Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => All things menopause => Topic started by: kiltgirl on December 16, 2016, 06:31:48 AM
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Hi ladies,
I'm really struggling with the decision on whether to have my ovaries taken out when I have my hysterectomy. I've read a few stories from women who have done this and found it has helped their PMS symptoms.
I've always had an awful time with PMS, always! Would be lovely to think that if I had them taken out it would be easier to regulate my hormone levels with some estradiol...
I know there are pros and cons re ovary removal...one minute I'm for and the next I've changed my mind again...
Are there any ladies on here who have done this noticed an improvement?
thank you in advance x
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Hi kiltgirl
I haven't had mine removed but I'm having a hysterectomy early next year and they will be removed then . I too suffer terrible pms and have read many positive things too.
I know there are many against removal due to lack testosterone etc but I cant carry on like I am and for me personally I do believe its the right thing to do , xx
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:hug: Thank you WTD
This is what I'm thinking too, I hope it goes well for you, mine is supposed to be sometime Jan/Feb, just want it over with...
Wouldn't it be amazing to be free from PMS, is so awful at the moment, I am going to discuss with my gynae and hopefully she will put on my notes before I'm discharged back to the GP...that I want testosterone checked as well as estradiol...
I don't know if it's naive to think that we can regulate our hormones externally once we have gotten rid of the ovaries...would be nice to think so!
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Hi kiltgirl
I just know I have tried everything to regulate my hormones hrt hasn't helped my pms or low mood and anxiety. ADs haven't helped. I also have endometrial hyperplasia which is reason for hysterectomy as no amount of progesterone has helped thin it. I just think I cant be worse off without ovaries as I am now. I have been in some very dark places and I'm not rushing into ovary removal blind. Even professor studd recommends it on his web site. Good luck with your op I'm waiting for the all clear from mrsa then I can go ahead.
Hopefully we can support each other through it, your welcome to PM me if you wish. There's another member going to have ovaries removed soon mis71mum xx
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Thank you, yes we can all support each other. I feel a bit tearful at the moment, so thankful for this forum, I'm a very solitary person when my daughter isn't here, that's prob down to my mood lately. Talking to people who don't know what you're going through can make you feel worse if they belittle your experience etc.
I totally get the 'dark places' and have been thinking exactly the same in that it couldn't be worse than it is now without the ovaries.
Lately even just getting out of bed in the morning is a chore, even been thinking on the way to work that it might not be so bad if I got hit by as bus or something...I could never do that my DD though :'(
This isn't a life...hardly even an existence really...so yes bring it on...'The Change'...thanks for the heads up on Professor Studd's site, good reading and making me feel more optomistic.
By springtime next year we'll be on here saying how glad we are we took the step I hope x
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HI Kiltgirl. I've had the BSO and hysterectomy - for slightly different reasons but I too had awful PMS and hoped it would help.
I'm not the bearer of good news well, not yet. it's not quite as simple as taking a bit of oestrodial for me unfortunatley! I'm struggling to get my levels balanced (6 months post op) and have lost a lot of hair.. I was losing hair before but the change has been dramatic and I can now only put it down to the testosterone/oestrogen balance being awry
So... there is this blog
https://msjekyllhyde.wordpress.com/
that should give you a pretty good idea of a success story! and hoepfully I'll be able to join you feeling better soon!
It's not a decision to take lightly.. your own hormones, as problematic as they are, don't poop out all in one go - and dribble away for years.. WHile in surgical menopause it's another story!
I hope you make the decision that's right for you. I feel I wasn't given enough information and literally hurled out of the hospital without much advice on HRT or anything. I'm fumbling my way through right now.. another 6 months to go before i'm seen again but at this rate i'll be bald and a bit mad - I'm not going to lie, this is the hardest part of my life!
