Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => Personal Experiences => Topic started by: GypsyRoseLee on August 09, 2015, 12:57:14 PM
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Not sure if anyone else would be interested but I thought I might keep a brief daily journal on here charting my progression with taking the Pill for my peri symptoms which are random anxiety, bouts of depression and insomnia. Also get aching joints and stiffness.
Thought it might be useful for younger women whose hormones are just out of control. I took my first Pill yesterday.
Day One:
Took first pill. Felt there should be some drum roll or something. Felt weary and pretty down and a bit anxious all day but we travelled back through the night on Friday so no wonder I was so tired. Felt slightly nauseous but perhaps due to tiredness? I have found that if I am tired my peri symptoms are much worse, especially my moods.
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Definately interested thank you x
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Yip here too....all hrt I have tried makes me feel extremely wired and feel like that enough to be honest!!!
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That will be really interesting.
BTW, when I first started on the pill (pre-peri - it was for period problems), I had nausea at the start of a pill pack but it got easier as I went on. Maybe the body adjusting to something new?
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Brilliant idea GRL. I will be keeping everything crossed for you and follow with interest x
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Hi All
Day Two: woke at dawn which hasn't happened in a while butanaged to get back to sleep. Had that 'tired but wired' feeling all day. Wanted to nap but didn't dare rest. Felt rather flat and empty all day. Met friends for dinner and mood improved possibly helped by a couple of glasses of wine? Definitely felt unusually tired all day with accompanying headache. Could it be the progesterone?
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thank you, most helpful.
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This could even be your own system causing problems at this point, rather than the pill (or as well as, knowing how crazy our hormones are!)? I reckon it was a week before I had any true side effects - I nearly quit at the end of the first month, then things got much better.
Since this thread is very much pill focused, thought this link might be of interest to people:
http://www.avongpeducation.co.uk/handouts/2012/youngpersons/The%20pill%20ladder.pdf
NB: Rigevidon®, Ovranette® and Microgynon 30® are interchangeable
Millinette® 30/75, Katya 30/75® and Femodene® are interchangeable
Gedarel® 30/150 and Marevelon® are interchangeable (Taken from NHS Scotland).
B x
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True Briony.
I had a real mood dip last when I had a bleed unexpectedly ( hadn't taken any Utrogestan and it had only been 17 days since last bleed).
Had usual amount of bleed and mood plummeted. In desperation applied 2 x 50mg patches. Within 48 hours my mood had gone back to normal again, when typically my mood dip usually lasts 7-10 days.
Started the Pill on Saturday and mood has been extremely flat since...just don't know if this is due to the Pill, or my own hormones???
Day 3:
Woke in night with adrenaline jolt but got back to sleep. Felt extremely flat and depressed all day. Really quite nasty. Really hope my mood lifts soon and I'm not reacting badly to the synthetic progesterone in the Pill. I know I have to give it at least 3 months, but 3 months of this awful flatness and depression would be unbearable.
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Hello GypsyRoseLee.
Although I am not ' a younger woman ' ( thanks for that by the way lol ). I am following your posts with interest.
I hope you find the combination that works for you and it's great that you are keeping us informed.
Take care.
K.
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Oh Kathleen you are always so supportive and thoughtful I'd never want to offend you (I know you're only joking).
I feel pretty dreadful at the moment if I'm honest, but I intend to perceivere. It would just be so much easier if a nice scientist could reassure me that I am currently reacting to abc because of xyz. I could deal with that fine, soong as I knew what was happening and why. Just knowing it's my hormones isn't enough, too generalised and vague.
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Not that it's much consolation, but I so know what you mean. You just want 'proof'. If it was a broken leg, the X-ray would show a clear break - and the doc would then know exactly where to put the plaster and for how long it would be needed. Smiles all round. If only there could be a hormone x high/low pee stick like there is for pregnancy! X
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God yes. If someone could tell me categorically 'You are reacting to a change in your prog/oestrogen levels today, but at lunchtime on Wednesday they will recalibrate and your mood will lift' I would feel SO MUCH better about it all.
It's the unshakable fear that this time the mood won't lift which is so hard to bear.
Just wish I knew if the prog in the Pill is causing this, or is it my own hormones etc.
Can you remember if you felt this flat and depressed when you started Qlaira?
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The prog on Q is much more estrogenic - nearer the right on the ladder - so hard to compare. From memory, I felt pretty normal from early on in terms of emotions. It was the physical side effects I noticed more - especially the itching, fatigue and spotting (spotting often sign of low estrogen with a pill). Also, with Qlaira you don't take prog days 1 and 2, and only low dose til the following week, hence reason I can tell whether it's prog or estrogen likely to be at fault with me. I definitely react more to progesterone - either when it goes up or down.
Were you feeling fine on day zero then got worse days 1 to 3? Or were you feeling like this already when you first started the pill? I really don't think it's possible for it to lift you out of a low mood after only three days if you didn't start at neutral, if that makes sense? Try to hang in there. Still early days xx
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Yes, see what youean about being hard to compare.
Prior to starting the Pill, I had a withdrawal bleed arrive totally unexpectedly last Monday (hadn't taken my Utro) and by Tuesday night my mood had seriously dipped. Felt very low and anxious last Wednesday and Thursday but mood suddenly improved late Thursday evening. I was surprised as typical my downers always last 7-10 days.
But in desperation, last Wednesday morning, I had stuck on an extra 50mg patch so was getting a 100mg dose. Don't know if this is why my mood lifted quickly?
Felt fine again all day last Friday, but then travelled back through the night from holiday and only got a few hours sleep. Woke up feeling a bit wretched and shaky. Just not right at all. Took my 1st Pill Saturday lunchtime. The shakiness and tiredness stayed with me all Saturday and plus I started feeling pretty flat and depressed. Have felt flat and depressed since then.
But logically I can't see how taking just one Rigevidon Pill could cause depression in the space of a couple of hours for God's sake???
Aaaarrggghhhh. I hate this.
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If you were already not 100 % when you took pill one, I don't think you can (yet) say it is down to the pill. When I had a banging headache and nausea last weekend, during pill free days, it took two days at least for the new pack of pills to kick in. (And that's after six months of a higher estrogen dose). I reckon it's your own hormones still bubbling in the background? The longer you take the pill, the more they'll be controlled xxxx
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http://www.menopausematters.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,28810.0.html
This thread may be of interest to you guys. Seems to confirm the view that those of us in our early 40s need more estrogen than those at the more expected meno age. I wonder what gel dose equates to 3mg estrogen (ie standard pill strength). I know a lot of ladies get on well with it.
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Think it must have been some jiggery pokery from my own hormones, perhaps one final, Herculean effort to mess with my mind before the BCP blatted them into submission.
Day 4:
Stayed up late last night as was dreading going to bed because I was still feeling so horribly low and depressed. But as I got ready for bed I felt the depression shift and start to lift and by the time I had read a chapter of my book I felt much, much calmer and so much happier. This is the way my mood swings always happen. Slept well and woke feeling drained but upbeat and peaceful. Have felt very good all day, and I am very, very grateful. Not sure whether the Pill is subduing my own hormones already? But just very happy to be enjoying the respite.
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great news - it's a good feeling :-) my swings are exactly the same throughout the day - crazy.. X
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GRL - :hug: :great: :sunny:
Long may it continue x
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Hi! Gypsy rose lee I have been reading this thread with interest as im considering trying this route, just wondered which pill you are trying, I wondered what it was called as I know Briony (I think) tried qlaria..... may have spelt that wrong! LOL
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Hi Robotwars. I have just started taking Rigevidon, which is identical to Microgynon and Ovranette apparently.
Day 5:
Slept well last night, despite waking to wee, and had no problem going back to sleep. Felt slightly drained all day, but mood still quite light hearted and upbeat. Feel able to appreciate things again, and get satisfaction from everyday stuff like my husband making me a nice cup of tea or knowing I have finished a huge ironing pile. We're going away tomorrow for a couple of days in a hotel and I feel excited about it. I know it doesn't seem like much but when you have just gone through a week of feeling very depressed and unable to take any pleasure or satisfaction in ANYTHING to just feel 'normal' again is wonderful :)
As it's only Day 5 I don't know if my improved mood is thanks to the much higher dose of oestrogen that's in the Pill, or whether my own hormones are still mainly in charge and doing something of their own? I don't know how long it takes the Pill to shut down your ovaries and halt your own hormone production? But, whatever the reason I am just very, very relieved to feel much better these last couple of days.
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Can I ask what's the difference in taking the bcp and bio identical hrt? Isn't the latter supposed to be better for us? I used to take ovranette years ago before my breakdown and anxiety but was told I had to come off it due to my age and because I smoke, I remember feeling good with no anxiety or pms etc. I tried the mirena and just seemed to bleed constantly so had it removed and then went onto the mini pill. I don't know if any of this had anything to do with my breakdown??
I'm now on oestrogel 3 pumps and testim but not really seeing an improvement :-\
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Bio identical HRT is probably the safer option, but those of us in peri who have strong fluctuations have found the HRT tops us up, but doesn't control things. The pill on the other hand suppresses ovulation and is therefore more controlling. Theoretically this means fewer fluctuations.
Qlaira is a bio identical low dose BCP. It is four phase unlike most pills and is particularly good for people with heavy periods, especially those in peri. There are a number of pills available, so you can hopefully find one that suits your own body's preferences. Hope that helps x
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When using BCP for contraception they say as long as started with day one of period you would be safe from pregnancy. So I suppose that means not very long, however I am not sure how long it would take your body to adjust to consistent level of hormone, but they recommend the same for HRT and to try each one for three months before trying a new one.
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Isn't the hrt supposed to suppress ovulation though? Do you mean in some ladies it doesn't so the bcp is better?
Sorry for the questions but I'm still trying to get my head around how this all works, I was told that my oestrogel would stop my periods but for the last few months it hasn't and I'm already on 3 pumps?
Just trying to see if the bcp would or might be a better option and would help with the low moods and anxiety? :-\
I still smoke though so is it a definite no no?
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Isn't the hrt supposed to suppress ovulation though? Do you mean in some ladies it doesn't so the bcp is better?
Sorry for the questions but I'm still trying to get my head around how this all works, I was told that my oestrogel would stop my periods but for the last few months it hasn't and I'm already on 3 pumps?
Just trying to see if the bcp would or might be a better option and would help with the low moods and anxiety? :-\
I still smoke though so is it a definite no no?
I know Professor Studd says you'd need 200mcg patches twice weekly to suppress ovulation, so no, the normal HRT doses dont automatically suppress it. You also still need contraception when on HRT but dont need it on the pill. I think smoking would mean you couldn't have the combined pill (the one with estrogen in) especially if you are over 35? I'm no expert on this, so stand to be corrected. x
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Thanks Briony, so the bio identical bcp can't be taken if your over 35 and smoke? How is this different to the bio identical gels etc? Sorry more questions :oops:
So if I'm on 3 pumps of oestrogel how does that compare to 200mcg paches?
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hi what is BCP? x
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Birth control pill . ;)
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ahh lol
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Thanks Briony, so the bio identical bcp can't be taken if your over 35 and smoke? How is this different to the bio identical gels etc? Sorry more questions :oops:
So if I'm on 3 pumps of oestrogel how does that compare to 200mcg paches?
Here's the leaflet re Qlaira which is bio identical (Zoley is another b/i BCP but Q is more popular apparently. It says being over 35 and smoking are both risks. Not sure if that means you cant take it or not? I take it even though I have migraines with aura which is often a no-no for stronger pills.
https://www.medicines.org.uk/emc/PIL.21702.latest.pdf
200mcg is very high so I would guess it would be more than 3 pumps, but to be honest, I really dont know. Does anyone else? x
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Thanks again Briony :)
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Was unable to post yesterday as no mobile reception, as we're away.
Day 6:
Quality of sleep seems a bit thin and patchy. But mood still quite upbeat and good. Have noticed my appetite is a bit weird. Feel hungry much of the time but nothing I eat seems to satisfy me, and after eating I feel bloated and a bit queasy. I remember feeling exactly the same when I was pregnant, years ago so can only assume it must be hormone related again?
But the important thing is that my mood is still pretty good.
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looking very positive :-) think i may discuss this option on my next appointment.. is the pogestrone harsh with this pill? x
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Great news GRL - Generally sounds like it's going in the right direction. :) Do keep posting as it's relevant to so many of us (and also a less common discussion on here than HRT trials).
