Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => Personal Experiences => Topic started by: racjen on June 02, 2019, 01:04:19 PM
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I don't think i can take any more of this evil stuff. Been on it for 8 days - initial side-effects of constant stomach ache wore off quite quickly, but the even more acute anxiety, insomnia, constant diaorrhea and now increasing depression are becoming unbearable. i can feel i 'm getting to that suicidal point again, which is what SSRIs always do to me - been in bed all morning and not planning to get out anytime soon. Don't think I'm going to make it to the 2 week point where side-effects are supposed to magically melt away. Whenever I describe this to doctors they act as if I'm REALLY unusual and that suicidal ideation with SSRIs is only really seen in young people - result is I come out feeling like I'm making it up. But it really is real and i feel so shit I want to go to sleep now and not wake up, I've just had enough.
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Hello racjen.
I am so sorry that you are suffering, my heart goes out to you. I'm afraid that I can't remember but are you seeing a psychiatrist at all? It appears that your GP is out of his/her depth and a more clued up professional may have the answer. Incidentally I heard recently that Clonidine is often prescribed for anxiety and this may be worth a try for you.
I completely understand your frustration and despair but hang in there. The ladies of the forum are always here for you.
Take care and sending hugs.
K.
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Hi racjen
I'm same with any ssri and the worse one was the one your taking , My GP knew this as yrs ago after birth of my daughter I took post natal depression I was given Prozac and it sent me crazy ... then it was called in and fluoxetine!!!
Are you still on mirtzpine? As they can cause what you are feeling , I went through 4 yrs of hell with
I honestly know how your feeling as I've been there and it's hell
Sending you hugs
Kaz x
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This was prescribed by a psychiatrist with the Community Mental Health Team, but now it's up to my GP to manage it. To be honest i've found it tends to be psychiatrists who're more patronising and disbelieving of the severity of the side-effects. My GP is a lot more sympathetic and treats me like a grown adult.
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If it hasn't started 2 give relief than ease off! It may work after a couple of weeks but it may not so why suffer? 4 me it was nausea that stopped me taking many of them, usually within 36 hours :'(.
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No, not on mirtazapine as well, that just did nothing at all (except help me sleep). I've tried sertraline, citalopram, venlafaxine, reboxetine, lofepramine, amitryptyline as well as pregabalin and beta-blockers. Nothing helps without terrible side-effects.
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If it hasn't started 2 give relief than ease off! It may work after a couple of weeks but it may not so why suffer? 4 me it was nausea that stopped me taking many of them, usually within 36 hours :'(.
Because I am desperate to find something that helps, and if it takes two weeks to get past the worst that's what I have to do, otherwise I'll never know if it would've worked if I stuck it out. I can't keep on trying and giving up after a few days; with this one i'm resolved to stick it out and then give up on the whole AD thing if it doesn't help. So it's my last chance.
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U need a :bighug: .......... what have U tried 4 anxiety, do U have any rescue remedy to hand? I find mouth spray useful. What about a warm bath?
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Racjen
I know exactly how your feeling and I truly understand it it's the bloody worse thing ever !!!
Yes I agree with you stick it as long as you can as it can take 14-18 to get into system
Have you used the anxiety spray or the pills from Holland & Barrett ? I also found lavender bath salts eased anxiety for me little ..
Mail me anytime you want a chat sending you hugs xx
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For anxiety I've tried propanolol, pregabalin and all the ADs listed above, plus various less conventional things like CBD oil. As far as ADs go, I don't want to be rude, but ca I suggest you don't give advice unless you know what you're talking about? It's usually stated that you can expect at least 2 weeks of feeling worse before they begin to kick in, so it really isn't helpful for you to suggest I give up after a week if they're not helping.
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Your began by stating : I don't think i can take any more of this evil stuff. Been on it for 8 days - initial side-effects of constant stomach ache wore off quite quickly, but the even more acute anxiety, insomnia, constant diaorrhea and now increasing depression are becoming unbearable.
Hence I shared my experience of not being able to tolerate side effects :-\. Until after 18 months my GP found one that actually helped within 3 days. It was the last available at that time - 1991.
