Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => Other Health Discussion => Topic started by: purplenanny on February 03, 2014, 07:46:48 PM
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Hi ladies
I had an area on my face diagnosed as a bcc in November and have been waiting for an appointment for the op. I got the letter today and I am very worried.
The specialist I saw said the procedure will take an hour and half and the scar will be quite large on my cheek. He said he would personally do the op, which pleased me as he did one for my sister and she recommends him. But the letter states someone elses name/or a member of the team!
Does anyone have knowledge of this procedure? I read on google that Omhs('spelling) is one type they can do, where they take off layers of tissue until it has all gone. I have so many questions, maybe I should pay privately? No idea how much but at least I would know who I am getting. Oh dear, what to do? PN x x
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Phone & check with receptionist. I've had appointments through with different names, but when I got there actually saw who I was supposed to.
Not much help regarding procedure though.
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Thank you cubagirl. x x
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Hey
May have another name as they are part of a 'firm' it is a team of doctors, but if the guy said he would be operating I guess he will........you have your sisters reassurance too xxx
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No different going privately if the procedure and probably the surgeon are the same.
make a list of questions and ring his secretary!
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I looked up the surgeon online and he is very qualified with 35 years experience (hope he has a steady hand!!). Then I phoned the hospital and spoke of my concern re the letter saying 'or one of the team' - very nice lady confirmed the surgeon sees his own patients, it will definitely be him.
So, I have confirmed the appointment and will now worry myself silly until then! at least it takes my mind from other things!!
Thank you ladies - as always :thankyou: (http://:thankyou:) PN x x
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:tulips2: :tulips:
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Glad to hear you got in touch. One less worry. Let us know how you get on. :foryou:
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:foryou: Purplenanny x
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Thank you!
Yes, I will let you know how I get on. It is scheduled for 4th March. x x
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Hi there. I have had 3 BCCs removed over the last few years. I was worried when I was told what the first one was - (8 years ago or so) but honestly, it is nothing to worry about. It virtually never spreads so is the most benign of any type of cancer. You may have a small scar but I actually like my scars - I think they make me look like a lady pirate!
I have scars all over my back as I have had a number of (non malignant) moles removed as well as the 3 BCCs. I also have a small scar on my nose where a biopsy was taken but this turned out to be a pre-cancerous spot which was cured with a cream I had to put on every day for a fortnight.
I hope your procedure goes well, I'm sure that afterwards you will wonder why you were so worried. I found the only painful bit was having the anaesthetic injection.
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Thank you kes. I am not concerned about the cancer part as the surgeon told me he would remove all of it. It is just the procedure and scar. I have a phobia of needles which does not help.
Were yours on your face?
May I ask a few questions as you have experienced this? Unfortunately I have not had the opportunity to talk to the consultant as the appointments got messed up and he decided to skip the biopsy.
How big were your bcc's and how big in comparison are the scars? I have read they need to cut at least 4mm wider all around to ensure full removal.
Did they put a numbing cream on before the injection? The secretary said to ask on the day
How long did each operation take?
How long before the covering is removed?
I have been told initial healing takes approx 2 weeks, but how long before the bumpy bits settle?
I realise every case is different, but I do prefer to be prepared and know what to expect, so any info will be appreciated kes, thank you.
PN x x
Sent from Samsung tablet
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Hi
I don't know if this will help but I did have a mole removed from my face.
It was on my lipline and although not cancerous it wasn't pretty.
I have also had a mole removed from my shin and my husband has had several removed from his back.
My facial mole was removed by a plastic surgeon.
The injection did sting a bit but your face will not be as sensitive as a lipline!
It was only for a very short time until the injection took effect.
I had 3 stitches in my face for a week. The whole thing took about 15-20 minutes if that.
When the stitches were removed there was a small red line which went in about a week and honestly now you cannot see a thing- not even a tiny scar- it's amazing!
I am sure if you are in good hands then you will be fine.
Sarah x
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Hi sarah
ouch, a needle in or near your lip - the very thought of it makes me shudder!
Thank you for your reassurance
Mine is in the centre of my cheek and approx 1 inch diameter so I am guessing quite a few stitches.
pn x x
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Are they cutting it out or maybe shaving it off?
Is the surgeon a plastic surgeon? Can you talk to him before the day of the op?
