Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => All things menopause => Topic started by: Hopeful2 on July 30, 2023, 07:56:38 AM
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Good morning ladies.
I'm looking for some reassurance please. I saw a gynacologist who did a blood test showing my oestrogen level was 316. So he said I could go up to 3 pumps of oestrogel to help manage my atrophy. I take my 2 pumps & utrogestan at night. So was going to start with 1/4 pump in morning working up to a pump as I get big sore spots where I apply it on thighs when I up it, then it settles once used to it. Really anxious about upping dose, but 316 isn't too high is it? I had worked my way up to taking 2 pumps for one month at the time of the blood test but that was a few weeks ago now still haven't had courage to up the dose. Thanks for your help.
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Are you using any local oestrogen (eg, Vagifem, Ovestin) for the atrophy? Systemic oestrogen doesn't always address the genitourinary symptoms, so an increase in local oestrogen might be more appropriate.
JP x
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Thanks for your reply Joaniepat. I tried ovestin but it gave me terrible prickling feeling down backs of legs. Oestrogel has made problems was atrophy bearable but not comfortable so was hoping 3 pumps would solve that. 3 pumps isn't too much is it?
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Hello Hopeful2. I was wondering how you were doing. Well done on working your way up to two pumps of oestrogen! That is amazing. I remember how much your body struggled to adjust to it.
Three pumps is not too much. Is it possible to go as slowly as possible? So instead of increasing by half a pump, could you increase by a tiny bit? I do not use the gel so I do not know if that is something you could do.
You managed to get up to two pumps so if you wanted to I am sure your body would adjust to the increase. :)
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Thank you for your reply Flossieteacake lovely to hear from you. Hope you are keeping OK. Yes was going to do just a tiny bit and build up so anxiety won't go too crazy. Anxiety bad as usual dont feel ill ever be myself again.
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Thank you for your reply Flossieteacake lovely to hear from you. Hope you are keeping OK. Yes was going to do just a tiny bit and build up so anxiety won't go too crazy. Anxiety bad as usual dont feel ill ever be myself again.
I really am sorry your anxiety is really bad. That makes it all the more difficult for you to increase your oestrogen. Would it help to increase your oestrogen when your anxiety is not as bad? I may be wrong there but just wondered if it would take some pressure off you.
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Hi if you are taking utrogestan on a sequential basis, then I'd suggest upping the estrogen at a time when you are already taking the utrogestan. For me, my anxiety and digestive things (which make the anxiety worse) spike more when my estrogen is unopposed.
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Thanks for your reply Joaniepat. I tried ovestin but it gave me terrible ****ling feeling down backs of legs. Oestrogel has made problems was atrophy bearable but not comfortable so was hoping 3 pumps would solve that. 3 pumps isn't too much is it?
There are other local oestrogens you can try besides Ovestin. I use Vagifem, which has been great for me. There is a list of products available under treatments in the main menu.
JP x
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I agree re different vaginal treatments. For example if you want to stay with estriol, the generic estriol cream is 10 x weaker than ovestin and therefore can be used more liberally and the fillers are different too.
These are the fillers for Ovestin:
Octyldodecanol
cetyl palmitate
glycerin
cetyl alcohol
stearyl alcohol
Polysorbate 60
sorbitan stearate
chlorhexidine dihydrochloride
lactic acid
sodium hydroxide to pH 4,
purified water.
These are for 0.01% estriol cream:
Benzoic acid
Arachis oil
Glyceryl monostearate
Glycerin
Glutamic acid
Purified water
I use Vagifem (now generic Vagirux) and the 0.01% estriol cream, but as Joaniepat says there are others too.
As for the oestrogen reading - that is not too high - but it is a good reading - I would be very happy with that if you feel OK, and a local oestrogen now is probably the way forward rather than increasing your systemic dose, as it goes straight to where you need it :)
Hurdity x
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Thank you all for taking the time to reply 💐.