Why suggest that I don't know what I am talking about - that is disrespectful in that I have personal knowledge about ADs and anti-anxiety medications. Whilst it is stated in the leaflets about taking 2 weeks to 'work' on most ADs, as well as suggesting that symptoms may become worse etc., my experiences of talking with many sufferers over the last 25 years, including patients in hospital, is that the drug is either tolerated well within days so the patient continues; or side effects cause the person to stop taking it. Sadly there isn't a quick fix ......... I worked in the psychiatric 'industry' for several years and have relatives who are Nurses in that field so lots of discussions over the years has been had over mugs of cocoa into the early hours.
So I ask: why suffer :-\
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I have taken floxetine twice and had no problems. Everyone is different as to what suits them as well as tolerance to side effects. Sertraline effected me so badly there is a note on my medical record that I must not be given it again.
Only you know if the side effects are tolerable for you. I don't think CLKD meant to offend. She was just relating her own experience. That's all we can do.
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Hello again ladies.
I agree with Shadyglade that all we can do is refer to our personal experiences and hope that helps other ladies.
I think we've all encountered 'experts' whose understanding and insight has been sadly lacking so it's no surprise if we are sensitive to these issues. Knowing someone has encountered your exact circumstances and has found a solution is so helpful and comforting and I believe most posters on the forum recognise the limitations of their advice.
Wishing you all well ladies.
K.
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If it hasn't started 2 give relief than ease off! It may work after a couple of weeks but it may not so why suffer? 4 me it was nausea that stopped me taking many of them, usually within 36 hours :'(.
That's not sharing your experience, it's giving advice which you're really not qualified to give (unless you have a qualification in mental health that I'm not aware of). No-one should be setting themselves up on here as an authority on mental health matters, or anything else for that matter, unless like some members they do huge amounts of research and can provide references. Otherwise it's not only misleading, it could be upsetting or even downright dangerous. Your last piece of incorrect advice was that if you have breast cancer with no lymph node involvement you won't need chemotherapy - complete rubbish, I know, I had just that and still had to have 6 rounds of the toughest chemo going.
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Hi Racjen
I know how you are feeling. I have been on Prozac for nearly 8 weeks now - 6 weeks at 20mg but it made my anxiety so much worse, so I dropped down to 10mg 11 days ago. The anxiety is still there but a bit more bearable. I also started HRT a week ago and am feeling so tired a d down at the moment too. I am at a loss at what to do as it's having a big impact on me and those around me. There is a Facebook page for Prozac and it can take up to 3 months for some people to feel the benefits.
Just wanted to let you know you are not suffering alone and sending you a hug.
Jules x
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Hi Racjen
I know how you are feeling. I have been on Prozac for nearly 8 weeks now - 6 weeks at 20mg but it made my anxiety so much worse, so I dropped down to 10mg 11 days ago. The anxiety is still there but a bit more bearable. I also started HRT a week ago and am feeling so tired a d down at the moment too. I am at a loss at what to do as it's having a big impact on me and those around me. There is a Facebook page for Prozac and it can take up to 3 months for some people to feel the benefits.
Just wanted to let you know you are not suffering alone and sending you a hug.
Jules x
Thanks Jules. So are you getting any benefit at all from the Prozac? The frustrating thing is I have a friend who's on it and it's working wonders for her, don't think she had this trouble getting onto it either. I did ask my doctor about reducing the dose but she said she didn't think it'd make any difference as your brain has to adjust, however much you're taking. I took some phenergan last night just so I could get a decent night's sleep, and today the anxiety is very nearly not there at all. Trouble is I know that if i take it for prolonged periods it makes me really depressed, so I just have to use it occasionally when I'm desperate for a break. Aaaaaaargh.....
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Hi Racjen
I know how you are feeling. I have been on Prozac for nearly 8 weeks now - 6 weeks at 20mg but it made my anxiety so much worse, so I dropped down to 10mg 11 days ago. The anxiety is still there but a bit more bearable. I also started HRT a week ago and am feeling so tired a d down at the moment too. I am at a loss at what to do as it's having a big impact on me and those around me. There is a Facebook page for Prozac and it can take up to 3 months for some people to feel the benefits.
Just wanted to let you know you are not suffering alone and sending you a hug.
