Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => All things menopause => Topic started by: CrispyChick on March 16, 2025, 04:44:48 PM
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So, I wanted to refresh this topic from about 5 years ago. There is an old thread and I found it very useful and reassuring to find others in as terrible a place as myself. :'(
All my tests are clear (there have been so many). The only other option for me is ME/CFS. But there is most definitely a hormonal link.
I feel so ill every min of every day. My main symptoms are:
1) A fluey feeling, like poision running through my body. My back aches with it.
2) motion sickness and nausea
3) dizziness, spinning and ear pressure / pain
4) loss of appetite when at my worst.
5) terrible fatigue
6) lightheaded
Then at times so many other symptoms, which are definitely hormonal, including - extreme mood swings, rage, crying etc. Migraines, indigestion, extreme brain fog, night sweats sometimes, hot flushes more recently.
I'm looking for others that may feel this ill. >:(
I'm not looking to be told to try HRT - thanks. I've tried everything over the last 7 years, including chemical menopause. All made me worse.
I'm still in peri. Just missed my first period, which corresponds with the new onset hot flushes. I'm 48. But still the underlying ill symptoms plague me - and they've felt worse than ever after missing a period.
Anyone else? X
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Hi CrispyChick…we’ve “spoken” before so I won’t go into detail, but yes everything you describe was me in peri and I could add lots of symptoms to the list 😢.
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Thank you dotty. Yes, we have spoken a few times. X
Can I clarify - did you feel poisoned? Flu feeling in your blood constantly? Motion sickness? Generally very very ill - constantly!?
Unfortunately HRT, at this stage, seems to make me worse. 😞
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Yes….i felt dreadfully ill all the time. I had horrendous nausea all day every day and I couldn’t eat. Even lying in bed made me feel ill.
My first symptom was exhaustion. I was totally exhausted and couldn’t do anything. Then the nausea started and the heart palpitations and the insomnia and a horrible internal shaking. There were more random symptoms that were just crazy.
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Hi crispy chick,
In peri I actually felt like I was dying from some kind of unknown disease, I had all the symptoms you and dotty had and some.
At its worst I became housebound for six months I couldn’t leave the house because of my severe anxiety and the multiple physical symptoms I had .
I had an early menopause at 36 and it’s took me to get to 51 to finally start to get relief but unfortunately still get some symptoms.
You are not alone in experiencing extreme symptoms I did too I can’t offer you any kind of advice as to how to alleviate the symptoms only lots of understanding and empathy, but I can say after many years of suffering I feel I’m now getting to a better place and better days .
Stay strong I know it feels impossible but those better brighter days will come for you too x
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I don't have all of those symptoms but I live with dysautonomia resulting from a brain injury at 34, and as part of this I do have motion sensitivity, nausea, chronic dizziness and lightheadedness, slow GI transit and impaired thermoregulation.
None of these issues are caused by lack of gonadal hormones in my case, however the lightheadedness and frequent syncope were noticeably exacerbated by menstruation when I lost access to my combined pill.
I have also been helped a lot by androgen replacement with DHEA, which has improved my access to upright posture over and above my pacemaker and fludrocortisone, so there's that.
I also know that a lot of people with ME/CFS have autonomic dysfunction as well.
Regarding whether your symptoms are wholly or partially due to perimenopause - I think it is difficult to tease apart but age of onset is one clue, and did this coincide with any changes in menstrual pattern?
Also did it come on gradually, or was there any specific event or trigger?
Additionally, and I know this hasn't been the case for you, but usually if a person's illness is wholly or largely peri/menopause related, they would typically improve when ovarian hormones are restored.
That said I am convinced a lot of women with a similar cluster of symptoms around their 40's who were previously completely well, are being diagnosed with ME or fibromyalgia and various other "untreatable" conditions when really it is perimenopause.
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Crispy, this is a very long shot but have you had your bilirubin levels tested for Gilbert's Syndrome?
Gilbert's is hereditary and it often goes unnoticed until the menopause kicks in. Read up on it and you will recognise a lot of your symptoms and people with Gilbert's have difficulty processing oestrogen.
It's supposed to be a symptomless condition but in my experience, it's far from it.
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Thank you ladies. Much appreciated.
Dotty and Asher it is so reassuring to hear your stories. It still doesn't give me a solution, but it's reassuring.
Asher - did you /are you taking HRT??? And it seems most of your issues arose after your early meno. Is that correct???
Thanks Mary - I shall ask my GP about that. I assume I've been tested for everything, but I don't really know! Neurology just tested me for lots of randoms like lupus and lymes. So could be in that batch. I never heard anything, so assume all fine.
Bomb - it all started for me at 41. I stopped the mini pill at 40. Got terrible pms so tried Agnus Castus at high dose. It was amazing, then gave me migraines. I stopped it overnight. 8 weeks later descended into this. So in my head I always assumed I'd destabilised my hormones with the agnus castus.
I do struggle to see how HRT can always help in peri, since I truly believe, if this is hormonal, it's all down to the fluctuations and my sensitivity to them. But we have to remember I got even worse in chemical menopause. So I think it's all my body's immune/nervous system response to changes, not the hormonal levels themselves.
I've never had low estrogen symptoms. My current hot flushes are the first of them. Hence I can see why HRT has never helped.
What I will say is, despite other side affects - migraines, stomach issues etc - I could lose the fluey poison when on certain pills. Surely that suggests it's not ME/CFC but hormonal????
And this is me just trying to find that reassurance by finding others who suffered similar.
Flat out on the sofa today with 'flu'
Xx
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I don't actually think HRT is the best way to manage perimenopause either in many people (although some thrive on it and that's great) as like you say a lot of the symptoms are due to chaotic and fluctuating rather than deficient ovarian hormones.
Personally I prefer to just shut it down and add back a consistent stable daily dose with the pill.
Your history does sound very much like hormones are implicated, I just wish there was a straightforward solution to help you feel better.
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I didn’t get hot flushes till 5 years after the horrific symptoms started.
I wish I could help more :'(. X
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Actually, that is helpful Dotty because that's exactly like me. I'm 7 years in now. I've had sweats off/on about 18 months. Now hot flushes.
And I know my my chemical shut down that I'm a hit flushes girl when my E goes. No sweats in chem meno.
So it is helpful, as it's reassuring. And it explains that it's the fluctuations making us feel so ill before the E declines.
Bomb - I was certainly told by the NHS meno clinic to try every combined pill going. I did. I really did. But I got so many migraines and gastritis, mood swings and you name it. Despite taking pills for years earlier. To be honest, I tried again last year as I was desperate, but I think once my body is 'flared' anything I take just causes even more problems. :(
So here I am. 3 months on nothing. Perhaps I'd be feeling a bit more positive if they hadn't stuck me on an antidepressant that made me suicidal. Now coming off that.
It's not been fun!
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Really feel for you. They tried me on an antidepressant instead of HRT being offered initially. I last 7 days before coming off it, made me feel like I’d totally lost my mind, scary. Again others have good experiences so not saying they aren’t helpful if they suit. Feel wobbly today too but the second down teen is being a bit of a pest so that is not helping. I think it’s my resilience to previously normal/ I could handle stuff that has depleted a bit. But then on other days when hormones behave I’m ok again, it’s that crap rollercoaster feeling without the fun bit! I’ve not watched my eating as much either over the weekend and I’m paying for it. Totally notice the difference in my mood and symptoms with what I eat and drink! I hope things start to settle for you, at least you have an outlet here with nice folks! X
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I can understand you being reluctant to try anything else but have you ever had any form of androgen replacement, or know what your testosterone levels are?
