Menopause Matters Forum
General Discussion => This 'n' That => Topic started by: groundhog on January 22, 2017, 10:37:18 PM
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Hi all,
I need your opinions.
Most of you know my long nightmare health saga. I also have a mother who had a brain haemorrhage around the time my bowel perforated, she is in a home as I couldn't cope. Anyway....
She has a small house and the council are now taking it into account. It's a low value but lovely cottage In a rural village and I was born there - I'm attached to it and as my marriage is on dodgy ground, I sometimes can see me ending my days there. After my Mother's Day the house has been left to my sister and I plus the grandchildren! My mother has not made things easy for me ever.
The point - If we rented the property out we could cover the carehome fees ( coupled with her pensions ) there would still be a small shortfall but nothing much. Trouble is renting property can be stressful and all I seem to hear are horror stories. My own health problems mean I can't seem to take any stress whatsoever and not sure I would be up to being a landlord with all that entails. The local authority, like most , do a scheme whereby they house people in need - they vet the tenant, do all the necessary paperwork, and collect the rent. They will even pay for any required works to be carried out to bring the property upto standard although it's a nice house. So They are in effect agents and charge 8% commission. The man from the council ( who I know personally ) said I could hand him the keys and relax, they would manage the whole lot. He then said it would have to be a long term let as in 3 years and the tenants would be Syrian refugees.
I don't know what to think.
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Hi groundhog
Most estate agents now take all the pressure for you and charge a fee. Some even guarantee you'll receive payment even if there's no tenants
I rent privately and on one we even had 6 monthly inspections
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I may well be in the same position soon. Mum is in a care home and I think she has almost decided she will stay. At the moment she's funding herself as she's just over the limit. I think we will have to start thinking about selling her house. The other option is the deferred payment scheme but I need to read up on that.
Renting out your Mums house won't be that straightforward. It will need to be brought up to a good standard if it's not already. It will need a thorough sprucing up and it will need smoke alarms etc. I have no idea how you would go on either with Landlords insurance which would be essential. I am a landlord myself and our insurance company insists that we provide references and background checks etc for our tenants but how would you do that with Syrian refugees? You can't because you know nothing of their backgrounds so they could be anybody.
I do six monthly checks but we are very fortunate in that the retired couple we rent it to love cleaning and housework and it is immaculate. I do know plenty of'people who have had lots of problems with bad tenants making a mess, not paying rent etc.
Hope this gives you something to think about anyway. X
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The Home Office do the background checks for the local authority so that wouldn't be an issue.
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This is a difficult one.
We own a small house that we rent out, which is ironic as our daughter has to rent, but selling wouldn't solve this as we couldn't recoup enough of our investment to help her since the financial crash and it does give us an income.
We have experienced the ups and downs of being landlords. Good tenants and bad ones. For the past few years we have had the same tenants, who are lovely and we have a good relationship. But before that, well put it like this, on one occasion we didn't return their deposit! We manage the property ourselves, but use a rental agency to do all the checks for us when tenants leave. To be honest, I wouldn't want to manage it on my own, despite having such lovely tenants, but that's partly because it's not nearby.
You can use management agencies to manage it, but they charge a lot and the ones my DD has had to deal with do very little. She has to fight to get anything sorted out, including health and safety issues when they have a young child. Our tenants can ring us up and we sort things out as quickly as possible. The best way through if you decide to manage a property is to build a network of trade people to call on when necessary. I would think that might be easier for you as your Mums house is nearby. It's definitely more of a hassle managing a property from a distance.
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This is a difficult one.
We own a small house that we rent out, which is ironic as our daughter has to rent, but selling wouldn't solve this as we couldn't recoup enough of our investment to help her since the financial crash and it does give us an income.
We have experienced the ups and downs of being landlords. Good tenants and bad ones. For the past few years we have had the same tenants, who are lovely and we have a good relationship. But before that, well put it like this, on one occasion we didn't return their deposit! We manage the property ourselves, but use a rental agency to do all the checks for us when tenants leave. To be honest, I wouldn't want to manage it on my own, despite having such lovely tenants, but that's partly because it's not nearby.