I think once I've got onto some kind of regime that suits me, I'll be much better but I can't seem to think what that might be.. Testosterone seems to be the magic bullet, but I can't have any until my E levels are higher, apparently
Good luck and the other women on here are incredibly kind and knowledgeable and supportive so you are in the right place
Abby xx
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I didn't have my ovaries removed but after my hysterectomy when I was 32 they started playing up. oestrogen levels dropped quite low so went on hrt alongside ovulating every few months or so. Felt fantastic for years until they finally packed up at 45, everything went downhill then and for the last 4/5 despite different types of hrt , even testosterone I'm still not good
They now can't find my ovaries and given my symptoms think they've dissolved and gone
Your stories could be different and I really hope they will be but I think it's good to hear the good and bad side so that you have a clearer understanding
Since the ovaries packed in hair loss has been dramatic and continuous and it does nothing for self esteem
They say oestrogen is the hair growth hormone, well my levels have been really high, maybe too high ? Who knows, sometimes I don't think anyone knows exactly what causes what
You each have your individual reasons for thinking about this and that has to be the most important thing. I didn't suffer pmt but having read about it I can understand your desire to end the misery
X
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HI Kiltgirl. I've had the BSO and hysterectomy - for slightly different reasons but I too had awful PMS and hoped it would help.
I'm not the bearer of good news well, not yet. it's not quite as simple as taking a bit of oestrodial for me unfortunatley! I'm struggling to get my levels balanced (6 months post op) and have lost a lot of hair.. I was losing hair before but the change has been dramatic and I can now only put it down to the testosterone/oestrogen balance being awry
So... there is this blog
https://msjekyllhyde.wordpress.com/
that should give you a pretty good idea of a success story! and hoepfully I'll be able to join you feeling better soon!
It's not a decision to take lightly.. your own hormones, as problematic as they are, don't poop out all in one go - and dribble away for years.. WHile in surgical menopause it's another story!
I hope you make the decision that's right for you. I feel I wasn't given enough information and literally hurled out of the hospital without much advice on HRT or anything. I'm fumbling my way through right now.. another 6 months to go before i'm seen again but at this rate i'll be bald and a bit mad - I'm not going to lie, this is the hardest part of my life!
I think once I've got onto some kind of regime that suits me, I'll be much better but I can't seem to think what that might be.. Testosterone seems to be the magic bullet, but I can't have any until my E levels are higher, apparently
Good luck and the other women on here are incredibly kind and knowledgeable and supportive so you are in the right place
Abby xx
Hi Abby,
thank you for replying...I was reading that blog post early this morning when I couldn't sleep...it's all so confusing, I guess we don't find out if it will suit us until we do it, and if it doesn't...
I honestly don't think I can feel much worse than I do now, everything hurts, I have zero energy and black mood...I can't carry on like this...can't do ADs (have tried many times), can't do progestins (make me suicidal)
I don't know...I think I'm going to have to risk it...will call my gynae to see if I can have a chat with her to see what she thinks.
I'm so sorry you're having such a bad time...it must be soul destroying to still be feeling so awful...I really hope you start to feel better soon...from what I understand so far it's a question of balancing the estradiol and testosterone?
:hug: x
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I didn't have my ovaries removed but after my hysterectomy when I was 32 they started playing up. oestrogen levels dropped quite low so went on hrt alongside ovulating every few months or so. Felt fantastic for years until they finally packed up at 45, everything went downhill then and for the last 4/5 despite different types of hrt , even testosterone I'm still not good
They now can't find my ovaries and given my symptoms think they've dissolved and gone
Your stories could be different and I really hope they will be but I think it's good to hear the good and bad side so that you have a clearer understanding
Since the ovaries packed in hair loss has been dramatic and continuous and it does nothing for self esteem
They say oestrogen is the hair growth hormone, well my levels have been really high, maybe too high ? Who knows, sometimes I don't think anyone knows exactly what causes what
You each have your individual reasons for thinking about this and that has to be the most important thing. I didn't suffer pmt but having read about it I can understand your desire to end the misery
X
Annie that's a long time to be feeling so bad...it must be unsettling to say the least to know what's happened to your ovaries!
I do worry about hair loss, I have a lot of thick curly hair but recently noticed it's been blocking the plug hole in the shower too often...have you noticed any new baby hairs coming through? I have high estradiol too...I don't know what that's all about...
I have a week to myself while DD is with her dad so I think I'll spend some of it researching...mind you sometimes it makes it worse!
