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Author Topic: Norethisterone and fluoxetine; can I survive?  (Read 3435 times)

FiGo

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Norethisterone and fluoxetine; can I survive?
« on: April 23, 2018, 09:01:30 PM »

On Evorel 50 and just about to change from Utrogestan (too weak) to Norethisterone 350mcg. I am also about to start fluoxetine 20mg to tackle my low mood, disturbed sleep, lack of energy and basic loss of mojo. Has anyone been on this combo for a reasonable length of time and has a positive tale to tell. Frankly, I'm terrified  :'( and have been told to give both at least four weeks before forming any judgment. I'm hopeful of a bit of bolstering as I embark on this new regimen. Thank you x
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CLKD

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Re: Norethisterone and fluoxetine; can I survive?
« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2018, 09:10:49 PM »

 :bighug:

....... and breath.  My lack of energy turned out to be low VitD levels  ::).  If any side-effects are really awful there are other forms of HRT out there.  Do you keep a mood/food/symptom diary?
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FiGo

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Re: Norethisterone and fluoxetine; can I survive?
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2018, 09:14:25 PM »

 ;D thank you! I've just read the fluoxetine leaflet and scared the living daylights out of myself. I should keep a diary. Great idea. How do you find out if you have a vitamin deficiency?
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Tinkerbell

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Re: Norethisterone and fluoxetine; can I survive?
« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2018, 08:15:09 AM »

You need a blood test to check Vitamin D levels, my teenage son struggles with his and is having a blood test today.
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Hurdity

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Re: Norethisterone and fluoxetine; can I survive?
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2018, 04:59:00 PM »

Hi there FiGo

Not sure why you are changing to this regime? Firstly why do you say the utro is too weak? Do you mean you are getting breakthrough or irregular bleeding? What dose are you taking? Also your oestrogen dose may not be high enough. Anti-depressants are not indicated for menopausal symptoms and it's best to persevere with finding the right combo before starting these. Low mood from hormonal imbalance can be caused by - too much progesterone (sedating and depressing) , too little oestrogen and/or low testosterone. It also depends where you are in menopause and your age. Personally I would hold off the ADs for the time being. How often are you due to take the norethisterone? Aldso that dose may not be sufficient to protect your uterus - depending partly where you are in menopause and if still ovulating and whether you are taking it cyclically or all the time. Some women suffer continuous progestogenic side effects from continuous progestogens. Hope you don't mind all the questions - just trying to get a picture!

Hurdity x
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Wilks

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Re: Norethisterone and fluoxetine; can I survive?
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2018, 05:53:47 PM »

Hi there,
I'm currently on fluoxetine and HRT which includes Utrogestan.
Although it's true that menopausal issues including low mood can be addressed with HRT rather than anti-depressants, in my opinion it depends on how bad your low mood is, and whether you feel you can wait until your hormones are stabilised.
I decided to take the fluoxetine as well as HRT (at least for a few months) as I was severely depressed. Not had any problems with combining the two, and plan to stop the fluoxetine after a few months.
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FiGo

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Re: Norethisterone and fluoxetine; can I survive?
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2018, 08:24:49 PM »

Hello Hurdity and Wilks. I have huge fibroids (“18 weeks”) that started, I think, when I was on Evorel Conti about 5 years ago when 49 and peri.  I was moved to Evorel Sequi and about three years ago, to Evorel 50 plus 100mg Utrogestan nightly and continuously. I was relatively stable for a couple of years albeit my mojo had pretty much packed up and moved on but I could work and function in second gear with family but started to be too tired for friends or socialising. This had continued to get worse such that I collapse at night and will not do or cannot do anything on a school night. I’m not interested in looking good, clothes (I loved choosing outfits and my lovely long thick hair), running, my house, the garden, planning holidays or indeed anything and latterly I cannot even face phoning to book a table or make arrangements for a tradesman. I’ve lost the old me and the replacement is a dumpy frumpy balding lump of lethargy. So, I had a long bleed recently and the meno clinic doctor suggested I should try something stronger than the Utrogestan. I cannot (I think) increase the oestrogen because of the fibroids but can I say that it’s doing anything? Not really. I’m a mess. I took this situation to my GP and suggested blood tests to see if my oestrogen levels are as expected but that’s not going to happen I fear. My description of how I’m feeling suggests I’m depressed hence the AD which I really don’t want to start.
If Norethisterone is so strong, 350mcg, and I have to take it continuously, can I up my Evorel to 75 and maybe feel better without exacerbating my fibroids I wonder? I hope I have stopped ovulating as I’m nearly 56.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2018, 08:30:10 PM by FiGo »
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Wilks

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Re: Norethisterone and fluoxetine; can I survive?
« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2018, 09:13:24 PM »

Hi again FiGo,
Have you discussed trying testosterone or is that not appropriate for someone with fibroids?
Wilks
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CLKD

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Re: Norethisterone and fluoxetine; can I survive?
« Reply #8 on: April 24, 2018, 09:28:27 PM »

There is an occasional option of sending Dr Currie a personal e-mail with a problem, 4 which there is a charge.  Might be worth thinking about?