You can use management agencies to manage it, but they charge a lot and the ones my DD has had to deal with do very little. She has to fight to get anything sorted out, including health and safety issues when they have a young child. Our tenants can ring us up and we sort things out as quickly as possible. The best way through if you decide to manage a property is to build a network of trade people to call on when necessary. I would think that might be easier for you as your Mums house is nearby. It's definitely more of a hassle managing a property from a distance.
That's very true. My son was renting a property in another part of the country and the agent was disgraceful despite being a "reputable" firm. They did no repairs and wouldn't give son and partner name and address of owner. They kept the property immaculate and took photos of when they moved in and when they left but the agent still tried to withhold money for things like hairline cracks on really old tiles etc which they didn't damage at all.
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The Home Office do the background checks for the local authority so that wouldn't be an issue.
But what background checks could they do as their records would most likely be destroyed and most of them were advised to destroy their own ID and passports. You know insurance companies will try and get out of anything.
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Yes, PF, very wise to take photos so you have evidence to back you up. There are bad landlords property management firms out there and bad tenants. But we are very fortunate. I would feel very guilty if we wanted to sell our property as it's their home and haven. They are very happy living there. We haven't put the rent up for years as the mortgage rates are so low, even though we been advised that we are undercharging. We don't want to lose such good tenants!
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I would NOT go with the man that you know in the Council!
As far as I know: because my neighbour rents her property next door: a 6 month let is now the Legal shortest length of time here, it may be different in Wales. It will NOT be for 3 years ......... any letting must be done with a proper Estate Agent who will draw up Contracts. Which will cost your mother money as this has to come out of her expected Estate. The ones locally charge between £150-250 per week letting fees even when the property is empty. They go into the empty property and draw up an inventory as well as noting down the state of curtains, carpets, general cleanliness. If necessary they will imply a company of their choice to clean right through: £400 was quoted in November !
It is better to let unfurnished because not many of us keep the 'fire' safety labels and you can no longer rent with un-protected furniture because of a fire hazard.
They also make sure that the tenants leave the place more or less as found as well as making sure that rent is paid less their fee. However: I have known Agents to take the money but wash their hands of any un-paid rent as they have their costs!
If it is thought by the Council that you are avoiding paying for care fees the property can still be 'snatched'. Despite your link to the place I would get rid so that your Mum's is paid up front. After all, who decides how much a property is worth in order to pay fees once someone has died? You will have maintenance to do if it remains empty. There is a risk of flood damage should the weather turn nasty.
You can decide whether you want adults only; with children; pets??? ; pets with no children; DSS ...... you can't decide which Nationality though.
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I would NOT go with the man that you know in the Council!
As far as I know: because my neighbour rents her property next door: a 6 month let is now the Legal shortest length of time here, it may be different in Wales. It will NOT be for 3 years ......... any letting must be done with a proper Estate Agent who will draw up Contracts. Which will cost your mother money as this has to come out of her expected Estate. The ones locally charge between £150-250 per week letting fees even when the property is empty. They go into the empty property and draw up an inventory as well as noting down the state of curtains, carpets, general cleanliness. If necessary they will imply a company of their choice to clean right through: £400 was quoted in November !
It is better to let unfurnished because not many of us keep the 'fire' safety labels and you can no longer rent with un-protected furniture because of a fire hazard.
They also make sure that the tenants leave the place more or less as found as well as making sure that rent is paid less their fee. However: I have known Agents to take the money but wash their hands of any un-paid rent as they have their costs!
If it is thought by the Council that you are avoiding paying for care fees the property can still be 'snatched'. Despite your link to the place I would get rid so that your Mum's is paid up front. After all, who decides how much a property is worth in order to pay fees once someone has died? You will have maintenance to do if it remains empty. There is a risk of flood damage should the weather turn nasty.
You can decide whether you want adults only; with children; pets??? ; pets with no children; DSS ...... you can't decide which Nationality though.
THen it would have to be no DSS. Sorted! ;)
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Yes, PF, very wise to take photos so you have evidence to back you up. There are bad landlords property management firms out there and bad tenants. But we are very fortunate. I would feel very guilty if we wanted to sell our property as it's their home and haven. They are very happy living there. We haven't put the rent up for years as the mortgage rates are so low, even though we been advised that we are undercharging. We don't want to lose such good tenants!