I've been using a tiny bit extra of oestrogel in the morning which has been going ok, I was hoping if I get up to 3 pumps I wouldn't need to use topical and it might help with my anxiety too which is pretty bad. Do you think this could work?
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Thank you all for taking the time to reply 💐.
I've been using a tiny bit extra of oestrogel in the morning which has been going ok, I was hoping if I get up to 3 pumps I wouldn't need to use topical and it might help with my anxiety too which is pretty bad. Do you think this could work?
I think it is going to be tricky to treat your VA without any localised oestrogen but I know how sensitive you are to medications so it is always worth trying to see how your VA responds. It is wonderful you have been able to increase the oestrogel slightly. :)
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Thank you for your kind reply Flossieteacake.
I've been taking my 2 pumps at night on my thighs & the extra tiny bit on my thighs in the morning as I think you can't put more than 1 pump on one limb at a time is that right. Hope I'm doing it right?
My mouth is much dryer/sore since upping the dose hope that's just a coincidence, but I best stay with it. Means so much to be able to chat 😊
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I do not have any experience with oestrogel but I am sure somebody will answer your question.
The dry mouth is so annoying. I get that too. I just use extra mouthwash. They say sucking lozenges can help too.
It is good to see you posting. :)
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Hopeful2 yes, so if you were doing four pumps you could either split into morning and night, or start using your upper outer arms for the extra. However some women (me included) avoid arms given it's proximity to breasts. I found I got sore breasts when using it on my arms but then I'm super sensitive to estrogen.
I have had dry mouth, burning mouth, more reflux type stuff, since starting hrt at Christmas - all the stuff I thought hrt was meant to alleviate, it is confusing!!!
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Thank you both for your kind replies, much appreciated 💐
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Good morning ladies, it's me again.
I was doing ok when I upped by oestrogel to 2 pumps plus tiny bit, but yesterday tried to up it more and have terrible pri ck ling all down thighs and burning and all red around my bum cheeks with a few nasty spots, feels like sitting on pins & needles. So upset, really uncomfortable to sit down and slight trace to blood too which sometimes happens when I up oestrogel. So I will have to go back to 2 pumps today and hope it will settle down, usually these things take ages to settle. No point going to GP as they know nothing about hrt.
I'm off work today, but back to work tomorrow. I have a desk job so will be really uncomfortable.
I'm off Friday again and maybe I will try & get estriol as mine is 4 months out of date although maybe I should just use that one I have anyway as I only use a pea sized amount mixed with moisturiser, but using any extra oestrogen in anyway is probably a bad idea now until it settles. I'm terrified to do anything now feel like a rabbit in headlights, sorry for ranting on 😓
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I wonder whether an antihistamine would help get you through the discomfort of today? Sounds like some kind of reaction.
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Oh no, not again! I am so sorry this has happened. I understand how upsetting this is but try to remember this has happened to you before and it will pass. It is so unfair you get these extreme reactions to medications.
Penguins suggestion of an antihistamine is great. Are you able to tolerate them?
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Thank you both for your kind replies 💐
No I didn't get on well when I tried antihistamine before. Disappointed it's making me have a bleed too when I haven't had one for months, but like you say it will pass and settle again
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Thank you both for your kind replies 💐
No I didn't get on well when I tried antihistamine before. Disappointed it's making me have a bleed too when I haven't had one for months, but like you say it will pass and settle again
That really is bad luck. It is tough reacting to medication. I really feel for you. How are you feeling now?
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Well red & sore when sitting. Thanks for your support Flossieteacake 💐. How are you keeping? Hope things are well with you.
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Ouch. I really hope your skin heals soon.
I am fine. Thank you for asking. :)
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I know I should be using Estriol again, but my anxiety wouldn't let me. So trying to up oestrogel again.
I have sore jaw & tongue white again like last time I upped it. Hoping breakthrough bleeding won't start again this time and prickling down legs won't get worse. Not to mind burning at back of head. Its terrible trying to up it finding it difficult to stay calm.
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Could the white tongue be oral thrush? I wonder what else would cause the white tongue, is it bothering you?