Certainly DHEA has helped me, and anecdotally many women with ME/CFS like symptoms have improved on DHEA and/or testosterone.
Apologies if this is something you have already tried/discounted.
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Hi crispy chick ,
All my symptoms began when I hit peri .
I did use hrt for 7 years but in all honesty it made me worse I spent so long trying different types at different doses but unfortunately for me it just didn’t suit
I recently came off hrt altogether been off it for 10 weeks now.
Peri began at 36 but the hot flushes didn’t begin until I was 42 , so I think flushes don’t always come straight away .
I really hope you start to get a break soon, it’s such a long unpleasant journey for so many of us .
Wish I could offer you kind of solution x
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Thanks ladies.
Asher that's do interesting about the HRT. I've dabbled a lot over the years. Convectional HRT sent my poision into overdrive then an expensive trip to the Marion Gluck clinic saw me try progesterone only treatment off/on for some time. Bur I could never get better. So much up/down as I tried.
But now on nothing, it's still just as hellish.
How are you feeling now on no HRT??? Do you wish you'd given up sooner?
Yip, my flushes have come later. I assume that's E starting to decline. Did your flushes start nearer the time you hit meno?
Bomb - I did try DHEA through the Marion Gluck clinic. Combined with testosterone. I liked it. I think it made me very calm. But I was also so ill. And wasn't sure what was what. So stopped.
Do you take oral DHEA? Mine was a cream, but I have tablets. I'd love to try it again. But too scared right now. Very interested in what you say about woman with ME/CFC type illness finding dhea helpful.
My testosterone always sat around 0.4 at that time. Interestingly in Jan this year it was 1.22.
But - all my hormones were high in Jan. I wonder if there was some sort of surge after stopping chem meno. Because a month on I feel like I've totally gone the other way. Getting some bloods this week. Be interesting.
Thanks for your support Ruthiebell. It's been an absolutely horrid time. It just keeps going. Unfortunately I never have any good days. And diet seems to play no part for me. When I'm at my worst I stop eating. >:(
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Hi crispy chick ,
The hot flushes started when I started missing periods , they ramped up as I started to move into meno , when I was on hrt it did stop the flushes but everything else didn’t improve then I was dealing with so many side effects and never knowing is this a side effect or meno or is the dose too low , too high I just got so fed up with the constant stress of it all and other than the hot flushes going I felt like complete crap everyday .
I do wish I’d stopped sooner, off it I feel much better, the flushes are back but only a few here and there nothing I can’t handle. I think now I’m post menopause things have calmed down and I’m no longer dealing with the wild fluctuations.
I too was like you I never had any good days it was just nothing but one symptom after another, raging anxiety and feeling like there was no relief from this hell , but now I look back and think what the hell happened there , never thought I would ever feel well again, but fingers crossed and hoping it lasts I feel the best I have in 15 years .
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I'm soooo pleased for you Asher. :-*
And you gave me hope. X
So, basically you've felt the best you have in 15 years after stopping the HRT?! Just shows us eh.
I really don't know what to do next. I'm so bad physically just now. It's unbearable. Mentally I'm a bit better since reducing the AD. Yet they want me to try another.
After going and looking at my testosterone results yesterday, I think I'm seriously thinking I had a massive surge of all hormones on stopping the chem meno and now I'm bottoming out.
So all that change will be causing more carnage. It's so awful. Feel so so ill.
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Hi CrispyChick I’ve just got my diary out that I kept when I was very ill. The symptoms I had were very long . Here’s what I wrote….exhausted, ill, no energy, nausea, can’t eat, stomach feels full even though I haven’t eaten, cold and hot flushes, dizzy, feel faint, woozy, can’t concentrate, heart palpitations, disoriented, shaky, groggy, morning anxiety, insomnia, internal shaking, muscle twitches in arms at night, burning pain in forearms at night, very weak, crying ….
It was awful…does any of that resonate with you ? xxx
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It really does resonate with me Dotty. Thank you for doing that. It is kind of nice to see others had similar symptoms.
The ones I don't have are stomach fullness (although had terrible stomach issues off/on), heart palps, insomnia, muscle twitches and burning pain. Yay!
I have all the rest. Plus others though - dreadful ear pressure and pain, tingling/sore scalp ABC hair, migraines, Jose pressure, indigestion. The list goes on...
I'm still having the dreadful poison feeling though. Also terrible body flu every day and awful achy back. I'd class that as separate to the other stuff. And that's the question mark over ME/CFS I guess.
I can see I posted years ago, post a covid experience about a terrible achy back. Makes me wonder.
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Hi crispy,
Regarding the DHEA, I take 25mg sublingual daily, life extension brand. This increased my free T from virtually zero to the top quartile, and has noticeably reduced presyncope and improved my access to standing (although nowhere near to what someone in a typical body has).
I first heard of DHEA from people in the ME/CFS community, but didn't look into it at that time because they had a different condition with a different etiology to me.
I became interested in it a few years later after reading about testosterone helping people with dysautonomia - I am on the combined pill for menstrual suppression which is also incredibly valuable to me and there is no safety data for testosterone alongside the pill, whereas there is for DHEA, and the cost of testosterone is also prohibitive, so I chose DHEA.
I may try testosterone in the future when I am postmenopausal and on MHT.
Also I just wanted to pick up on the "poisoned feeling" you describe - whilst I haven't experienced this myself, I have come across many with ME/CFS using virtually identical words to describe their experience.
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Hi Crispychick, to answer your question yes, absolutely. I've asked myself this so many times, because I've felt so incredibly ill and unwell so many times, and especially over the past almost 3 years, which is when my symptoms worsened a lot. It came to a point where the rarity was to feel well, to feel like before all this started.
My symptoms were many, many, many... too many to list here. The scariest ones being a variety of heart palpitations, dizziness, internal shaking/vibration, tingling hands and feet which become legs and arms and eventually total numbness, and a feeling of being poisoned as well at my worst, a difficult to describe feeling but horrible, which fortunately didn't happen all the time though often enough to make me feel I was dying. I've never had a hot flash however. Of course I've been to many doctors and had all kinds of testing done to rule out other problems (I thought I had a serious illness of some kind).
So I started my HRT journey in April last year and symptoms have improved but not disappeared just yet, I think it's because I still need to find my dose, so that's what I'm working on, unfortunately I have to go slowly because I happen to be very sensitive to any hormones.
Some days I feel almost normal again, some days not so much, and then there's 2 or 3 days a month or so where I feel just absolutely awful and I can barely function (like yesterday, for example, I had all my symptoms all day plus terrible nausea in the evening, which thankfully ended up going away after 2 sprays of Lenzetto). But for now I can't say I'm back to feeling well again, not even most of the time.
I think I'm still perimenopausal (age 52), at least I was last year before I began HRT. My FSH is quite high at 44 but I'd say I must be in the last throes of peri, and I'm guessing that's why my estrogen must be doing really huge ups and downs, hence some of the very bad and very good days? I don't know. I find this to be really difficult to navigate to be honest.
Anyway I hope this is helpful, you're definitely not alone in this.
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I'm soooo pleased for you Asher. :-*
And you gave me hope. X
So, basically you've felt the best you have in 15 years after stopping the HRT?! Just shows us eh.
I really don't know what to do next. I'm so bad physically just now. It's unbearable. Mentally I'm a bit better since reducing the AD. Yet they want me to try another.
After going and looking at my testosterone results yesterday, I think I'm seriously thinking I had a massive surge of all hormones on stopping the chem meno and now I'm bottoming out.
So all that change will be causing more carnage. It's so awful. Feel so so ill.