LW44 - If you look on the 'pill ladder' you will see that the progesterone in the pill GRL takes (similar to Microgynon) is quite progesterone dominant. (It is also one of the safest in terms of risk). What this means is entirely dependent on the individual. For GRL, who had progesterone withdrawal symptoms previously (if I remember rightly - not 100% sure?) a constant dose of this could well be exactly what her body needs. Others, who need a more estrogenic pill - or one that's more andi-androgenic - might find it's too much and have problems with it. As ever, it's all trial and error (combined with a good dose of patience, constant reminding that it's 'only hormones' and access to Gin and Tonic on tap, as required!).
If I do swap from Qlaira, I would want to keep with a less progesterone dominant pill (I know in the past I have had acne, hair loss and low moods with some progesterones). Qlaira is too new to feature on this chart, but would be under Yasmin and next to Mercilon, if that makes sense - so I'd try to keep to something like it, but with more estrogen. (I love how I make that sound so 'logical' and 'common sense' when the reality is that it'll take me ages to swap, I will be looking out for a million side effects, and no doubt end up with exactly what I thought I didnt want. ::) ).
I would love to know why there is no contraceptive pill - as far as I know - with the same progesterone as in Femeston.The ladies on here who take it seem so positive about it, so it's a shame it isn't available in other forms.
Hope you're all doing OK today, B x
http://www.avongpeducation.co.uk/handouts/2012/youngpersons/The%20pill%20ladder.pdf
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thanks briony
i would have to have a more oestrogen dominant pill then.. because of the progestrone intolerance. just trying to get all info before i see consultant.. not bad today at all.. in fact feeling that much better the fear clicked in again.. :-/ just watching corrie and riding through it :-) x
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Try to distract yourself. Sometimes if I feel it coming on, I phone up an easy going mate for a gossip, or even have an ebay splurge, simply to see if I can avoid the fear feeling! X
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playing online bingo.. ;-) my fear is that my life is ruined because anxiety came back. totally irrational.. but arent they all..x
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I'm keeping everything crossed Briony. It will be interesting to see what happens over the next few days, because I will be 'due' a mood dip soon.
I hope this diary will be of use to some people, I really do.
Day 7 (yesterday):
Felt fed up and on edge yesterday but really don't think this was due to hormones at all. Had a stressful day having to change holiday plans thanks to DH getting his diary muddled.
But despite the hassle and stress I didn't get that awful sinking, despairing feeling which I was very relieved about. So all in all am still feeling pretty good and positive. I have noticed I am getting quite headachey much of the time but I can take aspirin for that so it's not an issue.
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Day 8:
So far, still so good. Mood still good. Still got this slightly weird thing going on with my appetite but that's all. I'm expecting a mood dip within next few days so we'll have to see.
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My appetite far greater than ever been pre hrt/pill. It annoys me, but small price to pay, I guess. X
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Day 9:
Not a good day today. Even though I had plenty of sleep I woke feeling drained and jittery. Spent all day with that very unpleasant wired but depressed feeling. Kept myself busy with lots of little chores to keep the depression at bay. But couldn't take any satisfaction in getting stuff done. Just felt very flat and on edge.
Mood slightly improved during the evening because I made myself meet a friend for a drink so I had to cheer myself up a bit. Really hate this flatness feeling.
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I know it's easy for me to say this, as you're the one in the thick of it, but try to hang in there. It is so early in your journey. At the moment, you are probably only experiencing side effects. Most of mine stopped by month three. Strangely, day 8/9 was when I first got noticeable side effects. At present, your own hormones are probably still objecting loudly, which is t going to help matters. X
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Thanks Briony.
I know it's very, very early days yet. I have been wondering how long it will take the Pill to completely shut down my own hormone production? I'm thinking only a week or two because that's only how long it takes before you can't get pregnant.
I am slightly concerned that whilst the Pill might keep my mood on a much more stable level it will keep me in this rather flattened, mildly depressed mind set because of the constant progesterone dosage? I know progesterone can have that effect. Though I don't recall feeling like this years ago when I took the Pill.
I always got PMS on the Pill but only a few days before my bleed, so I now suspect it was caused by progesterone withdrawal.
Day 10:
Despite a decent amount of sleep again, I woke feeling I needed another 3 hours sleep and felt quite jittery and anxious too. Felt really quite flat and depressed all day. Can't feel excited or pleased about anything. Not pleasant at all.
Mood improved slightly this evening and feel slightly more light hearted. But it's like someone has switched off all my happy/loving/affectionate/contented emotions. Really hope they return very soon.
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Out of interest, what pill did you take previously? How does it compare on the ladder to what you take now? X
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Sorry again :-\ I'm just confused ??? So the bio identical pill isn't safe to take if you smoke but the bio identical gel is?? What's the difference?
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sure they will.. maybe its because flat yesterday that you were jittery this morning..in anticipation of how yiu weee going to feel.. i was the same this morning x
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Sorry again :-\ I'm just confused ??? So the bio identical pill isn't safe to take if you smoke but the bio identical gel is?? What's the difference?
There's risks with all routes. I don't know re the gel and smoking, but in general, pills are higher doses than HRT hence greater risk. For example, Qlaira is 2-3mg, most pills are at least 3mg or higher, whereas HRT tends to be 1 or 2 mg. Qlaira is kind of unique as it's b/i and a lower dose than most BCPs. You'd need to speak to a doctor I guess. In theory, I should not have the pill as I get migraines with aura but the doc said I could have Qlaura providing I was aware of the risk xx
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I was on several different brands over the years, and I'm pretty sure I even took Microgynon which is identical to Rigevidon.
Don't remember feeling too flat or depressed except when I had PMS each month.
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I hope so LW. I long for the day when I'm not aware that I'm 'not well' and don't wake up every morning checking 'how I feel today'.
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How are you feeling today? I guess when you took the pill previously your own hormones were different so it's hard to compare?
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Definitely feeling a bit brighter today, thanks, which is a relief :)
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Knew you would grl :-) you sound just like me. .. i say all the time " cant wait for the day i dont think about how im feeling" it will come for both of us..has done before :-) aybe we are just too self aware - if that makes sense?? also my consultant talked about a complete hystorectomy as suffered with pnd/pms.. not sure how i feel about that...has this ever been mentioned to you ? x
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Hi LW, no they have never offered me any surgery. It's treated as something of the very last resort.
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thats what i was thinking...very very last resort...
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Day 11:
Woke up feeling much more light hearted, and without the dragging weariness of the last couple of mornings, thank goodness. Felt quite upbeat and productive all day. Got lots done at work and really enjoyed myself. What a difference from the last couple of days.
Physically though I am getting a lot of aching in my right arm and it feels quite weak. Not sure what that is all about. And I have had some very, very light brown spotting and some mild period cramps.
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Day 12:
Slept well and woke without any jitters. Still feeling light hearted and with that lovely 'normal' feeling of well-being which I took totally for granted, until this peri menopause craziness stripped it from me.
Continued to feel good all day. Still getting very slight, brown spotting. But no headaches for a couple of days now.
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great news :-) looking forward to the "well being" feeling and i will savour it !
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Gypsyroselee your story sounds so much like my own, I can identify with all you say in your posts! Remind me what pill this is I might look into trying it myself? :)
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Hi, it's Rigevidon :)
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:thankyou:
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Day 13:
Still feeling very good. Centered and contented, which is so lovely. I am not especially confident that my current mood will last more than a few more days? But it does give me hope that I can at least feel like this whilst on the Pill. I was concerned that a daily dose of progesterone would make me feel permanently flat and low.
Still getting very slight spotting, but no headache now for 3-4 days which is good.
I have been offered the opportunity to go and see Dr Annie Evans which I am very lucky for. But at present I'm staying with the Pill to see how I go over the next 8-10 weeks.
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That's great news. I think you're beginning to find what i found when i switched to the pill - you do still have bad days, but there's a greater certainty that they'll not last long? Do keep us informed of how it goes. You are helping so many of us in that undecided phase (assuming you don't mind being an e-guinea pig!). I have bad two bad headaches this month, both lasting several days, one coinciding with ovulation time, the other on the pill free phase. Makes me wonder if my own system is still trying to have the last laugh >:( x
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I googled ::) rigevidon I know I know I shouldn't have but blimey it didn't half frighten me :-\ first things I saw was "woman dies" "woman has stroke" :o
I know Im being silly because if you google most things you'll find all sorts ::) just my anxiety kicking in I suppose :-\ ::)
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I googled ::) rigevidon I know I know I shouldn't have but blimey it didn't half frighten me :-\ first things I saw was "woman dies" "woman has stroke" :o
I know Im being silly because if you google most things you'll find all sorts ::) just my anxiety kicking in I suppose :-\ ::)
To put it into perspective, the risks of DVT on no pill are 3.7/100,000; on Rigevidon (older, second generation) it's 7.5/100, 000 and on the third generation pills (kinder progesterone) are around 12.5/100,000; being pregnant raises your risk higher than any of these. When I saw those figures, I felt more able to make a considered choice than when I just read individual 'stories'.
I still wouldn't 'choose' to be on the pill, and do worry about risks as I have extra factors against me, but for me, at the end of the day, it's about quality of life. Apart from this week(!), in general, being on the pill has massively improved my life for the better. This week it just feels like I might as well be eating sugar cubes for all it's helping! x
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PS If you would feel happier on HRT rather than the pill, you can still use it to suppress ovulation:
Ovulation can also be suppressed by moderately high dose transdermal oestrogens in the form of oestradiol patches or oestradiol gel. Appropriate doses would be a 200ugs oestradiol patch or 2 or 3 doses of oestrogel twice daily. Woman may occasionally feel a little worse in the first two weeks on this high dose, like an early pregnancy, but should be advised to continue as substantial benefit is almost certain if the diagnosis is correct. A longer term therapy would be a 75mgs estradiol implant inserted every 6 months. This like the patches and the gel will produce plasma estradiol levels of about 600pmol/L and abolish ovulation in most cases. However, women should be advised that this will not be used as contraception, as the appropriate tests have not yet been carried out.
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I can't believe I'm asking this at my age :oops: but do we only bleed if we've ovulated? I've had a bleed each month for the last 2/3 months and that's being on 3 pumps and no progesterone, I quite often get a sharp pain where my ovaries are and it's always on the same side, could this be me ovulating?
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This might help x
Can I Have A Period And Still Not Have Ovulated?
Having a period does not necessarily mean that ovulation has taken place. Some women may have what is called an anovulatory cycle, (meaning ovulation has not occurred). During an anovulatory cycle, women may experience some bleeding which may appear to be a period, although this is actually not a true period.
This bleeding is caused by either a buildup in the uterine lining that can no longer sustain itself or by a drop in estrogen. The main way to decipher if ovulation is in fact taking place is by tracking your basal body temperature.
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If you Google aspirin you'll find evidence of death and danger if you take it.
Agree with Briony that it"s all about quality of lifestyle. I'd have quaffed mildly radio active rat pee if it had stopped the mood swings and random anxiety.
Day 14:
Still feeling light hearted and 'normal' despite having quite a depressing day, due to various reasons. Plus I woke up with a sore threat and runny nose. Lovely.
I actually feel very chilled out, which is how I used to feel mid cycle before HRT. I am mid cycle now, but surely can't be ovulating because the Pill should have stopped that happening by now?
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Briony, it could still be your own hormones larking about, you know? Qlaira won't be shutting them down completely I wouldn't have thought?
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Hi GRL,
just reading your posts regarding the pill. I and wondering if I should go back on the pill , I haven't been on it for about 10 years though. I should probably know this but I don't - does it replace the oestrogen ? I think I need that as I have all the symptoms indicating low oestrogen . I haven't a clue exactly what the difference is in terms of what it is adding or replacing etc and why it would be better than HRT. At 48 my Gp would only let me take it for a couple of years anyway. I hope you are getting along Ok .
Pepperminty xx
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The three of us seem to be at different stages of the same situation. I would hate to wish it on anyone, but it's soooo nice to know this. Sometimes I feel there's no one left in my world who 'gets it' - it's very isolating, isn't it ?
In answer to your question pepperminty, basically HRT 'tops you up' but the pill controls/takes over. As a result, those of us with severe fluctuations have found HRT, whilst better than nothing, still results in poor symptom control. Some ladies have taken stronger HRT - usually 200 mcg patches, to suppress ovulation, whilst others have opted for the pill.
