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Author Topic: Pelvic Pain  (Read 69478 times)

Judith57

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Re: Pelvic Pain
« Reply #105 on: September 23, 2014, 05:54:04 PM »

I see we have been renamed pelvic pain, not sure that warrants a  :) or a  :'( because pelvic pain is so horrible!

Hattie, I am in the midst of a major flare-up at the moment, I don't know what I have done to cause it. I have the cheese-wire feeling, terrible burning, I feel as if there is a large tampon stuck in my vagina at the wrong angle and also tight elastic bands around the tops of my legs and fizzing buttocks! I wanted to just run away this afternoon but there is nowhere to run to!

I went to see the pain management specialist this morning and he has increased my dose of amitriptyline and booked me in for two more nerve blocks next Tuesday. I am slightly wary of having more nerve blocks, and MJ has quite rightly told me to think twice before having any more, but to be honest I am in so much pain at the moment I will try anything.

Does anyone else have bladder issues with their pelvic pain?

I have been 'googling' like crazy this afternoon looking for answers. My google search history this afternoon makes for very odd reading: barbed wire in vagina, razor blades in vagina. I still find it very difficult to understand how I have ended up in this sorry state  :'(

I will need to remind myself that this flare-up will pass and I will feel better but I despair of ever feeling normal again.

Are there any pelvic pain sufferers out there who are now pain-free?
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Hattie

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Re: Pelvic Pain
« Reply #106 on: September 23, 2014, 06:44:30 PM »

So sorry Judith - this sounds like hell.

I know you don't like the H forum but there is a lady called M (in UK) on there who a few years back went to the same pain management Dr B that you are going to.

She posted one time that he gave her 5 blocks in all and that she felt with hindsight that it was too many. She doesn't often post but you will find her by a search on there. I sent her a pm when i went to the physio in Southampton this May.
She had been to the same physio for 2 years and she kindly told me about her. It is easy to see a professional and naturally think that they are going to help you because you desperately want them to. i found that this physio wasn't really listening to me and M confirmed that she had helped her to some extent but didn't always listen to her. She may be able to talk to you about more nerve blocks and her opinion of them and Dr B.

There is one other lady on there who saw Dr B if i can remember her name i will post here again - will look in a minute.

I had the one nerve block done which was sold to me as being diagnostic but also that the steroid element could improve things so i accepted it. Too late to regret it but i can't be entirely sure if it hasn't made me worse.

I really do not know what else to suggest but if it is of any comfort to you i have probably not taken the right decisions each time with this.

 :hug: 

 Hattie X
« Last Edit: September 24, 2014, 05:19:43 AM by Hattie »
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Judith57

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Re: Pelvic Pain
« Reply #107 on: September 23, 2014, 07:01:21 PM »

Thank you Hattie. It is all so confusing as my body is a stranger to me now much of the time. I definitely made things worse a few weeks ago by trying to sit on my office chair without the foam donut.

I spent over £900.00 last week going to a Harley Street herbalist as I was worried about the effect on my body of all the anti-biotics. I need to arrange some blood and urine tests but feel too unwell at the moment. I will try to sort them out at the end of the week, especially as I have already paid for them!

The Hope forum does depress me I am afraid, but I'm sure my story would depress others equally. I still have my head in the sand and my fingers in my ears somewhat....

Dr B only offers three nerve blocks, but you are right it is so easy to see them as 'Gods' who hold the magic cure and will make everything alright. He drew me some diagrams this morning explaining how the role of the painful bladder may be implicated in all of this. Did your pelvic pain start with a UTI?
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Maryjane

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Re: Pelvic Pain
« Reply #108 on: September 23, 2014, 07:09:04 PM »

Hattie re nerve blocks, the guy in France said there is a real danger of making the PN nerve worse as it can damage it and cause ateophy around the muscle sight, in other words almost tightening the area further.

Dr B is a pain specialist, and nerve blocking backs is very different to this nerve where it is located and the job it needs to do.

