Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => Postmenopause => Topic started by: Postmeno3 on April 13, 2022, 08:46:55 AM
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I'm sure I read about this somewhere yesterday and can't for the life of me figure out where. Has anyone else come across this? It sounds very radical and flies in the face of the "sufficient oestrogenisation first" thing, but as women produce so much more testosterone than oestrogen, in my understanding, has someone got a point? 🤔
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Yes I think someone posted a link about all the benefits of testosterone and quelling a lot of the myths. I seem to recall that it's an option in particular for women who can't take oestrogen for whatever reason. Also that in the past it was used to treat breast cancer. I can't remember which thread the post was on though.
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I think this might be the thread, there are links to testosterone research:
https://www.menopausematters.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,61392.0.html
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Yes it was me who posted the link Postmeno3. I’ve read quite a bit about it on this particular doctors website in the states.
She started out just treating women with breast cancer in this way many years ago but that expanded to treating many women without breast cancer.
Quite a few clinicians in the states now do this for menopause but my understanding is that it’s always with implants so not at all sure if it would work the same way with gel.
I know the head judge on ‘Strictly’ has testosterone implants and must say she looks well on it!
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Wow, ladies. Thank you so much. Am really curious about the myths. After all, men have standalone testosterone despite having other hormones circulating. It's really the "benefits" of testosterone I need; primarily energy and stamina leading to improved motivation, concentration, mood etc in terms of a reasonable QOL. I'm zero further forward with those priorities in relation to oestrogen, but there are the tiniest flickers of early days testosterone. This is REALLY INTERESTING stuff. Thank you all! 🙏
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It is very interesting indeed Postmeno3! As it is our most predominant hormone (three times as abundant as estradiol) throughout our reproductive life it’s little wonder we feel the lack of it post menopause.
It’s not just about libido!!
The best book on the subject is by a doctor called Kathy Maupin called ‘The Female Secret Hormone’
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Is there much awareness in the UK, Marchlove? I might put a post on the Newson Community! 👍
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Practically zero, apart from some of the hysterectomy ladies who used to get testosterone implants on the nhs and have been campaigning to get access since it was withdrawn. It worked wonders for them.
I believe Chelsea and Westminster are able to prescribe them so that might be an option for some.
As I said I’m really not sure if the gel works the same way but you might be able to find out as the campaign ladies have some sort of group I believe.
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Yes, I thought this would be the case. I have a bloods review coming up with the NHS specialist any time now and I will mention this to her as it was she who was most emphatic that it was the qualities of testosterone I needed far more! Meanwhile, I have put up a post on the NH Balance app community and will report back if I hear anything. I wonder if those of you with private consultants attending you might run the notion of standalone testosterone past them should an opportunity naturally arise? 🙏
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I had a Google re Shirley Ballas ( head judge Strictly) re the testosterone implants. I couldn't find anything apart from a news article saying she had had tests done and her testosterone levels were abnormally high. Couldn't find much else about it.
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I had a testosterone implant inserted privately whilst waiting for my appointment with the nhs meno clinic. I can't say I was impressed with it. It took 2 months before I felt any benefit from it then it stopped working in month 5 so from the 6 months it should have lasted I only got 3. I find the Tostran I'm on now much better, it also has the benefit of being able to stop if I need to. They say the implant can't be removed. Also not keen on the scar it left behind.
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That's really useful to know, thank you.
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Ah, Sheila99! Thanks for sharing your own experience. I'm hoping we can find out about whether testosterone gel on its own deals with what certain women need. Seemingly the testosterone sachets are being changed soon for better titration......for men! 🙄
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Bump for Hurdity.....🤔
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Hello girls xx
I use testosterone only (Androfeme) I love it.
I have been doing this on and off since November.
Prior to November I was on Livial for 18 months, and I also tried estrogel/prometrium ; only for 4 days (I hated it)
So I decided to try testosterone (only) because I read that it changes to estrogen if you don’t have enough in your body, so I thought that I can benefit from both (estrogen and testosterone) without having to take prometrium.
For me it works. It has fixed what I wanted it to; mainly being my constant aches and pains in my body, and constant headaches and feeling like I have the flu.