Jules x
Thanks Jules. So are you getting any benefit at all from the Prozac? The frustrating thing is I have a friend who's on it and it's working wonders for her, don't think she had this trouble getting onto it either. I did ask my doctor about reducing the dose but she said she didn't think it'd make any difference as your brain has to adjust, however much you're taking. I took some phenergan last night just so I could get a decent night's sleep, and today the anxiety is very nearly not there at all. Trouble is I know that if i take it for prolonged periods it makes me really depressed, so I just have to use it occasionally when I'm desperate for a break. Aaaaaaargh.....
Do be careful mixing it with other medications. I had to change the anti histamine I generally use, when on fluoxetine/Prozac. Anything that makes you sleepy is usually contraindicated. Might be wise to check with your pharmacist.
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Thanks, hadn't thought of that. Weird though because Fluoxetine makes me feel totally wide awake, so you wouldn't have thought mixing it with something that makes you sleepy would hurt. Will check.
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Hi racjen
I don't know that I'm getting much relief from Prozac, which makes me think it's hormonal. I was on the 20mg for 6 weeks and couldn't cope with it as it sent my anxiety through the roof! Have been on 10mg for 11 days and the anxiety is a little better. I started HRT a week ago and am starting to feel so tired during the day, but keep waking up at night sweating!
I'm so fed up of it all, as I'm sure you are. I'm going to stay with the 10mg for another couple of weeks, a d see how the HRT goes.
Do you feel shaky and dizzy on the Fluoxetine? Please feel free to private message me if you want to. Hope you get relief soon.
Jules x
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Hiya racjen.so sorry you're suffering the 2 week horrors. In my experience with prozac the side effects did go away after 2 weeks each time.i went on it But I feel for you. Those 2 weeks can feel like a lifetime.and you feel you need something to help you push through. I was on ADs when my physch prescribed 50mg phenegran before bed. The pharmacist advised at the time that prozac can increase the sedating effect of phenegran. I think some people might feel drowsy on prozac anyway but like you I never did so I didnt feel overly sedated with the phenegran.
What dose phenegran do you take?
Xxxxxx
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25mg of phenergan - had the best night's sleep for ages, and the least anxiety for ages today too. If it gets me through the start-up phase of Prozac it's got to be a good thing; I feel like this is my last chance with ADs, I've tried so many I'm not putting myself thru this again. So I've got to give it a good go or I'll never know if it would've worked.
Jules, if an AD is going to work for you it should work whether the anxiety is hormonal or not, it targets the same mechanism in the brain. If you've been on it for 11+ weeks and it's not helping I'd say it's not the one for you, maybe you should try a different type.
It does make me shaky and nervous but not dizzy; also initially gave me terrible stomach upset but that's settled down now. All the other SSRIs I've tried made me feel suicidal within a few days; the fact that this one hasn't gives me hope that it's worth persevering.
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Keep going racjen. If the phenegran helps during this time then i wouldnt be afraid to use it.
After years of going through the 2 week thing each time I eventually asked if I could take something to help me through it and that's why he gave me the phenegran. Hopefully it will ease you through and the next few days pass quickly for you.
Jules I would think 12 weeks is long enough to expect some improvement. Between 12 weeks and 6 months you may then feel further improvement but if it's made no difference so far then I agree with racjen. You may need to try something else. I suppose the decision is whether to up the dose or change to something different. Prozac has quite a long half life but I wouldnt recommend just suddenly stopping it after several weeks on it. I have done this in the past and had quite bad withdrawal. Always best to see the doc first.
Xx
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Hi Racjen - I'm sorry you're feeling so bad and I do empathise. I just wanted to say that I've taken Prozac three times (each time for about a year/18 months) and it worked very well for me but it took 4-5 weeks for the good effects to start kicking in. Each time I suffered really dreadful increased anxiety and scary thoughts a few weeks into taking it and the first time I was prescribed it this made me very, very frightened indeed, as I thought it must be a worsening of my previous symptoms (moderate depression with a lot of anxiety added in). The second and third times I was prescribed it I was prepared because I knew that it was the meds causing a temporary issue. I had the nausea and sweatiness as well, but that did wear off after a couple of weeks.
