this is REAL! Ive had many thoughts about how this could be happening, and I think it comes down to those pesky adrenals again. There has to be a shift in function with ageing, another upheaval. Maybe the adrenals were able to keep up with hormonal demands, and then with ageing they started to struggle to do this or this is an age related normal downshift in the adrenal 's functioning. Who knows?!

Ditto with the disappearing ovaries! Hysterectomy - woman retains ovaries and goes for a scan. No ovaries to be found. Zilch! Nada! I read one thread where they had to painstakingly go over the theatre notes of the original surgery to make sure they weren't removed, and they definitely WEREN'T as the surgeon had taken photos during the procedure and pre suturing at the end of the procedure clearly showing the ovaries intact! Where do they go?!? Do they dissolve, get absorbed by the body, what??? There are so many weird and wonderful things happening that Gynae's. and Endocrinologists have no idea about, and it is REAL.

By the way, without thread jacking completely or taking away from the OP, I have just received an appointment in today to see the surgeon who did my oopherectomy (my Gynaecologist for over 10 years) as since I have started HRT (coincidentally) I have been experiencing increasing pelvic pain in the last 3 months. Clear for UTI's, no prolapse that GP can tell. No history of endo. I'm hoping this is just more adhesions (of which I have many) and not, dare I say it, ovarian remnant syndrome. I have very, very dense adhesions from many prior pelvic surgeries and my surgeon (who is one of the best for laparoscopic procedures in the UK) was still a bit leary at taking my ovaries laparoscipally but wanted to avoid yet another laparotomy (I'd had 3 previously).

I only phoned his secretary last Friday, and my appointment is for 9th January, so that was very quick. Me being me, I'm worrying quite a bit now because he IS seeing me so quickly! (I'm never happy, am I)?!?

[CLKD]

The thing for me - when I had depression I thought every day 'it will be better tomorrow' until I was so ill I couldn't move from the house  - in fact, my GP saw me walking in the street and phoned me to visit the Surgery, he could see by my posture that I was slipping back.  I learned to visit him B4 I got too bad to knock the symptoms on the head! 

Going along to discuss options with the GP opens the door for that discussion.  I don't tell many people that I take medication, unless they 'need' to know or are reluctant to try tablets, then I wade in with my experiences.  For me it was 6 months B4 I realised that I felt 'better'. 

At this time of year surgeries will be fuller as people realise that C.mas/New Year are close ……..

[Tempest]

I can relate to the 'it'll be better tomorrow' totally, CLKD. I'm so very grateful that I now have the Psychiatrist I do (he's very empathetic and thorough), but boy have I been stubborn! I was also encouraged by Nikki's post on going on the low dose of an AD and how it helped her go cope and how she has moved on.

I don't think I've made the best decisions at times this year, because I refused to believe that I was that low and couldn't necessarily fix myself quickly or completely with HRT or alone. If it helps as a 'bridge' at least then I'm personally open to it. If I need something long term, then so be it. I only have one life, and I want the best from it. Like the old cliche says, life ain't a rehearsal!

[Nikki180515]

Hi again

Yes I used to regularly post on hysterectomy association -- another good site, but we seemed to have all moved on now.

Thank you for saying about my kind words - I am currently retraining to be a counsellor, so these words are great to hear!! 

I forgot to mention that I went through lots of counselling, I found CBT really good and also went on a self esteem course which really helped.  But I think the tesosterone was the key, I am on testogel, along with 2mg of sandrena, vagifem and ovestim cream!!!  I am throwing everything at this menopause! 

But yes I look back to myself this time last year and I was not in a good place.  It would have been nice to have some counselling pre op and also a meeting with the menopause specialist so I had an idea of what options were available.  I was given no HRT for 6 weeks in which time my poor body didn't knew what had happened.  My doctors surgery tried their best but weren't knowledgeable and until I stamped my feet about having to go on the sick they finally sorted out me an appointment with the menopause specialist which took 2 months to come through.

I have had hair loss too - but wasn't sure if this was down to stress or menopause.  Tried that Plantur shampoo but didn't find it helped.

But yes keep going, use this site for info and fight to get the right medication you need.  I feel all hystercotomy with ovaries removed and especially surgical menopause like me, should be given the option of testosterone straight away.  You should be given the hormones you had before your op to help your body adjust.

I could go on and on, but honestly it does get better if you get the right medication for you, and we are all different so it's a bit of trial and error, but hopefully you will get there.

I have changed my attitude in that I can only do my best and if its not good enough then so be it and most of the time it's other people's opinion and their problem so let them think what they want! 

Keep in touch and keep going!

Nikki xxxx

[Annie0710]

Tempest
Try not to worry, easy for me to say,  I'm glad he's seeing you quick, you will hopefully get answers for your pain, I guess he wants  to see you quite soon to he can see exactly what is /isn't happening.  I've never thought about adhesions, I've had 2 laparoscopies and the hysterectomy and 2 D&Cs but I haven't ever noticed any pain there apart from IBS when it's been at it's worst

CLKD
I understand what you're saying.  I think the problem with me is ive always been a mind over matter person (please, no one take that personally, that's just how I have coped through life) so many things have happened in my life my philosophy was always to give it time.  My family have no history of anxiety or depression so will have no experience of medication or symptoms plus I only have 2 brothers left so definitely can't talk to them

If I go for help with this social anxiety (I have give it time, and the mind isn't coping with the matter) like you I won't broadcast it.  I don't want anyone in my normal life seeing or treating me any differently

  I have always acknowledged mental health and never mocked it, unfortunately I do think some people in my real life have played on it so as never to have to work but I also know of others that are struggling to get through each day with it

Can I ask about BBs ? Once you have taken one, how quick does it work to regulate the heartbeat ? Or don't they work like that ?


X

[Tempest]

I thought I recognised your story, Nikki! 

Thank you so much for sharing what has helped you, and yes - I couldn't agree more. We DO need the hormones restored that we had previously for our wellbeing! I went a whole year with no HRT whatsoever following my surgery as I naively believed my surgeon who said I didn't need any! I cannot believe now that I put myself through that (I'm seeing him again in January and whilst I trust him implicitly as an excellent surgeon, boy is he going to get a huge telling off)!

Thank you too so much for your encouragement,  it really helps ladies like us who are struggling. It's wonderful that you're training to be a counsellor - I truly believe that those who have fought their own struggles make the best and most empathetic counsellors and therapists. I think you'll do just marvellously!

I hope you were taking notes on the Testogel, Annie! I wonder if there is any difference between the Testosterone gels? I know we've compared performance of various ERT's but I don't think there has been any comparisons in performance between these (probably because so few ladies can GET this treatment. Grrrr)!! Maybe you can get some tips from Nikki on how to progress with the pea blob?!?

I would be a candidate for a Testosterone implant (my Consultant is BIG on implants) eventually.......But I would want to make sure of the dose and suitability by using the gel for some time first. I think this is still a little way off for me, though!

I'm hoping it is just adhesions obviously, even though the blighters have caused me myriad problems in the past. It's much less worrying than the alternative, I have to say!