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[CLKD]

A bone scan should be done on pelvis and hips 

Both Mum [92] and myself [not that old] spend a lot of time outdoors but we were both in 2017 low in VitD levels. Capsules certainly helped. 

[Hurdity]

I quite agree Hummdinger that we should all be aware of the potnetial for sunburn - I don't think anyone was suggesting otherwise? That netdoctor info is probably out of date now (2016) although probably rightly erring on the side of caution because some people really are stupid enough to keep themselves covered up for most of the year and then as soon as there is a heatwave, roast themselves for long periods of time – you do see them every year!

Current thinking as I understand it, is that people should expose themselves to the sun at a time of day and length of time that is suitable for their skin type (like mentioned in the netdoctor guidance -  knowing your skin type is crucial). Like I said – if you have very fair skin for example you would be able to make vit D more efficiently in shorter periods of time at a time of day when the sun is not strong, and cover up or use sunscreen the rest of the time. In any case the sun starts to get strong enough very soon ( it actually was last week!) so even fair-skinned people could have exposed their skin for a decent amount of time without sunscreen, make vit D and not get burnt.

The Royal  Osteoporosis society give guidelines on sun exposure here:
https://theros.org.uk/information-and-support/looking-after-your-bones/vitamin-d/

“In the UK, your skin can only get vitamin D from sunlight between April and September.
During this time, it's recommended you expose your skin to direct sunlight for around 10 minutes, once or twice per day.
There are some important things to remember when getting vitamin D from the sun:
•   If the weather is cloudy, it may take longer to produce the same levels of vitamin D as on a sunny day
•   It's important that you go outside - glass blocks the sun's rays
•   If you have darker skin, it produces vitamin D at a slower rate, so you need to spend longer in the sun to get the amount your body needs
•   Using sunblock or high factor sunscreen stops the sun's rays reaching your skin, which reduces the amount of vitamin D that your body makes”

... as well as cautioning against burning the skin here:

“It's important to give your skin short periods in the sun, when you haven't applied sunscreen. But don't be tempted to avoid wearing sunscreen to increase your vitamin D levels. You may do more damage to your skin than good for your bones.
To protect your skin, aim to get your vitamin D from the sun while you're doing short outdoor tasks, like:
•   hanging out the washing
•   pulling up weeds
•   walking to the shops
If your skin is exposed to the sun for more than 10 minutes, always apply a sunblock or sunscreen. And avoid exposing your skin to direct sunlight when the sun it at its strongest, in the middle of the day.”

ie not blanket sun-screening and taking supplements instead.

The latest guidelines from the Royal Osteoporosis Society published in November 2018 regarding vit D  levels is:

“Following review of the Scientific Advisory Committee on Nutrition (SACN) and Institute of Medicine (IOM) reports, we propose that the following vitamin D thresholds are adopted by UK practitioners in respect to bone health:–plasma 25(OH)D < 25 nmol/L is deficient–plasma 25(OH)D of 25–50 nmol/L may be inadequate in some people–plasma 25(OH)D > 50 nmol/L is sufficient for almost the whole population”

https://theros.org.uk/media/100231/nos_vitamin_d_and_bone_-health_in_adults_web.pdf

They also give lots of info about dosing but no mention of Boron or Vit K

They recommend that people with levels of over 50 –  should maintain vit D levels by safe sun exposure and diet. They say that this is sufficient for most of the population although personally I would want my level to be higher than just sufficient  - which when tested it was almost double this in March at the lowest time of year.

Hope this information is helpful!

Hurdity x

[CLKD]

Better to get natural VitD from sun-light than taking minerals which may/not give the required amount.  By mid-Feb., simply by walking or gardening, my hands and face are brown.  The rest of my skin hardly gets to C the light of day  .  It is said by dermatologists that we should get out B4 10.00 a.m. and after 4.30 p.m. when the sun is going down.  This avoids the intensity of burning sunshine.  Also we have to remember [I probably said already  ] a drying wind.  I have to remind DH to put lots of cream on when he's fishing: back of the neck, ears, face, scalp where he's thinning  ..........

The last time that I got sun-burnt - in the early 1980s - I was laying under a brolly against sun and wind but my feet were outside the shade  I can remember how tight my ankles felt as I tried to walk the 2 miles back across the hard sand.  NEVER again!  It took a lot of water to rehydrate via the gut and lots of cooling cream with ankles elevated.

Yet my sister in Law can lay out in the hottest sunshine and never burns, never puts protective cream on  even when we have explained how awful skin cancer can be. 

I don't like the 'only get vitamin D from sunlight between April and September' .......... has anyone actually measured this?  What about people that are out doors most of the year, after all we get lovely sunshine earlier and later than expected across the UK. 

[BlueButterfly]

I take a vitamin D supplement during the winter because my levels get low...but it still never works as well as getting actual sunshine for me. Just waiting for winter to end and not having 90% of my body covered to stay warm.

[CLKD]

I'm back in thick socks and a jumper today!  Last week we were in short sleeves  .

As I can't tolerate heat I tend to be out and about early and evenings. 

[dahliagirl]

I don't like the 'only get vitamin D from sunlight between April and September' .......... has anyone actually measured this?  What about people that are out doors most of the year, after all we get lovely sunshine earlier and later than expected across the UK. 

The sunlight that you need to make vitamin D is at the short end of the spectrum - beyond violet.

The shorter wavelengths get absorbed on the way through the earth's atmosphere.

If you draw the earth as a circle, put another circle around it for the atmosphere, and mark a spot on the earth's surface for you, then if the sun is directly above you then that is the shortest distance through the atmosphere.  If it comes from an angle (like it does when the sun is lower at the beginning and the end of the day and in the winter) then the light will have to go a longer distance through the atmosphere until it reaches you and will lose more light at the short end of the spectrum.

This is why the sky and the sun go red in the evening.

As a rule of thumb, if your shadow is shorter than you are, then the sun is at the right angle to get enough UVB rays.

10-20 minutes or so is enough, depending on your skin colour.  It is the same part of the spectrum that causes cancer, so don't stay there long enough to burn!

[CLKD]

WOW we are a Mine of Info on here, that's for sure.     now, is that physics, biology ......

I've nipped in and out several times to our garden but it is really cold!!  Sun is out, stiff breeze. 

[dahliagirl]

Physics, geography, environmental science, biology - they all cover it from different angles 

It is too cold here too and the wind makes my house colder BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR 

[CLKD]

  put another jumper on?

Sun is pouring into the lounge but the wind is sharp.  Straight from the Urals   . 

At least the sky is blue.  Laundry inside, no need to go out any more today but I may have another wander round B4 dusk.

[dahliagirl]

I have some flowers to plant in a tub, but I may leave it another day 

Not the best of weather for vitamin D production 

[CLKD]

The wind suddenly dropped so I've been outside again.  Feeding the birds.  Chilly but hazy. 

[BlueButterfly]

Have had several days of sunshine and weather warm enough to not need a coat so could actually have some skin exposed! It's been heavenly....still can tell how much better it is for me than a supplement. Looks like we may have one more day of the lovely sunshine before the clouds set back in. And then grey skies for another week or more.  I wish spring would officially get here!

[dahliagirl]

Puts a bounce in your step, doesn't it 

[CLKD]

It certainly does, DH and I sat in warm sunshine with a cuppa at 3.00 p.m..  Hopefully it will be nice tomorrow, I need to encourage him to put lotion on as he will be fishing: a mix of sun and wind