Hi crispy chick
I’m so pleased I gave you some hope , but I’m sorry to hear how unwell you
feel , I know just how difficult this is it’s so hard to know what to do to get relief hopefully some of the suggestions the other ladies have mentioned will help you find some kind of solution.
It’s just so bloody hard to get through this hell and being able to see any end to it , but it will come , I hope it’s sooner rather than later , honestly wish I could offer you a solution to make you feel better.
What dotty wrote is so helpful, seeing it written like that shows us we aren’t alone in these strange and unpleasant symptoms.
I used to keep a diary and that could have literally been written by me , I think seeing what others experienced definitely helps us and seeing that they improve is comforting, it does give hope .
So stay strong it’s tough but you too will get to a place where things are so much better.
Wishing you all the best x
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Reading these posts makes me quite emotional as I’ve never really met or spoken to anyone who suffered like I did. It’s just so awful what we go through, especially in my case, where doctors told me I was depressed ! Yes, I was depressed but only because I felt so ill.
Sending hugs out to you all xxx
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I agree Dotty , it’s so sad to see just how much women suffer , I too have never met anyone that suffered like me.
How are you doing today crispy chick , hoping you are ok x
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Thanks ladies.
It means a lot to hear your stories :-*
I've also been speaking to Itwillpass - the original author if the first 'can peri make me feel this ill' thread. And she's finally found some help - with the mirena coil and E. Food for thought.
I'm not good at the moment. Unfortunately got a toothache too so had emergency dental appointment this morning. Which I could good with had I bot felt I was dying on the way there and whilst there:
Head swimming, woozy
Extreme lightheaded / fainty feeling.
Nauseous
Extreme brain fog.
Just general ill feeling
I decided on the way home, I need to try something else. I cannot live feeling this ill. The doctors want me to try another AD (the last one made me suicidal) bur they are not my answer!
I've taken 4 days of pregabalin. But going to drop it again to ensure it's not causing stomach issues.
Yes I'm always crying, but because I'm so fed up of feeling this ill and rough.
I'm off work. Can no longer do anything. And now I realise I cannot go to a morning appointment. Where does it end????
So. What options do i have??? Bear in mind I've already tried chem meno. :(
I've just had a blood test, so be interesting to see given my missed period. But previously, whilst feeling like this, E levels have always been fine.
I need stability. Would mirena give me this???? I'm seriously considering it. But I know levongestral in a pill jills my stomach.
Also I just wanted to pick up on the "poisoned feeling" you describe - whilst I haven't experienced this myself, I have come across many with ME/CFS using virtually identical words to describe their experience.
Absolutely bomb. I felt like I found my clan when I joined a ME/CFC FB group recently. They talk of poison.
However, so are the ladies on this thread :-* and there have been episodes of less poison for me when on the mini pill. Stability???!
It doesn't work now. 😔
I'm really struggling to understand why my body makes me feel so ill. :'(
Rferdi - I'm sorry you were in this position too. May I ask what hrt you find is helping? X
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I’ve been on this forum for a while but never posted. I’ve also seen a lot of your posts Crispy chick which resonate 100% with me. I have been very unwell mentally and physically for over two years now and despite various HRT doses and types I am no better. My journey/hell started with severe irrational anxiety and insomnia and I was put on utrogestan only as my private GP thought I was Estrogen dominant. This made me feel like my body was made of lead and I felt so unwell. Next Estrogen was introduced very slowly but my anxiety seemed to get worse and when I finally got to 3 pumps I was walking round the house at 2am with anxiety like I’ve never felt before. I was then put on desogestrel which did help for a few months and I was also back on Estrogen and was managing pretty well on 3 pumps however this then all changed and I was taken off it, given mirena and went through another year of utter hell because the mirena wasn’t switching off my cycle and I was having severe fluctuations. I have now been on Slynd for 3 months (with mirena still in situ)) but no HRT and am probably the best I will get although I am still feeling so unwell with severe fatigue every day, I feel drugged at my worst, muscle pain, head pressure, no appetite, low mood and anxiety. I have gone from being a social, fun loving, gym addict to a shell of a woman with constant illness, exhaustion, negativity and desperation. Some days I just want to take a pill and never wake up. I feel that I have exhausted all options and fear losing my husband, family and friends as I have nothing to give anymore and am just trying to get through the days. I feel for you and all the other ladies who are going through it or have been though it as it’s complete and utter torture and so unfair
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Lclegg002 welcome to the forum. I don’t post as often as I should on here but I read lots. CrispyChick and everyone else who is suffering you are my people. I’m 52 and have been suffering for around 4 years but since hitting my fifties it has been hell.
I’ve had depression since my twenties on and off but since hitting menopause it has been the worse time of my life. I had a week of feeling quite stable recently and thought maybe my hormones are settling but then out of nowhere everything has hit me again. Nausea, fatigue and the severe blackness where I just feel despair at times. I feel I let my family down every day as I don’t function how I used to or how I want to. It really is so unfair that we have to suffer like this.
I’ve tried different kinds of HRT and now on progesterone only, which sometimes I think it helps and sometimes not. I also don’t understand as my last period was in 2021 so I am post menopausal but I can literally feel my hormones fluctuating physically. I feel like I have a bug most days.
I used to get up and go for a run early mornings and always into fitness, I stopped running almost a year ago as it was making me feel mentally worse.
I just wanted to post to say I can so relate to all of you and it’s just so damn unfair. A lot of the time I feel menopause is killing me. This forum is amazing and it’s so nice to not feel alone.
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Wow LCkegg. :-* I'm right there with you. Xxx
This is pure torture. Yes, I've posted a lot. ;D so if my posts resonate with you - we must feel similar.
My god - you've hit the nail on the head!!!! It's stopping the fluctuations that's necessary, not adding in extra E. Although why I felt so so ill in chemical menopause is a mystery. My gut feeling is it was a 'massive' change!
Ok. So you've tried all the shutting down fluctuating hormone techniques. I've tried desogestral - no longer shuts me down. It used to. And I tried Slynd in May and I got worse and worse. >:(
Ive never had a Mirena. I'm scared of it. But I'm wondering if I need to try?! Although, obvs it didn't work for you.
I'm thinking a Mirena can not be as bad as chem meno. But with my body, who knows.
I just don't think I can continue like this.
The drugged feeling is a good description. My brain fog (if that's what it is) can, at times be so severe (it is today) that I don't feel safe to drive. Yes. I feel drugged.
I 100% understand how you feel about losing everything. I've lost my life over the last 7 years. This year specifically I'm losing my job. I too feel i'll lose my husband and beautiful children as I have absolutely nothing to offer anyone. Ever.
If this is all hormones, I don't understand how our bodies cannot cope with it. >:(
Thank you for posting. :-* I appreciate it.
Are you still peri? X
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Reading your last post reminded me of some other things….I didn’t drive for 8 months as I just couldn’t trust myself to concentrate. I had to resign from my job . I was housebound for months.
I can also say I felt useless and that i was letting everyone down. xx
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Yes. Exactly where I'm at Dotty. That trip to the dentist this morning was carnage. :(
Now, my mood has slumped and I'm in a depressive state. It's never ending.
But you did find an end Dotty. You are hope. :-*
I think I'll have to try the mirena. Scared stiff. But I can't live in this hell.
Thanks for posting Torri. I'm so sorry you're suffering too. Especially as post meno as I'm still living in hope that meno helps me. But I think fluctuations do continue for quite a while. It's worrying.
How much progesterone do you take? I don't tolerate utrogestan. But I have dabbled with bhrt creams, until my system went absolutely bonkers and I couldn't tolerate anything. 🙈
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Yes I did find an end :).
