Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => Other Health Discussion => Topic started by: Blot on October 05, 2018, 02:38:57 AM
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Had first vagifem before bed last night and not sure if this is normal. Almost straight away I felt uncomfortable but just thought I had inserted it too far or something. Then within 2 hours I had an intense burning/stinging in the V and feel like I need to pee constantly. Must have been 5 times for a wee and have also taken some ibuprofen which haven't helped.
I am regretting taking this now as my symptoms had improved and now are as bad as ever :'( and I've been awake all night.
Surely I can't be reacting this way after just one dose and so quickly? I know you are supposed to persevere for the first two weeks but don't think I can cope with this, especially as I was feeling ok as well.
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I suspect you are expecting side effects ? Do you use any vaginal moisturiser? Inserting the Vagifem may have grazed some delicate skin internally if it's very atrophied. I got stinging with the first couple of weeks of treatment and I think this is to do with the fillers - the skin is so fragile due to the lack of oestrogen. I use a little SYLK just around the entrance and a bit inside to aid insertion and to prevent my skin reacting to the fillers - though you shouldn't use too much moisturiser or it will prevent absorption of the oestrogen. Some women do find that they need to pee more when they first use Vagifem and sometimes there can be a bit of cramping or even spotting - the initial hit of oestrogen can give a reaction( as with any hormonal treatments) but once the oestrogen has plumped everything up to make the whole area healthier you should feel the benefits.
Don't take painkillers, drink plenty of water but try not to drink too much through the evening.
Perhaps take a Nytol tonight (not the herbal one but the one from behind the chemist counter) so you sleep better. The antihistamine in Nytol can have a calming effect in the bladder.
Do persevere - it will be worth it.
DG x
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Thanks. I don't feel dry inside at all. No problems inserting and I can even put a tampon in and out no bother (I tried to see if I was dry).
I'm so disappointed because my symptoms were quite mild and this has ramped them up to another level. I thought it wouldn't do any harm, not make things worse.
I'll have a think about it and see if things calm down today. At least I've got the vagifem. I may wait a few days and restart if things don't improve. Off to get some multi gyn actigel as well so I'll get some nytol when I'm there.
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It may be the capsule or the fillers that you are reacting to. Put the product into the search box and see if anyone has mentioned soreness. When I use the Ovestin - inserted by a syringe action rather than a capsule - I feel like I need to pee the next day but have fortunately not had burning.
Why no pain killers :-\
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CKLD - I say no painkillers as NDAIDs are very acidic so will aggregate the bladder and paracetamol doesn't do anything anyway.
There was a very thorough trial done not long ago on the effectiveness of paracetamol and it showed that paracetamol had no more benefit that placebo and in fact carried risks to the liver and kidneys. I believe that NICE subsequently wanted to remove paracetamol from the NHS drugs list (enormous amount spent prescribing this) but GPs asked to keep paracetamol on the list as they needed something to offer patients even if it didn't help. It would probably be safer to dish out sugar pills or maybe vitamin d pills?
I found the paper on this trial easily by googling ‘does paracetamol work' and I believe this trial was done by a doctor called Cochrane??
DG x
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Interesting about the painkillers DG. I don't usually take paracetamol because they don't work but I do take ibuprofen.
Seems like I'm in the minority on here regarding the soreness but a few have mentioned it. I could put up with headaches or other side effects but to make my symptoms (that I was using it for in the first place) a lot worse is just not worth it. I'm even scared to use the multi gyn actigel in case it makes things worse.
I must have been to the toilet 6 times between 1 and 7 am. That's no exaggeration.
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I have always found that not enough vagifem is worst.
I didn't do the full load properly, then went onto 2 per week and I was always having problems. I reloaded, then went onto every other day and now use it 2-3 times per week. It works best once you have used enough of it to be stable.
The actigel helped me through it.
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If my symptoms were bad to start with, I'd use it. I'd have nothing to lose. I'd give it a good go and if it didn't help then fair enough.
But to make the thing that I'm supposed to be helping a lot worse than it's been lately? No.
I will see if things calm down and have a rethink.
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I could take a bottle of Paracetamol - it would kill me but I have never found it useful. Nurofen eases symptoms, maybe Blot speak to a Pharmacist about options. My Gran swore by Bicarb of soda, bathing in it as well as drinking it, she also used it as a paste on burns.
Do try Ovestin if symptoms are bothersome. If the tissues are thinning localised HRT will relief it as it plumps up the area ....... or perhaps look at the threads on Sylc and Yes products?
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I use estring as there are none of the fillers that make my va worse
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I agree with Robin, an Estring might be the best thing if the fillers in Vagifem are making things too painful.
JP x
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Interesting about the painkillers DG. I don't usually take paracetamol because they don't work but I do take ibuprofen.
Seems like I'm in the minority on here regarding the soreness but a few have mentioned it. I could put up with headaches or other side effects but to make my symptoms (that I was using it for in the first place) a lot worse is just not worth it. I'm even scared to use the multi gyn actigel in case it makes things worse.