As long as you can bear it, it may be worth you sticking with it in the hope that it will help but only you know how you feel. As others have said, it doesn't suit everyone. Are people around you supportive? That makes so much difference.
Also, I assume you're taking the Prozac in the morning to try to minimise the initial insomnia effect?
I hope you feel better soon - it's really horrible, I know.
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Hi racjen and TC
I have been on Prozac 7 weeks and was on Venlafaxine for 5 weeks before that, so 7 weeks in total for Prozac. I started on 20mg, which I think was far too strong and stimulating for me. I have been on the lower dose of 10mg for 12 days.
I have actually started to feel calmer the last couple of days and I'm not sure if it's the Prozac or HRT, which I have been on for a week. I will keep in with both for the moment and keep you posted.
Hope it works for you soon racjen.
Thanks.
Jules x
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25mg of phenergan - had the best night's sleep for ages, and the least anxiety for ages today too. If it gets me through the start-up phase of Prozac it's got to be a good thing; I feel like this is my last chance with ADs, I've tried so many I'm not putting myself thru this again. So I've got to give it a good go or I'll never know if it would've worked.
Jules, if an AD is going to work for you it should work whether the anxiety is hormonal or not, it targets the same mechanism in the brain. If you've been on it for 11+ weeks and it's not helping I'd say it's not the one for you, maybe you should try a different type.
It does make me shaky and nervous but not dizzy; also initially gave me terrible stomach upset but that's settled down now. All the other SSRIs I've tried made me feel suicidal within a few days; the fact that this one hasn't gives me hope that it's worth persevering.
I'm on Fluoxetine but stopped taking it months ago because I decided it wasn't working and the depression was hormonal so it wouldn't work.....I did did not realise that anti Ds would work whether it was hormonal or not ( I'm not massively clued up on how they work to be honest)
I'm so glad I read this post now,I've just gone back on it after having the worst few weeks of my life feeling practically suicidal at one point, it actually scared me that I could feel that way,I'm now on about day 6 and not feeling too bad,I have been on and off this drug for the last 15 years though so maybe I won't get too many side effects
I also didn't realise it can cause insomnia,I have terrible sleep patterns and have been known to not sleep for 24 hours at a stretch, when that happens I just don't feel tired and am bursting with energy but then two or three days later I will sleep for a whole day ,I take 20mgs a day
I really don't want to take this drug anymore but I feel so awful without it that I am making my peace with it and staying on it for now
I really hope the side effects wear off for you and that it does work for you,I'm also wondering if because of the severity of your side effects you might need to give it a bit longer before they wear off,I'm Not sure if that's how it works or not
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How are you racjen?
Nanny
That why i personally think it's important for docs to recognise the initial side effects are the reason a lot of people give up on it and they should if possible prescribe something alongside to help that. Not everyone suffers as bad initially but for those of us who have a history of reacting in that way they should be able to offer help to get through it I didnt realise they could until I saw a new physch and explained that my past experience with initial side effects was making me refuse going back on it.
As I said each time on 20mg the initial "horrors" went away after a few weeks but once I was on 60mg for bulimia and was given mirtazapine alongside it at night to help sleep. It worked, although it made me have nightmares, so I took myself off it. But it might not have that effect on everyone.
I must say I am notoriously naughty with taking myself off ADs when I start to feel better, much to my phychiatrist frustration. It's the old "I feel a lot better now, why am I taking all these meds" thing. It's hard getting your head around the fact that you might need them long term as I did and if I'm honest still do, probably now more than ever.
Xx
Xxx
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Hi Tc, today is Day 13 on Prozac - I'm feeling less anxious but really depressed today. Didn't take phenergan last night as i know if i take it too long continuously it makes me depressed, so feeling very tired and unmotivated. But I'm gonna keep going - I've made it this far and i know i can take phenergan every now and then to get some sleep, makes it feel more bearable as it also seems to relieve the anxiety and improve my mood the following day too. Thanks for your moral support - it's so hard to keep going on this stuff when you have no idea if it's going to work, especially having done 12 weeks on mirtazapine with no effects whatsoever (except much better sleep and putting on half a stone) xxx
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You're in the home straight now racjen. You've done so well. Keep going. Xxxx
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Hi racjen
I'm glad to hear you are getting some relief from your anxiety.