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I know I should be using Estriol again, but my anxiety wouldn't let me. So trying to up oestrogel again.
I have sore jaw & tongue white again like last time I upped it. Hoping breakthrough bleeding won't start again this time and ****ling down legs won't get worse. Not to mind burning at back of head. Its terrible trying to up it finding it difficult to stay calm.
This will pass. Unfortunately, you do seem to have a bad reaction to any increases but they do pass. I am so sorry you are feeling so poorly. Can you lie down and listen to something you find relaxing be it music or a podcast?
You are not alone and we are all here to support you.
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Thank you both for your kind replies. Yes it causes thrush in my mouth and scalp, scalp burning terribly & bum cheeks burning prickling and random sore spots on back & boobs occasionally and slight breakthrough bleeding. This is what I always get when upping. It's hard to know whether this or atrophy is worse, but if I can withstand this it will probably settle down. We were supposed to be going away this weekend but because I keep breaking down crying we couldn't go.
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Thank you both for your kind replies. Yes it causes thrush in my mouth and scalp, scalp burning terribly & bum cheeks burning ****ling and random sore spots on back & boobs occasionally and slight breakthrough bleeding. This is what I always get when upping. It's hard to know whether this or atrophy is worse, but if I can withstand this it will probably settle down. We were supposed to be going away this weekend but because I keep breaking down crying we couldn't go.
I am so sorry you cannot go away this weekend. That is unfair. You are so brave. You keep trying to increase your HRT despite having such a severe reaction. I think you should feel so proud of yourself.
You saying this will settle down is so positive. I just hope it is soon and you are feeling okay while you wait for it to calm down.
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Thank you Flossieteacake for your kind words.
My head has been burning so much it's made my hair all frizzy so now panicking again. Worrying constantly that I'm doing the right thing upping the oestrogel. I know 316 is a good level if it wasn't for the atrophy it would be ok.
I found out yesterday when I rang the menopause clinic as I hadnt heard anything that the referral had been rejected a month ago as the GP never put what the referral was for and of course GP never did anything about it, I was so upset, after seeing 3 gynacologists so far which didn't know about menopause when I was supposed to be referred to menopause clinic instead each time. So hard to believe we have to suffer so much to get help.
I'm am sorry for ranting on again.
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Thank you Flossieteacake for your kind words.
My head has been burning so much it's made my hair all frizzy so now panicking again. Worrying constantly that I'm doing the right thing upping the oestrogel. I know 316 is a good level if it wasn't for the atrophy it would be ok.
I found out yesterday when I rang the menopause clinic as I hadnt heard anything that the referral had been rejected a month ago as the GP never put what the referral was for and of course GP never did anything about it, I was so upset, after seeing 3 gynacologists so far which didn't know about menopause when I was supposed to be referred to menopause clinic instead each time. So hard to believe we have to suffer so much to get help.
I'm am sorry for ranting on again.
Please feel free to post as much as you want to. Your GP is appalling! It was so hard for you to get the referral in the first place. Pity the clinic did not contact the GP to ask the reason rather then just reject it. On Monday perhaps you could send a message to your GP or even the practice manager and explain what happened. You really need this referral done.
How long does it usually take for these side effects to wear off after you increase?
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I haven't really had bad side effects as bad as this going up to the 2 pumps. Now my hands look all greasy and bits of skin coming off. Now in complete panick. Don't even want to take my 2 pumps tonight now but that would be a mistake wouldn't it. Crying again now definetly won't sleep tonight.
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I haven't really had bad side effects as bad as this going up to the 2 pumps. Now my hands look all greasy and bits of skin coming off. Now in complete panick. Don't even want to take my 2 pumps tonight now but that would be a mistake wouldn't it. Crying again now definetly won't sleep tonight.
I would not stop the gel completely but why not go back to your usual 2 pumps? Once your body is back on the dose you can cope with I am sure you will feel much better.
I am so sorry you have had such a bad reaction. It is very distressing for you.