I spent about 5 years feeling so ill, although thankfully not as ill as when I was at my worst. I had a couple of “normalish” years although I was nowhere near right, but I did manage to go back to work. Then 3 years after my last period the horrendous symptoms hit me again. It was then that I suddenly realised that I’d been wrongly diagnosed with ME / CFS. I began to get the same old spaced out feelings and then the hot flushes ramped up and I began to feel like a zombie again. It was when the nausea started that I suddenly realised what was wrong with me.
I went on hrt , but hrt didn’t help me until I was put on 4 pumps of Oestrogel. The lower doses did nothing for me. I had another 6 months of hell and then finally, bit by bit the oestrogen started to work and within a month I was feeling much better. It took about 6 months to take full effect.
I won’t say I’m 100%, but I’m so much better than I was. I’m sure I’ve got PTSD and the fear of regressing is always there. I’ve been on 4 pumps of Oestrogel now for 7 years.
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Interesting dotty.
I'm guessing you believe estrogen would've been your answer earlier in then?
I suppose that's where we differ. I've been shouting this is hormonal at the docs for 7 years. But having tried everything (except the mirena) they feel like they've proven me wrong. ???
I've nothing left to try hormonally really. I mean, I can try HRT again, but as I'm so sensitive, I doubt it'll end well. I can try the mirena.
That's it. :(
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Crispy Chick….i don’t really know if oestrogen would have helped in peri. I can’t say for definite. I was taking Noriday mini pill at the time and had been taking it for 21 years prior to this. I stopped taking it about two years later to see if it made any difference, but it didn’t.
All I can say that I didn’t start getting better until I was on the right dose of oestrogen post menopause.
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My money would still be on something androgenic - has tibolone been considered?
This tends to be prescribed postmenopausally but as long as pregnancy is not possible and you aren't bothered about the potential for irregular bleeding, which I am sure is a very first world problem given everything else, there's no medical reason it can't be used earlier.
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No. It has not.
I did ask the gynae about that when going into cm. She said not the preferred approach.
Yes, perhaps another one for my list. So it would make my body make its own E, P and T??? Would it actually help balance pre meno though? :o
I'd take irregular bleeding any day over mg other stuff. Bleeds are light and fine. And, well, now missing. The only thing that's fine. ::)
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It's terrible that still so little is really understood about this.
I had near zero medical history until I turned 50, and then...BOOM.
Crazy insomnia, mood swings, rage, burning skin, achy arms & legs, sore breasts, palpitations, nosebleeds, itchy skin, & more.
The medical profession has largely been just baffled.
Health anxiety off the scale, I've been to A&E twice in the last 6 months thinking I was dying.
And not a single hot flush!
HRT has helped my one intolerable symptom, which was waking up every hour at night and needing to prowl around the house with all the lights on.
However, it has been a lot of trial and error, especially the Utrogestan.
I do increasingly think it's the fluctuations rather than the deficiency that is really problematic, I can sometimes feel my personality changing hour by hour.
If I had the answer I would share it (although good bras, supportive shoes, and turmeric have helped) ;)
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Thanks for joining in minnie mouse. Are you still peri then?
I think you're so right. For us with extended symptoms it seems to be the fluctuations rather than deficiency that cause our issues.
I've started with hot flushes this month. Gone now. First month of missed period. My symptoms are worse than ever.
My brain fog is like zombie land. I usually get this at ovulation. All my pains and bloating I think may have been ovulation yesterday.
I was hoping I was passed ovulatory cycles. But I expect I've seen even more extremes of lows then highs this month.
Having tried chem meno, I know what pure deficiency feels like. Not pleasant. But it's not what I've got now.
I just can't see how HRT can help these fluctuations. I'm glad it's helped one of your symptoms. ;D for me most things I try just create more symptoms.
I tried utrogestan before. Knocked me out within 5 days. Couldn't function. Not that I function now to be fair. Then tried it vaginally and it triggered the biggest, longest episode of stomach issues I've ever had. So that's out for me.
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Rferdi - I'm sorry you were in this position too. May I ask what hrt you find is helping? X
I'm currently using Lenzetto 1 spray morning and 2 evening, and 200mg Utrogestan for 14 days a month. I just recently added the 3rd spray of Lenzetto at night and that seems to be helping. Before I was using Oestrogel which I think was also fine but Lenzetto is so easy to apply I wanted to give it a go and see if it suits me. We'll see.
I'm still experimenting and I'm not sure using HRT during perimenopause is the best idea, I think can be very difficult for some of us to find balance with it. But I can say since I started it I've not been to the ER again, which was something that used to happen before as I often felt like I was about to die, so it must be doing something good.
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Hi,
Yes I'm still Peri, still ovulating at nearly 56, which also seems to baffle the medics.
With so many women experiencing early Meno, there must be lots who go later. I'm really hoping I'm done by 60 :'(
Several times I've wondered whether the HRT is fighting my now chaotic natural cycle.
Your post reminded me of another symptom, chronic flatulence :o
If men went through this, Utrogestan would be a lot better formulated by now...
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I had near zero medical history until I turned 50, and then...BOOM.
Same, 50 was the magic number >:(
And not a single hot flush!
Same, not one.
I do increasingly think it's the fluctuations rather than the deficiency that is really problematic, I can sometimes feel my personality changing hour by hour.
Very much agree with this, I think the fluctuations in peri can be brutal.
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Yes I'm still Peri, still ovulating at nearly 56, which also seems to baffle the medics.
Sorry if this is a silly question but, how can you tell you're still ovulating? Thanks
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...series of medical investigations and scans when I went onto continuous regime too early and had "unscheduled bleeding"
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Yes Crispy chick I am still peri. I’m 46 and all this started at 43. I literally don’t know anyone who is suffering like me, all my friends are sailing through and living their lives to the full still. I think they just see me as the hypochondriac now and think it’s in my head and I should push through it and I am withdrawing more and more from them and my world is becoming very small. I feel very angry at being dealt such a shit hand and can feel myself becoming resentful of people (everyone) because I desperately want to be ‘normal’ like them. My husband asks why I spend so much time on here but it gives me so much comfort knowing I am not alone, as in my world I am.
Torrij I’m sorry you too are having such a hard time..you hit the nail on the head when you said menopause is killing you, it is me too. It is sucking every bit of life from me. But the worst part is some days I want to be dead and then I wouldn’t be suffering anymore.
Crispychick def worth trying the mirena.i think at this stage we just have to try anything. Can I ask how you felt on Slynd? I def feel less anxious on this but my mood is very low and I am now thinking I have chronic fatigue. I can’t figure out if this is the Slynd though as I also get chronic fatigue when I take estrogen … tried it time and time again…within 2 hours of putting on gel a wave of exhaustion comes over me, my eyes go heavy and weird and I feel sedated … this wasn’t so apparent when on desogestrel so I have no idea what’s causing it? I am also spotting on and off pretty much every few days and have pms nearly every day. I’m just so done with it all xxx
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LCkegg. Hi.
I've just looked back, on Sound my motion sickness (one of my constant symptoms) tanked up even further and I was just so dizzy and sick.
To be fair, I think it's whoever I make a hormonal change that this happens, rather than the hormones themselves being the issue.
After 7 years of trying, my body tolerates nothing now.
My idea was to do nothing. But 3 1/2 months I to doing nothing and I'm in hell. Been made worse by my first missing period.
I'm now getting new symptoms - more bloating, hot flushes, low moods and crying etc. And that's all fine and 'normal' peri stuff. But for me, it's the underlying poison that tortured me day in day out.
