Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => All things menopause => Topic started by: nearly50 on February 09, 2017, 10:03:18 AM
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http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-4205566/midlife-malnutrition-FACE-reveals-nutrients-body-needs.html
Interesting article about nutrition during perimenopause. For those of us not wanting to (or unable to) use HRT, it might be something worth looking at. I know my symptoms are not as bad when I don't eat sugar and there's a possibility that some of my early symptoms such as muscle pain were helped by vitamin supplementation.
Would be so good if women were more prepared for what was about to hit them - I would've liked to have kept an eye on ferritin and vitamin d levels, and been a bit more ready for the onslaught.
Be interested to hear what people think - I know some posters are very set in their view about HRT on here!
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Be interested to hear what people think - I know some posters are very set in their view about HRT on here!
Well – just to put you straight on that one nearly50 in case you have got the wrong impression - these are not simply the views of the posters, but the reason many members advocate HRT in most situations, is because they are merely reflecting the prevailing advice of the medical profession - but of course as you say there are women who cannot take HRT for a variety of reasons who need to be especially attentive to other areas of their general health ( as we all do!).
However whether you can take HRT or not, whether you are a women approaching menopause or anyone else, the advice given about lifestyle and diet applies to all of the western world - in terms of health benefits - so we all need to heed this! Also many of us on here also promote this advice as well as HRT - ie that lifestyle and dietary changes are essential to maintain good health – look at my and Dancinggirl's posts for example. The paper a couple of years ago for published for World menopause Day recognised that HRT was but one treatment in a whole spectrum of measures that need to be taken to help prevent diseases in women after menopause.
http://www.imsociety.org/downloads/world_menopause_day_2014/white_paper/wmd_white_paper_english.pdf
The abstract is so clear I'm going to put it here:
Women may expect to spend more than a third of their lives after menopause. Beginning in the sixth
decade, many chronic diseases will begin to emerge, which will affect both the quality and quantity of
a woman's life. Thus, the onset of menopause heralds an opportunity for prevention strategies to
improve the quality of life and enhance longevity. Obesity, metabolic syndrome and diabetes,
cardiovascular disease, osteoporosis and osteoarthritis, cognitive decline, dementia and depression,
and cancer are the major diseases of concern. Prevention strategies at menopause have to begin with
screening and careful assessment for risk factors, which should also include molecular and genetic
diagnostics, as these become available. Identification of certain risks will then allow directed therapy.
Evidence-based prevention for the diseases noted above include lifestyle management, cessation of
smoking, curtailing excessive alcohol consumption, a healthy diet and moderate exercise, as well as
mentally stimulating activities. Although the most recent publications from the follow-up studies of
the Women's Health Initiative do not recommend menopause hormonal therapy as a prevention
strategy, these conclusions may not be fully valid for midlife women, on the basis of the existing data.
For healthy women aged 50–59 years, estrogen therapy decreases coronary heart disease and all-cause
mortality; this interpretation is entirely consistent with results from other randomized, controlled trials
and observational studies. Thus. as part of a comprehensive strategy to prevent chronic disease after
menopause, menopausal hormone therapy, particularly estrogen therapy may be considered as part of
the armamentarium.
Noone ever says that HRT alone is the answer in fact emphatically not – and anyone who does so should revise their opinion post-haste otherwise they may be disappointed!
Of course this is a DM article and as such – well what more needs to be said?!! Supplements are mostly unnecessary unless people have had diets so poor that they have actually become deficient – but nutrient deficiency is also totally unnecessary if we attend to our diets properly. A few well chosen supplements now and again during winter months might be advisable ( cod liver oil?) and of course extra iron is needed in those who bleed a lot…
Blood sugar regulation is crucial - and again not just for menopausal women - we eat far too much sugar and too many carbs/refined food in the western world!
I so agree women should be prepared for all of this!
Hurdity x
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I don't click through to the daily mail on principle (so I haven't read your link) but I'd think lots of us on here would agree that diet, exercise, etc, all help a lot with symptom control. I exercise daily and eat well and carefully.
Sadly, though, that does nothing for my extreme bladder pain and vaginal atrophy which would stop me exercising at all if I didn't use HRT. (Or sitting. Or doing anything else really.) So those of us who are "set in our views" on HRT might well have good reason for that.
As people often say on this site, the meno is different for everyone. If I didn't have VA, I wouldn't use HRT, because my other symptoms are manageable. Lots of women don't need HRT. Some do, and any amount of healthy eating won't get round that (though it always helps, obviously). And there are going to be women in the middle for whom a healthy lifestyle will really tip the balance.
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Oh and yes, yes, yes, to women being prepared for all of this. But the medical profession don't do it, and for most of the press and women's magazines, the details are a dirty little secret. Flushes are fine to talk about, but none of the rest of it.