My surgeon explained how the scar would be ( not that there is one now)- said it would be a vertical scar because this is more easily hidden in the lips than one going horizontally. As I said, there is no scar, which is great, but he did explain how he would cut the skin in a certain way so that drawing the edges together would be as 'scar-less' as possible.
Maybe if your man was to explain it all a bit more then you might feel more confident about him ( or not) and decide how good he is?
It may not be an option for you money-wise but if it was, then would you consider having it done privately if this meant you got him rather than one of the team?
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I believe they are cutting it out
According to his online profile he is a maxillofacial surgeon with 35 yrs experience and I have had it confirmed he always completes his own list of patients, none are passed to one of the team. I checked this out as the letter stated it like that and it worried me
hopefully I will be in good hands :-\ (http://:-\) PN x x
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sounds as if you are in good hands- hope it goes well.
xx
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purplenanny plastic surgeons (especially a maxillofacial surgeon) a are very skilled especially any surgery on the face, once the scar has knitted together one tip is to use Vitamin E on the scar, using a natural vitamin E capsule ( d not dl that's important) ask at the health shop. Piece the capsule and smooth on the scar, facial skin is different to the rest of the body and heals quickly with less scaring.
Don't worry about the injection even if he doesn't use Emla cream to numb the area (you have to put it on about 15-20 mins before injection)) , the needles they use are so fine that its like a pin **** and the numbing of the area is very quick.
I think the skin cream you had to put of other lesions might have been a type of Vitamin C cream (google it)
The worrying before is worse then the procedure purplenanny.
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Bio oil is very good for scars.
My mum had a long scar on her neck after an op and bio oil helped a lot.
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Hi again - I will try to answer your questions:
I had two BCCs on my back and one on my abdomen. I also had a biopsy on my nose - which involved removing a little bit of skin and I must admit the injection for that was painful - mainly because it was on bone. I don't think it would have been that painful on my cheek - no worse than a dental injection.
My BCCs were all about 5mm across. The scars are a few centimetres. I think when they send what they remove away for biopsy they can tell if they got it all or not - they always have on mine.
I did not have a numbing cream, but as you say, you can ask for it. Each procedure took about 20 minutes or so. One time I had two done (a BCC and a mole) and the surgeon let a student do one of them (with my permission) - he was so grateful and kind but VERY slow. I know you won't have that problem!!
You can remove the dressing after 48 hours. The most recent one I had done, I had internal stitches ie put in UNDER the skin - they dissolve and don't have to be removed. I was doubtful about these, but would definitely have them again. They don't itch have as much as external ones - are not sore, and you don't have to go back to have them taken out. If you do have external stitches, I put a bit of germolene cream on them if they are itchy and sore.
The bumpy bits settle after a few months, but I think on your face they would be taking extra care not to create bumpy bits. They really are very skilled. My husband had a mole removed from his chin because he was always cutting it, shaving. I can't even see the scar now - he had it done in 2009 and after a few months the scar was invisible.
If you have any other questions I can help with, please let me know. Best of luck with your procedure, I'm sure it will be fine!
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Thank you kes for answering all of my questions, you have been very helpful.
I do have bio oil Sarah, my hubby uses it on his dry skin, thank you for suggesting
silverlady , thank you for your reassurance - I just wish I could stop thinking about it! :-\ (http://:-\) I have looked up about the procedure and the mohs surgery is recommended, but this particular surgeon does not use that method. But he is very experienced and as you say, skilled, so I should be ok. I guess he just cuts, as opposed to scraping. Do you have knowledge of this? Interesting re skin on the face healing faster, I did not know that. I will get some of the vitamin E you suggest, thank you. PN x x
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The tiny blood vessels which aid healing are closer to the surface in the face/ears/neck which is why head wounds can be messy. Do you have an appt yet?
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Hi CLKD, yes it is the 4th March !!!! 8.45 in the morning, which is great as I would hate to wait til the afternoon
x x
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Sorry if I missed that ::) - I would hate to have to wait until afternoon ;)
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Excuse my ignorance, but what is a bcc? Is it some sort of skin lesion? Hope that all goes well with your surgery PN :) x
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basel cell carcinoma
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Here is some info purplenanny http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/infocenter/skin/vitaminE/
But I would hang on before buying or applying vitamin E until you have asked your surgeon, he might not agree. Its best not to put anything on until the skin has started to knit together. My PS said that its all about keeping scar massaged and supple, and even Vaseline can do this.
