Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => Personal Experiences => Topic started by: suey43 on September 22, 2014, 07:12:43 PM
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Hello,
Been taking HRT for a few weeks. Main symptoms are palpitations and anxiety. Still suffering and now feeling quite depressed and 'weird' - cant think of another way to describe it
GP now thinks I need extra help and has given me Citalapram 10mg to try. Anyone found these worked? Haven't started then yet but an pretty desperate to deep better as am now having to take time off work as its all too much
Never had anxiety or this very strange feeling before even during extremely stressful times.
Any advice appreciated.
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Most medications have initial side effects, it all depends on whether the patient is able to tolerate them long enough to let the medication begin to work. HRT also takes time to kick in.
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suey43 - A colleague of mine at work who was suffering dreadfully with meno symptoms and anxiety is using HRt alongside Citalopram and I have to say she is a new women.
EVeryone is different and as CLKD says, I think you have to get throughout the initial side effects before you feel the benefit. Good luck Dg x
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I am a bit sensitive to most meds.
They made me sick and very light headed and I couldn't stop shaking. Everyone is different though and you won't know until you try.
Honeyb
x
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Hello,
Thanks for replies everyone.
Just been doing the old googling of SSRIs which has scared me to death. So many scare stories about how they change your brain, potentially for ever.
Everything seems so daunting. Hard to make such a big decision when you're not feeling yourself.
Still unsure whether to take them. Taking a few days off work to try and get a bit more perspective.
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I felt like that too , its horrible, perhpaps give the HRT a bit more time , it could be 3 months before you get full benefits, maybe they need to up the dose?
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Suey 43 citalopram seems to be a favourite at the moment but I wonder if there are better ones for anxiety. I found even 10 mg after about 6 weeks gave me achey limbs and sweats. Only realised what it was when I checked the leaflet.
Some people find Prozac good or a beta blocker but unfortunately you have to try them first really. It's a tough time for you and you need a good supportive doctor. Keep us posted as to how you get on.
Kelly x
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Of course they change your brain :bang: :bang: :bang: ....... ::) the brain is an organ very often neglected. Until depression sets in. If you are hungry, do you not eat? If you have pain, do you not take relief? For many years I fought against taking ADs because I need/ed to know what is causing my constant depression. Usually it's lack of chemicals. When I accepted that I need to take a low maintance dose FOR LIFE, I was able to move forwards.
Many things we eat/drink/imbibe - do nor not - alter our bodies/brain for ever!
What scares you the most?
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Bravo CLKD. Just as there are so many silly scare stories about HRT, there are negative accounts about almost any drug. If anxiety and depression are ruining your life and you have tried CBT etc, then it makes sense that ADs are the answer. It's worth giving them a go and if they don't suit you, then stop.
I think one of the down sides of this site is you can get some mixed messages as there will always be positive and negative experiences that are shared. It is easy to latch onto the negative stories. It is very difficult to be objective about yourself and to know what is the best thing to do - especially if you are anxious or depressed. Sometimes you just have to trust your doctor and go with their advice - they may well be right. DG x
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I agree with DancingGirl and CKLD on this one. If you trust your GP to do the best for you its worth giving ADs a go. I held out for a while and then my GP compared the high blood pressure med I have been taking for years to keep BP stable to taking citalopram to keep serotonin stable and it seemed to make sense to give it a try. Yes there were some side effects and yes it took some time to work but if you don't feel it is right for you after a while you can always stop them (albeit slowly). There still seems to be a stigma attached to ADs, as if you have failed in some way if you need them, but you have to do what is necessary to feel the best you can-life is too short to spend it on a state of constant anxiety! Hope you feel better soon
Thorntrees
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I would suggest that you have a long chat with your GP. Talk through the various anti-depressant options. Ask how they work, what they are designed for and what other conditions they might help because some ADs have been found to help with hot flushes. If you decide to go the AD route, how about taking 2 weeks from work? That way you aren't ruled by the alarm, you don't have to justfiy yourself to anyone and you can take your time adjusting.
It can take up to 3 months before a sufferer begins to realise that actually, they are beginning to feel better. ;)
Also the ADs used now are NOT like the valium-types used in the 1960s so a patient cannot become 'hooked'. The brain can become used to a drug so it may require weaning off because the side-effects felt initially come back, but they are not addictive.
Also - again ::) - why feel that you have to explain that you are taking ADs :-\ - do you tell people each time you go to the loo, when you change your socks, which cereal you eat?
Keeping a mood/food diary can help as can a journal - vent, vent, vent ......... once the depression and anxiety 'lifts' we can see the 'wood for the trees' and can make more informed decisions.