Off to my doc to get something for my Mirena acne...I'm so gross, a paper bag will probably do ::)
thank you for your reply xx :hug:
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Hi kiltgirl
I haven't had the surgery but did fight a neurologist who was pushing me to have it years ago. Long story, won't bore you with the detail! I did lots of research and eventually saw a number of docs with different specialisms. The gyneas/endos were suggesting I have a medical oophorectomy in order to see how my body reacted i.e. a gonadotrophin analogue with add back oestrogen which would close down my ovaries. It was eventually decided that this wouldn't be suitable for me but has this been considered for you? If you faired well and the results were good this could perhaps give you a better idea of how your body would react to the surgical menopause. Just a thought!
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I'm not sure if I have new hairs or they're broken ones, so hard to tell but my hair doesn't feel like there's more of it. It's very up and down as is everything with me
It's been a horrible journey since 2012 and I just cannot wait for it to be over. As much as I thought peri would be flushes and no periods I thought post meno would be the light at the end of the tunnel but for me it's not. I think I'm 2 years post meno and still no further forward
Research, research and some more !
I like Elizebethroses suggestion
X
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Hi Kiltgirl, I had mine removed last year, but for different reasons, had lots of fertility treatment in the past that they now state can potentially lead to ovarian cancer and was having some pain from left ovary, so it was more a preventative action.
My problem was I was not given HRT immediately, as I was supposedly post meno. So had really bad symptoms start off, indicative of no oestrogen, which blood test 2 weeks post confirmed. I started on HRT after 2 weeks and then slowly got back to normal. Found that the transdermal, constant dose oestrogen to be the best (started with femoston tablets, but got bad headaches). So please make sure that you start the HRT as soon as you have had the op, also it may be wise to get a blood test of oestrogen levels before (if you are post meno), if not it will fluctuate anyway. I find I do not need testosterone, my energy levels etc eventually got back to normal (my adrenals must be producing it).
Hope this helps a little.
Rhiner
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Hi! I'm 19 months post oopherectomy (previously had hysterectomy at 36) and I STILL can't get my HRT right! I'm very sensitive to even small fluctuations in estrogen, so uneven delivery methods are causing me huge problems with unstable mood etc. When this happens for me, its just like being back in perimenopause. :(
I wish HRT was straightforward after removal of ovaries, but sadly in my case it hasn't been. I agree with Rhiner that its very important to start HRT as soon as possible after surgery, as figuring out your ideal dosage/delivery can take some time.
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My hysterectomy happened in my mid 30's after near constant bleeding & cramps. I'd turned into a nasty, grumpy person. So hysterectomy was a blessing. Ovaries were left at that time. However, needed HRT. Some 10 years later I was in a lot of pain again & ovaries were removed. Turns out I had bad adhesions especially on one side.
At time of my hysterectomy I was told they would leave ovaries in place. In hindsight, maybe should have been done all at once.
You really need to rely on consultant's advice. Ask, it's your body.
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I'm two months post radical hysterectomy for ovarian cancer and so far, so good. I have had hot flushes but no worse than prior to removal and by and large, the terrible mood swings and agitation I was experiencing in peri have abated. There's no chance I'll be offered any chemical support now so am trying to make sure I eat well, get enough sleep and practice mindfulness and relaxation more. I had always thought I'd get ovarian cancer as I'd endometriosis and lots of fertility drugs so just wish I'd been offered chance to be rid before it was a reality.
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Hi kiltgirl
I haven't had the surgery but did fight a neurologist who was pushing me to have it years ago. Long story, won't bore you with the detail! I did lots of research and eventually saw a number of docs with different specialisms. The gyneas/endos were suggesting I have a medical oophorectomy in order to see how my body reacted i.e. a gonadotrophin analogue with add back oestrogen which would close down my ovaries. It was eventually decided that this wouldn't be suitable for me but has this been considered for you? If you faired well and the results were good this could perhaps give you a better idea of how your body would react to the surgical menopause. Just a thought!
That's an interesting idea, will take that to my gynae...think I'm going to write myself a list!...part of me doesn't want to string it out too long but also scared of making the wrong decision.
I know a couple of women who have had theirs removed and they don't regret it. We need a MM time machine!
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I'm not sure if I have new hairs or they're broken ones, so hard to tell but my hair doesn't feel like there's more of it. It's very up and down as is everything with me
It's been a horrible journey since 2012 and I just cannot wait for it to be over. As much as I thought peri would be flushes and no periods I thought post meno would be the light at the end of the tunnel but for me it's not. I think I'm 2 years post meno and still no further forward
Research, research and some more !