I must have been to the toilet 6 times between 1 and 7 am. That's no exaggeration.
Blot. I will write you a longer reply tomorrow. Only have phone now. Have also had soreness since yesterday and slept badly. Possibly because my dose is too low? Now only taking 2 per week. Will put another in tonight.
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Thanks. Had a good nights sleep last night. Didn't even get up once.
How was your start up with vagifem Katejo? Did it make things worse?
I'm having a think about what to do. I may start again but do it when I'm not at work.
CLKD that's interesting that you feel the need to wee for 24 hours after using Ovestin. That's the main reason I got them, to stop this feeling, so if you are using twice a week then you get this feeling twice a week?
Not keen on the estring option.
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Sounds like the fillers have irritated and caused this reaction. Perhaps try Ovestin instead. I use both Vagifem and Ovestin but the only time I need to pee more is when I've forgot to take or need to take more. Try using YES moisturisor also, it's on prescription or you can order online, this is the only one I can use that doesn't irritate. Vagifem caused me cramps in the first couple of weeks but then settled and Ovestin can sting when first used especially if you are very sore but this does settle once it starts doing the job.
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I was lucky and didn't get any stinging etc.. I take 1 Nurofen capsule to ease any symptoms of urgency and it doesn't last.
Glad you had sleep last night ! I did. But oh the dreams >:( :-X
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I was lucky and didn't get any stinging etc.. I take 1 Nurofen capsule to ease any symptoms of urgency and it doesn't last.
Glad you had sleep last night ! I did. But oh the dreams >:( :-X
When you say it doesn't last, do you just mean that the Nurofen sorts it or do you mean that you get used to the Vagifem and it doesn't happen after a few applications?
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Thanks. Had a good nights sleep last night. Didn't even get up once.
How was your start up with vagifem Katejo? Did it make things worse?
I'm having a think about what to do. I may start again but do it when I'm not at work.
CLKD that's interesting that you feel the need to wee for 24 hours after using Ovestin. That's the main reason I got them, to stop this feeling, so if you are using twice a week then you get this feeling twice a week?
Not keen on the estring option.
My startup worked really well and continued while i was using it every day for 2 weeks but the irritation has returned since I dropped to 2 a week as per instructions. I actually had another urine test done this week in case the infection hadn't cleared. I expected the result yesterday but haven't had it yet. I previously tried Estriol cream but dropped it when I realised that the 'weeing effect' was really bad so my first impression of vagifem was very good.
It is a bit odd when the treatment which is supposed to prevent irritation sometimes seems to cause it.
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The maintenance dose of twice a week is not enough for most and I need to take daily all the time. If you were feeling better after the 2 week every day then you may need to up the doseage. If you go onto the search tab and type in vagifem up dosage you will find a lot of people do not manage on twice a week especially since it was reduced from 25mcg to 10mcg per tablet. The NICE guidelines also say that the dosage can be higher if needed.
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It is Trial and Error for many ladies. If 2 weeks helps but dropping the dose gives a return of symptoms up to alternate nights? 4 me it's as necessary as my symptoms fortunately are less and I get good warning when symptoms niggle. I then do a 3/4 night re-load then see how the area feels.
If my bladder is irritated the morning after use of the Ovestin I take 1 Nurofen capsule, which eases the feelings. I think I've been using it for about 5 years now.
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Do most people use vagifem at night or can it be used any time?
Also does multi gyn actigel always sting so much. It lasted a good 30-45 mins last night.
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Do most people use vagifem at night or can it be used any time?
Also does multi gyn actigel always sting so much. It lasted a good 30-45 mins last night.
I had assumed that it was normally used at night but have wondered whether daytime use was an option myself. I haven't tried the actigel. I have irritation now and really don't know the cause. i am thinking 'Could it be this or could it be that.....'?
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I just wondered if I start up with it again whether it might be a good idea to use it mornings then I could deal with any symptoms better during the day.
I too keep thinking of different causes for everything. I tie myself in knots. It's exhausting and I want to just forget about it.
I'm trying the actigel to see if that helps calm things down first.
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Maybe stick with the actigel for 2 weeks? Otherwise you will have little idea of what may be helping ;). Good old Granny recipe of bicarbonate of soda or Vaseline might also help. Keeping the outer lips supple is as important as the internal areas. I use KY jelly if the outer lips are dry and itchy.
How are you today?
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I just wondered if I start up with it again whether it might be a good idea to use it mornings then I could deal with any symptoms better during the day.
I too keep thinking of different causes for everything. I tie myself in knots. It's exhausting and I want to just forget about it.
I'm trying the actigel to see if that helps calm things down first.
I know what you mean. If I get my urine test result tomorrow and it shows no infection, part of me will think "It could have developed between giving the sample and now"! :'(
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Nope. Unlikely. Vaginal atrophy mimics urine infection-type symptoms which GPs don't often associate with peri-menopause. As oestrogen levels drop so the body may become dry, inside and out: including deep in the vagina. Dryness can equate to itchiness as the skin thins. What lubricant do you use regularly? 4 me it was like razor blades up there :o
Some ladies myself included as well as a Great Aunt now aged 90 :o began symptoms way later. I was 11+ years post bleed for example.