I'm wondering if anyone else can relate to this specific thing - it really is the deal breaker on whether I have hormonal issues only, or also have ME/CFC. Very hard to describe. But here guess:
Poison - I feel ill combined with a woozy feeling, nauseous, motion sick and something running through my blood - fluey I guess. But the worst bit for me is it really ramps up when I have to talk to people either socially or for an appointment. So I feel hideous when even having a chat with a friend or speaking to my kids. If is not anxiety. Im sure of that.
Anyone else get the worse when taking thing???
LClegg. I know exactly how you feel. I often want to dud so I can stop feeling so bad. It reached a peak when they put me on AD which made me suicidal. So that reinforced the want to die because of how I feel feelings.
I have actually been very pleasantly surprised by the majority of my friends and my close family. They can see how bad I am and how long it's gone on for. They've been great. But ...I do wonder if it's because doctors keep telling me this is noticeable hormones so everyone is standing by awaiting to hear what terrible disease I have. Not sure?!
I guess I might try Mirena. But scared. But I'm seeing no improvement on doing nothing, or indeed my own hormones declining. Just more turmoil.
So. I'll put it out there - whilst chemical menopause was a disaster for me, have any of you in peri considered it????
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Hi crispychick :-* I can relate on the dizzy, woozy feeling… mine seems worse in the evening and was one of my first peri symptoms that freaked me out. Sometimes I’m lying in bed and feel like I’m on a boat as my body is moving and vibrating. I get it worse some days of the month 🤷♀️ my ears always seem blocked at the moment too and my nose is constantly stuffy so don’t know if related. And yeees, talking to people is the worst, I put it down to anxiety because I start to feel dizzy and weird and like I just want to escape. I think that’s why I’ve become so withdrawn as anything social just stresses me out. I’ve got dentist and hairdressers tomorrow and am freaking out about both because I hate being in a situation where I cannot escape if I need to! Problem is I now think I have some form of ptsd where this has gone on so long and I now associate pretty much everything with the severe anxiety, dread and depression that I have experienced so hard to say what’s real and what I’m making worse 🤷♀️
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Interesting about the ME/CFS association too as I’m having bloods
done next week to rule out other stuff but if all normal I’m thinking I may get this diagnosis. I tick all the boxes and found out the other day that twitching can be ME which I have had for months in my eye and brow, legs and arms. I also have ibs which is another symptom. Some days I can’t get off sofa, others I have more energy but have to pace myself as if I do too much I pay for it! However, I also have days where I am highly energetic and can get a lot done so I guess my question would be with ME is it every day fatigue or do you get bouts of normality?
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Thanks LClegg.
I've just had a long phone call with a friend and I've felt poisioned all through it. Now very fatigued. Maybe this part of me is ME/CFC. I'm not 100% convinced.
I can have days full of fatigue and others better too. But, so far, I can't see any pattern linked to PEM. Other than maybe the awfulness comes more from social interaction for me.
All my other symptoms are more identifiable as hormones. And they are not as constant.
I have read that a higher proportion of woman in their 40s are diagnosed with ME/CFC.
I've recently been diagnosed with PPPD. A dizzy functional neurological disorder. But that only covers about 25% of my symptoms. Again, common in peri woman.
So I'll probably end up with those two diagnoses, plus neurologist diagnosed GAD and that before we even look at my peri symptoms.
It's pure hell. It really is.
What have you tried? Xx
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I just want to add that this perimenopause is killing me. Irrespective of my poison and ME/CFC type stuff.
But...there lies a suspicion. I've had a horrific month. Longest cycle ever. Period just arrived. Feeling hideous with dizziness and mood and achy fatigue.
But...no poison today. I mean, seriously?!?! It's plagued me every single day of this long cycle. Surely that's an indicator it's hormonal.
Anyone know about FSH? Mine was 23. But that was 3 days before this period.
I do not know how to continue folks. :(
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You could view it as a sign that the volatility is coming to a head. For some they get a massive calmness after the last cycle so that could be forthcoming. It also could be because you were in chemical menopause and then the hormones have surged again so it may calm down a little to how it was before if that is the cause.
I am currently looking into pro metabolic diet to support the thyroid/liver/hormones better. I did a lot of Keto and one meal a day intermittent fasting back in the day, which can create some debilitating internal habits later on, where the emergency state of prolonged ketosis is at the cost of the thyroid functioning properly and over reliance on our stress hormones. This then can impact the liver and sex hormones, made more obvious when progesterone levels fall so low in peri and beyond as they are so protective when younger. It would also explain why progesterone only helps for a while as the root cause of the above still remains.
Think it will be a long journey but makes more sense to me than anything else ever has.
Even if you have not had such eating habits, use of the pill (which I was also a long term user of) can also impact these systems.
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Just to add that this is all due to the brain prioritising keeping us alive when in this catabolic state, hence, mood goes out the window as we are in a flight or flight state until the brain recognises that nourishment is stable. This is through eating enough carbs but always with a fat and a protein, not eating too much protein, eating far more than we have been (if been dieters or small eaters), taking light exercise only, which must include strength training (yoga, weights etc) and enough rest.
I would also get rid of the low dose AD I think you still take as it all has an impact.
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Thanks dangernouse.
I've gotta get back on an AD as my moods are hell. I'm totally done.
I'm going to try pregabalin first.
I'll look into the diet you mention. Unfortunately I've had no appetite for months.
I really really hope my volatility is coming to an end!!! You're absolutely right - I had a surge after stopping cm. I tested. My E, P and T were all high. And my fsh low.
I still felt awful though. So it's defo the volatility in my case, not hormonal levels. Which makes treatment impossible. :'( I pray mine will calm I really really do. I can't take much more. :(
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Hi crispy chick :-* it’s totally relentless isn’t it? I really think come menopause things will be a lot easier for us as still maintain it’s these shitty fluctuations that are making us so ill. Your FSH is on the higher side of normal so I really think you haven’t got long to go now. My dad is on pregabalin for sciatica but he said it’s worked wonders for his mood too. I asked dr for some but they wouldn’t prescribe because he said it wasn’t for mood related stuff 🤷♀️ anyways… I have survived my dentist and hair appointment, felt so dizzy and weird at one point and thought I was going to have to make an emergency exit but I got through. It’s so weird because my dentist and hairdresser are lovely and I could tell them how I’m feeling but I just bottle it up and pretend I’m ok! I feel beyond exhausted now though so understand how you felt yesterday after your long phone call. I will pray with you that it ends very soon for us both and we regain our lives and get our sparks back. I can’t give you any solutions but I totally know how you feel. You’re not alone ❣️xx
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Also, and this is prob just me overthinking and putting it out there, how were you after your pregnancies? I was reading that hormone levels are very low during breastfeeding (which I did unsuccessfully for a few weeks) and I felt really well (apart from being knackered obvs) so I’m now wondering why all women who breastfeed don’t feel like they’re in menopause and be symptomatic? Which again adds to my theory that it’s the fluctuations as opposed to low hormones levels otherwise we would all be feeling menopausal when breastfeeding. Am I wrong in this assumption and/or overthinking? I hope not because it gives me comfort that when this madness is over, life will be good once more 🙏🙏xx
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Hang in there. Things tend to get worse just before they get much better.
I’ve just finished my steroid eye drops and when on the highest dose I completely lost my appetite. It was the fight or flight feeling of intense fear so appetite naturally goes away as blood flow is diverted away from the digestive system to deal with the apparent threat. I had the same in peri when I lost 2 stone in 2 months from zero appetite and intense boat nausea. As you may remember I used the combined pill to calm things enough to eat again back then but the nausea gradually broke through as it was no longer strong enough to keep a lid on my own hormone volatility. It did eventually settle and now I just get instances of it if I intake too many oestrogenic foods or herbs - in fact, herbs all seem to cause me nausea now. Magnesium too.