I spoke to another lady on another forum who had three nerve blocks and said it was to many and it made it worse, and ended up going to France for surgery. I am going to give until after Christmas and see how I am and will go to France as there is nothing other than physio that the UK can do, and the surgeons here are just not experienced enough, but that is a very big step the lady who runs another forum you and I Hattie are a member of has a lot of friends who have had the surgery and are now getting on with there lives, as does my physio have some of his patients.xxx
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Judith57

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Re: Pelvic Pain
« Reply #109 on: September 23, 2014, 07:25:10 PM »

I'll come with you to France MJ.... :scottie:
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Maryjane

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Re: Pelvic Pain
« Reply #110 on: September 23, 2014, 07:45:00 PM »

 ;D you need one of those dogs best medicine ever, night time snuggles with a dog are scrummy.x
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Judith57

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Re: Pelvic Pain
« Reply #111 on: September 23, 2014, 07:59:06 PM »

I might come and 'borrow' Bertie xxxx
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Hattie

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Re: Pelvic Pain
« Reply #112 on: September 24, 2014, 10:08:44 AM »

Judith

I probably shouldn't be giving other forum names so have changed previous post. I will pm you these other names on the H forum.
There is C who has seen Dr B - she is a success story - had a bladder problem and physio but she is in her 30s.
AS is another lady aged 60 who has seen Dr B.

My problem didn't start with a UTI - short story at 55 postmeno i had nerve irritation in one vulva was given 25mcg vagifem and amitriptyline and Eumovate cream by a gynae. The Eumovate did nothing and was stopped after 3months. Was told 2yrs of amitriptyline would solve it and then to carry on with vagifem. I found though that during this time things just got worse i gradually felt a lot of burning until one day i was sat out in the garden and came back in and said to my husband that i could feel as if something was poking in my vagina. After internet searching that set me on the pudendal route and seeing a doctor in Bristol who referred me back locally to a pain clinic.
Urine has been my enemy throughout this as it constantly keeps irritating the vulva nerves - i have tried various barriers but they also started to cause more irritation.
The 25mcg vagifem didn't stop things happening either.

I hope that your partner is supportive as you are on your own - my husband retired early because i was not coping physically and mentally. We  live miles away from family due to work circumstances and i have always been organised and just got on with everyday things for my own family also managed other illness/operations that have been wrong with me but this as you have said this floors you somewhat.

I am just another depressing story i'm afraid ! i will pm the names

Hattie X


 

« Last Edit: September 25, 2014, 10:11:29 AM by Hattie »
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Hattie

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Re: Pelvic Pain
« Reply #113 on: September 24, 2014, 10:30:33 AM »

Maryjane

The nerve block i had blew everything up painwise and physically to look at so i wouldn't be surprised if some of my muscle tightening now is due to it as i didn't have much before.

As you say it is one thing to give an epidural - which this is similar to - in the back maybe a bit more experimental 'down below'.

I enquired about going to France - just an initial email - i think they can help you with surgery if they find that the nerve is trapped  but even then it is a long unknown journey to recovery and you would need a physio back here in the UK to help you through it - you have a good one.

A big decision.
Hattie X
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Wanderer

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Re: Pelvic Pain
« Reply #114 on: September 24, 2014, 06:01:09 PM »

Wow! This is such an unresearched subject! I think in America they have  Pudental and Pelvic Pain specialists, I saw a very good video online,  grrr..., can't remember who it was, but he was showing a model of the pelvis and explaining exactly what happens to the nerves, tendons etc., when inflammation is present, either through injury or hormonal changes, made such sense!

Mine is slightly more weird (just had to be!), my pain comes up through the vagina, right up into the cervix, and then causes tightness and spasms, it makes me feel weird, nervous and agitated, like biting on a piece of silver paper, then it goes into my buttock, and aches like hell! Why?!!!!! The spasms then affect my bowel, God help me, I have seen so many consultants who are useless, not even sure a pelvic physio can help, as I am sure it is the vaginal atrophy that is setting the nerves on edge! Vagifem doesn't touch it. Are there any vaginal experts out there, aside from the Porn industry!!

With you always ladies!

PS. I asked Emma to change the title, as it is such a worrying symptom!