Maybe take a pain relief medication? I do and it eases my symptoms of feeling the need to wee. Also make sure that you drink enough but not too much. Your urine should be straw coloured not darker or lighter ;-).
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I'm not dry and itchy at all CLKD. I've no idea what's going on. I m sure the actigel has made me worse, I'm going to stop that too and just wait and see.
Does your gp just let you drop a urine sample off Katejo? I took one into my last appointment and the doc didn't even test mine!
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Nope. Unlikely. Vaginal atrophy mimics urine infection-type symptoms which GPs don't often associate with peri-menopause. As oestrogen levels drop so the body may become dry, inside and out: including deep in the vagina. Dryness can equate to itchiness as the skin thins. What lubricant do you use regularly? 4 me it was like razor blades up there :o
Some ladies myself included as well as a Great Aunt now aged 90 :o began symptoms way later. I was 11+ years post bleed for example.
Maybe take a pain relief medication? I do and it eases my symptoms of feeling the need to wee. Also make sure that you drink enough but not too much. Your urine should be straw coloured not darker or lighter ;-).
I already keep an eye on the urine colour and have taken 1 dose of Nurofen today. It didn't cause me any problems during peri menopause either. I started getting UTI's a bit later. I have only tried a lubricant bought over the counter at Boots.
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That's fine Katejo - keep using the lubricant regularly on the outer lips. Anything to stop dryness developing. I wasn't dry either but my GP diagnosed VA over the 'phone [don't ask ;D] and not on Skype ......
Wait and see is a good idea. Maybe try something more simple if symptoms continue? When I had symptoms I would ring the surgery to see if the sample would be taken to a Lab. on that day, didn't want it sitting around! One got 'lost' ..... another was too old hence the 'phone call.
Gt Aunt was surprised that at her age ??? .......... but has been gently advised to keep an appt with the Practice Nurse ;-).
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I'm not dry and itchy at all CLKD. I've no idea what's going on. I m sure the actigel has made me worse, I'm going to stop that too and just wait and see.
Does your gp just let you drop a urine sample off Katejo? I took one into my last appointment and the doc didn't even test mine!
Sometimes yes and sometimes no. On this occasion i had had a phone appointment and explained that the AB wasn't doing the job and asked for another test to be done. The GP left a form for me to collect so I just needed to do the sample and hand it in. Firstly i delayed the test for a while because I thought that the Vagifem was helping but then, after the 2 weeks initial period, the symptoms started returning.
Your GP didn't even do the quick test in the surgery?
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That's fine Katejo - keep using the lubricant regularly on the outer lips. Anything to stop dryness developing. I wasn't dry either but my GP diagnosed VA over the 'phone [don't ask ;D] and not on Skype ......
Wait and see is a good idea. Maybe try something more simple if symptoms continue? When I had symptoms I would ring the surgery to see if the sample would be taken to a Lab. on that day, didn't want it sitting around! One got 'lost' ..... another was too old hence the 'phone call.
Gt Aunt was surprised that at her age ??? .......... but has been gently advised to keep an appt with the Practice Nurse ;-).
The outer bit doesn't feel dry and itchy. The discomfort is only inside.
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The quick test shows what exactly? Very rarely signs of infection; there may be protein or blood but the latter may be caused by atrophy. A sample MUST be sent to a Lab. to see if bugs grow which means the correct anti-biotic can be prescribed. My GP was furious that my samples hadn't been sent away! A waste of Appt. times - I went 3 times in 18 months and the samples were 'dipped' - a sample tested correctly would have meant appropriate treatment immediately.
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The quick test shows what exactly? Very rarely signs of infection; there may be protein or blood but the latter may be caused by atrophy. A sample MUST be sent to a Lab. to see if bugs grow which means the correct anti-biotic can be prescribed. My GP was furious that my samples hadn't been sent away! A waste of Appt. times - I went 3 times in 18 months and the samples were 'dipped' - a sample tested correctly would have meant appropriate treatment immediately.
Your GP was furious? So who did the dipping test if it wasn't a GP? I have to see/speak to a GP to get a test of any type. In my latest one, it was sent away. The result said that I had bacteria resistant to both Trimethroprim and Amoxycillin but still the new AB didn't work.
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Practice Nurse did the dipping test. Quicker than seeing a GP. Would be a waste of GP time. But the samples should have been sent to a Lab. which our Nurse Practitioner could have done.
The World is running out of Anti-bitotic choices :'(. Due to over-use. The reach for go2 treatment for years it is now being realised that over-use could be problematic.
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So does anyone know if you can use vagifem at any time of day?
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Hello Blot,
I use vagifem in the mornings, I do experience some discomfort sometimes...it's like I can feel the tablet which does seem unbelievable due to how tiny it is.