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suey43 - I think CLKD and thorntrees have given you brilliant advice - do read their last posts carefully and follow their advice - sometimes we just need to be told what to do.
DG x
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So true ::) - the times DH used to shout across the room when I was giving advice "Wish you would take your own advice" ……… ;D and he told me over and over and ………. "your body is hungry so EAT" ….. we are lucky in the West that we have choices, GPs to discuss issues with, no outside influence telling girls that they can't go to School or have medication or ……….
I find that if I take a list with me my GP/Practice Nurse can go through it with me.
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Thanks everyone for your very helpful advice - I appreciate it so much. You're all so kind to take the time to help.
It's so good to hear from people who've been through similar tough times. Am also seeing a counsellor this week so may talk about CBT to see if that could help.
Good idea about taking time off work - I'm doing that this week to give me some thinking time.
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Notwithstanding the helpful advice you have been given about ADs from those who take them or know of them, I still think you have not given HRT enough time to work - and even whether you know if it is the right preparation for you. I think we have maybe discusssed on another thread - but I can't remember your circumstances and what HRT you are on?
A few weeks definitely is not long enough - if the palpitations and anxeity and weirdness are new to you and you don't have a history of depression, and you can find other ways to cope, I would try to do so before starting the ADs. You don't sound that keen on trying them anyway and I might be repeating myself when I say, that if it is the HRT type that is helping to make you feel weird, what you don't need is to take another kind of medication to counter this feeling.
As I said, if you can cope I would really try to see if you can find an HRT regime that will suit you - and this will take time, and maybe a bit of trial and error.
Hurdity x
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A problem shared etc. and BT used to tell us 'it's good to talk' ::) ........ at least here we can share and ask and take on board what might work for us. Also nothing is for ever so if you don't find a med which works you can discuss other options with the GP/Practice Nurse. Trouble is, once I wanted help I wanted it yesterday .........
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Hi Suey43
What hrt are you on? I too suffer from anxiety, and am on everol sequi patches now, im on the third week of the second month on them, previous to that I was on elleste duet which I couldn't get on with, well not the green tablets which included progesterone anyway, I also tried citalopram but only managed too take four as I felt v low, it may not have been them not sure if four would have any effect, but I had to come off them and felt better when I did, with me the anxiety makes me nervous of being on hrt and taking anything alongside it, I would agree you should give the hrt a chance, Im going to try it for at least three months, I have good and bad days, its helped flushes and night sweats, but I still get bad anxiety on times, good luck x
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Hi Suey43
I've used citalopram for about 9yrs now (30mg daily), when meno kicked in for me I was in full breakdown mode again and I was using citalopram at the time and thought it had stopped working.
After two years of trying different HRT's I've finally started to settle. I use Citalopram 30mg, Evorel 50 patch and Utrogestan 200 for 12 days. I must say the majority of the time I feel great. I still have a few ups and downs as we all do, hormone related or not.
I will say though it will take a few weeks for the citalopram to do its thing but it's great for anxiety, I upped my does gradually untill I found the correct dose for me, that's the good thing about it, you can play with it untill you get it right.
With the right combination of HRT and AD's you will definately get your life back.
We are all different, some of us sail through meno without noticing it and some of us need a little help along the way.
As long as you feel well it doesn't matter.
Good luck
Shellb
xXx
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Hello,
I'm on Evorel 100 patches and was on Elleste solo for 4 weeks before that. GP thinks that HRT alone isn't enough to help. Have to say I think I feel worse rather than better at the mo.
Am trying to stop other drugs she gave me - beta blockers, sleeping tabs and diazepam as have been taking them for a few weeks, but now can't sleep at all. Have had about an hour's sleep last night and feel pretty desperate TBH.
Just don't know what to do. Still haven't taken the ADs. Cannot believe how bad I feel after never having any anxiety or depression or insomnia in my whole life before. Does feel like I'm going crazy and can't cope with it :(
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:)
Citalopram has really helped me, I increased to 20mg from 10 and my anxiety has really gone down.
I need help re my flushes.
I have been taking Evorel patches for a long time, they worked well.
I stopped for a matter of less than 2 weeks !! and now they are waking me overnight. Why ?
Someone said use half patch, but this is not advisable. I am using full patch changing twice a week.
Can anyone help re this ?
thanks
Haze :(
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suey43
That is quite a cocktail of drugs you are trying to come off all at once - no wonder you can't sleep. Have you been advised about how to withdraw these drugs? Maybe your GP wants you to start the Citalopram to counter balance the withdrawal effects? I don't know anything about ADs so I think you need to go back to your GP to ask for advice and support about what to expect when coming off all these drugs.