I like Elizebethroses suggestion
X
I hope there is a light at the end of the tunnel, and soon...makes me angry that we have to go through this [email protected] men had to go through this there would be a lot more help available, GPs wouldn't roll their eyes when they see us...etc etc.
Remember the days when your biggest decision was which top to buy to wear on a Friday night out...would we ever think then we would be making decisions like this ::)
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Hi Kiltgirl, I had mine removed last year, but for different reasons, had lots of fertility treatment in the past that they now state can potentially lead to ovarian cancer and was having some pain from left ovary, so it was more a preventative action.
My problem was I was not given HRT immediately, as I was supposedly post meno. So had really bad symptoms start off, indicative of no oestrogen, which blood test 2 weeks post confirmed. I started on HRT after 2 weeks and then slowly got back to normal. Found that the transdermal, constant dose oestrogen to be the best (started with femoston tablets, but got bad headaches). So please make sure that you start the HRT as soon as you have had the op, also it may be wise to get a blood test of oestrogen levels before (if you are post meno), if not it will fluctuate anyway. I find I do not need testosterone, my energy levels etc eventually got back to normal (my adrenals must be producing it).
Hope this helps a little.
Rhiner
Thank you Rhiner, wow I didn't know this about fertility treatment! Am glad you've found your way back again...I don't want to take anything orally, would rather use a transdermal type too...something about telling a GP this when they give you that look makes me lose my bottle a bit...I think if I can get my gynae to put this on my notes then they might be less indignant!
I'm not post meno yet, actually my last blood test showed higher than normal estrogen, so my GP sent me to endocrinology...?!
Thank you for your reply, I should be able to compile a pretty good list of things to discuss with my gynae!
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Hi! I'm 19 months post oopherectomy (previously had hysterectomy at 36) and I STILL can't get my HRT right! I'm very sensitive to even small fluctuations in estrogen, so uneven delivery methods are causing me huge problems with unstable mood etc. When this happens for me, its just like being back in perimenopause. :(
I wish HRT was straightforward after removal of ovaries, but sadly in my case it hasn't been. I agree with Rhiner that its very important to start HRT as soon as possible after surgery, as figuring out your ideal dosage/delivery can take some time.
Thank you Tempest...I have a feeling I'm pretty sensitive to fluctuations...this is going on my list too...we need steady not up and down...had enough of that for a life time...no wonder men think they have the upper hand grrrr...
which method are you using for your HRT if you don't mind me asking? x
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[/quote]
Remember the days when your biggest decision was which top to buy to wear on a Friday night out...would we ever think then we would be making decisions like this ::)
[/quote]
Lol the days of deciding what mini dress to put on and the music blaring was only stopped because of peri in 2012 !
Sad times these days !
X
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My hysterectomy happened in my mid 30's after near constant bleeding & cramps. I'd turned into a nasty, grumpy person. So hysterectomy was a blessing. Ovaries were left at that time. However, needed HRT. Some 10 years later I was in a lot of pain again & ovaries were removed. Turns out I had bad adhesions especially on one side.
At time of my hysterectomy I was told they would leave ovaries in place. In hindsight, maybe should have been done all at once.
You really need to rely on consultant's advice. Ask, it's your body.
You're right...I actually trust my consultant, she's pretty cool, I googled her...very impressive too. She did emphasise that the ovaries are very easily damaged during the procedure and might be lost anyway.
I'm still leaning towards getting it all done at once...if I can get assurance that testosterone will be available...must have been hard for you to have the op at such a young age x
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I'm two months post radical hysterectomy for ovarian cancer and so far, so good. I have had hot flushes but no worse than prior to removal and by and large, the terrible mood swings and agitation I was experiencing in peri have abated. There's no chance I'll be offered any chemical support now so am trying to make sure I eat well, get enough sleep and practice mindfulness and relaxation more. I had always thought I'd get ovarian cancer as I'd endometriosis and lots of fertility drugs so just wish I'd been offered chance to be rid before it was a reality.