Hrt is more likely to be bio identical, with most pills 1 or 2 mg; the pill is rarely bio identical and usually 3 mg or higher. The main exception is Qlaira which averages 2 mg only and is bio identical. Qlaira has been super for me for over seven months, but recently I have suffered with headaches and low moods, plus increased itching (had this on it initially).
Hope this helps x
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Thanks Briony,
I was on the pill for years with no side effects. Perhaps this is the answer? At least temporarily. I never realised the pill had oestrogen !! You just take it and don't question anything if it works. I was on marvelon before so maybe I should give that a go instead of HRT? It is so difficult making a decision as I am scared of going back to square 1. It is good to know there is someone out there who gets it definitely. As Grl says I would take radio active rats pee if it worked.
pepperminty xx
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Thought this link may be of interest. It's related to severe PMS, but given that's basically due to fluctuating hormones, the science behind it is relevant to us.
Interesting to look at the 'medical approaches' - a third generation pill is recommended over a second generation one (Marvelon is very like Yasmin in terms of it not being an oestrogen dominant pill). If I do go back on the pill, I think Marvelon is the one I would request. Im also interested to see that even a 100mcg patch can suppress ovulation.
Hope it's of interest, x
http://www.pms.org.uk/assets/files/guidelinesfinal60210.pdf
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Thanks Briony,
I have had a little look and got the gist I think , but I am suffering from severe goldfish brain at the moment.
I am starting a new relationship and will need contraception eventually when the time is right , so perhaps this may be the answer?
why don't GP's suggest the pill as an alternative to HRT? I really am completely lacking any knowledge on this subject.
Will the pill stop the hot flushes and prevent vaginal dryness? Does it have all the beneficial effects of HRT?
I have only just started to get my down below issues under control and don't want to go back to the issues I had before.
Trouble is I really am unable to make a rational decision at the moment.
Peppermintyxx
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A new relationship, how exciting :)
Back when I very first saw a female GP and listed my symptoms she did, actually, vaguely mention my taking the Pill. But I immediately declined as I was certain I was too old at 42! She didn't push it and didn't explain that as a non smoker, of a healthy weight, I was okay to take the Pill through to my 50s.
I have never suffered from any problems 'down below' as yet, so can't say if the Pill has aided in that area or not? I must say my libido seems to have gone on holiday since I started taking it. Things work perfectly fine once I get started, but the urge to actually get started is definitely lacking.
I've actually had 2 very stressful days because we received some bad news yesterday which is distressing, plus I feel very under the weather thanks to a heavy cold. But my actual mood has stayed level with no horrible dips, or feelings of dread/anxiety.
This could all change though in a moment though, of course.
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Hi GRL,
Yes the new man is lovely I am very luck, but it is early days.
I wonder if the pill is the answer? I always thought you had to stop in your 40's ! If I could take it for a couple of years to get me over the peri stage and it worked that would be great. I have done a little research today and it does contain oestrogen, I never realised what it did contain when I took it years ago.
It may be worth a go? I will take the HRT until the meno nurse and see what she says. If I take it though, I will take it continuously so I do not have a bleed as reading previous articles by Dr Currie she thinks that this is acceptable as we don't actually need to bleed. I think the bleed was originally incorporated to reassure women that they weren't pregnant. I have been bleeding for 9/10 days at a time which is dire. I also have developed headaches , which I suspect is due to the dose being increased.
Anything is worth a go at this point!
Do you feel it is working for you?
I am sorry that you have had some bad news and a cold to boot.
Also it is cheaper than HRT! and I would save on the cost of Tampax.
God I feel foggy headed.
Peppermintyxx
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Yes, there is much oestrogen in the Pill than found in HRT, which I think is what we need because we are younger than average to be dealing with peri symptoms. Or it may just be that we are women who just need more oestrogen generally and just can't cope when it starts to decline even just a little bit?
When I spoke to my GP he said he had quite a few patients in their 40s who still took the Pill for contraception, and he was happy for them to be on it until at least 50. It is important though that you don't smoke, aren't over weight and don't have any medical history which causes concern.
I don't intend having a break between packets, either. My GP said there's no medical need to have a bleed at all. And if you're using it to control peri mood swings and anxiety then it's sensible to not risk any withdrawal symptoms and just run the packs together.
If you can be bothered it might be worth reading 'My Pill Diary' thread which I update daily. I hope this might help anyone considering the Pill.
But basically I started the Pill 15 days ago and was a bit up and then very, very down over the first week. But since the start of this week have felt really quite stable and light hearted, despite the bad news and nasty head cold.
But obviously it is still very early days. Though I assume the Pill shuts down your own ovaries/hormones production by the end of the first week, as you are safe to have unprotected sex after 7 days.
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Hi GRL,
I have read all the posts and it does appear that it may be working for you, which is great. I am coming round to the idea and have taken ovrannet and marvelon before. And another low dose pill I can't remember the name , but I came off it after 1 month as I was shedding bits of womb daily in the bath and got scared at the time and the GP did not explain that it would eventually stop and told me to stop taking it then!
As I have had no real problems in the past this may be an answer.
All I know is I can't keep on like this.
Pepperminty xx
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Hi,
just found the pill ladder and found that I was on loestrin 30 , and that is the one the caused the womb to shed daily. Marvelon is oestrogenic ( I have got you now Briony), and ovranette more progesterone based. I don't want acne , and I seem to remember being spotty at one point , but can't remember which pill it was. My GP explains nothing!!
Well I can't be any more of a nut than I am now , so Marvelon is the pill of choice if I go for that option. Fingers crossed .
Pepperminty xx
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Well it's working for me at present, but you know how my mood swings.
I must admit, I felt just like you before I swapped to the Pill. Halfway through our holiday my mood suddenly really dipped for absolutely no reason and I just thought 'I can't take anymore of this'.
After 4 months HRT just wasn't making enough of a difference to me. I think my own hormones were just too volatile for it to deal with.
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Day 15:
Feeling weary and fed up today but that's due to having a head cold. Otherwise my mood remains nicely normal and stable. No sign of the anxiety or that generalised feeling of jittery 'wrongness' that has come to define my peri menopausal nightmare.
The very light brown spotting seems to have stopped which is good. My hair is definitely feeling a bit drier these last few days too. But this is irrelevant so long as my mood stays stable and quite 'up'.
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Hi GRL,
I am so pleased that it is working for you. I agree there does come a point when your quality of life is no better, that one has to make a decision. I am so teary and feel worse than ever.
You know, the awful thing is that once you feel well, and then ill again, the contrast seems even greater as now I know what it is like to feel normal and look normal.
Without this forum I wouldn't know that I had any choices, or indeed that I was not alone.
Although as you know it is difficult to make choices or indeed any decisions when you are like this.
I have woken up looking and feeling zombie like and looked at the side effects of too much oestrogen and tiredness is one of them . Who knows?
Is the pill you are on more oestrogen or progesterone based? I am having a goldfish moment.
Your posts are definitely reflective of how much better you seem. I remember how despondent you were and although not perfect - but we aren't going to get that - you seem to be coping well.
Perhaps the pill is the answer for some, until 50 odd years of age and then once your hormones have calmed down a fraction HRT is the next best option.
I have all the physical symptoms back as well as the doom, Both together I cannot cope with. Briony had the aches as I do, can't remember if she had the exhaustion and fog too.
So reading your posts is so informative and definitely widens the options.
Pepperminty xx - I am thinking of changing my online name to foggy zombie goldfish
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Hi both, yep I definitely have the crashing fatigue and foggy brain too. I get a weird 'I'm here but not in the room' feeling too, if that makes sense? When the fatigue hits, it usually lasts hours, not days, and I often feel nauseous and shiver.
Although I've had a blip recently, I still feel the pill is a positive way forward in peri. From months zero to seven, my life has changed massively. The fluctuations that I still had with 50mcg patches disappeared as did the headaches.
I like the fact Qlaira is bio identical and has a less progesterone dominant progesterone. It's a great 'bridge' for peri, especially as it reduces bleeding massively. On the down side, the fact it's bio identical means it's not as strong - a 2mg dose is less potent than a 2mg dose of synthetic estrogen. That's why I think I may need a stronger pill (all others are synthetic and tend to be 3 mg or higher) or else a 100 -200 mcg patch (enough to suppress ovulation). I'd recommend Qlaira to anyone considering the pill as a stepping stone to something stronger if required?
In answer to your other question, the pill GRL takes is the same as Microgynon which is the first line to prescribe for most doctors, being cheap and relatively safe (levonorgestrel is second generation). It's on the far left of the ladder, meaning it's more progesterone dominant. It's the same progesterone as in the Mirena. The pills to the right are more estrogen dominant and may some allegedly have fewer side effects, in general, as they are third generation. The big but is that they are more risky in terms of DVT. The one I'd love to take is Yasmin - it is recommended for those who're worried about head aches, spots and hair loss, plus it can reduce bloating. However, there are more concerns with its progesterone than any of the others.
Do read what Nick Paney said about the pill and which are best for fluctuations/Pms - he is well regarded in the meno world.
Above all, I think the key things to remember are: everybody responds differently to the same hormone combination; what works for one may not work for another; the pill is not perfect but nor is it permanent - you can stop at anytime, unlike implants or a coil. It does suppress ovulation, so if taken back to back, it's likely to prevent the fluctuations us ladies in peri menopause so often experience.
Really hope you find something to suit you soon :)
Xx
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Hi again Briony,
I had the mirena 5 years ago for 6 months and they took it out as My legs swelled to twice their size and larger. I didn't know progesterone could make you swell like that.
So Marvelon is probably the best for me as it is oestrogen dominant and I have also taken ovranette before , but as so long ago I cannot remember much about it.
Thanks for your support
Lets hope we find a good answer before we retire to shady pines.
Pepperminty xx
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I am seeing the doc tomorrow and am going to request either Marvelon, Yasmine (did you read what Nick Paney said about this?) or 100mcg patches and conti utrogestan. Will let you know how I get on. Am not hopeful as I am such a high risk ! x
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Hi Briony ,
yes I read what Panay had written. It took me two go's as my brain is so foggy. I am definitely leaning towards the pill option. Interestingly I have used both marvelon and ovranette and they are both oestrogen and then progesterone dominant respectively.
I hope you get what you want, but it is balancing the risks with quality of life.
I suppose 100mcg patches and utro are another option. But as I am feeling so crap on femeston 2/10 I am scared to change to an even higher dose. I couldn't decide anything today- completely brainless and my speech has gone - can't find words - spelling atrocious - you have to laugh or you'd cry.
Good luck for tomorrow, let us know the outcome.
Peppermintyxx
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Pepperminty
Dont lose hope yet. When I swapped to Qlaira, which in terms of estrogen is fairly similar to Femeston 20 (ie generally 2 mg of estrogen) it took a good few months (or more) to feel the benefits. Looking back, what I thought were side effects/ signs it was too high, were actually signs my estrogen was still low, if that makes sense?
I found this just now which is useful to anyone interested in the pill: http://www.bpac.org.nz/resources/other/guides/bpj12_coc_extracts.pdf
x
PS Just seen your other post. If you're due to start prog tomorrow, it'll be interesting to see if you notice a difference. My blip came one day before my blank pill was due. It was as if my own hormone system was so strong it was trying to play the pill at its own game! In fact, it was that which convinced me I needed something stronger. 2mg is very low for the pill - most woman take 3mg or higher and many have no problems at all (basically because their ovulation is suppressed rather than the estrogen just topping them up as it does in HRT, I guess?. When I think of it like that, it gives me more confidence in upping the dose I take ???!) x
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Thanks Briony,
Great that you find all this info!
My hormones must have taken an almighty crash then !! ??? :'(
I haven't got the time or the finances to wait for another 4 months to see if this or another HRT will work. So like you I feel that the pill may be a solution. And the thought of no more 10 day periods would be lovely.
It's worth a try and if it doesn't work I can go back on HRT.
There are risks in everything and the thought of months or years like this is worth it to me.
Thank you again for your support - much needed and gratefully received.
Peppermintyxx
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I agree with Briony, in that possibly you just aren't still getting enough oestrogen Pepperminty? At your age I would think it very unlikely that HRT was giving you too much.
Day 16:
Well mood is still definitely up, despite this blasted head cold driving me mad. I feel centered and contented still. Very slight brown spotting has returned, but it's minimal and only noticeable when I wipe.