My mum was on Pregablin last year but had to stop as she had numbness in her fingers 6 months in but she had been ok on it compared with SSRIs (which made her more anxious) and SSNIs (which caused a vertebrae to fracture). It may help with your nervous system for now.
The metabolic eating approach I am following is the Kate Deering book, and Kitty Martone, who I think you used to follow on FB ED group who now runs ONAs, also does this and she no longer needs to take any hormones including progesterone cream - which she used to take high doses of. She states that the diet has fixed her metabolism so that her body now makes the hormones it needs (she is post meno now).
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Thanks guys.
I'm just at a loss. Feel so utterly ill with no hope.
But you'd both given me hope in the pregabalin. I did do 4 days earlier in week if very low dose. And it was fine. But I've had terrible stomach bloating this week, so took 2 nights off to be sure. I think the bloating is my very delayed period. So I'll restart then increase slowly.
I couldn't find much about if helping mood, so I'm so pleased to hear that about your dad LClegg. What dose does he take?
And yes, dangernouse, I'm so broken after my trial of higher dose ssri that I can't face another AD. Good to hear your mum found pregabalin easier.
LClegg...interesting re. The refusal. From what I've read, it's licenced in England for anxiety! Not mood mind. I saw it in NICE guidelines. It's not however licences for it here in Scotland. But my GP is very supportive as she's watched me go through this hell for 7 years. My nervous system is rattled, so my thinking was to try and calm it with pregabalin.
I'll let u know how it goes. I'm starting very very low. It should also increase appetite.
I'm not sure about the pregnancy thing. But if a blur. Got anxiety both times though. Also struggled to feed.
I just need this to end. I'm losing so much now. 🙈 I'm going to do my own bloods on day 3. Check that fsh again. Everything I read says estrogen plummets rapidly in the last year of peri. I want that. Because I can't stand what I feel is the massive peaks and troughs.
Thanks for the messages. It really is nice to hear you're not the only one. Although it's horrible for you guys too. Xx
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In case this helps at all. The feeling of nausea and dizziness when socially interacting and needing to just go to my room and lie down was the beginning of I guess in the old days what would have been called a nervous breakdown for me back in 2017. I had no clue what was happening to me. Shaking, hot and cold extreme nausea unable to eat, unable to get out of bed... When I look back I guess it was perimeno but I hadn't a clue. I was very lucky in that it was completely cured with a low dose sertraline and a few days of diazepam. I never knew that anxiety could be so debilitating. I know you thought it wasn't anxiety but the symptoms sound so like what I went through. x
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Morning Crispychick :-* I’ve told you incorrect info, sorry, my dad is on gabapentin but I think they are similar to pregabalin. He is on 300mg.
How are you feeling today? I am feeling really low, I think I pushed myself too much yesterday. I’m supposed to be out with my girlfriends tonight but once again I am cancelling. They don’t even think anything of it these days, I’m surprised they even invite me anymore if I’m honest. I’ll be annoyed with myself that I haven’t gone later but if I go I will just want to come home so I am just constantly at battle with myself. I started some meditation last night, I find it so hard but am desperate to feel well and just need to switch my head off. I hate being inside my own body at the moment. :'(
I hope you are having a better morning xx
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Thanks Gnatty. I'm pretty sure that symptom is not anxiety, as I've been battling it 7 years. And tried many things in that time.
LClegg. I'm sorry you're in that position again. I do absolutely nothing nowadays. My friends are understanding - I think because I'm off work and being investigated for so many things.
Thanks for the update on your dad. Yes, I believe gabapebtin and pregabalin are very similar. But different dosing.
After a mm assume depressive episodes yesterday - I decided to bite the bullet and try mirtazapine instead. Both a phsychiatrist and my neurologist recommended it to me for my anxiety, depression (that's new) and my dizzy thing. Also helps stimulate appetite.
I'm, as expected, a complete zombie today. Big feel better now knowing I tolerated low dose pregabalin, so can still go back to it and work my way up.
It's actually been quite nice to start something without weeks of overthinking first. Although now im totally overthinking. I'm so scared of any side affects. Zombie is one of them. >:(
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Hi there, I think I have spoken on here before about Mirtazapine. That was what I went on after my total hysterectomy and oophorectomy four years ago. Yes it does make you feel like a zombie to start with - it's really common - but it wears off after a few weeks and the good thing about it t is there aren't any of the other awful side effects you can get when you start an AD. I shall be eternally grateful for my GP for giving it to me. I really believe he saved my life.
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Thanks Gnatty.
That's very reassuring. So a few weeks it took to wear off for you??? What dose was this on?
I went straight in on the 15mg as the phsyc confirmed lower doses are more sedating.
Yip. I upped my escitalopram for 12 weeks and became suicidal. Horrific 12 weeks.
Are you still taking it now? Many thanks for the support. X
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I have to agree with Gnatty, I too am on mirtazapine which my doctor started me on 2 years ago when I had such severe insomnia I was so mentally unwell. I too believe it saved my life as I could not have lived so sleep deprived for much longer. I’m on 7.5mg but may look to increase to 15mg with my mood being so low as I haven’t found it to have any impact on my mood or anxiety at 7.5mg. I’m also on sertraline which I have been on since I was 20. A doctor I saw did suggest trying venlafaxine but I’m scared to try this reading how awful it is when you start and try to come off. However, I need a life and if it gives me one then I will try anything as at the moment I’m just existing. The next day groggy side effect with the mirtazapine does wear off after about a week. X
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Hi Crispy! I was put straight on to 15mg and stayed on it for about 12 months. I think it also enabled me to find the right dose of oestrogen, and once this was sorted and I felt well enough I was able to come off them without any problems as I recall. I remember the joy of sleeping through and getting my appetite back. Within 24 hours! Previous to trying them I had restarted the sertraline which had served me so well four years previously and it was like poison. I certainly didn't make and wouldn't have made 12 weeks like you did...I was honestly within a gnats fart of asking to be sectioned.... If you'll excuse my terminology!
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Oh. Great.
Thanks ladies. Both very reassuring replies.
It's only day 1. I've just had a nap. Definitely not out of the woods yet. I have extreme sensitivity to everything I touch. I can't even take a utrogestan without severe stomach pain. And by day 4 I'm comotosed. There are so many weird symptoms I have that could kick off with this trial.
So jury is very much out on mirtazapine for me. But I feel good that I've at least made a start and tried it. Ive had it for weeks, but was too scared to try.
Gnatty - how long until you saw benefits for anxiety and mood?
Unfortunately I should never have stayed (been allowed to stay??) on my increased escitalopram for 12 weeks. It's why I ended up under a crisis team. But it's behind me now. But it's also the reason I've been too scared to try mirtazapine .
LClegg - venalfexine was the next one suggested to me. But I'm not interested. That's why I pushed for the pregabalin. If you have anxiety, it'd definitely be worth re asking. It was ladies on this forum put me onto it. ;)
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So had my bloods done last week and Estrogen has come back at 82pmol which doctor advised is very low. I’m wondering if this is because of the Slynd pill I’m on. I guess it would explain why I’ve felt excruciating fatigue and very depressed mood for the past couple of weeks. Have no idea where to go from here though as tried Estrogen so many times and just can’t find the right dose but equally barely functioning at the moment and had some really dark thoughts last week. Crispychick, can I ask how you felt in chemical menopause please? I’m wondering if I should go down this route myself to just switch off my cycle. I know, even on Slynd, I must still be cycling as have had high Estrogen symptoms too… it just feels like my body cannot tolerate the fluctuating. How have you been feeling? How are you doing on the mirtazapine so far? Xx
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::) truthfully, I'm not sure I'm the right person to ask. It wasn't right for me. But we think my body overreacts to changes - so cm is a massive change.