Off topic slightly, but I increasingly read stuff about women having surgery on their vaginas and vulvas to make them smaller/tighter/whatever and I think: in 10 or 15 years time you may really wish you hadn't done that when you get, ahem, "natural shrinkage". Why doesn't anyone warn them?
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Well – just to put you straight on that one nearly50 in case you have got the wrong impression - these are not simply the views of the posters, but the reason many members advocate HRT in most situations, is because they are merely reflecting the prevailing advice of the medical profession - but of course as you say there are women who cannot take HRT for a variety of reasons who need to be especially attentive to other areas of their general health ( as we all do!).
Didn't mean to offend. I only mean that many people think HRT is a solution for every woman. What's good for you is great, but it might not be good for another individual. There are many reports on here of women being questioned by their GP as their experience doesn't tie in with the prevaling attitude of the medical profession. I must confess I do not have 100% faith in the medical profession due to the over reliance on medication and the pressures of Big Pharma. I think much of the general population's reliance on medication could be overturned by more natural methods (thinking of the recent 'The Doctor who gave up drugs' doc here).
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Can you explain what you mean by "the general population's reliance on medication" please?
I don't agree that people think HRT is a solution for every woman. It's not the message posters give on here, and in real life most people are horrified if you admit using it.
I would agree that many more people need to understand that antibiotics should not be handed out for colds, sore throats, etc, and also for better scientific knowledge for the population about antibiotic resistance and the difference between bacterial and viral infections. I'm also not quite clear about the benefits of mass prescription of statins for older people. Other than that, I can't see any particular problem. Have I missed something?
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nearly50 - I know you didn't mean to offend - it's easy to type something that can be interpreted in different ways. I do agree with you about too much medication - we should question everything we are prescribed - we just don't want to be told by our GPs that if we changed our diet and exercise regime the meno symptoms would be fine. My brother-in-law who was a GP (fortunately now retired) actually said me when I mentioned my flushes were really bad “its all in the mind†- I'm sure he dished out numerous prescriptions for ADs to his poor female patients.
As Hurdity has said - I keep banging on about good diet and exercise when we hit this time in our lives - whether we use HRT or not. HRT can't solve everything. Just look at the strain the NHS is under - we have to take responsibility for our lifestyle choices. Of course we mustn't loose sight of the benefits HRT brings for our long term health (for those who can take it) but HRT is a personal choice and how each of us experiences the menopause will differ - we all have to explore what will work but the first strategy must be to try to eat well and get enough sensible exercise (e.g. brisk walking each day).
I am also an advocate of supplementation where necessary - Vitamin D is recommended for everyone during winter as we get little if any sunshine and it is now known that vitamin D deficiency brings some nasty problems e.g. fatigue, joint aches etc. One does need to get enough Magnesium alongside the vitamin D or we don't absorb the Vit D.
Cutting out as much sugar and fat as possible is really a 'no brainer' (one must still get enough calcium in the diet e.g. cheese, milk and yogurt ) - weight does tend to creep up when meno hits so reducing sugar can really help to keep weight under control.
I think the reason we are often so keen to recommend HRT on this site is to do with this notion that if we just ate well and got exercise then this would be enough to get us through menopause - this then implies that it's our own fault if we can't cope with meno symptoms. I believe that stress is one of the biggest villains when it comes to controlling meno symptoms and this can be the hardest thing to reduce. Insomnia is the toughest meno symptom, as sleep deprivation is absolute torture - diet and exercise sadly doesn't reduce a stressful life or help one sleep better when meno hits.
You are so right about women not being prepared for what meno brings - we are prepared for puberty but the meno is still rather taboo. DG x
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Because Life goes on between periods starting and menopause arriving? :-\ .......... we've been familiar with ladies going red from the neck upwards or flapping their napkins over their faces but after often told 'it's my age'. Well that doesn't help but I suppose it's a way of saying 'mind your own business' ?
It is true that the Big Pharmaceuticals needs us to believe in their products because they are in it to make profits - in order to fund the next round of possible medical break-throughs. It is up to the Medical Profession to be aware of what is being pushed and what might actually help patients ::) in any medical field. Also, if a person hasn't experienced side effects or benefits from the various medications across the board, they can prescribe but often don't have time to quizz patients how they are on the medication!
'natural' isn't always safe, i.e. arsenic is natural ;)
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I eat very well , walk 6.5 miles x 7 days a week come rain or shine , slim, take ferritin and vitamin D.
Not ONE hot flush , but boy oh boy the lady who wrote this has NO idea about vaginal atrophy, because of it comes and bites her literally on the bum , she will be downing the HRT.