Oh not that must have been horrible to go through :'(
I hope your recovery is going OK, yes I agree it would have been better to have had the choice and been in control rather than what you've been through. At least you do have the consolation of feeling better mood-wise...this is what I'm aspiring to...can't imagine anything making my mood worse...if I were worse I would probably be arrested or banned from Tesco...
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Lol the days of deciding what mini dress to put on and the music blaring was only stopped because of peri in 2012 !
Sad times these days !
X
Rock on!!! I have legs like a Tiny Tears doll so mini skirts were never my thing...I did get a massive tattoo on my hip and thigh earlier this year though...still makes me jump when I catch sight of it :o
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Lol the days of deciding what mini dress to put on and the music blaring was only stopped because of peri in 2012 !
Sad times these days !
X
Rock on!!! I have legs like a Tiny Tears doll so mini skirts were never my thing...I did get a massive tattoo on my hip and thigh earlier this year though...still makes me jump when I catch sight of it :o
I can just picture that !
When we were in holiday in sept I noticed my belly bar was missing , OH asked how long ago and I said not sure, looks like it's all healed up (story of my life!) pre peri I would've noticed straight away and gone straight to replace it
X
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Lol the days of deciding what mini dress to put on and the music blaring was only stopped because of peri in 2012 !
Sad times these days !
X
Rock on!!! I have legs like a Tiny Tears doll so mini skirts were never my thing...I did get a massive tattoo on my hip and thigh earlier this year though...still makes me jump when I catch sight of it :o
I can just picture that !
When we were in holiday in sept I noticed my belly bar was missing , OH asked how long ago and I said not sure, looks like it's all healed up (story of my life!) pre peri I would've noticed straight away and gone straight to replace it
X
Story of my life...that made me laugh...sorry! Is just not glamorous this meno business is it...it's the reason I got my tattoo though, I wanted something pretty to look at rather than my ever expanding midline and grumpy face...
I thought I would feel ridiculous getting my first ever tat at my age but it was actually a really nice..but painful experience!
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I've got 3 tats, 2 are cover ups so I guess I've been inked 5 times. But they're cover uppable for Work etc. I'd love one at the nape of my neck to symbolise my 3 kids and angel baby
They're only exposed really on holiday
X
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I've got 3 tats, 2 are cover ups so I guess I've been inked 5 times. But they're cover uppable for Work etc. I'd love one at the nape of my neck to symbolise my 3 kids and angel baby
They're only exposed really on holiday
X
I'm kinda glad I'm too skint for more right now I think it could be addictive! Angel baby...I'm so sorry :'( A tattoo is a lovely idea, never forgotten x
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I've got 3 tats, 2 are cover ups so I guess I've been inked 5 times. But they're cover uppable for Work etc. I'd love one at the nape of my neck to symbolise my 3 kids and angel baby
They're only exposed really on holiday
X
I'm kinda glad I'm too skint for more right now I think it could be addictive! Angel baby...I'm so sorry :'( A tattoo is a lovely idea, never forgotten x
Aw that's ok. She would be 27 just after Christmas
I've often thought 3 open flowers and the 4th a flower bud in 2 pinks for the girls and 2 blues for the boys
X
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I had a subtotal hysterectomy 13 years ago. Initially the surgeon wanted to whip everything out - i.e. womb, cervix and ovaries - but after lengthy discussion agreed to do the subtotal, provided that they looked healthy.
I said to him how many men would have their testicles removed just because there was a chance they could become troublesome at some point down the line and he totally agreed :)
As far as I am aware, ovaries do still produce small amounts of oestrogen even in post menopausal women.
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loving the chats about tats and mini skirts, think we all got to that age. I haven't got one (yet)!! Annie - that is so sweet about the flowers and a bud, a lovely idea.
Now down to more serious matters......Kiltgirl - it sounds like you have a good gynae which helps enormously. My surgeon was very anti HRT and then very reluctantly put me on tablets after it was obvious that I had had a hormone crash! But, he did not want to know when I then had problems with the tablets. It was thanks to this site, that I went privately to a consultant that I found about on here who was very knowledgeable about HRT and who recommended transdermal, as its a constant dose (alongside Utrogestan as I still have my uterus). It took a few weeks to settle after the switch in dosage forms, but now normality is resumed, including visits to the gym!
Coldethyl- really sorry to hear of your experience and so glad that all seems to be settling now. Ovarian cancer is not easily detected is it.