All I'll say is the first month your hormones surge - which, for me, caused awful anger. Then they depart. I felt a lag time between my hormones bottoming out and true menopausal symptoms hitting - which were extreme joint pain and massive hot flushes.
That said, most people go into it with add back HRT already in place. Perhaps that feels like a different game. :o
Have you tried the milder estriol creams you can buy? Biovea / onas etc. As you're in slynd you don't need to worry about the prog side. Just a thought.
My body is most certainly in extreme fluctuation. My boobs hurt this month - I think my E is sky high. In yet last month I think it was low as I had a really long cycle. Both are hell. :o
Erm mirtazapine. My trial is over! Not unexpected. I got to day 9 then had to jump. I had terrible sedation and zombie (no idea how u can take 7.5mg) but I was continuing with that, then on day 9 I started to get really dizzy. And I just can't do dizzy. I already have a neurological diagnosis of PPPD (constant dizziness) I can't add more dizziness. So that's off the cards. I'm slowly coming down. 7.5mg was more sedating for me than 15mg. Even 3.65mg last night caused sedation. Crazy!!!
It's not for me. It's disappointing as it was helping my mood, appetite and hot sweats already!!! Definitely worth you increasing to help your mood. If you tolerate 7.5mg, you'll be grand on 15mg. X
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Oh that’s really disappointing, you just want/need a break don’t you? Something to work just for once. I don’t find the mirtazapine sedating anymore if im honest, I think eventually your body just adapts but im worried now to come off it and get no sleep like before and maybe it is doing something. I really think my low mood is the low estrogen or fluctuating so reluctant to up just yet and then have to try and get off it at some point as I’m also on sertraline so not ideal. I get the not wanting to feel dizzy, I had full blown vertigo a couple of times when this all started but now mine is an off balance feeling/swaying which makes me really anxious!
I’ve tried Biovea progesterone cream and have looked at the Estrogen ones but I just think until the fluctuations calm down nothing will help.
Yep massive swollen boobs is a tell tale sign for me when Estrogen high. .. hurts to take bra off. I had that a couple of months ago so def fluctuating still even on Slynd.
I’m truly gobsmacked how some women go through all this without any symptoms… I just cannot get my head round it. It has ruined my life. I just obsess daily about how I feel now, what symptoms I have, what they mean and it’s just utter shite. Xx
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You sound exactly like me!!!
I obsess constantly. Which I know isn't healthy or good for me. So I try AD to help escape my rumination -more symptoms. It's just hell.
Yip. I've got really bad woozy, swaying today. My ears are sore with it. I'm spinny. Horrid. But I couldn't take any more dizziness. It just felt like bad side affects over and above the severe sedation. Too much for me.
I don't often get sore boobs. So my E must be dancing very high. Right enough, I was flushing constantly last month. Nadda this month.
And the obvious meno symptoms - flushing and sore boobs dont bother me - it's the rest of the hell. I just feel so ill. 24/7. :(
I'm the same. I can't comprehend how some Roman feel very little. But my own sister is one of them. Although she bypassed most of this peri stuff on a combined pill.
If you want to chat more about chem meno, I'm happy to. I'm just not sure I'm the best person to ask. ;)
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Thank you, i appreciate that…. I’m going to give cm some serious thought and may book a consultation with a gynaecologist at our local private hospital and ask their opinion ..I just feel like I’ve spent so much on private appts with meno specialists and no better. I think it’s fine if you fit the stereotypical give HRT and it solves all or most issues but they don’t have the answers for people like us. One doctor said I needed to just ride it..: yeh, perhaps be in my shoes for a few days and then tell me how you feel about ‘just riding it’! 😡
It’s funny you say about your sister because I went to doctors in my late 30s to ask to go on the combined pill because I was starting to feel hormonal and not quite right and they wouldn’t let me because I was over 35 yet I have a friend of 52 sailing through with just a few night sweats and she’s still on combined pill. I really think had the doctor let me I would have skipped all this shit as I felt great on the pill before I had kids. Perhaps they should also look at the risks of not allowing women on the combined pill as id happily take my chances over the suicidal thoughts, severe anxiety and debilitating fatigue that I have been having over the past 2.5 years! X
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Well, if it makes you feel any better, I was advised by the meno clinic - in my 40s - to try the combined pill. Try them all.
And try them all I did. But every single one brought side affects that I never used to get - mostly migraines. But the moods on some were horrific.
So, unfortunately, it wasn't my panacea. :(
So now I'm stuck in a void of no hormonal help, when I've got symptoms most woman in peri could never imagine, never mind experience. >:(
I was told by a bhrt clinic, after many failed attempts at hormonal treatment 'it'll end eventually '. Wonderful.
So, when I went to gynae. I paid. But already had my GP on board for chem meno. So I had a referral. So the decision to have cm was then pretty quick. If that helps? X
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My GP 10 years ago recommended the combined pill for perimenopause as she said that HRT was not strong enough to override peri volatility. It worked for a few weeks but the very high surges broke through.
I have been using CHAT GPT and found the medical advice, and the way it remembers all of your history, better than any real life medical experiences. One thing it threw up was that I was sensitive to any blood flow changes, hence why vasodilators (most herbs, magnesium, oestrogen fall under this), which causes me the nausea and dizziness.
It also explained that progesterone-only HRT initially stimulates the circulating oestrogen causing good effects but after a few days (depending on where you are in menopause) the P will dominate and cause low oestrogen symptoms which does make sense when I’ve had blood tests that’s show E to be very low. In early peri (before wild fluctuations) you can be in an oestrogen dominant state instead, so the progesterone-only makes you feel worse for a few days as it stimulates oestrogen further but then better as it rebalances the high oestrogen. (Please note that the ‘dominance’ word, derived from how they would measure combined pills, is important as they offset each other and it’s all about achieving balance between the two).
It explained that as I am sensitive to the blood flow changes, oestrogen HRT would still make me feel worse but that micro-dosing could help to gradually allow it in - it suggested 10mg of progesterone and a cocktail stick tiny smidge of oestrogel, which you gradually raise over months and months, as an option.
It also suggested that my new pro-metabolic diet could equally provide complete hormone balance without needing exogenous hormones - or it said I could try both.
I was going to do the micro-dosing this week but have already started to feel better from the diet. I am now able to tolerate milk, for the first time in 15 years, and I am already feeling some hormonal stability and more energy, where I have been dragging myself around for the last 10 years! So am going to leave off the micro-dosing for now.
What I have also learnt, which may help you Crispy, is that hormones do not just return to normal after having taken or restricted them. They take at least a 30 day cycle to start to settle and rebalance themselves, and I suspect 3-6 months to properly complete this.
Also, any emergency body function systems that the brain turns to, such as using stress hormones to produce energy after prolonged fasting or low nutrition, also need to have a prolonged period of re-feeding to recognise that food is available. It can then turn off those emergency systems and switch back to the ones that need sugar to function. This will then gradually improve energy levels, concentration, sleep, digestion, mood etc as the emergency states are to keep you alive at the cost of these.
Sometimes just stopping everything and letting the body come to a balance all by itself, albeit with adequate nutrition, can be the most powerful thing that we can do.