Don't have any excessive tiredness still either which is good. I have noticed a few blemishes on my face but nothing major. For me it's always about the mood and anxiety, and so long as that is controlled I can happily deal with anything else.
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love reading this grl ! x
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Yes, fab news GRL :cancan:
I am actually relieved all is going well as, being someone who encouraged you to try the pill, I'd have felt so bad if it had been a nightmare for you!
It'll be interesting to see how you feel at the time when you'd have naturally had a bleed. For me, that can mean a dip, but being on something stronger, I suspect you won't be affected.
Xx
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Thank you. I'm not taking anything for granted at all. It would be far too good to be true if by just taking one little Pill each night magically all my problems disappeared almost straight away.
One thing I have learned with peri is that it twists and turns you until you never trust the direction in which you're heading.
I don't think I will let myself have a bleed this pack, just go straight to the next one. I want my own hormones to have been thoroughly beaten down.
Please don't ever feel worried at talking to me about the Pill. Your advice and support have been so incredibly helpful. But I'm a big girl, it was my decision to take, regardless of the final outcome.
But if taking the Pill 'does' carry on making me feel like this over the next weeks/month's then that will make you (un a surreal internetty type of way) one of the most important people I have ever known, I think? Because I was in such a very bleak place for much of the time and I had started to lose my sense of myself.
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Good to see you are still making progress Fingers crossed !!!
Pepperminty xx
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Thanks for the wise words GRL, as always ;)
Went to see GP today at open surgery. There were so many in front of me for my doc that I was asked to see the locum. She was lovely, but ... as soon as she saw I've a history of migraines with aura, she said she would not personally prescribe the pill. I felt a right idiot sitting there with all my research only to get a total refusal ???. In fairness, I see what she is saying - if I had a stroke, she wouldn't want it on her conscience.
She explained that Qlaira is just about the same as Femeston 20 in terms of estrogen, so no point swapping. She was very positive about taking a high dose patch to suppress ovulation, but suggested giving Qlaira another month in case it's just a blip. My plan is to wait a week or so then book up to see my own GP! X
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Oh how frustrating for you. I hate seeing locum GPs.
Personally I would have thought if you were going to have any blips on Qlaira, you would have got them out of the way by now?
A high dose patch could be a good alternative though? When I was away a couple of weeks ago I had a random mood dip with some nasty anxiety. In desperation I stuck on an extra 50mg patch, so was getting 100mg, and within 36 hours my mood had definitely picked up.
I'd never had such a fast recovery before. Since this peri nightmare, once my mood dipped it stayed down for at least 6-7 days.
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Funnily enough, by accident, I took two pills the other day (reading the day of the week on the pack was obviously too much for me ::)). Within 24 hours I felt great!
Currently researching 200mcg patches which Prof Studd recommends to avoid ovulation and the PMS effect. At least the risk is lower, even though the lazy part of me prefers the idea of popping a pill! x
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Well that's quite telling isn't it. I know when I very first saw my consultant she talked in terms if my having a 100mg patch. At the time I was feeling better so declined it (stupid). When my symptoms came back I couldn't get an appt with her for over 4 months, so went to my GP in desperation.
He was only prepared to start me on 25mg, which did nothing. He then agreed to increase to 50mg which was a slight improvement.
I then finally saw my consultant again, and she said she wanted me on AT LEAST 50mg (with the implication that it should be more) but then forgot to give me a prescription! I couldn't get in to see her again for months, and my GP refused to increase my dose without a letter from her.
At which point I thought sod this and switched to the Pill. I might well have been much better in 100mg patches? But I am enjoying the economy of just taking one tablet a day (and it's free).
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Yeah, I'd have had the same logic had it have been an option (free pill rather than faffing with patches).
Assuming my own GP wont let me have the pill, I will definitely try higher dose patches. The nearest comparison you can do is 1mg pill = 50 mcg patch - however, doc added that the rate of absorption for the patches is much stronger as it by-passes the liver. That means, on 100 or 150mg surely I should be near the oestrogen dose of a standard BCP?
I'd still love to know why, in peri menopause with regular periods, we can take the combined pill back to back, but not have continuous Utrogestan?
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I don't understand why we can't have continuous Utro either? It doesn't make any sense?
I hope, for simplicity, that your GP does let you try a standard BCP.
Day 17:
Mood still really stable and 'up' despite head cold still lingering, and petty annoyances at work. I have noticed I am feeling a lot more feisty these last few days, which is definitely more the 'old me'.
Brown spotting still here with tiny 'bits' in it (sorry if that's TMI) which is a bit weird?
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Don't worry, I remember having lots of spotting, including 'bits'. Had random bright bits too, which freaked me out. Phoned doc, thinking it was a red light, but she simply said it was 'settling in symptoms'. She said if it continued, I needed a stronger estrogen. (That wasn't the doc I saw today!). From memory, it was always around the middle of the pack that it kicked in X
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Hi GRL,
glad you are still making progress.
About the bits - If it helps - I was on loestrin BCP and every night bits would be in the bath ( again apologies for TMI ) it's the womb shedding. At the time my GP didn't give me any reassurance or tell me why it was happening and I panicked and stopped the pill.
I had a thickened lining , so the pill was just thinning it out ( progesterone) .So it is quite normal.
It should right itself within a few weeks.
Peppermintyxx
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Phew, thanks for the reassurance. It's not physically troublesome, just a minor irritation. I really don't care about any physical symptoms, so long as my mood stays 'up'. I can deal with anything so long as my mood is stable.
I only have a few more days before this pack finishes and I intend to go straight to the next one without a break. But how long can you feasibly do this for? Anyone know?
Interestingly my boobs aren't swollen or painful anymore, despite the BCP having much stronger hormones. Yet when I was on HRT they were getting really uncomfortable at times.
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Hi GRL,
as far as I understand you can take the pill back to back indefinitely. My friend did. There is no reason for us to bleed at all whilst on the pill. My friend did it for years ( and saved a fortune on tampax!!)
Peppermintyxx
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Glad things are still going well grl :-) reading your posts you sound just like me ! " i can deal with any physical symptoms as long as mood ok " ive been bleeding on and off had headaches and still some tiredness.. but my mood is improving day by day so the rest of i dont bloody care ! xx
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Thanks LW44 :)
Day 18:
Thankfully mood still very stable and normal. This is despite having a very worrying day about a couple of issues at work which will impact on my future there. Expected a dip any moment, but it didn't come.
I just can't think that the solution to all this awfulness ( and it really has nearly broken at times) was something as straight forward as just going on the Pill. It can't be that simple, and I'm not that lucky as a rule.
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Lets hope you are that lucky and it is that simple!!
The pill has been much maligned over the years, as HRT I suppose. But if it works for you it works.
And it has come at a difficult time for you so that is good as you are more able to cope.
One good thing is that you haven't had to resort to the radioactive rats piss!!
If only life was like Disney, do the NHS do a prescription for that? - where are the singing blue birds and the fluffy bunnies ? What do we get - manic moods, painful joints and sore Hooha's !!!
Pepperminty xx
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I'm never that lucky Pepperminty ::)
But just trying to enjoy it for what it is right now.
Sorry you have a sore hoohah, by the way ;)
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If only life was like Disney, do the NHS do a prescription for that? - where are the singing blue birds and the fluffy bunnies ? What do we get - manic moods, painful joints and sore Hooha's !!!
Pepperminty xx
Wonder what Banksy's take on meno would be?
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Would love Banksy to do me a picture !!
So Banksy , if you are out there make my day !!
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You know how I said I'm just not that lucky?
Day 19:
Slept very well and felt absolutely fine all morning through to mid afternoon. Then as I was reading a good book I suddenly got a nasty jolt of anxiety, completely out of nowhere. It quite shocked me. Then a few moments later I had a stronger one.
Haven't had another one since but they've left me feeling on edge, jittery and without that contented and centered feeling which I've been really enjoying these last 8 days.
Something chemical/hormonal most likely is going on though because shortly after the anxiety jolts I developed a headache which is lingering despite aspirin. I also felt a sudden slightly dragging tiredness even though it was only tea time.
And, not wanting to give TMI, but things got intimate with my husband and the sensation was so intense it was almost painful and with very little 'build up' if you get my meaning? Quite peculiar really.
Can only assume this might be a surge of my own hormones? But I would have thought I wouldn't be able to produce any hormonal surge of my own? Surely my ovaries can't produce any hormones anymore because of the Pill over riding them and shutting them down?
Feel rather glum tonight. But I knew it was all too good to be true, to be 'cured' so quickly and simply.
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my god grl.. this is spooky - the similarities of our "symptoms" i found a few times when intimate..it was all too much and intense ! i was thinking maybe it was the oestrogen i was taking.. it freaked me a bit.. but i do rememeber before all this i was highly sensitive at certain time of month.. think it was just before i started period.. with yr other symptoms youve probably had a hormonal blip.. unsettling though i know x
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Look back over my Qlaira posts and you'll see how many early day blips I had. Trouble is, during the early stages, you judge things by days (even hours) and it's all very intense. After a while, you'll hopefully see things in terms of 'overall patterns' if that makes sense? I had very crappy days at the start (months 1-3)but not those hideous , days-on-end downers I had previously. Try to say to yourself, some form of effect, along with side effects, is almost inevitable for us sensitive peri girls. Today in some ways is good as it shows something is happening, you're moving on in the process, and that means success is that bit closer too xxx
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Thanks LW and Briony. Trying very hard not to feel discouraged this morning. Felt tired last night but really thought I wouldn't be able to drop off because I felt anxious, but managed it quite quickly.
I'm just confused that I could be having a hormonal surge, when my own ovaries are supposedly shut down? The dose from the Pill is completely constant day in and day out, so surely there shouldn't be any surges? Very confused.
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It takes a while for the pill to totally take control - it doesnt happen automatically. This month I am sure my own hormones are doing something in the background. I know that sounds crazy, but I am convinced. Today would be my natural period day, however, I've strung things out a few days as we're going away (ie not taken the blanks). Yesterday I had a headache and today I've started bleeding. It's very light, but there all the same. :-\
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Hi GRL,
when I remember your blips before this is not as ' blippy ' as you have felt previously, so there is progress. I agree with Briony , we do at the beginning judge hour by hour. But it is hard to be objective when it is yourself . Overall it has been great for you so far and we all have our bad days even before the peri 'menace' opause.
Peppermintyxx
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I wonder if I was being naive thinking the Pill will have already shut down my ovaries so I would never have another mood dip again? Obviously so. Ever the optimist me!
Briony, although it seems unlikely I think your hormones must still be in play to some extent hence your headache and now a bleed. That can't be a coincidence surely? With Qlaira basically piggy backing on top of your natural cycle I wonder if that's why you're getting the disruption now.
My GP didn't seem remotely convinced that the Pill would sort me out. But even he said to disregard anything that happened in the first month of taking it because my body would be adjusting to it.
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Hi Pepperminty, you do make a very sensible observation which is quite reassuring. This dip doesn't feel as severe as ones I've had previously. I don't feel as out of control and panicky and irrational. Do I 'sound' a bit more composed, is that how you can tell?
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Yes you do sound more composed.
I know myself when I am dreadful my posts are definitely tell tale,- you are much or composed.
As I am when I get my sense of humour back!
Pmintyxx
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Day 20:
Despite waking in the night and having the nasty ****les of anxiety, I managed to quickly get back to sleep. Which is progress of sorts. In the past there have been nights when I couldn't get back to sleep.
Woke early around 6, but this is the norm for me now since starting peri menopause. Felt quite jittery and anxious just lying there in bed so got up and felt a bit better.
But all day have felt on edge, anxious, unable to take pleasure in anything really. That lovely sensation of contentment is totally missing. Really unpleasant.
But, I could function although secretly miserable. It's horrible and draining having to fake smiles and force yourself to act like you're absolutely fine.
Really praying this is just a temporary dip while my body adjusts under the Pill. I can cope with the odd day, or even couple of days feeling like this. But it's the fear that it will last a week or more.
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Day 21:
Had a bit of a struggle to get off to sleep as I was fighting feelings of panic/anxiety. But I did manage to drop off after about an hour.
Felt a little bit better when I woke up, but still very far from 'right'. I've been doing some reading and basically when I am in one of these dips my symptoms have a specific name which is dysphoria e.g. restless anxiety mixed with depression and an inability to take pleasure in anything.