I am 2 weeks on the reduced dose now and am a bit up and down with the anxiety. I'm not sure though whether it is the HRT I'm taking which is causing my symptoms or the Fluoxetine. I'm going to post a separate thread on that though and am seeing my doctor on Monday.
Keep going, it sounds like it's working for you😁
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How are you racjen?
Nanny
That why i personally think it's important for docs to recognise the initial side effects are the reason a lot of people give up on it and they should if possible prescribe something alongside to help that. Not everyone suffers as bad initially but for those of us who have a history of reacting in that way they should be able to offer help to get through it I didnt realise they could until I saw a new physch and explained that my past experience with initial side effects was making me refuse going back on it.
As I said each time on 20mg the initial "horrors" went away after a few weeks but once I was on 60mg for bulimia and was given mirtazapine alongside it at night to help sleep. It worked, although it made me have nightmares, so I took myself off it. But it might not have that effect on everyone.
I must say I am notoriously naughty with taking myself off ADs when I start to feel better, much to my phychiatrist frustration. It's the old "I feel a lot better now, why am I taking all these meds" thing. It's hard getting your head around the fact that you might need them long term as I did and if I'm honest still do, probably now more than ever.
Xx
Xxx
I'm another naughty one who stops taking it when I feel better and I always feel better for a while then slowly start to go downhill,now I'm going through the menopause my moods swings and depression are,worse than ever, so I'm going to stay on it now for the foreseeable future I think
I was given it originally because I have Fibromyalgia and it's meant to help with that,the depression came later after being in pain for years,my pain is now mostly under control but the depression has stayed 😟
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Jules I hope you get on o.k at docs. Tell them exactly how you feel.
You have started a couple different things at the same time so it's hard to tell what's causing what. The body does take time to adjust but that doesnt help you right now. I was in the same position. My doc seems to think getting hormones right will help but I would say dont give up on the ads just yet. Let us know how you get on at docs.
Nanny. My first bout of anxiety depression was pretty young with a eating disorder and then I was o.k for years until I got glandular fever and subsequent ME at 25. I was given ads then for ME. My body seemed to go through a change after ME. Though. My immune system has never been the same since and if I get run down it flares up.
Xxxx
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Thanks Tc. I'm going to stick with the AD a bit longer and not use the Utrogestan until I see the doctor on Monday. That way, I should be a key to tell if the AD is working and whether the Utrogestan is giving me problems.
Thanks for your support. Hope you are feeling OK? x
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How are you racjen? Xxxx
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Well I think I've made it through the worst of the start-up period - now on Day 18 and no longer getting the really bad anxiety it was causing to begin with. Still finding it's disrupting my sleep though. So now just waiting in the hope that I'll see some improvement over the next few weeks. Thanks for asking x
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So pleased to hear you are starting to improve Racjen!
My anxiety has calmed down the last few days too. 😁After seeing the doctor yesterday I am staying on the 10mg of Prozac and on the Evorel 50 and Utrogestan, as fingers crossed, it seems to be calming things down🤞x
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Sometimes I think that all ADs actually do is make you feel so incredibly awful to start with, that when you get through the first two weeks and feel pretty much like you did before you started taking them, you think you feel much better!
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I think you have hit the nail on the head there racjen! I hope you are continuing to feel better though x
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Hi Racjen,
I have not posted before but follow lots of anxiety threads with great interest. I too have crippling anxiety & depression and have tried many meds including Sertraline, Mertrazepine, Quetiapine all for about 8 weeks with no relief and actually made me worse. I was then put on Lorazepam 2mg (valium equivalent 20mg) in December and only on for 6 weeks but since January have been trying to taper off with one failed attempt and reinstated in April - currently down to 0.25mg (valium 2.5mg). I also started escitroplam 2 weeks ago and going up very slowly with the dose only up to 5mg so far.
I am also on John Studds regime of 4 pumps of oestrogel and 100 ultrogen 7 days of the month. Been on for 2 months and not really felt anything.
I have come to a conclusion recently that our bodys want and need a long time to heal and reach homeostasis.