Think I'm just very sensitive down there...
😔
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So does anyone know if you can use vagifem at any time of day?
I have just looked at the instruction leaflet in my pack. It doesn't mention any need to do it at a particular time of the day.
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Hi I use mine in the morning, you can use it any time of day. I've never had any problems. I don,t get on with the oestrogen creams at all they really irritate me.
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Hi I use mine in the morning, you can use it any time of day. I've never had any problems. I don,t get on with the oestrogen creams at all they really irritate me.
Like Estriol you mean? I have just dropped that because I had to go to the loo so many times during the night. i also wonder whether it is less effective because it comes out when you pee.
I think I will try applying Vagifem in the morning too.
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Hi katejo, yes estriol cream irritated me so bad after 1 application it took me days to get back to normal. I now use Vagifem every other day only ever in the morning.
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Hi katejo, yes estriol cream irritated me so bad after 1 application it took me days to get back to normal. I now use Vagifem every other day only ever in the morning.
I used Estriol off and on for a while and initially didn't connect this irritation with the product. I just thought it was a symptom of a UTI. Then I used it again once recently and had a really bad reaction so I looked up side effects and concluded that the Estriol was the cause.
I have just switched to trying vagifem in the morning so will see if that is better.
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Well it seems I can't tolerate the multi gyn actigel either. Been burning since using it yesterday and I'm back to square one with my symptoms. I must just be very sensitive. I'm miserable 😩
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:hug:
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Hi Blot,
Can't you perhaps make an appr with your GP and get some other type of HRT for your VA.
It's such a miserable thing I know, hope you feel better soon 😔
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Thanks.
I've got an appointment next week so I'll see how I get on in the meantime.
Haven't got much faith in gp tbh. I think she was going to give me meds for overactive bladder until I mentioned atrophy. I've made a double appointment slot and might take hubby with me as well.
If things don't improve I might have to give the vagifem another shot as I'll have nothing to lose.
Meantime I'm throwing everything at this. Even though it's not a uti tonight I've taken cystitis sachets, d mannose, antihistamine and ibuprofen.
People just don't talk about this do they? I've mentioned it to a few people and they have never heard of this and don't understand.
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Blot - I can't remember whether you had seen a urologist?
You should be referred if this is an ongoing problem just in case there is a deep infection that needs more appropriate treatment. It might also give you peace of mind if you had a cystoscopy.
It does sound as though you have an over active bladder and this can be helped with appropriate advice. Local oestrogen and/or medication will only do so much if the bladder has tightened, so it needs to trained to hold more urine again.
My theory is that as we age and with the bladder loosing good function due to the lack of oestrogen, everything becomes squashed and lax in our lower abdomen so at night when we lie down the bladder can fill more easily - hence the extra trips to the loo at night. I find that during the day I pass much less urine!??
Clenching and feeling stressed about it all makes it worse. I can't sit down for too long or I start to burn and whenever I have my urine tested there is always blood present and apparently this is quite normal for urogenital atrophy!
All I know is that the Vagifem has improved things so I will never stop using it but I did sting and burn a bit in the first few weeks of use as it began to work it's magic. Using Multi Gyn the morning after really helped reduce the burning. DGx
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Thanks.
I've got an appointment next week so I'll see how I get on in the meantime.
Haven't got much faith in gp tbh. I think she was going to give me meds for overactive bladder until I mentioned atrophy. I've made a double appointment slot and might take hubby with me as well.
If things don't improve I might have to give the vagifem another shot as I'll have nothing to lose.
Meantime I'm throwing everything at this. Even though it's not a uti tonight I've taken cystitis sachets, d mannose, antihistamine and ibuprofen.
People just don't talk about this do they? I've mentioned it to a few people and they have never heard of this and don't understand.
After suffering badly over the weekend with cystitis like symptoms, I used Vagifem yesterday morning and things improved over the day. By this morning it was much better so I used it again today. I then went to the GP practice for my flu jab. It was done by their new pharmacist so I took the opportunity to ask her view on using Vagifem more than twice in the week (after the initial 2 weeks). She said she understood that I had tried the correct procedure but it wasn't enough. However she would have to speak to my GP about me using it more than twice a week. She suggested 3 times but no more. She said she would ask the GP to ring me tomorrow about it. She did at least say that I would get another prescription. I have almost run out of the first one.
I really hope that things get better for you. I agree that most people don't talk about it but do occasionally chat to 1 colleague who is a couple of years older than I am.
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Hi Dancinggirl. No I haven't seen a urologist. I've had a pelvic scan and they looked at the bladder.
I don't think I've got an overactive bladder tbh. I think it might be atrophy but I could be wrong. It's more of a soreness and now I don't feel like I need to go all the time, although when I do need to go it's a bit painful - not painful to wee, just the pressure.
I think I panicked when I used the vagifem because I felt more sore and uncomfortable and got really anxious, which does make me pee more. And when I was peeing it was proper volumes, not just drops if you know what I mean. I'm finding it hard to believe that one little tablet caused all that bother?