I have used natural Vit E, I did not like Bio oil.
Skin start to knit together within 48 hours http://www.pilonidal.org/_assets/pdf/mgmt_surg_wounds.pdf
but they can use a laser knife to staunch bleeding , I have had this.
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No, you didn't miss it CLKD - first time mentioned. The !!!!! related to my fear !::) (http://::))
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I know how it feels to be facing surgery (no pun intended) - been there, done it and survived ;) :hug: what scares you the most?
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Also been there done that, got the scar on cheek to prove it.
Be prepared to have a nice black eye after surgery (well I did) .
Mine was done 15years ago and all was fine......So please try not to worry.... :foryou:
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;D (http://;D)
All of it! I am just being stupid and need to pull myself together! People have been through so much worse.
Getting there in the first place will be hard. I have a phobia of needles and hate hospitals, which came about from unexpectedly seeing my Mum with all sorts plugged into her in hospital. No-one warned me and I was only 15. Sadly we lost her, which also affects the whole 'hospital' experience.
Then I guess it is the scarring and not knowing how big/deep it will be and how long before it fades
I know I will be fine and I am telling myself that all the time. Mind over matter and all that. I am a very strong willed person and I will be ok, I just can't stop worrying at the moment and my brain is working overtime with all the 'what if' scenarios...what if the surgeon has a bad day, what if it goes wrong, what if it doesn't heal, what if I get MRSA. Nightmare! So,I am trying to keep busy with other things and keep myself calm.
I realise how pathetic I am sounding, but thank you for listening! x x
Thanks for the info links silverlady - very detailed. The 'shaving' part made me chuckle, they talk about pre-surgery hair removal rather than the technique!!
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Hi ellie and thank you.
May I ask how big your BCC was and how big is your scar - did it take long to fade? x x Why the black eye? did you fight the surgeon? :o (http://:o) x x
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Heavens no, you're not being stupid! Nothing wrong with your fears at all PN. Things like that scare me too. We can't stop our brains working overtime. Let the surgeon & his team know your fears beforehand. They will have seen & heard it all before, I'm sure, and will be able to answer most, if not all your questions. :hug:
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You are certainly not being 'silly' about your worries! You could have a word with the Secretary and find out the chance of MRSA during this type of surgery. Or the Ward Sister. Perhaps the Hospital has a page on it's web-site stating their MRSA incidences?
I found that the only time my skin didn't heal well was when I was undergoing radiation treatment and for 6-8 months after, even a small scratch would take weeks ::) because my body was already under stress. Skin regenerates but sometimes it can take longer than 'usual'.
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Purplenanny :bighug:
Love Dyan
X
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Oh dear - I have just read my newspaper from Wednesday and there is this lady who went on a sunbed every day for half an hour (for years) and has just had a BCC removed - scar from eye to mouth - 29 stitches!!. I know mine is nowhere near that large , but it was the bit she said about the 'burning flesh smell' when they were operating and the bruising. The sooner this is over and done the better I think :( (http://:() PN x x
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Try not to fret - there will be no "burning flesh"! On point about the Mohs surgery - it is quite lengthy - as they have to go away and look at each layer of skin as they remove it apparently - ie a mini biopsy - so personally I would not want that - I want it over and done with in 15-20 minutes which is what will be happening with the traditional excision method. I have not had the Mohs but I knew someone who had.
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thank you kes, yes I agree and feel the same - the quicker the better!! x x
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Stop googling, there are always that kind of story out there.
Have you considered a course of arnica tablets. They really help with bruising.
My sister had keyhole surgery on both knees at the same time. Her surgeon was so impressed with the lack of deep bruising and told her he was going to recommend them to all his patients. Perhaps also a short course of echanacia to boost your immune system.
:hug:
I think you are very brave and I just know you will come through with flying colours.
Honeyb
x
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Thanks for the good advice HB, I will do that. I wasn't googling on that occasions, I just opened the newspaper and it was there! ::) (http://::)) but yes, I will stop searching for answers now and try to take my mind off it. :whist: (http://:whist:)
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Nice cuppa. Bubble bath. Magazines ……...
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Operation tomorrow and trying to keep calm. I am really quite worried but putting on a brave face so as not to worry hubby. A good thing as otherwise I would be in pieces
early appointent so will be over and home by lunchtime
forgot to take the arnica and echinacia..is it too late HB?