So, soldiered on with dysphoria all day. Suffering with a nasty headache which paracetamol wasn't really shifting.
Got home from work and felt extremely tired, almost nodded off on the sofa which is most unlike me. Then around tea time I started to feel gradually better. No lightning fast mood change like I usually have. Just a gradual lightening of mood and the dysphoria lifting.
I feel quite a lot better this evening.
This is a very positive development because the dysphoria only lasted 2 days. And the last couple of times before that the dysphoria also only lasted a couple of days.
Before, when I went into a dysphoria dip it could last up to 11 days, but was more typically lasting about 6-7 days, which was crucifying.
Hopefully this is what the Pill is doing. Much shorter dysphoria dips and not as intense when they happen?
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Also, still have brown spotting which has been constant now for about 2 weeks. Anyone know when it might go. I intend running the packets together. If that makes any difference?
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Day 22 (yesterday):
Slept well, and barely any anxiety when I woke up. Felt much better and stronger. Relieved and pleased that the latest mood dip only lasted 2 days again. Phew.
Am definitely plauged by headaches though and getting a few spots, which I've never had since my early teens.
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glad your sleep and mood is better, seems like we cant have everything then :( We were having a chat about 'spots' on another part of the forum.
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Spots could well just be a Levonorgestel side effect - hopefully will only be temporary. Otherwise good to hear things are going well. Will be interesting to see how it goes during the week you would have had a bleed. I've had a proper bleed this month - first in ages that needed more than a panty liner - and psychologically feel better than when I didn't bleed last month (had the blank pills but nothing came apart from random tears!). X
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Hi GRL,
I think the spotting can go on for about 3 months and then it should settle if it doesn't you may need a different type of pill.
Keep gong it appears to be working!!
Pmintyxx
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Day 23 (yesterday):
Didn't have any of that awful restless anxiety mixed with depression. But didn't feel all that great. Felt quite flat and despondant. Still getting headaches all the time unfortunately.
I wonder if the constant dose of progesterone is making me feel quite flat? Just can't really seem to get excited about anything or really take much pleasure in anything?
Appetite a but weird. Definitely reminds me of how I felt when pregnant. Hungry but tinged with queasiness and nothing tastes quite right. Think I'm sleeping more deeply at the moment too.
Still getting the brown spotting with 'bits' in. Nice!
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Hi Briony
This should be the week where I should have had my bleed, but I've gone straight into the next pack so will have to see what happens. I do feel flat though.
Curious that you had a more proper bleed this time around and yet feel better for it. Have you decided which way to go for the new regime?
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Thanks PM.
The spotting doesn't bother me too much, it's just an inconvenience really. How are you feeling at the moment?
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Hi Briony
This should be the week where I should have had my bleed, but I've gone straight into the next pack so will have to see what happens. I do feel flat though.
Curious that you had a more proper bleed this time around and yet feel better for it. Have you decided which way to go for the new regime?
I have to say I feel better for a bleed - rather than flat as I usually feel when I 'should' be bleeding, even though I have had no control over whether the bleed came.
Am hoping to see my own GP when she's back from her hols re taking the pill. DOnt hold out much hope, but got nothing to lose x
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Hi GRL,
I am a bit crap really , but that is the throat infection. I am getting all the signs of a period a week earlier than I should again , so no doubt it will last another 10 days , so I will be pleased when I go on the pill and that all stops = hopefully !!!
Hopefully you will even out on the pill soon.
Pminty xx
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I think I might have mentioned this earlier, but couldn't you sign some sort of waiver absolving your GP of any culpability?
Day 24:
Slept very well. Didn't actually wake until 7.15 which is just unheard of this last year. I definitely think the daily prog in the Pill sedates you more. This morning I just wanted to lie quietly in bed which is most unlike me. But I woke with yet another nasty headache.
Moodwise I've been alright, I suppose? Not good and not bad either. If I was going to describe myself as a colour then I'd be a slightly dingy looking beige. I feel quite flat inside and can't seem to feel any excitement. Laughing and giggling is out of reach. I can just about manage a smile at a push.
Brown spotting is heavier today with some fresh blood in it. This is really weird because I went straight on to my next pack without a break. So theoretically I shouldn't get a withdrawal bleed. But looks like I am still going to get one anyway!
Can my own hormones still be so strong to overide the Pill?
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Oh poor you, I read you had a nasty throat infection. I always find gargling with salt water is very soothing and anti bacterial. Plus lots of fresh lemon juice mixed with hot water and some good quality honey.
If your nose is bunged up then sleeping with an extra pillow helps too.
I hope the Pill stops these overly long period of yours. Though having said that I have run 2 packs together but looks like I'm still going to get a withdrawal bleed anyway, which really surprises me!
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Hi GypsyRoseLee
You mentioned about using the Pill back to back - surely this isn't advised? Has your doc said it's OK - remembering that GPs may not necessarily know the answer. I did read that it was OK for a month or two to miss a period but not long term. I mean if a bleed is expected each month during the Pill free days and you don't have one then what happens to the lining? Surely the expectation is that despite the high doses of progestogen there is still some build up which must be shed? I am absolutely no expert on the Pill ( in fact quite the opposite!) but just seems logical to me. Also I did read it is not advised except under supervision and perhaps you are confident about this?
Taking pill packs back-to-back
For monophasic combined pills (pills all the same colour and with the same level of hormones), it is normally fine to start a new pack of pills straight after your last one – for example, if you want to delay your period for a holiday.
However, avoid taking more than two packs together unless advised to by a doctor or nurse. This is because you may have breakthrough bleeding as the womb lining sheds slightly. Some women find they feel bloated if they run several packs of the pill together.
http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/contraception-guide/pages/combined-contraceptive-pill.aspx
Sorry really can't advise re the spotting - maybe try Musmnet as well as this forum as there will be lots of women doing this with much experience re the Pill.
Hope your moods stabilise and improve.
Hurdity x
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Hi Hurdity
My GP explained that there's no physiological need to have a bleed whilst on the Pill. It's more for reassurance. The daily progesterone stops the lining building up.
On Prof Studd's website he mentions that if you use the Pill to control PMS/cyclical anxiety and depression then it's pointless having a withdrawl break for 7 days because you will get total withdrawal symptoms from the hormones which is what you're trying to avoid.
But having said all that it looks like I'm getting a withdraw bleed anyway.
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Hi Grl,
there is definitely no need to have a bleed. Dr Currie has done an article regarding this I remember reading. Is there less chance of getting spotting on a progesterone based pill or an oestrogen based one I wonder? Or is there no difference?
peppermintyxx
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Thought this link maybe of interest
www.menopausematters.co.uk/article-bleeding.php
Peppermintyxx
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Hi Grl,
there is definitely no need to have a bleed. Dr Currie has done an article regarding this I remember reading. Is there less chance of getting spotting on a progesterone based pill or an oestrogen based one I wonder? Or is there no difference?
peppermintyxx
Not sure re estrogen pill v combined, but I do know that with the combined, the lower the estrogen, the higher the possibility of spotting. I had spotting most days for the first few months but now it rarely occurs. Did get a bleed despite taking the 2mg estrogen pill, which surprised me.
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Hi Briony,
wonder if I will get spotting on mercilon , I have started the pill on the first day of my bleed from HRT today . I haven't a clue what to expect , a bit scared really which is silly as I have taken the pill before. Just terrified it may not work and I will be back at square one!!
Pmintyxx
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Day 25:
Woke in the night and thought I wouldn't get back to sleep as I didn't feel remotely sleepy. But I managed it. Woke quitecearky with nasty little churnings of anxiety and didn't feel rested.
Felt very flat and depressed all day. No pleasure in.anything I did despite being taken out for a nice lunch and being bought a surprise present. Felt near to tears several times but hid it well I think.
Really hate feeling like this. These are days I will never get back. I really, really hope my mood improves quickly.
Still got the spotting and some of it was quite red. No headache though.
Felt slightly better during the evening but still very sad and down inside. Oh dear.
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Hi Briony,
wonder if I will get spotting on mercilon , I have started the pill on the first day of my bleed from HRT today . I haven't a clue what to expect , a bit scared really which is silly as I have taken the pill before. Just terrified it may not work and I will be back at square one!!
Pmintyxx
Lol I hadn't read this when I replied to your other post. You will see I had exactly the same fear! Spotting eased within three months. X
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Day 25:
Woke in the night and thought I wouldn't get back to sleep as I didn't feel remotely sleepy. But I managed it. Woke quitecearky with nasty little churnings of anxiety and didn't feel rested.
Felt very flat and depressed all day. No pleasure in.anything I did despite being taken out for a nice lunch and being bought a surprise present. Felt near to tears several times but hid it well I think.
Really hate feeling like this. These are days I will never get back. I really, really hope my mood improves quickly.
Still got the spotting and some of it was quite red. No headache though.
Felt slightly better during the evening but still very sad and down inside. Oh dear.
Hate to think of you feeling like this. Do remember how early it is - DR Currie talks of having to have a settling in phase which allows your system to reset. That's where you are now. If it doesn't ease by the second month, remember there are many other pills to try. All is not lost. Yours suits some but others find it affects their mood - search Microgynon on Mumsnet. If you fall into that category, at least you know your body prefers a more estrogen dominant pill. Most people find one that suits - but not always first time.
Hang in there and keep posting. We get it and get you. We're all in this meno chaos together ! X
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Aw thanks Briony. You are always so supportive and the voice of reason.
Day 26:
Slept better and woke quite late (well 7am). Felt calmer inside. Still felt a bit sad but not the awful deadening depression of yesterday. As the day went on my mood improved even more and I felt quite lighthearted, though felt drained. When I have had an episode of depression and then recover I always feel so drained. Like I'm recovering from a nasty trauma or shock.
Still getting the brown spotting but no headache thankfully. Feel incredibly relieved to feel lighthearted again but God these ups and downs are really taking their toll on me.
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Day 27:
Slept well right through from 11.15 to 6.45am, with no waking so really can't complain. Woke feeling rested and calm, basically 'normal'.
Felt good all day. Calm and centered and quite productive. Getting satisfaction out of getting things sorted at work. Looked forward to coming home and putting my feet up after cooking a nice dinner. I know it doesn't sound all that special but these sort of 'normal' days don't happen that often for me so I really treasure them so much.
The brown spotting is STILL here but very slight. I'm wondering if my nasty, sudden anxiety and depression these last few days were somehow linked to my natural cycle because it was when I 'should' have had a withdrawal bleed (but didn't because I went straight onto the 2nd pack).
But the brown spotting did get more for 3 days or so, with some fresh blood too. Plus a few nasty headaches and of course the sudden anxiety/depression.
B
A couple of years ago before I twigged I was peri I noticed that my PMS was getting much more severe and I was struggling with a real deadening depression for 10-12 days per month.
Really enjoying feeling 'good' again and I'm hoping I am more emotionally stable on the 2nd packet.
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That's good news. A decent night's sleep helps to maintain a sense of perspective. When I've got into insomnia phases, I've found I blow everything out of perspective. Definitely makes a pants day even worse!
I'm pretty sure my spotting lasted for a few months, but no more. Funnily enough, despite being on the pill, I'm convinced my own cycle was up to silly buggers this month. I bled the day before the blank pills were due.
Out of interest, does anyone know anything about Nuvaring? (Vaginal combined contraceptive ring). Does it serve as HRT as well as a contraceptive? I know the side effects are meant to be less than the pill ... is it less of a risk too? X
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Day 28:
Still feeling good. Just nicely normal. This is how I want to feel every day. It's a double edged sword though because I don't know how long it will last? Another hour or another week?
Still got the brown spotting though. But that's a small price to pay.
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Day 29:
Slept very well. Then pretty much the same as yesterday. Infact I think I feel better than I did yesterday. I truly feel like 'me' again, and I can't tell you how wonderful that feels.
Still got the brown spotting. Plus I am about 11lbs heavier than I was 2 months ago.
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That's so good to hear. Don't worry about the spotting - I think it's quite normal for first few months . Keep posting as others in our position will find it so useful x
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So glad things are still going well for you, hope it continues :)
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Thank you both x
Don't want to bore anyone with my daily ramblings. But it will be interesting to see how this second month compared to the first.
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Definitely not boring me ;) :)
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I do hope this keeps on improving for you . Fingers crossed,xxx
Peppermintyxx
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Thanks guys :)
Day 30:
Another good day. Mood still upbeat thank goodness. Unfortunately I feel like I'm slightly tensed, just waiting for the dysphoria to re appear.