I'm going to give it a few days and maybe try again when I'm not at work, and use it in the morning so I can cope better if I have stinging etc. I can't go back to docs if I haven't given it a proper go. I can't use the actigel though, it stings too much.
Thank you Katejo. I'm glad you are feeling a bit better. I don't see how your gp can object to this if it is relieving your symptoms.
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Well I decided to give it another go and have used the vagifem this morning.
Does it matter how high you insert it? Last time I put it in very high up but this time not so high. I'm a bit of a nervous wreck, which always makes me want to pee more but hopefully I can tolerate it this time.
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Well I decided to give it another go and have used the vagifem this morning.
Does it matter how high you insert it? Last time I put it in very high up but this time not so high. I'm a bit of a nervous wreck, which always makes me want to pee more but hopefully I can tolerate it this time.
Good luck with it Blot! Let us know how it goes. I don't know if it makes a difference. I pushed it as far as it naturally wanted to go without any discomfort/resistance.
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Thanks Katejo.
Much better than last time. I'm still sore but no worse than I was before and haven't been running to loo all day. It also hasn't fallen out lol.
I was just wondering if you still get the full effect if it's not right up high. I didn't want to push it as far as it would go like I did last time in case it gave me the same problems.
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Thanks Katejo.
Much better than last time. I'm still sore but no worse than I was before and haven't been running to loo all day. It also hasn't fallen out lol.
I was just wondering if you still get the full effect if it's not right up high. I didn't want to push it as far as it would go like I did last time in case it gave me the same problems.
I don't know the answer to this Blot. Maybe someone else will?
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I have been using it lower down, at the front where it is near my bladder (rather than my bowel - you need to look at sideways diagrams)
When I have used it every day, I alternate.
Hope it goes well for you. If my bladder is irritated, then I drink plenty of water during a day, to get my bladder full and stretch it a little - it calms things (you need a day where you can be close to the loo ::) )
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Well what a dreadful night I've had. In and out of sleep and sore and burning all night. Been really hot as well. I was dreaming a lot and can't be sure if my many symptoms were actually real but I know for sure the pain was.
The idea of using the vagifem in the morning was so I could deal with symptoms better during the day but that didn't work. I don't know if it starts to work immediately or as soon as it dissolves but I was OK during the day yesterday and it got worse in the evening closer to bedtime which would be 12 hours after insertion.
I'm a bit better now and I'm going to use the vagifem again this morning and see what happens.
I know the list of side effects is just everything under the sun but can vagifem really cause weight gain and hair loss? Surely its too small of a dose and too localised to do this?
I'm just trying to understand what's going on but have to give it a proper go no matter how miserable its making me and I have a million and one questions.
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Blot - I don't think it's necessarily the Vagifem causing your problems. You are very anxious about using this so I suspect you are clenching and when the urethra is sore and inflamed (which happens following an infection or as a result of atrophy) then the clenching makes things worse.
We are told to do pelvic floor exercises but we are seldom told to practise completely relaxing our pelvic floor.
I assume you taking showers, not baths, and taking great care not to let anything perfumed( especially shampoo) get anywhere near your intimate area? Are you avoiding caffiene, fruit juices and highly acidic foods?
You also need to try and put your feet up and completely relax your pelvic region for half and hour in the middle of the day if possible.
I also suspect your vaginal flora is out if balance. I do know that Multi Gyn Actigel stings after application but have you tried using a small amount on the end of your finger and pushing this up inside 2-3 times a day and, after inserting the gel, wet some kitchen roll with cold water and hold this to your intimate area, for about a minute, to cool the area and help it to relax?
I know my urethra is very sensitive and will react to any changes in the flora and this will make me burn and want to pee.
I use a whole variety of strategies to keep things comfortable and by using the Vagifem every 3 days with Multi Gyn (occasionally when needed) and Sylk every day, I can control things most of the time. I still get up to pee between 3-4 times at night because that seems to be when my bladder fills up.
Sitting too long, getting very hot around my intimate area, tight trousers and of course sex, all tend to trigger problems.
BUT relaxing and letting the air get to my intimate area really helps.
BTW - do not wear pajama bottoms or pants in bed. DG x
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Thanks Dancinggirl.
It probably isn't the vagifem causing the problems but I am so anxious about all of this and can't think about anything else. I've got to give it a proper go.
I am just baffled about the symptoms and doubting at times whether this is VA. I'm second guessing everything.
I apologise as well as I do go on a bit, but this is the only place I can discuss it.
I feel kind of full inside the vagina, maybe swollen and sore? Does that make any sense? I didn't start out like this though, I just felt like I needed to pee all the time and this soreness started about a month later. So now I've got both. Is this VA?
Ive cut out caffeine, have a small caffeine free coffee occasionally and no fruit juices. Can't identify any food or drinks that set me off. Wine makes no difference but I've decided to stop that as well.