Do you feel depressed?  Sounds like you are struggling with the list of not being able to do stuff.  What's to lose if you try the Anti-depressant for 6-8 months, if it lifts your mood you will be able to make informed choices. 
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Hurdity

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Re: Norethisterone and fluoxetine; can I survive?
« Reply #9 on: April 25, 2018, 08:02:10 AM »

Hi FiGo - I take what the others have said about ADs but also note what you say about not wanting to take them and also your symptoms and it really does sound like you need to sort out your HRT and its effect first if you can - and if you can cope of course. 

As I said in my previous post continuous progestogens can cause tiredness and low mood, headaches, depression - all sorts of unpleasant symptoms, but I gather you need to have a stronger one due to the fibroids. Low oestrogen can also cause continued low mood, and as I mentioned, low testosterone can affect energy, mood and libido too.

Here is what it says on this website about fibroids and menopause/HRT:


Fibroids   
    Fibroids are benign smooth muscle tumours of the uterine (womb) wall and are dependant on estrogen. They tend to shrink after the menopause but shrinkage may not occur, or they may even increase in size with HRT use. Increase is thought to occur in 25% of HRT users and mainly occurs in the first six months of therapy. There is some evidence that transdermal (patch or gel) but not tablet HRT nor tibolone may promote fibroid growth. [ref 24] Fibroid size can be monitored by regular examinations and sometimes by ultrasound scans. There is some evidence that the use of the progestogen releasing intra-uterine system, Mirena may cause fibroids to reduce in size. Mirena is often used in the perimenopause by women who have heavy periods and/or require contraception and can provide the progestogen part of their HRT.


Could you consider having a Mirena coil fitted? You would then be able to have a higher dose of oestrogen without hopefully affecting the fibroids? Have other options been suggested apart from ADs which don't actually deal with the cause ie having the fibroids is hindering you taking the most appropriate HRT you need in order to deal with your menopausal symptoms and to function properly?

I agree you need to check you are getting adequate nutrients and minerals in your diet and ideally get the doc to give you general blood tests rather than fobbing you off with meds first!

Re your Q about norethisterone - 350 mg may not be high enough to give uterine protection when adding oestrogen as part of hRT. If you look at the doseages for post-menopause here: https://www.menopausematters.co.uk/postmeno.php the dose for medium dose oestrogen is somewhere between 0.5 and 1 mg - and this is for women without fibroids. However if you have been prescribed it by a meno consultant it's worth a try but personally I would have thought that it may not be enough to protect your womb/fibroids from over-thickening from 75 mcg oestrogen.

There is also the option of taking the utrogestan vaginally but if you are in a relationship you may not want to do this continuously and taking a higher dose (200 mg) orally and continuoulsy is likely to be far too sedating/depressing.

It is so important to be able to feel good about yourself but you need the full support of the medical profession and the right treatment.

Let us know what you decide - whatever it is - and yes maybe contact Dr Currie (costs £25 - see home page) and ask her recommendation. There is also Women's Health Concern who have a telephone/e-mail consultation service.

Really hope you manage to find a solution so that you can turn a corner soon - I started HRT 11 years ago at just under 54 and never looked back - I never suffer low mood and do feel positive about myself (ageing aside!) and I would wish the same for every woman out there!

Hurdity x
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Wilks

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Re: Norethisterone and fluoxetine; can I survive?
« Reply #10 on: April 25, 2018, 08:06:28 PM »

I do appreciate that antidepressants are not for everyone but life is too short to be suffering needlessly. I had a very poor quality of life for 4 months with my menopause problems, and the thought of waiting another 3 months while the HRT kicked in was too much. That experience taught me that life is too precious to waste months feeling like that.
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MIS71MUM

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Re: Norethisterone and fluoxetine; can I survive?
« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2018, 09:09:58 PM »

Hello
Just a thought, when you start AD's, you feel worse before better. If you start notherhisterine at the same time, this is least tolerated progesterone, you won't know what is causing any possible side effects.

I appreciate life is too short but you definitely need a space between the two - speaking from personal experience.
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Wilks

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Re: Norethisterone and fluoxetine; can I survive?
« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2018, 10:11:15 PM »

Well I guess each person is different but I had reached a point where it couldn't get any worse - I wanted to take my own life it was that bad, so side effects were the least of my worries. In fact the fluoxetine just made me a bit sleepy for 2 weeks.
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MIS71MUM

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Re: Norethisterone and fluoxetine; can I survive?
« Reply #13 on: April 26, 2018, 05:18:51 PM »

Wilks - sorry to hear that you were so ill and hope you are on mend now.
For some reason when I take AD's, I end up with really bad side effects. Each time, it's taken me about 6 weeks to start to feel normal and end up being off work.
I know a few people who have started AD's and never suffered from side effects or missed anytime off work.

My AD is Duloxetine and has helped me loads, so I agree, if you need them, take them.
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