I was the ultimate Miss au natural , never been on the pill , dyed my hair or wear make up , but I now use systemic and local HRT all to give me any hope of quality of life , because like ancient runner I can't sit , barely walk , only wear skirts with no pants, they REALLY don't warn us , I am one of the younger ones for VA but a lot of people think I've made it yay , then early mid 60s bam vagianl atrophy big time.
Interestingly my mind does not like HRT doesn't overly agree with me , but life is far more miserable without it re VA.
Splitting episiotomies, burning vulva, atrophied labia and clitoral hood are no fun , I was truly SHOCKED when I looked down there , I have told my daughters to look and check there vulva areas every month like there breasts.
I am writing a book at the moment on all this , nothing may come of it but my daughters will have my VA
memoirs at least and be forewarned , forarmed.
I am so passionate/ annoyed about it ( the hush hush dirty secret ). That is devasting for so many women , who put up and shut up , so we are the generation that need it to be heard and recognised.
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Well done Maryjane - will you self publish, if not have a look in The Lady and other reputable magazines who advertise various publishing houses, there was one in Norfolk but can't remember the name - Lark something or other?
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Well said Maryjane.
What a great idea about the book ;)
I never new or was prepared for all the symptoms of menopause. With me the anxiety, dizziness adrenalin rushes and insomnia were unbearable. I spent £100s of pounds on natural products that did nothing. HRT along with it's unwanted side effects helped me to carry on working a few extra years. Retired at 56 (not from choice)
I just wish people talked about it more Wxx
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How brilliant that you've written a book, Maryjane!
Yes - my mind hates HRT too......... :'(
I so wish we had the Monalisa Touch treatment here in the UK - it works absolute wonders! Women's lives have been transformed by it. If clinic's were to buy this and offer treatments privately, I know many would be clamouring for it. xxxxx
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Here's the info. on it in case some of you haven't heard of this treatment.....
ETA: Just checked actually, and it IS available privately at BMI hospitals! :)
Edit by Admin
Commercial links are not allowed on the forum.
However, the company is currently advertising on our shop page here
http://www.menopausematters.co.uk/shopdetail.php?id_no=115
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We can get it Tempest , and I am highly likely having it done in the summer.
Unfortunately only private , can't imagine it ever beingnon the NHS women's vaginas are not top of the list.
It will go on an interest free credit card.
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What forums are you on re chatting to ladies who have had it done ? As I would like to have a chat with some ladies.
I no physios of ladies with VA from chemo are saying it is doing amazing things for them.
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Maryjane, you and I sound like twins. Out of interest - I used to get lots of cystitis-y problems as a younger woman - mostly pre kids. Not so sure now that's what it really was a lot of the time. You?
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No nothing until officially 46 , but when I look back sex was
Getting a tiny bit ouchy from 40.
Never had a UTI, on antibiotics since all this began.
How old are you ?
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Ancient runner I admin anpelvic pain group , and there are 20 year olds on it prescribed vagifem as it's a myth it's just menopause when needed , 14 year old who get repeat UTIs are put on it also.
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Hystersisters in the States, Maryjane and there are a few ladies too on Patient UK who have had it done. It's not cheap it's true, but the one lady I followed on Patient UK had wonderful relief! I think it SHOULD be available on the NHS (for everyone really) but most of all to ladies who have had chemotherapy. It improves quality of life no end!
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I too didn't realise, naively really of how the peri menopause would cause such anxiety, I walk every week, take vitamins because I cannot use hrt, I was in for a shock after reading on the forum many ladies feel the same. Its good to know I am not alone. :).x
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Jaz29 - have you read the alternative section?
Also, recent guidelines have opened up access of HRT to more women as past results were badly interpreted ....... so you may, if symptoms over-come you, look towards it - after all, if treatment eases symptoms it needed be for ever ;-).
Have a browse round. Do read the various threads on vaginal atrophy as HRT is usually the only way of easing symptoms ..... it often presents as repeated urine-type infections but is caused by dryness, thinning of skin, bladder irritation ::) and is treated by a different type of HRT.
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Hi Maryjane - 55 - was mostly fine from my mid 30s when I started having kids to when I realised something was badly wrong 3 years ago. In retrospect, I'd been getting more discomfort particularly in the evenings or after long days sitting and working for probably a year or two before that. Last period was in September - was regular till probably a year or 18 months ago.
Interesting what you say about the younger women and teenagers. Lots of food for thought there.
And like you, I'm really having trouble getting my head round having to (probably) be on full HRT for what's a local problem I'd never heard about before 3 years ago. Few flushes or anything else. Have looked at the Femoston pills since being prescribed a year ago, and have been patiently using my estring and reloading where necessary until it just wasn't working. Early days on this regime, and today has not been good.