The multi gyn hurt for a good hour after I last used it and I thought it aggravated things so not keen to use it. Mind I did use the applicator and probably squirted too much in. Waiting for my free sample if sylk to try.
How soon after using the vagifem can I use the other stuff? Bearing in mind I am doing mornings.
Being sweaty down below doesn't help things I agree. I suffer at work where its hot and we wear trousers with our uniform. Going to look for a suitable skirt for coolness. I wear loose fitting cotton PJs for bed. I can't wear nothing as my legs stick together and I get too hot.
Got a double slot appointment at docs next week so planning on taking hubby with me to discuss things. He's good and asks loads of relevant questions. I'll only have been using the vagifem for a week by then, after a false start last week, but my last appointment was too rushed and I wasn't very impressed.
I think I could do with being on an anti anxiety med but I'm very reluctant to do that. Another long story!
Thanks for the comments. I appreciate all the support so much because its not something you can discuss in real life.
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Day 4 and things still no different.
Well that's not strictly true. I've had a few hours here and there that have been ok. But still sore and uncomfortable. Look a bit red down there but the sylk is helping a bit. Bladder not too bad just this soreness getting me down.
I shall carry on until wed when I go back to docs and see whether she advises to carry on and if she can give me anything to help.
I had an epic meltdown on Thursday. Cried for hours. Cried a bit more on Friday but managed to hold it together for my half day at work.
Please tell me it gets better and that I'm not a total lost cause.
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Well not a good day yesterday and another awful night :'(
I am really thinking of just stopping this and seeing how I get on. I just can't think of anything else.
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I can't use sylk, multi gyn, coconut oil without burning and lots of irritation. I think you should just use the Vagifem and see if things improve then introduce one thing at a time so you know what is ok and what causes irritation. The only moisturisor I can tolerate is YES, it's organic without chemicals and you can get it on prescription.
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I seem to be ok with the sylk but multi gyn burns too much.
Can't wait till Wednesday to see the doctor but I just know I'm going to burst into tears and not be able to speak :'(
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Thanks Sparkle. I am not using the multi gyn any more.
Did the vagifem make things worse to start with? That's what's so disheartening and makes me think that I am allergic to the fillers.
My doc will probably just go along with what I want but I need some proper informed advice.
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Seems like I'm the only one who has got worse on the vagifem then.
I think I'm going to have to stop it.
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Seems like I'm the only one who has got worse on the vagifem then.
I think I'm going to have to stop it.
Hi Blot I have had irritation intermittently which makes it difficult to know whether it is caused by the Vagifem or whether it comes from not applying the Vagifem every day ( only 2-3 times a week as the GP pharmacist claims is allowed/safe). Yesterday morning I applied one. Later in the day I had some irritation and was going to the loo more often but by the evening the problem had improved a lot. Maybe because I was at a social do and my mind was taken off it? I really don't know. Hoping to speak to the GP tomorrow but missed the last 2 attempts to ring me because the practice can't tell me when she will ring. I easily miss the calls.
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What do you mean by irritation Katejo?
Its my uretha hurting and feeling like I need a wee constantly, which is what happened when this all started. But I don't think it was as intense as this, or have I forgotten.
Sparkle, I wasn't really that sore in the vagina and outside, more uncomfortable and aware. Gp never mentioned it when she examined me. Not convinced I have atrophy. It was me who suggested it.
Desperate for answers and appreciate the support.
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What do you mean by irritation Katejo?
Its my uretha hurting and feeling like I need a wee constantly, which is what happened when this all started. But I don't think it was as intense as this, or have I forgotten.
Sparkle, I wasn't really that sore in the vagina and outside, more uncomfortable and aware. Gp never mentioned it when she examined me. Not convinced I have atrophy. It was me who suggested it.
Desperate for answers and appreciate the support.
Hi Blot I mean a feeling similar to cystitis (particularly on the left side of the vagina) and frequent visits to the loo. I don't have any soreness around the area. If you go to the loo, do you actually pass urine or is there actually none there?
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Yes when I go to the loo I do pass urine. Feels like I've been holding on to it for hours though.
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Yes when I go to the loo I do pass urine. Feels like I've been holding on to it for hours though.
I have just seen the following comment on part of the Patient Forum. This woman seems to have had irritation to start with but then things improved. See the last sentence.
"the same happened to me with getting many UTI's before I was diagnosed with VA.......thankfully I have a wonderful GYN doctor. And yes once we have VA we will have to use Vagifem indefinitely........but grateful it gives us quality if life.....such a blessing. Yes, it does take time for the Vagifem to heal the vaginal area.....but ladies hang in there and be patient. Some will experience pressure to pee but in time that goes away as well!
I also saw a comment from another woman (US I think from her language) who was told by an unsympathetic doctor to stop complaining about VA because she was far better off than someone on life support!!
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I saw a urologist because I had the constant burning urethra and my urine always had nloodvpresent but no infection. I had the usual investigations - kidney scan and cystoscopy. He also stretched my urethra which was most unpleasant and didn't help the discomfort at all.