Rhiner
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Hi kiltgirl.
If I were you, I would get the Mirena removed asap and see how you feel. I am very sensitive to progesterone (most women who suffer with PMS are) and when I tried the Mirena it gave me much worse PMS, and I had it ALL month.
Just because the progesterone in the Mirena is released locally, it doesn't mean it STAYS locally. It can, and does, travel around your system and it can cause dreadful symptoms in some women.
Prof Studd mentions on his website that in some women the Mirena can exacerbate their PMS, and he doesn't recommend it.
I am one of his patients (my PMS has been getting steadily worse, until it became PMDD, and then got even worse in peri Menopause), and one of the first things he checked was if I had the Mirena, because if I had, he would have wanted to remove it there and then.
I am currently on a combination of 4 pumps oestrogel + testim gel + 100mg Sertraline and it is certainly helping - but my PMS still comes back every month. It is dreadful. I am crippled with anxiety and have felt suicidal at times. The depression is soul destroying. Then it suddenly all disappears as quickly as it came.
Prof Studd has written to my GP recommending I try a course of Zoladex injections + add back Livial. And I'm just summoning the courage to try it.
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I've got 3 tats, 2 are cover ups so I guess I've been inked 5 times. But they're cover uppable for Work etc. I'd love one at the nape of my neck to symbolise my 3 kids and angel baby
They're only exposed really on holiday
X
Ah that's perfect, what a lovely idea :hug:
I'm kinda glad I'm too skint for more right now I think it could be addictive! Angel baby...I'm so sorry :'( A tattoo is a lovely idea, never forgotten x
Aw that's ok. She would be 27 just after Christmas
I've often thought 3 open flowers and the 4th a flower bud in 2 pinks for the girls and 2 blues for the boys
X
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Yes, fluctuations are a killer for sure! I had enough of those during peri too. >:(
So far, I've tried Estrogel (twice), Premarin and now Estradot patches.
I USED to think the gel wasnt very consistent - until I tried the patches and I have found these much worse for me! I have problems the day 1 of a new patch as it doesn't seem to 'catch up' when I remove the old one until day 2. Day 2 is fairly even, and then it trails off again at the end of day 3. I certainly can't go 3 1/2 days on a patch! I've been on these 2 months in total (over a month at 50 mcg) and I thought it should have evened out at least a bit by now! My levels feel very low on this dose compared to the 2 1\2 pumps of Estrogel I was using (50mcg is supposed to be roughly the same as 2 pumps of gel).
I've also had problems raising my dose higher to achieve good levels whilst on anything, but I think this is due to having gone so long previously without any HRT. I've been offered an implant in January, but am very scared to go ahead with it as it cannot be removed once placed (and they last 4 - 6 months)! Given my problems, I would rather wait a while to get a rough idea of what level I feel ok at first (if I ever get there).!
I think I asked before if you're in Scotland? Sorry if you've replied before, but I can't keep track of where I posted (meno. brain)! If you are, then implants will be available to you of both estrogen and testosterone if you are comfortable with these. They are supposed to be the 'gold standard' of HRT for younger oopherectomised women - I know Professor Studd has written about this being the case too.
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I had a subtotal hysterectomy 13 years ago. Initially the surgeon wanted to whip everything out - i.e. womb, cervix and ovaries - but after lengthy discussion agreed to do the subtotal, provided that they looked healthy.
I said to him how many men would have their testicles removed just because there was a chance they could become troublesome at some point down the line and he totally agreed :)
As far as I am aware, ovaries do still produce small amounts of oestrogen even in post menopausal women.
You're quite right...I really want the moodiness to stop though...maybe it's a lobotomy I need instead :o
Did you feel OK after your hysterectomy?
Oh I don't know...I do want to keep my cervix though...I need to talk it all through with my gynae
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Hi Tempest
You say you feel bad on the day you change your patch, as it needs to 'catch up'. Have you tried keeping the old patch + the new patch, on together for say 12 hours, before removing the old patch?
It might help with the 'transfer'.
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loving the chats about tats and mini skirts, think we all got to that age. I haven't got one (yet)!! Annie - that is so sweet about the flowers and a bud, a lovely idea.