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Day 31:
Same as yesterday. Feeling good and quietly happy. Even managed a nap this afternoon, I felt so relaxed. It's been very nearly a week now of feeling 'normal' so it's very likely I'll be dipping shortly, as that seems to be the pattern. But so be it, I guess.
Still got the spotting, and I don't like being nearly a stone heavier than 2 months ago. But once I feel really confident my mood has stabilised properly I will make an effort to diet and exercise.
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I am in the same boat re weight. Hate it and I am scared it will continue. Been same weight for last 20 years so bit of a shock to the system. With me, I think it's increased appetite rather than the actual tablet?
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Hi ,
I noticed on the higher dose of oestrogen - the Femeston 2/10 I felt hungry all the time and just wanted to eat! I was only on it for 3 weeks but I put on weight! But with the lower dose I have actually lost weight and most of it has gone from my middle , which is where women traditionally put on weight during the meno .
I also think that the pill increases appetite due to the increase in hormones. Still it is a trade off I suppose - deep joy- it is never simple.
Peppermintyxx
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Day 32:
Slept badly last night, took hours to drop off. Nothing to do with hormones though. Just my fault for having a strong coffee at about 8pm. Idiot.
Another good day today though, hurrah. It's been exactly a week now that I have been feeling back to normal. So chances are it could all dip very soon. But I have really enjoyed this last week so much, I can't tell you.
Halfway through the second pack now, so wondering if it's taking much more control now?
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Even if you do have a dip, at least you know you 'will' come back out of it. I think that's the biggest difference for me between the pill and pre pill? X
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Hi Briony. Yes, I think you're right. I don't feel 100% but I definitely feel much stronger emotionally than I did pre HRT, and then when on HRT. I had good days and weeks then but it always felt like it was slipping through my fingers.
Day 33:
Slept poorly, but not hormones I don't think? Mainly because my DH was out and I was half listening for him coming in.
But mood is still very good. Not much else to say really. Just really hoping this continues.
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Day 34:
Didn't sleep well last night, and could possibly be hormones? My sleep felt a bit thin and patchy and woke before 6 not feeling sleepy at all. And I know hormones do that to me?
But felt fine all day, mood still very good. But having said that I started to feel very slightly on edge this evening. Wouldn't surprise me if a mood dip is pending?
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Have you noticed any change in mood when your sleep has been bad the night before?
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Hi Estelle. Yes, the quality of my sleep has a huge bearing on my mood the next day usually.
Day 35:
Actually slept better last night and didn't wake until nearly 7am. And when I woke I felt nicely sleepy. Not that instantly, drily awake and wired sensation.
However my mood hasn't been as good today. Nothing dramatic, but that lovely centered and contented feeling is absent. And I feel slightly on edge and slightly anxious. I can cope and tolerate it okay, but it's not pleasant. But I don't have that dreadful deadening depression of a couple of weeks.
It all feels a bit weird and off. When I was feeling very good 2-3 days back I was feeling almost too good. I was getting an overly satisfied feeling of contentment from doing something very mundane lime making my DD's bed, for goodness sake. I felt almost too dreamy and contented. Does anyone else experience anything like this?
I have just counted back, and out of the last 35 days of being on the Pill only 12 of them (including today) have been bad/down days. So that's quite positive.
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Yep, I get those 'up' days too, usually related to domestic contentment ie never when I am doing something amazing, but something mundane like serving an edible looking meal (admittedly a rarity). I feel like I could conqueror the world and want to run around making daisy chains (not at all 'me').
Then a day or so later, I'll be wondering where the hell that person went. She's suddenly been replaced with a strange woman secretly convinced she's about to have a heart attack who sees the pleasure in nothing.
I always assume it's when my oestrogen is high that I feel so good (ie, the 'normal' , pre hormonal chaos, ovulation feeling). The next day must be the sudden dip afterwards?
Either way, the only good thing is that neither lasts long!
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Phew, so not just me?
I also think it must be heightened oestrogen levels. Probably something to do with nesting instincts and Mother Nature wanting us to make a baby etc. Because I get inordinate levels of satisfaction from doing really dull domestic stuff like folding laundry. It's not normal, is it?
But I don't see how I can have heightened oestrogen now, when I'm on the Pill. I should have the same level every day surely.
Day 36:
Slept okay. But didn't feel good today at all. Felt jittery, on edge and with that tinge of dread. II just slogged through it all day, but it's quite horrible.
Felt tired all day. Still getting the brown spotting too.
Felt a bit better towards evening but that's pretty standard isn't it. Hope it passes soon.
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....Because I get inordinate levels of satisfaction from doing really dull domestic stuff like folding laundry. It's not normal, is it?
:rofl: no it isn't GypsyRoseLee!!! This really made me smile :)
Hope you feel better tomorrow
Hurdity x
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Hi GRL,
How do you feel you are doing on the pill? Do you feel better overall? I suppose regardless of hormones there are variables in life, but you know yourself that the feelings are quite distinguishable from normal " I feel I bit low / tired / moody."
It is harder coping with spotting and other physical side effects when you are emotionally low.
Peppermintyxx
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Hi PM
Yes, I think overall I have felt better on the Pill than HRT. It feels more stable. And my 'good' days and weeks feel more stable than my 'good' times on HRT. Also since being on the Pill my mood dips haven't lasted nearly as long. Usually between 2-4 days. Back on HRT my mood dips were lasting a week at least, and once as long as 11 days which was crucifying.
So, yes in balance I think the Pill is better for me because even when I have a down day, or 3, it doesn't feel as frightening or as overwhelming as before.
Day 37:
Was very sleepy last night and fell asleep on the sofa, and suddenly felt much better again.
Woke up this morning feeling nicely rested. Felt much better again. Much more upbeat and with that nice, normal contented feeling again. Went shopping with my Mum and ended up really giggling. Over the last 2 years I have so rarely felt able to giggle, I had nearly forgotten how.
I am very pleased and very grateful that my mood dip only lasted 2 days this time. Interestingly (or perhaps not) my brown spotting was heavier today with some fresh blood in it. I wonder if my body is trying to have a period, and my mood dip of the last 2 days was a sort of PMS? I just don't know.
But feeling much better. Hurray!
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Sounds like it's really working for you :yipi: I so wish they'd let me try the pill >:(
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Estelle, have you asked about Qlaira? The estrogen in it is the same as HRT so, I presume, it has the reduced risk of HRT (compared with the pill)?
Alternatively, have you thought about taking a pill-sized dose of HRT eg 200mcg patches or 4-5 pumps of gel daily? Apparently this will suppress ovulation in the same way the pill does by tricking your body into thinking you're pregnant. x
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I did ask about it in my recent email to prof studd and as usual he ignored the question >:(
I will ask at my new appointment with Annie Evans
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Day 38:
Good sleep again. Mood very good again. Feeling centered and contented still. Am still surprised my mood dip.only lasted the 2 days but it gives me a lot of hope.
This morning I had some quite heavy spotting with fresh blood in it, and some mild cramps. But have no way of knowing if is a period of some sort?
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Hi Estelle
I think it's fairly early days for me as regards the Pill. I know Briony felt it was 3-4 months before it really kicked in for her.
But, I have spent nearly 2 years getting into this awful peri nightmare and I think from a psychological point of view it's going to take a good while for me to fully recover.
I have experienced some truly dark days and the anxiety has been crippling at times. So I won't just be bouncing back to normal without a backward glance. Even if the Pill is now controlling my mood much more effectively, I'm still haunted by what I have been through ( hope that doesn't sound too dramatic).
I will keep my fingers crossed that you get some real support and consideration from Annie Evans. She was to be my next port of call if I felt the Pill wasn't working. And like Briony says I would have been asking for very high oestrogen dosage.
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Hi GRL
good news things are evening out and in the up ! im feeling quite the same..things slowly improving on the oestrogen only :-) like you have said.. i feel the same haunted by how ive felt... its hard to describe.. its fear of the fear i suppose... now if that can just shift ... but presume that will take time.. xx
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Hi LW44.
Yes, it's definitely being really frightened of feeling frightened, if that makes sense? It really does mentally scar you, and scars take a long time to fade.
And I suppose the longer you have suffered with peri anxiety and depression the bigger and deeper the scars, and the longer it will take to heal.
This whole experience has been devastating for me, and will echo for a long time. But I never thought I would properly recover from PND all those years ago, but I did, and for 10 years afterwards never gave it a second's thought really.
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yes your right... ive only been full blown suffering the anxiety since end of may but feels like a lifetime.. although i must admit since pnd 10 years ago i do have a phobia of "mental" illness.. at the moments its like im tip toeing through the days.. like i cant really look forward to anything." just in case.." were going away for the weekend.. and i am really looking forward to it.. but on the other hand i darent think about it.. "just in case.. " not carefree enough yet..
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Day 39:
Another good day. Feeling quietly content and cheerful. Nothing overt, just the old 'normal' me. But God it feels so wonderful.
Still having slightly heavier spotting, needing to use a panty liner rather than just noticing when I wipe.
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You will recover though LW44, just like you did from PND, like I did.
I remember when I was recovering from PND U had several false starts, then for a long time thought I had recovered but looking back I obviously hadn't. It took a long time, and there were faint echoes for a good 12 months.
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Hi LW44.
Yes, it's definitely being really frightened of feeling frightened, if that makes sense?
That sums it up perfectly !
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It's so cruelly ironic isn't it Briony? You fear the fear!
Day 40:
Another good day. Slept well. Mood still calm and contented. Not much else to say really. Really happy at the moment.
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This is great to hear - long may it continue! I think the biggest step forward for me was when I had been on the pill long enough to realise a bad day was a blip, and nothing worse. Prior to that, a bad day could so easily turn into a bad week or fortnight ...
Guess we do have to remember as well that even 'normal' people have times when they feel down. All this hormonal crap makes it so easy to lose a sense of perspective! X
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All too true Briony. One of the scariest aspects of hormonal anxiety and depression is that you totally loose all perspective.
Day 41:
Same again. Good day and nice, normal mood. One thing I haven't mentioned much is that my skin hasn't been very good since being on the Pill. I've been getting a lot of spots and blotches most days and my hair feels drier. Assuming this is the progesterone? Though I never had this years ago when I took the Pill ten years ago.
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Which pill did you take previously? Levonorgestrel is one of the most androgenic progesterone so, so may well cause spots. Some people even get them with it via the small dose in the Mirena. Hopefully it will ease with time. How's the spotting? I had random spotting today - day 17 - first time in months. Hormones!! >:(
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I tried several different brands, and I know Microgynon was one of them. Don't remember any issues with spots though? It's really annoying. I've ramped up my skin care routine to try and help but tonight I have another painful one starting on my forehead. I feel like a teenager! I really hope my body adjusts quickly.
Still getting the brown spotting every day, and plenty of clear discharge stuff (sorry if TMI). One good thing is that I haven't had swollen, tender breasts at all which is a relief.
How odd that you have spotting again now? These damned hormones just won't due will they? Have you made any decision yet about the vaginal ring?
Day 41:
Still good news. Mood very good. Had quite a stressful day at work but not even a twinge of nerves or anxiety. I don't have the words to express how wonderful it feels to just feel 'normal' like this. I don't feel ecstatically happy or anything. I just feel normal, and like 'me' how I used to be. Unless you have suffered with hormonal anxiety and depression you can't really appreciate how frightening it is when your hormones have such a power over you.
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That's strange it didn't affects your skin previously. Possibly because your own hormones were less erratic then? I recommend Clinique's range for problem skin. It has helped me a lot in the past when my skin has erupted. Think it's called Anti Blemish?
Really not sure what my body's playing at. Have had quite heavy spotting for 36 hours, dull head ache and dizziness, just like I get when I have a normal period, yet it's only half way through pack. I think spotting is a result of too little estrogen - usually told to take a stronger pill - but doubt I would be allowed to. I did investigate the ring. It's an effective contraceptive method, but apparently very prog dominant so not great as a form of HRT. I'd still like to try a stronger patch, one strong enough to suppress ovulation, but would like to hear from someone who's had success with it first!
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I'm wondering whether to ask for a more oestrogen rich Pill when I next see my GP? Not only am I more spotty but my hair is drier and coarser too, which I think is high progesterone?
When I was on HRT my hair was really glossy and lovely.