I wonder whether all the chopping and changing on meds does more harm than good. I do think that benzodiazepines are a drug that need a major overhaul in terms of how often and easily they are prescribed. They do not cure anything but just plaster over symptoms and I even believe people, unlike me, who take them as and when and don't become addicted still suffer withdrawals and end up with increased anxiety without realising it is the drug causing it.
I have decided what my body needs is consistency over a long period of time. However, I do think getting of the Lorazepam has to be my first goal - I am taking my time but moving forward all the time. Tolerance can set in quickly and I know a lot of people only start to feel better once they have come off rather than holding at a dose. I am taking this slowly at 0.1mg per month and even slower if I need to. I know I don't have long to go.
Once done, I plan to stick to everything else for at least 6 months - not changing anything. Hormones the same, escitroplam the same (even if I don't feel great benefit). Only then will I start to consider slowly coming off or changing anything and very slowly and one thing at a time.
Our brains and bodys want to heal and find the new equilibrium - it just takes our brains a long time to heal and adjust. We are all too impatient. I just want to wake up and be better!!!
I'm not offering advice just another view point. The waiting game is so incredibly hard when all just want to feel better. Hang on in there and I wish you all the best.
I really feel for you and understand the awful time you are having. I have had to give up work and lots of days need my parents to be with me as the anxiety and depression is too much to deal with. It has been a year I have felt this way and never suffered anything like this before.
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Hi Lumpy, totally agree with you about benzos - they're a great short term solution but SO easy to get hooked on and then you've got that added layer of difficulty to deal with. I've been on diazepam for over a year and I've developed such a tolerance I don't think it makes any difference at all now, but I have to take it to avoid withdrawal symptoms. And until I get on a more even keel moodwise I don't feel able to cope with withdrawal.
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2mg how often Lumpy? That is a maintenance dose usually given as a pre-med or to ease those who have taken a higher dose for much longer, in order to wean off. I can't remember the dose I take to ease anxiety, 1mg I think ........ as necessary. Sept. was the last time I needed it, phew. I had spikes last week due to an event I had to attend but I didn't need to take it. It crossed my mind to take one pill in order to stave off any anxiety but decided that if necessary, then I would ........
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Hi Lumpy
Sorry to hear you are suffering too. I totally agree with you about giving our body time to heal by sticking to a regime and not chopping and, which is what I have done recently.
I have suffered from anxiety for 10 years since I started perimenopause. I tried different types of HRT which didn't work and finally ended up on an AD, Venlafaxine, which worked well for the hot flushes and anxiety, but after 18 months I was feeling better, so came off and my symptoms quickly came back. I finally settled on Femseven Conti patches which worked well but they stopped making them so I had to stop suddenly, which made my symptoms come back 10 times worse! So I went back on Venlafaxine but it didn't work this time. I was changed over to 20mg of Fluoxetine, which makes anxiety worse before it gets better. I could only stand it for 5 weeks so the doctor lowered it to 10mg 3 weeks ago. The doctor gave me a low dose of Diazepam to take alongside it (2mg) and I did take small amounts most days (varying from 0.25 - 4mg of Diazepam). I took it on and off for 10-11 weeks but quickly realised that it wasn't really working for me anyway. I stopped taking the low amounts about 10 days ago and have decided not to take it anymore.
I started Evorel 50 patches and takeUtrogestan 100 vaginally every night and things are starting to calm down - in fact I feel spaced out now and not really anxious.
Anyway, I just wanted to say that you are right about being consistent for the body so I'm staying with the 10mg of Fluoxetine, Evorel 50 patches and Utrogestan for the forseeable future. I really hope things settle down for you soon.
Jules x
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Hi, Thank you for your kind words.
CLKD - I take 0.2mg Lorazepam a day (equivalent to 2mg Valium). I know it's low and i'm nearing the end of my taper. Am holding here while I go up on the escitroplam slowly to 10mg.
Hang on in there everyone.
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Doesn't it feel like hanging on at times :'( - I take 5mg Escitalopram in the morning and 10mg at night. As well as a beta-blocka and emergency as-necessary anti-anxiety tablet. I have used 'rescue remedy' with success too.
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Wading through treacle at times :-\