Hi Hazel and welcome to MM
I'm not entirely sure what you are asking. Have you stopped using the Evorel patches for just 2 weeks and then started again? If so why?
Is it the flushes that are waking you?
My thoughts are, if you stopped the patches for 2 weeks you will have unbalanced your hormones and this could give you disturbed sleep. If you are now back using the patches it could take a bit of time for your body to get back the hormone balance and stop the flushes. Many of us find (me included) that without HRT sleeping does become a problem.
Good luck both. DG x
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I agree that's a huge amount of withdrawal to cope with. Valium and BBs are after all, prescribed in order to ease anxiety surges. Did your GP suggest that you stop all at once? I take Cipralex, BBs regularly and if necessary and emergency Valium-type drug.
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Thanks again for your replies Hazel, DG and CLKG - really appreciate it.
To be fair to my GP she didn't tell me to stop taking them (well not until I start with the ADs anyway), but I was worried that they were the things making me feel so 'weird'.
Had weaned myself off sleeping pills (zopiclone) and was taking Nytol instead, thinking they were less harmful. The night before last just took beta blocker but slept very badly. Last night took nothing for the first time in ages. Although I coped with the anxiety i just couldn't sleep. I guess I was feeling dependent on them and wanted to see if I could manage without all these drugs.
Sometimes they do help with one thing but side-effects can be difficult to cope with. I felt really funny in the head during the day most days (like I'd never felt before). Difficult as not sleeping also makes you feel pretty funny in the head too!! Was only taking diazepam occasionally (as I was told when they were prescribed) although had to take one today as had to go out and couldn't manage without something to calm me down.
One of the reasons I'm putting off taking the ADs is that I haven't had proper CBT yet and that seems to be highly rated for anxiety. Also going to a menopause clinic soon and was hoping they'd have some advice too. All in all I'm an indecisive wreck aren't i?!!
Think never having had issues like this I'm really blind-sided by it all TBH - just don't feel like me at all and guess I feel like in some way I'm failing (although rationally I know I can't help it).
Sorry for awfully long ramble…. http://www.menopausematters.co.uk/forum/Smileys/extended/wink.gif
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You ramble, that's what we are here for. Getting it down onto paper can clear the head!
CBT can help some people. How long do you have to wait for an appt.?
Blind-sided - that's a really good expression - I think many here can relate to those words!
You are unlikely to be dependant physically but emotionally one thinks 'I wonder if I will sleep without ..... ' which then triggers the brain to stay awake; to see if we do/not ........ maybe 2-night, take a book to bed, read until you feel dozey. Or do crosswords. Whatever, soft music helped me.
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Hello again,
Had first couple of CBT sessions but didn't feel like they were going anywhere and feel v disappointed. Kept a sleep diary for 2 weeks and therapist just asked if I could see any patterns and when I said no she said "oh well there's nothing more we can do then as this is only offered for 2 weeks". She didn't seem to know what to say to me and kept asking me what I wanted. I'm so confused that I just don't know what I need or want and was hoping she would!
Sorry for moan. Am thinking of finding someone else now (these sessions were only 25 mins via the phone so probably not enough). Anyone found CBT helps?
Feeling much better today after sleeping last night (took a beta blocker and a Nytol and slept really well) - phew!
xx
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Hi suey43 - If you are sleeping with just a beta blocker and a Nytol then maybe using this combo every other night for a few days will get you back on track. I'm afraid 2 weeks of CBT over the phone is probably not going to reap benefits - sounds bonkers to me. I think many people expect any type of therapist to tell them what you should do and that is not their job - they are meant to help you make your own decisions! I had a whole year of therapy - one hour per week - and I still used some of the techniques I learned.
I think trying to be objective about what is your best route is very challenging. You have been given such an array of different things to try and you are now trying to ween yourself off some of the nastier ones - which is tough.
My GP did suggest I read the book Mindfulness by Mark Williams and Danny Penman. I do practise this 'Mindful Meditation' and I think it does help to keep calmer and more in control - maybe worth and try? Certainly a cheaper option. Finding a good therapist to help is time consuming and expensive.
If I remember right, you are on HRT? I would continue with this as in time it may help more that anything else. If you can slowly reduce your use of all the other drugs then do so. If in a 3-4 weeks you are still struggling then perhaps then start the Citalopram and give it at least a month to see if that helps alongside the HRT.
Does that sound like a plan?