Nothing untoward was found and he simply told me I probably had interstitial cystitis caused by urogenital atrophy and he recommended I continue with Vagifem.
Intestinal cystitis is a diagnosis given when they don't really know what is truly wrong. It seems that there are many peri and post meno women that suffer with this and it's often dismissed by doctors.
I now have the burning under control most of the time but it flares up really easily. I'm going with my 90 year mum to the Canaries in December and I'm dreading the flight - sitting for over 3 hours will definitely be a trigger even if I get up a few times to move around.
I have to keep my urine really neutral ( so no fruit juices or caffiene), ensure the flora balance is good inside my vagina by using all the products I've mentioned before to maintain a healthy environment - it's a constant process.
I started the thread called ‘The Burning Club' on this forum (do look at it) which really highlights how many women suffer with this.
DG x
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Thank you Katejo and DG.
I'm going to discuss with the doc on Wednesday. A big part of my problems is the anxiety I have over it. If I can relax then things calm down. A glass of wine will do it but I can't go down that route.
I'm scared of antidepressants and couldn't handle the side effects as well as all this. I'm getting really low though and this is affecting my whole life. I don't want to go anywhere or do anything and I'm avoiding people as I don't want to pretend to be OK. So I do need help in that department.
Yesterday I used the multi gyn just on the outside on the uretha and it helped. So that's good.
I'm sorry you have to keep going over the same things with me DG. I am listening but Im so fed up and I'm constantly looking for reassurance to make me feel better.
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Thank you Sparkle. Glad to hear things improved for you.
I just don't know what's going on with me. Do the symptoms if VA vary from day to day? Yesterday was so good. Didn't feel like I needed to wee all day, just normal pressure when I did need to go, and hardly any soreness underneath. I was at work and distracted i suppose. Then about 9 pm after dinner it all started again and lasted overnight.
I was in two minds whether to cancel tomorrow's appointment as I felt I'd turned a corner. Good job I didn't. I'm a nervous wreck and my heart is racing all the time and I've got a bit of an upset stomach since yesterday as well.
Think I really need to address this anxiety and sort myself out.
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I find my worse enemy is stress and anxiety, it makes my VA ten times worse. When I'm relaxed it's fine. It a vicious circle I know but try to relax, it really does make a difference.
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Yes Dierdre. Anxiety makes it so much worse and if I relax everything is better. Not just this but everything.
Can't relax though.
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Do the symptoms if VA vary from day to day? Sometimes I realise that I haven't used the vagifem in a while, and everything actually feels better. Then an hour later, I rush to the loo, wet my drawers and everything looks purple and feels swollen. ::)
I think there are a lot of stop - start problems when you first start to use it and you need the other products to help tie you over. Once you have used it regularly for a good while, it is much better (unless you forget ::) ) I have found Dermol useful for washing at times.
My first symptoms were ongoing non specific infection-like symptoms for which I had swabs and no infection, and unpredictable catastrophic incontinence (no one has done a sample for that). There was also much ****liness, itching and loss of hair.
I recommend a drinking plenty during the day to stretch your bladder if it is over sensitive. I just do it for the day then try and make sure I do not dehydrate after that. I have been offered things for irritable bladder before but these cause other problems and doing this sorts me for several weeks at a time.
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Do the symptoms if VA vary from day to day? Sometimes I realise that I haven't used the vagifem in a while, and everything actually feels better. Then an hour later, I rush to the loo, wet my drawers and everything looks purple and feels swollen. ::)
I think there are a lot of stop - start problems when you first start to use it and you need the other products to help tie you over. Once you have used it regularly for a good while, it is much better (unless you forget ::) ) I have found Dermol useful for washing at times.
My first symptoms were ongoing non specific infection-like symptoms for which I had swabs and no infection, and unpredictable catastrophic incontinence (no one has done a sample for that). There was also much ****liness, itching and loss of hair.
I recommend a drinking plenty during the day to stretch your bladder if it is over sensitive. I just do it for the day then try and make sure I do not dehydrate after that. I have been offered things for irritable bladder before but these cause other problems and doing this sorts me for several weeks at a time.
I have had loss of hair but had never associated that with VA at all. I just thought it was a natural part of menopause. I have had recurrent UTI symptoms and have also had microscopic blood traces in urine (which have been tested/checked but VA wasn't suggested as a cause). I haven't had any incontinence problems at all.
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Thanks everyone.
I will speak to my doctor tomorrow. I am going to carry on using this, after all I've only been on it for 7 days. I'm going to ask for something to just calm me down a bit - I've been running on adrenaline for months now and all the crying over the past 2 weeks is ridiculous.
I seem to have got myself until such a state of anxiety that I can't come down from it and the expression “heart in your mouth “ totally applies to me all of the time. But I don't really want antidepressants.
I cannot convey just how much I appreciate you all taking the time to help me, an anonymous person on the internet, with all of this. I'm overwhelmed with your kindness. Thank you.
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Hope you get on alright at the doctors tomorrow Blot.