PN x x
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Probably a little bit ;D
Just think, this time tomorrow you will be home sitting in your favourite chair with your feet up and being very spoiled.
I hope everything goes really well for you. Let us know how you get on and we will all be sending you positive thoughts.
:foryou:
Honeyb
x
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Good Luck! Once you get there you will be fine!
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Thank you both. I agree the waiting is the worst bit.
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Good Luck :foryou:
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Thank you Limpy. x x
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Good luck from me too - soon be over and you'll be telling us all about it.
Taz x :bighug:
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Thank you Taz. x x
Decided to take a sleeping pill otherwise I will be awake all night. Hope it is the right decision...oh well, too late now.
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Good luck PN. :hug:
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Hi everyone.
Well, I survived! I would not wish to repeat the experience but coped better than I thought.
lovely surgeon, really took his time and his team of 5 nurses were very friendly. He had a Hso(?)
with him who asked loads of questions which I found really interesting. It made me realise how exoerienced the surgeon is, but moreso how passionate he is with his work.
The worst part was the 5 injections, even after numbing gel. He worked for about 50 mins and removed an amount just bit bigger than a 50p piece. Lots of internal disolvable stitching. Outside stitches traditional (apparently better healing) to be removed in 10 days. Scar is from under eye to just above chin, zig zagged as less noticeable when healed than a straight line
Will be about a year before fading. Next big step is dressings off in 4 days!!!
feeling tired now and a little bit sick.
Thanks for all your support ladies, you are great. PN x x
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SHO? senior house office ;)
Glad you survived!
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Hso ? ::) (http://::))
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That's a new one to me :-\ (House officer?) which is nearly a Registrar
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:medal:
Well done you. You are so brave.
Now, we will all tell you the same. Get those feet up and do nothing. No matter how brave it's a shock to the system.
Get the Bio Oil on order so when you are fully healed you can use it. Ask your doc of course. It really helped my burn scar.
:foryou:
Honeyb
x
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:medal:
Well done. Feet up. Usually have to massage the areas after a while to help prevent scarring & bio oil is good for that, but nurse will keep you right with regards to that once your stitches are removed.
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Well done. I wish you a good recovery :) :foryou:
Ariadne xx
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Look after yourself, take it easy.
Don't do too much, until everything is healed. Even after the stitches are removed.
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Thanks for all your good wishes and advice. I have rested since coming home.
It is now very sore and I am taking pain killers for the night time.
can anyone help please, the dressings have become sodden with blood and it is worrying me. The surgeon put wide steri strips over the wound once he stitched it. Then went on to his next patient. The nurse then added 2 waterproof dressings, one overlapping the other.
she said the usual surgeon she works with always does this. But she placed the sticky bit on top of the strips so if I take them off they will also come off. I am sure it cant be good to have all this blood on the wound.
she said to leave everything on for 4 days
any suggestions? PN x x
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I would leave it well alone for tonight. Put a very clean towel on your pillow just in case you turn over in your sleep.
In the morning call your district nurse and ask her to call in and re dress it if she think it needs it.
Really better not to try anything at night. Or you could call NHS 24 and ask for some advice.
Honeyb
x
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Many thanks HB, I will do that. Just panicking a bit here, it looks so awful and feels as though it needs releasing, if you know what I mean.
I will ring first thing, thank you. x x
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I know it's easy for me to say but a little drop of blood looks an awful lot and I don't blame you for being a bit panicky about it.
I would sleep well propped up tonight.
Phone first thing and you will be able to get it sorted. You could always put another little light dressing on top of the wet one if it makes you feel more secure.
:hug:
Try and get some sleep.
Honeyb
x
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Good idea to prop up overnight, I will do that. I have put a soft clean towel on the pillow just in case i slip down. Thanks honeyb, appreciate your help and reassurance. PN x x
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See HB beat me to it. I was going to suggest likewise. Also if necessary place another pad on top of your dressing. Me thinks you're not going to get much sleep tonight, until you see nurse tomorrow, but try and rest at least.
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Thanks cubagirl.. all support welcome, trying to calm myself and stop panicking!
I am just hoping it will be ok if re-dressed. Would prefer it not to be disturbed as the surgeon was very specific and careful with the steri strips, insisting on a certain size. I would be happier seeing him to do it but feel sure that won't be possible.
