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[honeybun]

Sorry, you have lost me now.

Honeybun
X

[peegeetip]

Please be so kind and explain where I've lost you now?

 

[honeybun]

I'm afraid I didn't understand your post that said.....

"Or we could just start by avoiding (or not knowing ) the obvious.

[honeybun]

The voice of reason.
That's what I have been saying over and over to no avail.

Thank you Grangravy.....and I'm very sorry about your friend.


Honeybun
X

[thorntrees]

Have to agree with HB and Grangravy on this one. If my GP had put my symptoms of tiredness,feeling hot,ltchy skin aches  and pains and several others down to hormonal problems(at the time I was not 12 months without  a period)  and so still peri I would probably not still be here. I had already had these vague symptoms for nearly two years and had myself just thought it was my age. Fortunately my GP sent me for blood tests and then to the hospital and I was diagnosed with lymphoma and had 9months of chemo. Simple things might not always have a simple cause and personally I would prefer tests however unpleasant rather than miss something serious.

Thorn trees

[peegeetip]

Sorry for your illness Thorntrees. All the very best for the future.

Talk about sticking together.
I think ladies are scared to pitch in their thoughts which is sad.
I've had pm's that mention the same too.

Just to be clear. We are talking the majority of ladies here, not a very small number who sadly have much more serious conditions.

The main point your missing is most ladies present these symptoms and don't get help.

The majority of ladies who present in this time of their life will have some level of hormonal flux. However there seems be little awareness, help and even denial on the peri front. Lately posts have mentioned doctors just not allowing that some ladies may start peri/meno much earlier.

Just to make it crystal clear how little is known on peri I did a test.

I went to a "symptom checker" sites to add in the symptoms mentioned.

All bar one site came back with a mention of peri and that was only when I'd put in flushes.

Some sites identified "PMS" from the symptoms excluding Flushes/Sweats. But even on adding that symptom only one identified peri but it didnt mention meno - which is weirder.

Is PMS such a "disease/condition" that it warrants such prominence above peri and meno?

On another site I put in night sweats and got everything (kitchen sink of diseases) but no mention of peri or meno. The same site did not recognise flush as a symptom. Enough said on that one.

Either way these sites are put together based on medical info and knowledge and still don't see either the condition or the symptoms connecting up.

I understand that some have encountered truly awful situations but on the whole most ladies just need a helping hand thru peri, which seems to be hit or miss for a long time.

If your not seeing that then sorry but thats something you have to deal with yourselves

 

[GypsyRoseLee]

What has astounded me is how very little GPs seem to know about hormonal issues! And even less about peri menopause.

I think in an ideal world a woman in her late 30s, or in her 40s, presenting with intermittent depression and anxiety, plus the classic headaches and flushes should be considered as potentially having a hormone issue AT THE SAME TIME as being given the standard raft of tests.

What is appalling is how many GPs simply refuse to acknowledge that peri menopausal symptoms can even exist in a woman who is only in her thirties or early forties. And that even if they do acknowledge it, they are so wary of offering any hormonal help.

[honeybun]

I can't see how we are sticking together to be honest. A few of us agree and that's it, unfortunately it is not your opinion.
A frank exchange of opinions is surely a good thing and so why would anyone be put off posting 

Everyone's thoughts are welcomed surely.


Honeyb

[peegeetip]

Hi

its not frank if your just calling people out as wrong.

Your talking about a small minority and thats colouring your view.

I'm talking about the wider un-served majority and you and the cohort keep saying thats wrong.

I'm all for a frank discussion but you often say things are unclear but fail to elaborate.
Call things out as wrong but fail to put up the most basic of "other side" of the problem.

In this case we've lost sight of the majority of women who struggle for around 5-10 years prior to meno and have nowhere to go to seek help on their problems. When they do try they are left worried and tramatised by "possible conditions" and tests that again for the "majority" are just not required. This is rather than look to the obvious hormonal issues that face us from our 30 to 40's onward.

GypsyRoseLee put that very well also but you seem not to have any grind against that.

I think if our doctors were not so keen to get us off the BCP then we'd see a huge reduction in peri symptoms. There is so many scare stories given to why we should get off BCP but as we can see from others posts there are benefits by even a small change in a doctors view point and long term actions. Even posts about some docs allowing ladies to stay on the pill till meno is very positive. However I feel like some on the forum a lot of doctors have closed their minds to possible options or new thinking.

I hope one day to trawl something out that we can agree on but till then I'll try and look to the majority than the minority.

[Dorothy]

What is appalling is how many GPs simply refuse to acknowledge that peri menopausal symptoms can even exist in a woman who is only in her thirties or early forties. And that even if they do acknowledge it, they are so wary of offering any hormonal help.