DG xxxx
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Hello there Dancinggirl,
Thanks again for your advice - it sounds very sensible and is very much appreciated - THANK YOU!!
Yes, agree that BBs and a Nytol aren't too bad if you really can't sleep (2 days without sleep and I felt unbelievably awful and feel SO much better today after a good sleep). TBH think sleep is my main problem - if I could work out how to get to sleep like I was a few weeks ago then I could cope.
I do have that Mindfulness book and am just over half way through. Agree that it sounds like a useful strategy (have tried it one night and it did help me a lot). Also think that maybe I'm just too busy a lot of the time and don't have enough time to relax and recalibrate. May go down to working a 4 day week for a couple of weeks to see if that helps.
Yes, I'm on HRT and will certainly continue. My GP has been brilliant and has referred me to a menopause clinic in 2 week's time too in case they have any bright ideas. This is my 4th week on Everol patches (strongest 100mg dose) so maybe things will improve over the next few weeks. Really hope so. Have had a couple of stretches of a few days when I did feel better but have to say I think I felt worse when I went onto the strong does patches (was on Elleste 2mg tablets for 4 weeks before that). Maybe the strong HRT dose is a lot for your body to cope with so exacerbates symptoms at first?
Just been out and bought some B6 and magnesium as had read that this helped some people - am trying anything!!
Thanks again. xxx
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:hug:
4 day week sounds a good idea. I think we all need to pace ourselves during this challenging time. DG x
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Hi
I have taken Citralopam since a crisis last year, been on it about 15 months, started on 10, 20, 30 and now doing fine. I take Oestrogen 2mgs too and am a generally ok person again. Just has the death of my son aged 23 and still relatively functioning ...hugs Mrs January xx
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Oh my goodness Mrs January I am SO incredibly sorry to hear about your son. I can't imagine what you must be going through. Sounds like you're coping which is incredible.
Pleased to hear C has helped you. Must say if it helps in such circumstances then it must be good stuff - just sorry about the reasons why you need it.
You sound incredibly strong. Hope things get better. Big hugs to you xxxxxx
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Suey43 - I have taken Citalopram twice. Once for a major depressive episode some years ago when I would say they saved my life. Yes I had side effects in the first couple of weeks but they settled down and I did okay on them. I had a further depressive episode more recently, was prescribed exactly the same dose of Citalopram but this time side effects for me were unsustainable. No idea why the effect was different on separate occasions!
GP offered different ADs or counselling. I went for counselling which was not CBT but a 'mindfulness' based counselling giving coping techniques which seems to have helped to some extent.
So it's horses for courses I suppose and you may need to be prepared for a bit of trial and error until you find something that suits you.
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Hey Suey 43
Honey I took it last year due to reaching crisis and bad marriage etc. Now out of the mad marriage and had lots to cope with since, Jack's funeral on Thursday and I thank goodness for the C just now ...I plan to reduce it at some time but the loss of Jack is unbearable so we wait and see.
Try what you need hun and thing of it as just any meds to make you well, we all have a life to live and better for it if we are well honey
Love and hugs
Mrs J xxxxx
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MrsJ - wait at least until after New Year before even considering not taking it ;)
Sometimes the brain gets used to the concoction in a drug so won't absorb if given a 2nd/3rd time.
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Mrs J
What you're going through puts my trials into perspective. I'm SO sorry you're having such a traumatic time.
Sincere condolences and will be thinking of you on Thursday.
Very big hug and best wishes. Take care xxxxxx
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Hey Suey43
We all have stuff to bare honey.Life has just been harder on me this last two years.
Take each day as it comes, focus on priorities and don't let anxiety run away with you. I take C and am better for it, if I take it forever then so be it to keep my brain and I happy.
I cry each and every day just now for the loss of my boy Jack but he won't want me too forever and I treasure the memories he left me behind xxx
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How are you Mrs J?
Been thinking about you and what you've been through over the past few days.
S xxx
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Hi Suey
The days got tougher honey, as they do after a funeral. 200 plus at Jack's god love him...
Coroner's reports tomorrow for inquest so I hold myself tight some more for the days ahead.....How's u??
Love and hugs
Mrs January xx
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Sending my best wishes and sympathies to you and a big hug.
Thinking of you. Xxx
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Hi Suey43
Thanks honey, how's u?? I read the police reports and cried a river, but It gave me answers which have helped no end xxx
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Hi Suey43
Thanks honey, how's u?? I read the police reports and cried a river, but It gave me answers which have helped no end xxx
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So sorry Mrs J - sending hugs and best wishes xxx