It gives me ever lasting stamina (I run 8 kms most days and now I do it easier, since using testosterone)
I sleep very very well now ( I used to get up to wee every hour through the night; and now I only get up 3 times through the night but then go straight back to sleep)
It’s not all great, as it has given me symptoms of warm flush (I never flushed before using testosterone)
And a (sometimes) stinging vagina (I never had this symptom prior to using testosterone)
I don’t use it everyday. I use it every second day (MOO less is more xx)
I have dropped weight around my stomach (weight that I gained while on Livial)
I am a sensible woman, so if I start to feel or see a change that I don’t like, then I will stop immediately (like I did with the other HRTs that I tried in the past)
Hope this helps xx
Lots of love
Justyna
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Are you post menopause Justyna? X
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Hi all, I am a total newbie on the forum and have not posted before. I am 56yrs & post menopausal (15yrs approx) due to breast cancer treatment then a total hysterectomy (including ovaries). I have ALL the symptoms of menopause but am really struggling with forgetfulness and general brain fog but can’t have HRT. I had hoped that Testosterone alone might be an option but keep reading that the body converts this to oestrogen. I am not sure how it does this - it seems ovaries do it and I don’t have them but know our bodies are clever and have more than one way to achieve things… so, does anyone know if it still happens if no ovaries? Or know if T alone is an option for someone with a history of hormone sensitive BC? Also I saw it is expected that there are no vaso symptoms but I still have very regular flushes 🤦♀️ P.S. I am awaiting a menopause clinic appointment as my GP has now made a referral.
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Hi Podry and welcome
So pleased your Gp has referred you to a menopause clinic.
Yes testosterone can convert to estrogen by way of an enzyme. This is a natural occurrence. So, women with BC can take testosterone if they take a aromatise blocker which stops this conversion.
You can explore this with your menopause clinic but you might need a further referral to Chelsea and Westminster as the best delivery of testosterone for ladies in this situation is by implant.
If you Google testosterone implants for breast cancer you will find a lot of information from studies in the states.
Testosterone as a stand-alone treatment for menopause is accepted there in many circle’s, we’re a bit behind the times, but I think this is your best avenue if research.
X
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Hi Podry - I can't answer the thing about how the body converts testosterone, but I did want to encourage you to think and research more about whether you can have HRT. Because there are many women who've previously had breast cancer who choose to take HRT. The Newson Health doctors are very supportive of this choice, as long as your treatment has finished and you've been discharged.
And there is a lot of research showing that it is safe - take a look at the book called 'Oestrogen Matters' by Bluming on Amazon. There are also several podcast episodes from the Dr Louise Newson podcast where she talks about women taking HRT after breast cancer and the risks and benefits.
It saddens me that women aren't given all the facts and allowed to make an informed choice for themselves on this one. They are just told 'you can't do this'. That's not patient-led medicine. My mum had breast cancer and couldn't have HRT and had to take Letrizole to block all estrogen and she has just aged so badly on it, her memory is so bad and she's put on so much weight and had vaginal atrophy and a prolapse. I'm sure if someone had explained all the risks and benefits to her and allowed her to choose, she would have taken it.
After all, it's about quality of life. So please do some more research and reading and listening so you can make an informed choice - and if that choice is still not to take it, that's fine - at least it was informed and not you just being told by a doctor.
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Yes you’re so right joziel.
I’ve a bit of a thing about testosterone mono therapy for Cancer as it certainly from what I’ve researched had very good results.
That said, as you say, many women choose to take hrt for not only quality of life but also to prevent other horrible health outcomes.
You Mum is a case in point bless her.
My Mum died from cancer when I was very young, so it is a matter very close to my heart. Looking back she was treated inappropriately and hrt would have made her life, however long she had, so much better.
So Podry, if it was me, I’d explore every avenue to get hrt in the best way appropriate for your situation.
As Joziel says, you’ll have to be your own health advocate to some extent, but I’m sure there’s a way forward for you. x
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Hi all, sorry for the long delay in replying - I had not used the forum before and lost the link! Anyway, your responses are very helpful - although I have only been able to read them today. I did in fact do exactly as you all urged me to do anyway!
I was recommended elsewhere to explore the Balance-Menopause website/app and found loads of really useful information that educated and challenged my perceptions which were previously based on what I had been told at clinic - some 15 years ago though, so there was possibly not another view out there yet.
I ultimately saw one of the breast team doctors who is a menopause specialist after I called the BCN - I didn’t even know how to contact her anymore! I was so much more informed by then and after a 90 minute assessment and consultation I have been using transdermal oestrogen (2 pumps oestrogel) and oestrogen pessaries since early October. I will see her again mid January which is when she plans to start me on Testosterone too.
I do feel better already, my flushes have drastically reduced, I think my brain fog has also reduced and hope that will be boosted again by testosterone.
I am sad for the many years I have struggled on with these debilitating symptoms when it needn’t have been so bad. Many of the long term health benefits of HRT may still evade me since I have been post menopausal for so long - 13/14yrs but any improved quality of life is very welcome!! I am still only 57yrs old.
Thank-you again ladies 🥰
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Hi Podry
This is great news and thank you for coming back to tell us all.
It is sad that you have those wasted years but I hope that your new found knowledge and questioning of medical orthodoxy will stand you in a better place going forward, which it appears to be doing already :)