I think the nurse said I can ring his secretary at the hospital, so might try that first.
fingers crossed. Thank goodness fot the internet, need to watch some catch up tv as I dont think I will be sleeping much!!
PN x x
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How are you this morning PN?
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Hope you had at least some sleep PN
Taz xx
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Morning ladies, thank you for checking on me.
I had a very disturbed night and feel a wreck, but the dressing has now dried and gone dark so I am no longer panicking as it has obviously now stopped bleeding.
last night the blood was very red and the dressing just seemed to be filling up. I was so grateful you were there honeybun and cubagirl
I am only just getting up (very lazy) so will shower and decide what to do after
PN x x
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Glad things look a bit better this morning. You never really know what is supposed to be normal so it's very easy to panic.
I would still give your surgery a ring just to reassure yourself.
Feet up and do nothing. It's been traumatic for you and you need to rest. Rubbish TV and cups of tea for the rest of the day.
Take good care.
Honeyb
x
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Thanks HB x x
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Glad that you are feeling better PN - sorry I missed your post last night.
Take it easy.
Taz x :bighug:
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Thats ok Taz, no need to say sorry.
I am being very lazy!!
thanks for the hug x x
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Decided this morning to go to gp surgery nurse as dressing looking awful and wound really itching.
Male nurse, very positive, whipped the dressings off with what felt like half my face :o (http://:o)
there was a lot of blood being held within the seal of the dressings, so my wound was soggy and the stitches in danger of rotting if left any longer in that condition.
It all feels so much better now and I am so pleased I went. I just have to be careful when washing my hair as this dressing is not waterproof. If anyone has suggestions for keeping it dry I would be grateful.
thanks PN x x
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Can you manage to get someone to wash your hair from the back, like at hairdressers? Say sitting on a chair at wash basin. Even saying that sounds very awkward. Dry shampoo maybe. Not ideal, but hopefully wouldn't be for too long.
At least you've had it seen to. Have you to go back again?
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Yes I could try that, or I could actually have a treat and go to the hairdressers, now there's a thought!! ::) (http://::))
The stitches are due to be removed on 14th March at the hospital and the nurse said I could go back to him if I needed redressing in between. x x
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Glad for you that you have a nice dry dressing on now. The hairdresser sounds ideal and dry shampoo is really quite good. You can just damp down your hair and style it meantime.
You sound so much more relaxed now which is nice to hear.
Treat yourself to a wash and blow dry. You really deserve it.
Honeyb
x
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PN go and treat yourself at the hairdressers - You deserve it. :foryou:
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You know you really, really want to PN. Everyone deserves a treat, you deserve it.
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Thank you for the tips and kind words, but..
I have failed miserably and given in to washing it myself!! It was just too much money, I could not justify it. I would rather buy a plant for the garden
But it was not easy.. I stuck a plastic food bag over the dressing, with tape covering my eye, ear and neck and stood backwards in the shower [url] ::)] (http://[/url) and stood backwards in the shower http:// ::)- nearly put my neck out, but I do have clean hair now!! :yipi: (http://:yipi:) Thank goodness I don't have to do it everyday!!
PN x x
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Well done PN. :medal:
This showering while trying to keep different bits dry isn't easy is it?
I am still having very weird showers since a minor back procedure has refused to heal.
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Well done PN. Clean hair always make us feel better. Nothing worse than greasy locks. I can just about manage to leave mine for two days. The morning horns are not attractive though, so gets washed every day. ;D
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Oh that's not easy Limpy! Sorry to hear it is not healing, very awkward place to have a wound. I hope it gets better soon. :bighug: (http://:bighug:)(gently) x x
Visualising the morning horns CB :o (http://:o) x x
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Thanks for the gentle hug PN.
Enjoy your clean hair :)
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I can always find another road for the money too ::)
I had this problem when I badly burned my neck. Hubby did mine over the sink ( he has his uses ;D ).
We have kitchen bar stools that go up and down and I managed a back wash to start with. They then gave me really good water proof dressings so I could get back in the shower.
My daughter buys dry shampoo which works a treat. It's not expensive and it gives her another day between washes. Maybe worth a try until you can do it in the shower.
Now start to plan what garden plant you want.....nice to have a plan.