I agree - I have a friend who is the third generation in her family to start at 38 but is getting no help at all from her GP.  I can understand that if you are in your 20s or 30s your symptoms are less likely to be caused by peri than if you are in your 40s or 50s, but that doesn't excuse doctors refusing to consider it once they have ruled out all other serious conditions.  I know so many women who have started in their 30s - I am wondering if the age is coming down now and it is becoming more common to start earlier.

I even had a comment from my first GP about me 'wanting to think' I had early meno...I can't imagine anyone 'wanting' to start this process early - I can only think that she was so convinced no woman in her 30s could start, that she convinced herself I was making up my symptoms for some bizarre reason of my own.    

[Limpy]

In this case we've lost sight of the majority of women who struggle for around 5-10 years prior to meno and have nowhere to go to seek help on their problems. When they do try they are left worried and tramatised by "possible conditions" and tests that again for the "majority" are just not required. This is rather than look to the obvious hormonal issues that face us from our 30 to 40's onward.

PGT - I'd understood there weren't any simple tests for menopause be it at peri or any other stage, certainly that was the case with blood tests about 3 to 4 years ago.

It isn't good that anybody should be "left worried and tramatised" by anything. But perhaps it's better to  try to find the cause of their problems rather than prescribing HRT indiscriminately. You mention that the majority of women's ills can be cured by HRT. That was not the case for Grangravy's friend or Thorntrees, but hey lets give everybody HRT rather than find out what's wrong with them. HRT has helped me enormously but like any other medication it should be used when appropriate not dished out like smarties.

[honeybun]

Wary of saying anything now to be honest as apparently

" I'm calling people out as wrong "

Hey ho.......can't please at times......unless you agree then you are wrong.

Not how I thought things worked around here.


Honeybun
X

[peegeetip]

Hi

"once they have ruled out all other serious conditions"

Sorry why would we do that for just peri?

Surely we look for simple things first.

That would be like going to doctor with a chest infection from a possible cold / flu and the doctor sends us all for chest xrays, lab tests, chest or tb clinic etc. All totally unnecessary as you probably have a cold (but ooh you could have TB or pneumonia or even lung cancer if the cough last more that a few weeks).

This is similar to me going to the doc with
Worse PMS
Lower sex drive/Libido crash
Fatigue
Headaches
Mood swings
Memory issues
Given what informed ladies now know about Peri/Meno - I'd say it would be pretty obvious to anyone incl docs that someone presenting with those over a year or two is suffering peri/meno depending on their age.

The logic of going to worst case first can't be ok for peri/meno but not for a chest complaint in the examples above.
Surely you can see that?

All I'm saying is look at the simple symptoms in the context of peri/meno rather than "Ignore" them altogether as some of your are saying already happens.

But I guess I'm never going to convince some.

So next time you goto a doc lets hope they don't send you for extensive, intrusive tests first before seeing if its a cold first.

[Kittycat50]

I'm new to all of this and finding the debate quite interesting. The original question really clarifies the point that most woman enter peri without an inkling that it is the case and usually persevere with half a dozen troubling symptoms which do not seem to even raise the question of being remotely linked to the menopause.  I think that is of concern, especially when I reflect on the number of people I have seen who have been female   

With hindsight my first symptoms which started about 6 years ago (age 44 ish) were intolerance to alcohol especially wine (so discovered gin  ), palpitations (had an ECG as Mum has heart issues), very heavy and painful periods (prescribed tranexamic/mefanamic), insomnia (read trashy books in the wee hours  ), spells of fatigue (thankfully I don't work FT), brain fog/muddled words (early onset dementia concern ) very warm night flush (rather than hot), and recently what caused me to visit my GP with a request for HRT was the increasingly low libido - I felt too young to be giving up on a sex life!

It was actually doing my own research and finding this site which made me realise what was happening - the first time I'd heard the term peri-menopause and it's been a steep learning curve.  I'm just so grateful because it enabled me to go to the Docs to request HRT.  Thankfully she is one of the better ones and she suggested MM and to give some thought to which preparation I wanted whilst tests were done for thyroid/memory function and FSH.

A male friend recently declared he was surrounded by menopausal woman and in our conversation I asked if his wife was taking anything and perhaps HRT might help.  He said he didn't like that idea as there were a lot of risks and that it was just the odd hot flush after all  .  Thankfully I'm married to a man who is a little more understanding 

One of the problems I think is that it seems the symptoms don't all arrive at the same time.  I do think though things are changing - albeit slowly.  I'm just so grateful for the help and advice I have received and it is my mission to let friends in their early 40s know what may be on the horizon 

[peegeetip]

A male friend recently declared he was surrounded by menopausal woman and in our conversation I asked if his wife was taking anything and perhaps HRT might help.  He said he didn't like that idea as there were a lot of risks and that it was just the odd hot flush after all  .  Thankfully I'm married to a man who is a little more understanding 

You said what the husband said? What did the wife say? Or was he one of these AH's who speak for their wife? (AH= awful husband in case anyones imagination takes off - opposite of DH).