Snap! Our tenants have been in over five years and we've never put their rent up. People say we are undercharging but the place is like a palace and the rent just goes straight in the bank every month.
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If it's covering the Mortgage and Insurances required and they are good Tenants ....... when we had a letting agreement the owner of the property wasn't allowed to put up the rent in the whole of our tenancy, we were there 4 years ........
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I would find out more from the council about their scheme. Two things spring to mind - insurances regarding the building and potential damage by renters, and if there is a get out quick clause (ie if you need to sell at at some point because your mum needed the money). But it does sound a bit of a go-er. You could also ask around and see if anyone knows of a good letting agent. May be worth your while to find out the pros and cons from them, costs etc just to give yourselves something to judge the council scheme by.
In no way would I advise you to let it direct yourself and become a landlord.
Bramble
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Thanks all, good advice and it seems some of you have first hand experiences, both good and bad.
It's so hard to know what to do . I'm not in good health as you know and I cannot deal with stress at all, so I don't think i will be becoming a landlord anytime soon, I just cannot cope.
The council as agent sounds ok but 5 years is a heck of a commitment although he did say there are get out clauses. But do I want Syrian refugees in my mothers house - I'm very empathetic and certainly not rasist but I live in a small village And I'm not sure how they will be accepted. You know what some people are like, would I get the backlash as I can't seem to cope with anything these days. Plus if my mother had to move homes or passed away then maybe we would need to sell the house.
I just wish one of my problems would resolve xx I'm not up to making decisions like this x
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Mum in law fell again n house lad week but didn't bother telling anyone or seeking help. It was only when my husband went to see her he found she had gaping forehead wound. Sunday evening she rang an ambulance as she felt funny , her words, they took her to a,and e and later sent her him as low blood pressure. She then realised she had left the tap on n downstairs cloakroom and water was everywhere
She refuses to consider a nursing home or have help in as she says she's not paying!
We have no idea what to do, she's not senile just forgetful
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Groundhog - there is no way that a landlord is stuck with a 3 (you said initially) or longer rental agreement :bang: :bang: :bang:
From what you have said about this person in the Council, he knows very little about the rental market and probably does want money so don't tie yourself up with him! Go into a rental agency and ask the questions from one that doesn't want your money : an Agent will be happy to give as much advice as is necessary: Insurances required, time of rental agreements, get-out clauses, what to charge - the more rental is charged the more the next client will require in property being in tip top condition. This has to be sorted between each let, my neighbour is currently replacing carpets throughout because clients don't want the old ones! [which to be fair have been down several years]. This comes out of any rental paid over the last few years.
Personally I would put wood flooring throughout rather than carpeting ::). But touching up paint-work isnt' enough, rooms have to be re-decorated - which is something I would expect if was paying over £2,550 per calendar month. So add to that what would you expect to get from the property if you sold as it is and how much would you spend in order to make it saleable instead of renting it out.
Would, if it sold today: considering Agents Fees, Solicitors Fees and any Inheritance Tax : spread as far as it is needed to go anyway?
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We considered using the council for our rental property, they lease your property from you not rent it and they will pay you every month even if they don't have tenants in there. They completely take over the property ie they do everything that needs doing to meet the rental conditions and continue to maintain it through the agreement time. Then they refurb before returning it to you. All of this will cost you nothing. Of course councils in different areas could do things differently. Once they take it over for the agreeded time you will have nothing to do except sit back and let them deal with it.
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Thanks for that, how long is the Rental period for though, 3/5 years seems an awfully long time!
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Well for us it would have been for 2 or 3 years what ever one we wanted but there were get out clauses if we needed them. I can't remember what they were now.
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That's clearer, thanks. Not a way I would go though.
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Hello,
Yes star 35 that sound similar to our councils scheme. I suppose CLKD I'm drawn to the council as I worked for them for 25 years and know the guy personally. I don't think he'd mislead me but yes it is a long let. I think it's because the people they are rehousing are vulnerable ( refugees) and so they want stability but there are get out clauses. In return they will inspect the property initially and do any required repairs or decorating to bring it up to standard. In my mothers case this isn't really needed although there is some external work that needs doing. They will also collect and pay the rent to us, deal with any disputes, inspect and when the tenancy ends, hand it over in the same condition as it was let. But I realise the risks and on the basis I can't deal with stress and will probably be out of the equation for a few months ( post op, again ) I need as little stress as possible.