Now down to more serious matters......Kiltgirl - it sounds like you have a good gynae which helps enormously. My surgeon was very anti HRT and then very reluctantly put me on tablets after it was obvious that I had had a hormone crash! But, he did not want to know when I then had problems with the tablets. It was thanks to this site, that I went privately to a consultant that I found about on here who was very knowledgeable about HRT and who recommended transdermal, as its a constant dose (alongside Utrogestan as I still have my uterus). It took a few weeks to settle after the switch in dosage forms, but now normality is resumed, including visits to the gym!
Coldethyl- really sorry to hear of your experience and so glad that all seems to be settling now. Ovarian cancer is not easily detected is it.
Rhiner
I will definitely be pushing for transdermal, don't feel like putting a strain on my liver etc if I can avoid it.
Sorry your GP wasn't interested in finding something that actually worked for you...I wonder if it dents their egos when the thing they prescribe doesn't work!
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Hi kiltgirl.
If I were you, I would get the Mirena removed asap and see how you feel. I am very sensitive to progesterone (most women who suffer with PMS are) and when I tried the Mirena it gave me much worse PMS, and I had it ALL month.
Just because the progesterone in the Mirena is released locally, it doesn't mean it STAYS locally. It can, and does, travel around your system and it can cause dreadful symptoms in some women.
Prof Studd mentions on his website that in some women the Mirena can exacerbate their PMS, and he doesn't recommend it.
I am one of his patients (my PMS has been getting steadily worse, until it became PMDD, and then got even worse in peri Menopause), and one of the first things he checked was if I had the Mirena, because if I had, he would have wanted to remove it there and then.
I am currently on a combination of 4 pumps oestrogel + testim gel + 100mg Sertraline and it is certainly helping - but my PMS still comes back every month. It is dreadful. I am crippled with anxiety and have felt suicidal at times. The depression is soul destroying. Then it suddenly all disappears as quickly as it came.
Prof Studd has written to my GP recommending I try a course of Zoladex injections + add back Livial. And I'm just summoning the courage to try it.
Hi GypsyRoseLee,
I had it removed a month ago, still recovering!
Never again...and why are GPs always so surprised that we might link the way we feel to the Mirena!!? I mean...please don't tell me they haven't heard it before?
Your symptoms sound awful, do you think you will give the new treatments a try? The suicidal feeling is awful...I try to stand beside it, remember it isn't really me but my hormones. Is good you have the advice of a meno expert, I hate the thought of going to my GP and getting flustered while they deny that anxiety could be hormone based...I mean...WHAT!!??
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Thanks, GRL! Yep, that's the next plan!! Might go for keeping it on for 4 hours initially, as I've seen talked about over at Hystersisters.
Oh crikey - I'm gonna end up like the lady I read about that Professor Studd talked about in the DM in total desperation, I know it! She had 17 - yes SEVENTEEN patches on when he saw her! Her levels were astronomical, and she STILL didn't feel good (but no wonder, though)!! ::)
Tattoos? (You're a wee soul, Annie)! Mini skirts?!? Well, I have ONE tattoo, very small and I'm not sure that it's even in the same place now as when I had it done in my 20's. Lol! I haven't seen my legs for YEARS (well that's a lie - but no one else has)! ;) I'm strictly a leggings/jeans/trousers girl. It's too flippin' cold up here in Scotland (how the hell kilts are the national dress, I'll never know)! :o
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Yes, fluctuations are a killer for sure! I had enough of those during peri too. >:(
So far, I've tried Estrogel (twice), Premarin and now Estradot patches.
I USED to think the gel wasnt very consistent - until I tried the patches and I have found these much worse for me! I have problems the day 1 of a new patch as it doesn't seem to 'catch up' when I remove the old one until day 2. Day 2 is fairly even, and then it trails off again at the end of day 3. I certainly can't go 3 1/2 days on a patch! I've been on these 2 months in total (over a month at 50 mcg) and I thought it should have evened out at least a bit by now! My levels feel very low on this dose compared to the 2 1\2 pumps of Estrogel I was using (50mcg is supposed to be roughly the same as 2 pumps of gel).
I've also had problems raising my dose higher to achieve good levels whilst on anything, but I think this is due to having gone so long previously without any HRT. I've been offered an implant in January, but am very scared to go ahead with it as it cannot be removed once placed (and they last 4 - 6 months)! Given my problems, I would rather wait a while to get a rough idea of what level I feel ok at first (if I ever get there).!