Honeyb
x
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I used dry shampoo in my teenage years(many years ago ::) (http://::)), but did not like it much..made my head itch! Must admit it was effective though. Did not know they still sold it!!
ooh yes, I love a plan! Might have to be a pieris plant, saw one the other day, really pretty. Last much longer than a wash and blow dry!!
PN x x
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My daughter gets her dry shampoo in Super Drug. She swears by it for a quick pick me up for her hair and she is very very picky ::)
I have a couple of pieris plants. Lovely leaf colour although they are a bit bedraggled at the moment.
I can't wait for spring because I have garden plans :)
Honeyb
x
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Love pieris! Got 3 different varieties in my garden. Love the colours.
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Wow, 3, lucky cubagirl. I have 1 ver old one in a pot which I am going to plant in the garden. Then the new one will go into the pot. Which to choose though, saw lots of differnt ones at the nursery.
not long now hb, exciting, what plans do you have?
PN x x
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They're all quite small. I bought them when we had garden landscaped. Neighbour has a couple, but hers have become rather straggly.
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Well, our garden is not terribly big but lacks a bit of interest. We have a path that goes up some steps onto the lawn and I want an arch over it to climb a clematis and a honey suckle up and over.
We also have a corner bed that is in a dry shady bit of the garden that looks very sparse. I want to grow tall grasses in there of different types.
I also want a knew garden table as the one we have has fallen to bits.
A lot of wants and it won't all happen but I love to plan as I do love my little garden.
Honeyb
x
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Yes mine in the pot is a bit straggly but I dont think they can be pruned. I might try a tidy up when I put it in the garden.
Your plans sound great honeyb, interesting 2 levels and I love the idea of the arch, very pretty.
I bought a new table and chairs from ebay 2 years ago, lady bought 2 by mistake (???) from m & s. It has a mosaic design and was half price!
Have a good weekend. PN x x
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PN- just caught up with your posts.
I've not been on the forum for a while.
So pleased your op went well.You were so brave.
Love Dyan X
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Thank you Dyan, not sure I will be so brave when the dressing comes off..I dont think I want to look! x x
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Had my stitches taken out today. My god was that tender! Apparently it had healed so well the skin had grown over some of them so the nurse had to really tug to get them out. She kept saying sorry and I was just silent. It seemed to go on forever.
Now I can feel and see 3 areas of stitches still remaining, but not black stitches, like the ones she removed, they are see through ones sticking up about an eigth of an inch. I am wondering if it is internal dissolvable ones she may have pulled through while tugging the others out?
I really want to pull them out as they are very sore, but feel I may be undoing inside. I am upset she did not notice them
my scar is horrible, the shape of a question mark, all over my cheek. Much larger than i thought it would be and I hate it. I feel like a freak. :'( (http://:'()
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:hug:
Give the nurse a call and ask her what they are and what you should do . It's very early days and you really can't expect everything to be back to normal yet. It will take a while. Get some bio oil on order ready to use when you can. I remember you saying your surgeon was very good at this so trust that it will get better and better as the days and weeks go past. You are not a freak. You are you , just with a sore face .
:foryou:
Honeyb
x
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The scar will soon fade purplenanny. I read on the NHS site that if the operation is likely to leave significant scarring then a skin graft is carried out at the same time as the excision. Your surgeon must have looked at this possiblity and with all of his expertise decided that it wasn't necessary. It is still early days. Try to look at the positives i.e. that the cancer hadn't spread and you are going to be absolutely fine.
Taz x :hug: :hug:
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Hi purplenanny
Just wanted to say do take care and sending healing thoughts to you
Hurdity x
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Hi Purplenanny
The scar will fade as it heals it just takes time.
I have had a similar thing with my back and dissolvable stitches, they hadn't gone after 3 weeks and the nurse tried to remove them. She got one out but the others hurt like **** so were left. I can now see the scar on my back, it looks horrible but isn't leaking now, so at least it is healing.
Don't try and pull the stitches out yourself, like HB says give the nurse a call for advice. Have you got a follow up appt at the Hospital?
Lots of Hugs - IT WILL FADE
:hug: :hug: :hug:
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Skin is marvellous at healing itself. Just think of all the times you have cut or burnt yourself and you think it will never heal. Bet you can't find those places now. It really is very early days and I can only imagine how upsetting it is to see what the scar looks like now but just hang in there because it wont look like that soon.
See if you can get someone to check the stitches you can see - you don't want to pull them out yourself.
Have a big hug :hug:
Ariadne xx