I don't know of anyone on a 200mg patch unfortunately. But I can only think it would be a good thing? Maybe start on 100mg and slowly increase 25mg at a time?
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Day 42:
Mood still very good. Did a quick tally and out of the last 19 days I have only had 2.5 days of depression and anxiety. This is pretty good I think.
But the constant little spots, and the weight gain ate getting to me. Obviously there are no calories in the Pill per se, but my appetite has definitely increased. I am now nearly 14lbs heavier than I was 4 months ago and my clothes are too tight.
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I really, really empathise. I have been a size ten all my adult life. Last week, I went to get some new work clothes as mine were too tight. I picked up a 12 and, if anything, I needed a 14. I was devastated as I have always been quite body confident as an adult and now feel enormous. (I am not saying 14 is enormous by any means, but to go up two dress sizes - any size - does knock your confidence). I have also gone from a 34a to a 36/8 B/C (depending on day of month).
In the two years that I had severe hormonal symptoms but no medication, if anything, I lost weight. This weight has gone on since I started taking additional hormones. I exercise and still eat the same boring healthy vegetarian diet I have always eaten, so I can only blame the pill. It seems to have particularly gone on my 'knicker area' if that makes sense (bum, tum and hips). >:(
That said, when I was taking no hormones I felt crap and had no quality of life. Would I really want to go back to that place again?
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We're both very similar (again). I'm usually a size 12 and quite tall, so always look fairly slim. But my boobs would inflate each month!
Then, like you, when all this peri nightmare started I actually lost weight. The hormonal fluctuations really affected my appetite. I suddenly lost the taste for anything sweet and sugary. Only really wanted very bland, plain food.
Plus there was the almost daily diarrhoea which no doubt aided the weight loss. I lost a dress size and was a size 10 and my boobs were definitely shrivelling. They stopped swelling each month.
But, like you say I was desperately miserable and anxious most of the time. Some days and weeks were very black.
Then I started HRT and the weight crept back a bit. But I was still getting lots of days and weeks when I was still very low and suffering with anxiety, which quelled my appetite a lot.
But, since being on the Pill I feel like I have ballooned. And lime you it's all on my tummy and hips. Nice. Though strangely my boobs haven't got any bigger than usual?
I am now definitely a size 14 which I know isn't 'big' but for me it feels bloated and wobbly. I only have one pair of jeans which fit now and I'm reluctant to go and buy a few pairs in a 14.
Not sure if I need to just accept and embrace this larger me and just go with it. It is still infinitely better than being skinnier but thinking about stepping under a bus.
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Day 43:
Same again. Enjoyed another good night's sleep and didn't wake until 7am then happily dozed until 8.30am. A simple pleasure, but so wonderful compared to the times I was waking before 5am, like a meerkat and with dread rolling around in my chest.
Felt happy again all day. Very balanced. I can go for periods of time now just not even thinking about my hormones, and forgeting how I'll they have made me.
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It's so uplifting to read your posts, GRL.
I am having a slight blip at present - spotting, nausea and the chills mid cycle. The weirdest thing is, all three of my close colleagues came on today. It's like my body wanted to synch, despite the pill!
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Thanks Briony. I always sorry that I'm boring people and keeping a diary is a bit narcissistic? Have decided I'll keep going to Day 100 then reassess.
That's really weird about your mid cycle symptoms? Both my daughters now have periods and I was wondering what effect that would have on me?
When we were in holiday last month, my friend started her period and mine suddenly started several days early. I blamed her :-\
Day 44:
Still good news here. Feeling rested and balanced. Have just finished the 2nd pack, but have gone straight into pack 3. Wondering if I might get any hormonal symptoms over next few days as my body 'hopes' to have a withdrawal bleed?
Still get spotting 'downstairs' and on my face. Annoying.
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I think it would be great if you kept going, even if you don't have time to post every day. I've noticed a number of people refer to this thread in other posts - in fact, I did earlier today! X
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Iam eased if it can help anyone on here. I guess I could do a weekly bulletin pretty soon, instead?
Day 45:
Very good again. And surprisingly skin has suddenly cleared up! Don't laugh, but when I woke this morning my face 'felt' different. Looked in mirror and skin was so much clearer and 'felt' much better to the touch. Less oily and quite cool. Lately it has felt oily and itchy and flushed.
Mood still very good, upbeat and happy. Getting some nausea but unsure if this is hormonal or something else?
Just feeling so much better. It's like a group of brain surgeons have re wired my brain correctly after it malfunctioning horribly for the last 2 years.
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Oh no don't stop I find it really interesting and it gives hope to some of us ;)
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GRL - I have loved reading, infact I am thinking of suggesting the BCP to my new GP when I go as it has worked so well for you. I have been taking Omega 7 for about 3 weeks now and my skin is a lot better than it was, might be a thought for you too.
Love the bit about the 5am meerkat, that sound all too familair :-\
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Oh thank you :) I'm so glad it might be helping in some way.
Day 46:
Yet another good day. Slept well. I still don't sleep like I used to before this perio crappness, but I feel normally sleepy at bedtime, drop off easily and have fairly rational dreams which is a positive sign I think? Back before taking the BCP I had basically stopped dreaming as my sleep was so thin and patchy.
Back then the quality of my sleep was like a scratchy nylon shirt. But now it feels like a warm, soft jumper.
Mood still upbeat and normal. And this is despite having had a horribly stressful day at work where I had to deal with abuse from someone who isn't entirely well mentally. It was quite shocking and very unfair of them, and I felt sick and shakey at the time. But I seem to have bounced back and recovered like I would have done back before peri.
My skin is still clear again, and the brown spotting is much lighter today.
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Day 47:
Yet another really good day. Looking back I had become so down and basically frightened of life before I went on the BCP. HRT gave me an occasional taste of feeling much better but it never lasted long.
Skin still much clearer and virtually no brown spotting today.
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Day 48:
Skin back to being nice and clear again, and my hair feels much smoother and silkier (it has been feeling much drier and coarser since being on BCP).
I wonder if I'm adapting to the higher levels of progesterone and my body is now used to it?
But, in my self I just feel so good still. I have this very strong feeling of inner well being, that pretty much disappeared 2 years ago when my peri menopause began. I just spent so many days and weeks feeling totally on edge, and very exposed and basically just plain frightened.
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I so wish a thread like this had existed two years ago when I first wanted to switch to the BCP but was too worried. It would have saved me so many wasted hours/days/months. I think our experiences show that for younger women, you really will benefit from something stronger that will control rather than just top up. It's interesting what you say about getting used to the progesterone - I think I had a similar issue at first with my hair shedding. After a month or so things just turned round and I suddenly stopped being scared to wash it or brush it!
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so good to hear your still doing well ! can i just ask? is the fear of the fear subsiding? if i wasnt progestrone intolerant i wouls def consider the bcp x
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Briony, I have to confess that nearly 2 years when I first presented at my GP with mood swings and random anxiety the GP I saw did suggest the BCP. But I was horrified at the thought of taking it in my mid 40s ( thought there were big health risks etc) and she didn't push it. Sadly. Very sadly. If she had reassured me that there weren't health risks, and that younger women with fluctuating hormones need something stronger than HRT.
But she never mentioned anything more, and I had no idea that the BCP was much stronger than HRT. And so I spent the next 20 months in Hell, see sawing between anxiety, depression, insomnia and with just the odd few 'good' days scattered in between. What a tragic waste.
For me, HRT was like trying to pin the tail on the donkey whilst wearing a blindfold. Just so hit and miss. On the BCP I feel like I've got the donkey saddled up and I'm riding it, and in control.
LW44, yes I think the fear of the fear is starting to fade just a little. I suspect it will take months though. I know after PND it took nearly a year to have 'forgotten' how dreadful it had made me feel.
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Oops, just realised I forgot to update last night.
Day 49:
Still feeling nicely calm and upbeat. Skin really clear again and hair much softer and silkier. Think I have over come the issue with progesterone?
But during afternoon I started to feel very slightly edgy and fraught. Also felt headachy too and a bit grumpy.
But it's nothing like as dreadful as I used to feel on HRT and prior to HRT. It's what I would describe as just 'regular' PMS symptoms which is fine.
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I often have to remind myself that even 'normal' people have down days and PMS days. Going through all this crap has meant I've really lost sight of reality! x
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Totally agree. I lost sight of what was normal anymore. I was fluctuating so constantly and the dips were so awful that I had no idea of how I 'should' feel. You just lose all context.
Day 50:
Felt very, very slightly 'off' today. A tiny but edgy. But had a little bit of fresh blood in the usual brown spotting and a couple of very mild cramps. I'm 6-7 days into my 3rd pack so wondering if my body is trying to have a period, hence the slight edginess and the bit of fresh blood?
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Sorry, meant to add that although I feel a tiny bit off it's NOTHING like the awful mood dips and feelings if despair I used to experience.
I'm still fine and contemplating a bit of shopping tomorrow possibly in a town nearby that I haven't really visited before, just for a change. To put it in context, when I had bad days before it was all I could manage to just go to our village shop to buy bread. And I would usually have to ask my poor Mum to come over and be with me because I was frightened to be on my own.
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Day 51:
Slept deeply. Woke early, but went back to sleep and found it hard to wake up. Felt almost drugged. Felt headachy all day, and still a little fresh blood when I wipe. Some mild cramps too. Really think my body is probably trying to have a period. Also felt a bit on edge all day with some little ****les of anxiety. But nothing I couldn't cope with and much milder than the anxiety/mood dips I used to get.
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Day 52:
Found it hard to drop off to sleep last night, kept half jerking awake. Not nice. Woke up feeling out of sorts and rather flat. Felt worse as the day went on. Bit jittery and unhappy. Body definitely doing its best to have a period as quite a bit of fresh blood when I wipe.
Really hope this passes soon. If I just get a few days per month of this I can cope.
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I still get the odd blip like this too. I am convinced it's our crazy hormones fighting to over ride the pill's control. I seem to always have spotting -albeit really light - whenever I have a blip. Weirdly, I get this ... Yet don't get an end of pack bleed (despite blank pills!). Hope you feel better soon x
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Hi Briony
I can only think it must be our hormones trying to fight back. There can't be any other explanation. I'm just shocked my hormones can still even overide the BCP!!! How is that possible? Especially when I'm taking it continuously.
Day 53:
Felt so sleepy last night and slept well. But felt quite low and miserable all day. Had to force myself to smile and make conversation. Just the usual nasty sense of pointlessness mixed with some anxiety, and felt near to tears for much of the day. But I have had it quite a bit worse in the past.
It must be hormonal because I had quite a bit of fresh blood today and had a few quite severe cramps. My body seems determined to have a period come what may.
I just don't know what there is left that can shut down my ovaries totally, apart from having them removed?
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I feel the same way. All I know that's potentially stronger is the 200mcg patches ... But reticent to swap. Better the Devil and all that !
On a different note, have you seen the post about taking the BCP back to back? Once again, I found myself directing people to this thread. So grateful you started it!
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I had to run 2-3 pill packs together in my late 20s/early 30s to deal with gynae issues and I found I often still had a slight monthly bleed. Also, I feel like the BCP suppresses rather than totally overrides my own hormonal cycle - I can get slight PMT symptoms at random points during the pack.
My GP says that women on BCP SHOULDN'T get these symptoms, but accepts that they do.
On the plus side, I found that when I took BCP for gynae problems AND now that that I am taking it for peri, although the symptoms didn't go away totally, they were much, much better than not being on the pill - the ups and downs were less extreme and the symptoms not as bad. Currently, I'm having the break at the end of each pack, but my GP has advised running packs together to avoid getting the symptoms on my break - having read your Pill Diary, I'm now going to try this - thank you for sharing this as it has helped me make up my mind!
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Hi, thank you yes I have seen that other thread and replied on it to Dorothy :)
Day 54:
Felt incredibly sleepy at bedtime last night, almost to the point of being unable to keep my eyes open as I climbed the stairs to bed! Slept well.
Today I think I feel slightly better than yesterday, but I certainly can't class it as one of the 'good' days which I have happily been getting used to on the BCP. Still felt depressed and unable to find pleasure in anything, just forcing myself through the motions so to speak. That lovely contented feeling of well-being is very much absent and instead I feel on-edge and tearful.