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Just want to jump in … I hear you . I have been to hell and back with extreme symptoms started when I was about 50 and couldn’t sleep felt agitated in my head fast heartbeat night sweats ect ect and couldn’t function countless tests and countless trips to A&E I really thought I was going to die absolutely horrendous
Went on hrt at about 51 and it settled me down and been on 75mg evorel and daily utrogestran gradually increasing to this dose for about 3 years
But then these last couple of months 3 years later I have been in a complete mess again can’t work feel so dizzy and as I have read on this feed I also feel poisoned like adrenaline rushes
. I went to drs yesterday and blood pressure is high they put me on tablets and upped my mertazapine which I have been on for a couple of years after losing my mum also dr gave me a beta blocker to calm my fast heartbeat started them today All these tablets I feel drugged up …. But pulse rate today is normal and blood pressure is down
I think I have gone crazy with all of this and sent my family crazy with me especially my lovely husband it’s been awful keep asking my husband for reassurance he must be getting fed up with me I am like a broken record keep asking I will be ok won’t I what if it’s this and that . I am sure others can relate
I am really worried that there is something seriously wrong with me I couldn’t stop shaking and have zero appetite and crying all the time with very low mood so saw Dr yesterday as .I really needed help
I am sitting here crying again thinking I will never feel better and health anxiety is really ramped up . I feel so done with it all I am basically housebound as feel so weird when I try and do anything and desperate to get back to work and feeling normal .
It seems I am not alone and like others don’t know anyone who is as extreme as me I keep thinking the worst
I have had a blood test today to check oestridiol to see what level I am as hoping it’s low oestrogen and upping my dose will help me
Sending everyone suffering a massive hug
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Just want to jump in … I hear you . I have been to hell and back with extreme symptoms started when I was about 50 and couldn’t sleep felt agitated in my head fast heartbeat night sweats ect ect and couldn’t function countless tests and countless trips to A&E I really thought I was going to die absolutely horrendous
Went on hrt at about 51 and it settled me down and been on 75mg evorel and daily utrogestran gradually increasing to this dose for about 3 years
But then these last couple of months 3 years later I have been in a complete mess again can’t work feel so dizzy and as I have read on this feed I also feel poisoned like adrenaline rushes
. I went to drs yesterday and blood pressure is high they put me on tablets and upped my mertazapine which I have been on for a couple of years after losing my mum also dr gave me a beta blocker to calm my fast heartbeat started them today All these tablets I feel drugged up …. But pulse rate today is normal and blood pressure is down
I think I have gone crazy with all of this and sent my family crazy with me especially my lovely husband it’s been awful keep asking my husband for reassurance he must be getting fed up with me I am like a broken record keep asking I will be ok won’t I what if it’s this and that . I am sure others can relate
I am really worried that there is something seriously wrong with me I couldn’t stop shaking and have zero appetite and crying all the time with very low mood so saw Dr yesterday as .I really needed help
I am sitting here crying again thinking I will never feel better and health anxiety is really ramped up . I feel so done with it all I am basically housebound as feel so weird when I try and do anything and desperate to get back to work and feeling normal .
It seems I am not alone and like others don’t know anyone who is as extreme as me I keep thinking the worst
I have had a blood test today to check oestridiol to see what level I am as hoping it’s low oestrogen and upping my dose will help me
Sending everyone suffering a massive hug
Just want to send you a massive hug back, remember you're not alone in this, you already know it but still it can feel so lonely sometimes. I myself have been struggling quite a bit lately since I increased to 3 sprays of Lenzetto, I don't understand why, it seemed to work great at first... I sometimes don't know what to do anymore and I lose my patience with all of this. My husband's also an angel, so very patient and loving, I really don't know what I'd do without all his support. In every way, because I'm unable to work regularly due to this (self-employed), I'm mostly off sick, and so my income has decreased very significantly. I also don't know anyone in person who's suffering like this, all my friends and other women I know around my age have very few symptoms apparently, most of them mainly hot flushes, one symptom I've never even had (thankfully).
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Yes honeybee. You ate not alone.
I'm so sorry you're suffering too. It's so so horrid. I understand. I hear you.
I've lived in this hell for 7 years. It's now worse than ever as I approach 49. I've just had a month of low estrogen - causing my longest cycle ever. It was horrific. Had loads of hot flushes - but they're the least of my worries. Then this cycle has clearly been exceptionally high estrogen as my boobs hurt like crazy. And I feel so so ill.
I seem to feel every single twist and turn of my hormones. With them now surging very high and very low I feel like I am dying.
I feel there is no way out. But I'll keep trying. I took have a very supportive husband and I have two amazing teens who cause me no problems. But I'd love to interact with them like a normal mum. But I just feel so very very ill. It's breaking me. :(
I started this thread as I find it reassuring to hear from others in a similar position. We do need to support each other. Xx
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Hi Crispy. Just came to say that I have fibromyalgia which got significantly worse when peri hit. I went from being able to tolerate my symptoms to being in constant pain, feeling like I was wading through mud, constantly exhausted, feeling of flu like symptoms, throw in the lack of sleep, the palpations, tremors and anxiety for good measure and I was not loving life. I start E and P at the first sign of peri which sorted out the itchy skin and the uti's but did nothing for the pain, after countless attempts to get testosterone from NHS, I eventually went private and it made a big difference. Unfortunately, as time has past, my pain had got intolerable again. I tried gabapentin but I got side effects but no benefits. I've recently tried new pain Meds which is also an AD. The first week was rough, I was spaced out, dizzy and nauseous but I was desperate so I persevered. I'm 6 weeks in now, some side effects are still there but they are out weighed by the benefits. I don't feel like I'm 25 again but I'm definitely much better than I was and desperately hoping it stays that way. I know that doesn't solve any of your problems but I just wanted to make the point that peri had a huge impact on a preexisting condition so possibly there is more than one thing causing your issues. It's taken me 6 years to get to this point. I hope you find some answers soon, you will get there xx
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OMG as I move further into peri (nearly 49) still month periods, but erratic now - my level of feeling like I am 'dying' is just getting worse and worse.
My mood is doing okay since I stopped the increased antidepressants they are so keen to put me on. But I feel so physically ill that I regularly feel I don't wavy to live. I don't want to end it. But how long am I realistically going to have to live feeling this ill. Feeling like I am dying. Not functioning at all. :(
Thank you Peach8 for your comments. Im so glad you are finally getting 'some' relief.
I am honestly at a loss as to whether mine is all hormones, or if something else is at play. It just all started at the same time. :'(
I've just got a period and the swing from some symptoms to others is crucifying. I'm struggling so so much. Physically. Noone understands how ill I feel on a daily basis. .
It is pure hell.
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Crispy, so sorry to read in your last post here how much you're suffering. I just want to send you a hug, and I hope you and all the other women on this forum who are going through horrendous peri/meno journeys, me included, find the right solution to this, soon.
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Hi CrispyChick
Bless you! It’s God Damn awful! “Poisoned” is JUST the word I’ve used. I feel unstable, heavy, exhausted, tearful, horrible taste in my mouth, terrified, anxious, low, lightheaded, shaky, racing heart, dry eyed, burning mouth, head feels bunged up with some sort of weird pressure. I’m very nearly 50 and I’ve been feeling like this for about 5 years. I’ve not had periods now for just over a year so am post menopausal.
My husband and kids tell me that I’m getting better and I think they’re right but it’s taking SUCH an awful long time. I do, now and again, get better days, so I want to say to you that you will get there. It’s a long and horrendous road and I still can’t believe that Menopause can do this, but I’ve been tested for so many things and apparently I’m well!!! Hahaha 🤣🤣🤣
You have ALL my sympathy. BIG hugs. Pxx
Ps thank you so much ladies for this feed. It’s helped me so much.