The property is only worth about £80k so not a fortune. We could sell but houses can take years to sell in my village and they are usually sold to be rented out - at least this way we are keeping it in the family but no decisions made yet.
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Hi there, we rented out mums home to cover care home fees but did it through a local agency. Did this as didn't want the stress. They take 10℅ but do 6 monthly checks and ensure the payment is received. 6 month on going let. Also sort out gas checks. We specified type of rental tennet we would like and they did all they could. They have been there 3 years now. Very good agency, recommend that route.
x
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Thanks again ladies, all very valid points of course. Ones I have considered but without a crystal ball it's hard to know what to do.
Stellajayne the shortfall between what the home charges and her pensions is about £900 per month so if we do nothing the deferred debt will be abiut £11,000 per annum ). ( the council allow you to defer any shortfall until Such time as mother passes or property is sold ) . We could get about £6000 rental income per annum so all it will do is reduce the ultimate debt )
If she were to deteriorate and go to a more expensive home I would imagine it would be a nursing home and there is a contribution for the nursing element. Again though the option to defer any difference would remain - it would just mean the debt would be more.
There are limited savings to act as a buffer for repairs to the property. Plus of course my mother isn't a quiet little old lady with dementia, she is a feisty lady who thinks she is 45 and perfectly well! So she likes to spend money and be taken out. ( yesterday my sister took her to marks for coffee and there was a fire in store - she had to be carried down stairs in one of thoise evacu chairs - thought it was great fun lol ). Point I'm making is she needs an income too to give her some quality of life.
This is so hard ! I just do no know what to do. I'm now thinking the 3-5 year tenancy the council want is too long . If she were to pass away after 5 years, then the debt to the council would be £30 k ( even after taking into account the rental income ). So we'd have to sell the property anyway to repay this amount and I know for a fact if you can't sell the property within a short space of time the council will charge interest. The only fsmiky member who would have the means to pay the debt to the council would be - guess who - me! Why? Because I have been cautious and not had a life !!! This was to be my time, but the nasty bowel perforation saw to that one! Seize the day ladies 😖😖😖
BEAM ME UP 😩
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Oh have a :bighug:
I have found in the past that dealing with 'friends' can become difficult, you can't have a Really Good Row with a friend ::).
This is my High Horse again: EVERY care home should provide full Nursing Care, who would want at the end of Life when feeling poorly to have to move from one place to another >:(. This situation badly lets down clients as well as Staff who build up a working relationship and then have to watch their residents leave because full care isn't on offer!
Maybe have a look-see at the various places close to you groundhog and get an idea of yearly costs? Does the current place offer end of Life nursing care when required even if there is a top-up fee?
£80K won't attract a huge rent .........
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I have a booklet here about paying for care home fees but I've been so stressed that I can't even start reading it! I know I will have to soon though. I do know a woman who is going to rent out her mothers house now she has gone in a care home.
She has had to empty the house, give some to charities and dump other stuff and she says it's been a big job. She has also had to keep stuff her Mum wants. She's had to replace all the carpets as they were very old fashioned, update the bathroom and get it decorated throughout as that was worn too.
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Hi, I have to say when we decided to rent mums home out we had to blitz the whole house. New flooring, painting, some new windows and new kitchen cupboards and sink and new toilet. Me and the OH did the painting but had people in to do the other work. Brother and wife helped clean place out but couldn't do more as live so far away. So all that had to be paid for even before rental coming in.
Also I think if you do sell, once your mum's savings go below £23k then there is a reduction in what she has to contribute to home care.
Not sure if someone had mentioned attendance allowance to you. Good thing to look into.
Then I think if there is another step/reduction in payment when your mum's savings hit £12k.
It's mind field. And as CLKD mentioned try and find a home that will see your mum all the way, we did and it was a big help. They did everything they could for her the only move she made was to a different room near the care staff so they could constantly check on her and have her close at hand during her last week or two.
A big big hug to you as I do know it's very hard to go through :bighug:
Just try to take it at your pace.
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Fire alarms. Fire extinguishes. Fire blankets ......... it can run into more than the stress is worth.