But I have certainly felt much worse, so that's something I guess :-\
I'm on Day 3 now of getting quite a bit of fresh, red bleeding (sorry if that's TMI) certainly as much as I used to get during a 'proper' period back before the BCP and HRT. I feel quite angry with my body for being so determined to have a 'period' despite the very best attempts of modern medicine to stop it happening >:( >:( >:(
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Hi Gypsy,
Not to be a downer but this is what happened to me as well when I was on BCP. I did try several different BCP as my gynae informed me that we react differently to the different progesterone. After about 4 different pills I tried the BCP patch and this is what I tolerated the best. While I was definitely feeling so much better I was also having break through symptoms and decided to continue on my search for symptom control and decided to try HRT. I decided on this so that I could take estrogen and prometrium separately to try and figure if was having issue from estrogen or prometrium. Long strip short have not made much head way and think I will be going back to BCP. I do have an appointment with my endocrinologist in a couple of weeks, at that time I will be definitely talking about bcp not stopping break through symptoms and I will let you know what she has to say! Good luck with everything
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I would be interested to hear what they have to say Poppyflower. I go back to see my own consultant in 8 weeks time so intend staying on the BCP until then, and then see what she has to say. Though I don't hold out much hope as I barely get chance to speak and she's busy writing up my notes before I have even left the room.
If I just get a return of symptoms for say 3-4 days per month then I could shoulder that, I really could. Especially if I knew roughly when they would appear. Bit if they're going to manifest for a week to 10 days at a time, and popping up randomly through out the month, whenever, then I'm no better than I was before.
My GP is still quite keen to put me on ADs, because he's not convinced my issues are just hormonal. He thinks if my issues were purely hormonal then I would just get symptoms, at a set point once a month, and for a certain time.
But I know from before that ADs just switch off ALL emotion and I feel quite numbed-out and detached from life. Though I'm speaking from 14 years ago when I had PND, so not sure if I would react the same now?
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Poppyflower, I too had heard good things about the BC patch - though cant take it personally as it's a higher risk than the pill version.
Like you, I am wondering about being creative with what I take. I know my body liked Utrogestan (Prometrium) but hated the dip once I stopped the 12 days. I wonder, if I instead took it for 25 days (100mg) along with a higher dose estrogen more like the pill (ie equivalent of 3mg rather than 2mg which I take now) then I'd have the best of both worlds? I could take this amount via a patch or gel, even if HRT pills dont go that high. Trouble is, the reverse could be true too and I could make things so much worse, hence my reticence!
Must add, this isnt me trying to know better than the experts - I got the idea from the PMS society website!
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Day 55:
Not really any better today I'm afraid. I have felt worse in the past, but have also felt much, much better than this. Felt flat and grey all day, and life seems pointless right now. It is very, very werying living like this, except it's more like just existing.
Still getting the fresh blood mixed with the brown spotting. Just praying this bleed will stop soon and that my symptoms will stop with it.
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Hi GRL,
Been reading your diary with interest. How are you today? x
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Hi jedigirl, thank you for reading :)
Day 56:
Very, very pleased to report that my mood is better today. Phew. And I don't think it can be just a coincidence that my light bleed of fresh blood seems to have finished too?
I would so love to be able to sit down with an endocrinologist for just half an hour and find out exactly how the hormones in my BCP and my own hormones are interacting, and what has caused this bleed of 5 days. And why it has caused a return of my very low mood/anxiety. Because I really, really can't think this is a coincidence?
Anyway, last night I forgot to take the BCP (took it as soon as I woke) but still slept okay, but I did wake with that nasty wired, meerkat response. I do think the progesterone in the BCP stops that meerkat waking.
Still felt very flat and miserable all morning, but it started to lift around lunch. Now I'm back to feeling quite nicely contented inside and relaxed.
But my legs, knees and ankles are suddenly really aching. No reason for it, it just started this afternoon. It's like I've walked up a mountain and back in heels!
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Glad you're feeling better this afternoon. I felt awful this morning, slightly better now but shaking like I've had a shock.
The whys are always there aren't they, think it's the hardest part of understanding all of this.
I wonder if your aches are a reaction to your stressful day. I am fully expecting a backlash of aches or dodgy tummy once this stressy period passes. Always happens ::)
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Glad you feel a bit better. It's funny how our mood usually improves as the day goes on?
I just don't know what has caused my aching legs? I usually get very achy ankles, but never had it in my whole legs before.
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Day 57:
Slept very well. Had that lovely sleepy but rested feeling when I woke up. Mood still much better and legs have stopped aching.
Just back to the normal brown spotting too. Late this afternoon I kept getting little pangs of depression/dread which was odd.
I think the BCP is helping me. But I think I also need to recover from all the emotional/psychological trauma of all of this. And I really think it's going to take time, probably quite a bit of it. I feel like I've teetered on the edge of a breakdown and danced along the edge of it for nearly 2 years.
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Interesting you're on Day 59. I assume you started the pill at the start of a bleed/period? In which case, if you had not gone back to back you would now be in (towards the end of) a bleed/period? I wonder if the two are connected?
I am convinced I have PMS at present, despite being on day 8. I truly believe that this pill - while miles more controlling than anything else I've tried - is still not powerful enough to take over entirely. Taking 2mg of natural estrogen (so similar to many HRTs) it seems feasible that it's not enough to suppress my hormones entirely? But then again, surely that would mean it's not providing contraception? So damned confusing !
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Hi Briony
It was Day 57 rather than 59, but near as dammit as regards my own body quite possibly still forcing me through a 'period' and accompanying symptoms despite the BCP.
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That's what I thought - so close, surely not coincidental? Guess we do have to remember, in comparison to the older pills, we are both on a very low dose?
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I agree. I have a stack of 50mg patches still, I'm almost tempted to slap one on and see what happens?
Just so weary of second guessing myself. And it's so frustrating to enjoy 2.5 weeks at a time feeling really good, only to feel like you're back at square one again each time.
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Day 58:
Slept well but woke feeling on edge. Lay in bed for a while and didn't feel good at all. Just that unpleasant jittery, frightened for no reason sensation.
My mood improved after a big lunch, but it came back at around tea time. It's so wearing psychologically, having to push yourself through it and keep on going. I wonder if by pushing myself through I am actually helping myself or actually harming myself? Just don't know?
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Am same GRL, really wearing day, so hard to fight through a work day today feeling scared and anxiety surges.
Are you still happy with your choice of treatment?
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Sorry to hear you're struggling too Jedigirl. You have my sympathy.
Just over a week ago I was quietly confident that the BCP was really working well for me, I had begun to feel hopeful that I was on the road to recovery. But then I started a withdrawal bleed and felt I was back at square one again with the same old nasty symptoms. And still waiting for my mood to properly pick up.
If I get another 2-3 stretch of feeling good then that will change my opinion again I'm sure.
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Ah bless you GRL, its so frustrating isn't it? Always three steps forward two back. Hope things ease soon x
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Sorry to hear you're struggling too Jedigirl. You have my sympathy.
Just over a week ago I was quietly confident that the BCP was really working well for me, I had begun to feel hopeful that I was on the road to recovery. But then I started a withdrawal bleed and felt I was back at square one again with the same old nasty symptoms. And still waiting for my mood to properly pick up.
If I get another 2-3 stretch of feeling good then that will change my opinion again I'm sure.
Do remember it's still really early days. I was still having doubts by the end of month three and it wasn't until month five that I felt really sure I'd done the right thing moving to a BCP x
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Day 59:
Saw locum GP who suggested a change of BCP to stop the constant spotting. So given Gedarel 30/50. But have to give myself a withdrawal bleed by stopping for 7 days before starting it.
Got rushes of adrenaline each time I tried to drop off last night. Woke up feeling wired. Felt very anxious all day. Horrible. No idea why I should be feeling like this?
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Think that's the same as Marvelon? If so, that's the one I begged to switch to. Had really good reviews, especially for peri symptoms. Opposite side of pill ladder - more estrogen dominant - which could work for you. Will be so interested to hear how you get on. Don't over think your current mood - even going to docs and knowing you're starting something different would probably be enough to raise anxiety slightly. Also, remember that your new pill has fewer progesterone related side effects x
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Yes it's the same as Marvelon he told me. I'm pleased that it's more oestrogen dominant. Just wish I could start straight on it rather than having to have this 7 day break. Especially as my body insisted on me having a withdrawal bleed last week anyway.
The last 3 nights I've struggled to drop off despite feeling very sleepy. Nasty adrenaline surges keep snatching me back from the brink of sleep. Then I'm waking feeling that I've slept okay but feeling very jittery. Feels like I'm regressing.
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Thanks Briony, so the bio identical bcp can't be taken if your over 35 and smoke? How is this different to the bio identical gels etc? Sorry more questions :oops:
So if I'm on 3 pumps of oestrogel how does that compare to 200mcg paches?
I dont think any combined BCP can be taken if you're over 35 and smoke, but I could be wrong. If any was to be the exception, it would be the bio identical BCP (Qlaira) as the estrogen in it is a lot less potent than other pills (as it's not synthetic). Pross Studd and the PMS Society both recommend 200mcg patches or 4-5 pumps of gel so I presume they are similar? Would love to hear from people who've tried this method to suppress ovulation and control fluctuations, but I guess it's fairly rare as most people - unlike you and me - can take a stronger BCP instead.
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When I saw my GP yesterday for a repeat prescription of my BCP he suggested I have a 7 day break to allow my body to have a withdrawal bleed, and then start on a different brand in hope of stopping the daily brown spotting.
So next week I'm starting Gedarel (Marvelon). This is a more oestrogen dominant Pill than the Rigevidon that I've been on, so hoping it might be an improvement when it comes to keeping my mood better balanced.
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Hope the new pill works better for you GRL.
I went ahead with running 2 packs together, so I'm now on day 23 of taking it continuously - finally made my decision as I have a job interview for a p/t job tomorrow and couldn't risk having crashing fatigue during that! If I'd had the break according to plan, I could expect to be very tired today and totally incapable of waking up tomorrow!!!
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Good luck for the interview Dorothy, keeping my fingers crossed for you.
I was concerned how I would feel on this 7 day break, with no hormonal help, but since yesterday lunch I have been feeling much better. Slept great last night and some this morning feeling very well.
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Dorothy - all the best for your interview. Let us know how it goes.
GRL - I'm really hoping this works for you. I know a number of people who took Microgynon and found it affected their mood. (In fact we had an interesting talk about this at work today - we ended up questioning how many people have unnecessarily ended up on ADs as a result of not questioning the BCPs prescribed). That's why I got so obsessed with the (NHS) Avon pill ladder - I was determined to take one with a more estrogenic progesterone (not that the research did me any good). If you think about it, even the Mirena causes adverse mood effects in some people, so taking the same prog in oral form will inevitably have at least similar effects, if not greater. Hopefully this new prog will be kinder. I know reviews can be misleading, but there's lots on Mumsnet about both the pills you've taken. Marvelon seems to come out best! X
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Thanks Briony. I am feeling positive about starting Marvelon next week.
Right now I'm feeling very 'good' again. Upbeat. Centered. Positive about life. Yet again my hormones have turned my inner dial from 'Wretched' to 'Wonderful' in just the space of a few hours.
I know you understand how that feels, all too well!
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Thanks for the good wishes - not heard yet.
GRL, hope your hormones are still behaving themselves. Avoiding a break has worked for me so far - will see how long this lasts! Best night's sleep I've had in months last night.
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Keeping fingers crossed for you Dorothy.
I'm wondering if by running more than 2 packs together you get a problematic build up of hormones? Especially progesterone?
When I went from pack 1 onto pack 2 I didn't seem to have much or a problem. Just a mood dip for a couple of days followed by a bit of a withdrawal type bleed, then was fine again for over 2 weeks. But moving straight from pack 2 to pack 3 seems to possibly have been too much for me? Halfway through pack 3 things turned really miserable again for me when a withdrawal bleed came out of nowhere.
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The weird thing with me is that once again, I've had no withdrawl bleed, despite the two blank days, yet now mid pack, I am having what appears to be more than spotting. Qlaira is known for causing spotting as its so low dose, so I am not worried, but I'd love to know the logic behind it.
If you think about it, most doctors won't prescribe continuous hrt if you still have periods as it causes odd bleeding.
In a way, Qlaira is basically continuous hrt with six non continuous (progesterone free) days (four of which still have estrogen). It therefore makes sense that end of pack dips are less likely, but irregular bleeding is more likely ? Ditto if you take a conventional pill without any break at all, perhaps?