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Here's a link if you want to join. All welcome. :)
https://m.facebook.com/groups/1505719029448248?ref=m_notif¬if_t=group_comment_mention
I have just ordered the book and will look at this FB link too. When you ordered Vagifem from the Superdrug site, how did it deal with the required permission from a GP? I have never ordered any medication online but did look at 1 site. There were many questions.
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Well back from docs. She decided I should stop vagifem and gave me some cream to try and settle things down and I'm going to see another gp in the practice next week who specialises in womens health. Hopefully she will be more clued up than this one.
So I'll try this and see what the other one has to say.
I mentioned my anxiety over it all, and in general, and the only suggestion was antidepressants, which I said I didn't want, but I was trying to hold it all together so didn't go too far with that. I did cry a little bit :'(
Its just trial and error isn't it ladies and the main thing for me is going to be to keep my anxiety under control without resorting to the bottle :o
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Thanks Birdy.
How does this Facebook thing work then? I am on Facebook already but wouldn't want this linked to the VA one. Do you have to set up a new account and will everyone know who I am?
I am anxious and I'm really disappointed in my doctor for not recognising that and offering any suggestions, especially as I was crying in front of her.
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Facebook can go World Wide if 1 isn't careful :o
Birdy - your GP needs educating :bang: :bang: :bang:.
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Yes Blot they would know who you are although I doubt people would work it out from this forum to FB if you didn't mention MM on FB! It's also a secret group but obviously anyone can join. I keep menaing to start another FB account specifically for the MM FB page ( so I can comment without letting my sons and their friends see what I say!) and other similar groups but so far have too many other things to do!
Blot I hope the cream she has given you is either generic Estriol 0.01% or Ovestin (as Birdy suggests) as you do need local oestrogen to keep VA at bay.
Hurdity x
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No Hurdity. Neither of those.
Some caneston hydrocortisone cream for the outside, which I know is probably useless but hopefully the other doc next week will have more of a clue. I will def mention the cream next week.
I am just hoping these few days off will settle things down if I am reacting to the fillers in the vagifem. Then I can start afresh and at least I will know what to expect.
I'm going to go prepared with notes etc and hope she can give me better advice as the last gp was pretty clueless.
I'm disappointed.
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Canestan products sent me to the bath within minutes :o :o - I was in cool water for over an hour :'( B4 the reaction subsided . Cortisone creams should not be used if one is sensitive down there ;-).
I find that Savlon or KY Jelly on the outer lips eases dryness which lessens any discomfort. Used often. B4 the skin dries. If possible, go without panties - let the air get to it ;) and certainly get rid of panty liners as some cause reactions. Cotton knickers and no thongs ;-).
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I'm don't feel dry CLKD, inside or out. The caneston didn't really sting much but I'm not going to use it.
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Yes the doc said there was no point testing my urine sample because if I wasn't stinging when I wee it was unlikely to be an infection. I was too upset to argue that menopausal women can often get utis without any obvious symptoms. I didn't go there specifically thinking I had a uti but I asked about this and whether I might now have a vaginal infection and was told no, because I'd already had a pelvic exam and all looked ok. Yeah, 6 weeks ago, things can change! Just trying to cover all the bases.
I need to chuck out all that actigel that people swear by in here. I used it today and it's set me off again :(
I've joined the Facebook group. How you doing Birdy?
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Have you stopped the vagifem Birdy? I note from a previous post that you felt better having not used one?
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Yes the doc said there was no point testing my urine sample because if I wasn't stinging when I wee it was unlikely to be an infection. I was too upset to argue that menopausal women can often get utis without any obvious symptoms. I didn't go there specifically thinking I had a uti but I asked about this and whether I might now have a vaginal infection and was told no, because I'd already had a pelvic exam and all looked ok. Yeah, 6 weeks ago, things can change! Just trying to cover all the bases.
I need to chuck out all that actigel that people swear by in here. I used it today and it's set me off again :(
I've joined the Facebook group. How you doing Birdy?
Most of my Uti infections have been free of stinging / burning.
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I stopped the Vagifem because it hurt like a mofo even after three months. I just used Estriol cream now. I used Ovestin too but that stung as well.
I have given up on Estriol cream. It irritates me a lot and makes me go to and fro from the bathroom all night. I seem to be doing better with the Vagifem at the moment. I haven't tried Ovestin.
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Think I might go to the GUM clinic then as well just to rule out a skin condition.
They have a walk in at one of our local hospitals.
Omg yes the anxiety. That's why I'm up at 3 am looking at GUM clinic times!
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Think I might go to the GUM clinic then as well just to rule out a skin condition.
They have a walk in at one of our local hospitals.
Omg yes the anxiety. That's why I'm up at 3 am looking at GUM clinic times!
Does GUM stand for something? The name reminds me of my 6th form trip to Moscow/Leningrad in 1982 when GUM was the name of the Moscow shopping arcade where you had to queue up twice every time, firstly to be given a ticket and secondly to actually pay.