WANDERER. xxx
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Morwenna

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Re: Pelvic Pain
« Reply #115 on: September 24, 2014, 06:23:54 PM »

There is a lot of information about the causes of pelvic pain and some very good advice on a website called IC Network, however having scoured it, menopause and vaginal atrophy don't seem to feature a great deal. There is an interesting article entitled 'An Interview with Dr Robert Echenberg', here is an excerpt from it:

He's now helping to define a new pelvic pain syndrome, Complex Abdominal Pelvic Pain Syndrome (CAPPS), that will have many patients say “That's me! That's my life.” If you've suffered from a variety of ills associated with the bladder, the bowel, and the reproductive tract, this may explain the connection. It also adds new context for patients who thought that they were having recurring UTI's or yeast infections, only to be told that no infection was found. Dr. Echenberg and the newest research on chronic pain itself suggest that how our body processes pain messages is a large part
of the problem.

Patients visiting his clinic today, mostly women though he does work with a smaller number of men, range from teens through menopause. They have seen numerous physicians and many were told that it's “all in their heads.” They may struggle with what he calls the evil triplets: IC, endometriosis and irritable bowel syndrome.

These patients share a common set of symptoms from multiple organs, including:

     the bladder - frequency, urgency, nocturia
    the bowel – diarrhea, constipation associated with IBS
    lower abdominal bloating and pressure
    the vagina – itching, burning and sensitivity
    the vulva – pain, burning and/or itching
    sexual pain (entrance, during and/or after)
    lower abdominal pain

Many women suffer from general vulvodynia, vulvar vestibulodynia and several vulvar skin disorders such as lichen simplex and sclerosis. Pain in the clitoris (clitorodynia) and persistent genital arousal disorder (PGAD) is also seen. Many of his male patients also suffer from aspects of pudendal nerve neuralgias. Pelvic floor dysfunction, a clenching of the pelvic floor, is present in 100% of his patient population.


I'm not sure how relevant it is but worth a look? Hope this helps.

Morwenna x
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Maryjane

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Re: Pelvic Pain
« Reply #116 on: September 24, 2014, 06:46:01 PM »

Hi Ladies ( the miserable thread)  :-X.

Wanderer........the PN gives all sorts of different pain for different people, from numbness, burning, stabbing,shooting in the pelvis up the back, down the legs, one sympton or tho whole lot. The top top expert on the subject is in " Nantes" France a Professor, I have found by digging deep many of his papers. You have to think of your pelvic floor being in constant cramp like your leg, it is tightening around the nerve/nerves pinching it/them, now there are more nerves than the Pudendal nerve, however this is more often than not the culprit, and in a way it is possibly immaterial which nerve it is, the only different being the PN if you look at it is I control of sooooo much down there, and IBS sufferes are more likely to get PN, and IC will have the PN nerve involved as does Vulvodynia, your local GP and probably uro/gynae won't know about this nerve, as believe it or not they are not taught about nerves particularly in there training, and nureosurgeon don't really get involved in the pelvis nerves, that's why we are up a creek without a paddle :-\

I have just got back from London to see one of my three specialists this was the uro/gynaes I still have an infection UTIS that is now imbedded in my bladder wall, I have been put on Vagifem and local oestrogen for outside,he also found an old stitch from 28 years ago from my huge episiotomy is going to be left for now as the last thing we want to do is start cutting an already aggrivated vagina, when the specialist is pulling faces that resemble this  ???  :-\ you know all is not well.

I go to UCHL in two weeks this is the only pelvic pain clinic in the country, anyone can go there it has taken me seven months to get my appointment as they are so busy with pelvic pain , I saw one of the Doctors in February who told me to go onto his NHS list as I had major issues and self paying.

I had something called an MRI Neurography which is for all the nerves from the spine down and everything in the pelvic area, I have nerve impingement at L5 which is what controls the genitalia, and the PN nerve runs very close to all of this , as once one nerve starts firing off it gets others to join into the party, even if they are fine it is called " centralisation" which I also have, I get burning mouth syndrome and sensations up my spine also, as the PN sends messages up the spinal cord to the brain, which is why they peu put you on the likes of amitriptyline to try and break those messages to the brain.

If you also have lower back pain, that is actually pelvic pain as anything from the belly button down comes under the heading of pelvic pain but we are only looked at as the vagina, the back the brain not as a whole, which is why I am going to the pain clinic, as they have specialists from the brain downwards.

I used to get stabbing pains in my vagina up to my cervix, that is the very first real pain I had and that is a PN pain.

Where do you go from here ............million dollar question.........I have spent thousands literally, I have a diagnosis which has stopped me having lost lots of unnecessary investigations locally by docs who didn't have a clue...........is there a miracle cure for us all no........as nerve damage is probably one of the last unknowns still to theses specialists.........does physio help, honestly I don't know .............but if you think you have VA and you are not reacting to oestrogen then you have nerve damage...........and I personally think VAGIFEM woops VA is a form of nerve damage.

Sorry about the mistakes I know they are there but since my iPad had has been upgraded if I try and correct a mistake it looses everything I have written.

My daughter meat meet me after my appointment today and said I have to smile or be happy about three different things aday. She sent me a quote when this all started and I remind myself of it regularly " In order to rise from its own ashes, a Phoenix first must burn " .xxxxx
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Maryjane

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Re: Pelvic Pain
« Reply #117 on: September 24, 2014, 06:54:16 PM »

Morwenna.......I e-mailed Dr Echinberg when this all started, he spends three to four hours with his patients the first time he sees you as he says the pelvic floor is so complicated, as I have the awful pgad as well with this reached condition, the doctors at the pain clinic see this in per/meno women quite often, the rest go undiagnosed, so ther is felt to be a hormone element to it all, pelvic floor gets weaker from hormones changing, everything starts to go south even if you don't necessarilly notice it doing so.

If I lived there he's who I would see, he is starting to slowly retire, the PN expert who is a Professor of neurosurgery is in Nantes France, where a lot of British Ladies have been for surgery but it is a very big step, takes up to two years to see if it has worked, but others get immediate relief especially with the PGAD component of the complaint.
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Hattie

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Re: Pelvic Pain
« Reply #118 on: September 25, 2014, 11:16:09 AM »

I hope that your NHS pain clinic appointment goes well Maryjane

The most they will let me have regularly is Nortriptyline and Gabapentin - i had to drop the gabapentin as it was making me feel so bad - i am now just taking a low dose of Nortriptyline.
I have got Tramadol if the pain gets really bad but have avoided taking that so far - i expect that you have already researched it but they are reluctant to give opiates really as they cause constipation.

I wouldn't say that i am managing my pain that well really - which is what the aim is for you at the clinic - i am trying to keep a balance between putting up with some pain but not being constipated.
If i haven't emptied my bowels in the morning i now wait on an evening pill of Nor as i have found that if my body decides that i am going to 'go' after i have taken the pill with an evening meal it is a struggle. These meds aren't just targeted at the bad nerves unfortunately.

They have a system at our clinic where a nurse collects you from the waiting area and sits in on your appointment. Afterwards when she walks you back to the waiting area she repeats a bit of a summary to you that the consultant has said. Being me i first thought 'how nosy' but then realised that it was very helpful when after seeing the consultant i hadn't always taken everything in.

One thing i did find was that the letters back after an appointment were always an accurate description of what was said - can't say that for other letters i have had back from other consultants.

I asked the pain consultant for a diagnosis in writing should i need it - i got a letter saying that i was being treated for vulva pain - my husband says that it is not a diagnosis.

Basically though you don't really want to be going there at all   :'(   i keep kidding myself that it will 'all come right' as my dad used to say.

Hattie X

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Maryjane

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Re: Pelvic Pain
« Reply #119 on: September 25, 2014, 01:39:03 PM »

Must admit so far, apart from Dr B who's written letter was spot on, all of the others NHS and Private have all made mistakes in what was said, one I had aged me by ten years ??? Mind you the way I am at the moment 20 might be nearer the mark ;D

........and as J 57 and I are seeing exactly the same specialists including physio..........there are a lot of things that seem to differ 8).........quite often J57 has had an appointment in the am and I go and see the same specialist in the Pm.



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