I think I asked before if you're in Scotland? Sorry if you've replied before, but I can't keep track of where I posted (meno. brain)! If you are, then implants will be available to you of both estrogen and testosterone if you are comfortable with these. They are supposed to be the 'gold standard' of HRT for younger oopherectomised women - I know Professor Studd has written about this being the case too.
Hi...I agree the implant is a scary thought, given how reluctant they can be to remove it when you don't feel it's right!
I am originally Scottish, moved down to England when I was 20...thought I was all grown up then...sigh
Seems so unfair that the quality of our lives can be dictated by postcode funding etc...I for one would never be able to afford any kind of private treatment...so I guess we are at the mercy of the great British GP...
I will make sure I tell my gynae I want consistency...just as long as it's not consistently cr@p!
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You got it, Kiltgirl! Consistently crap is awful. :'(
Unfortunately, all HRT takes a while to stabilise in any case, but you can get a 'feel' for if it's going in the right direction after 6 weeks according to my Consultant.
The postcode lottery is a disgrace! Implants are also available in London - this shouldn't be the case and they should be consistently available across the board in the NHS to all oopherectomised younger women. We are unique in Scotland as we have control of our own NHS, as you probably know. Some of this is good, some bad. We don't have quite as many freedoms about being treated outwith of our health boards up here, which means that in some areas women have no access to menopause services at all! The odd patient has been referred to NHS Greater Glasgow & Clyde for implants, and they do them up at Grey's Hospital too. So it's not consistent by any means here either. :'(
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Oh Tempest I really love it when you pop in. I know your posts are serious and you know I'm rooting for you but I'm picturing you with umpteen estradots all over you!
That's what I love about you, although you have and are suffering far worse than the majority of us you still manage to put humour into your posts and can laugh about you!
You're a legend on here 😘
X
Forgot to add that the tat on my boob started off on my neck :rofl:
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Aww, shucks! Thanks, Annie. ;)
I'd love one day to be legendary for riding off into the distance and finally giving menopause the finger. Now THAT would be an epic ending! ;D
P.S......mine is now on the sole of my foot. Not going to even MENTION where it started out....... ;D
:rofl:
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Hi ladies
I'm too extremely sensitive to hormones. Had to have mirena removed as it left me sooo down! On ovary removal I can only tell you my experience but yours could be different.
I had my womb removed age 46 due to prolapse I was already on hrt because of peri. This made hormones even more unbalanced...dreadful. Anyway I went to prof studd and got the usual 4 pumps est gel bear in mind I was already on a 100mg patch. No better so to cut long story short I opted to have ovaries removed whilst still using 4 pumps est gel the idea being that fluctuations would stop and the estrogen would be then beneficial without interruptions. Afterwards I had a very slight improvement in daily headaches and nausea. My mood was still up and down still flushing still quite a lot of debilitating headaches.
I am now 55 and had estrogen & prog sensitive breast cancer in 2014 so had to stop estrogen! and take a hormone blocker, well the tears come and go, I sweat, have flushes, Im fatigued exhausted, anxious, flat no motivation had to give up work as could not cope. Sometimes I feel ok then it all starts again like I am still having cycles!!! Why?
Getting back to your dilemma of having ovaries removed or not all I can do is give you my experience.... it did not help me....but you could be different and I really hope you are.
Thinking of you all and wishing you the very best for good outcomes.
S tooth x
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I had a subtotal hysterectomy 13 years ago. Initially the surgeon wanted to whip everything out - i.e. womb, cervix and ovaries - but after lengthy discussion agreed to do the subtotal, provided that they looked healthy.
I said to him how many men would have their testicles removed just because there was a chance they could become troublesome at some point down the line and he totally agreed :)
As far as I am aware, ovaries do still produce small amounts of oestrogen even in post menopausal women.
You're quite right...I really want the moodiness to stop though...maybe it's a lobotomy I need instead :o
Did you feel OK after your hysterectomy?
Oh I don't know...I do want to keep my cervix though...I need to talk it all through with my gynae
Yes I was fine after, just wish I had had it done a lot sooner instead of having three years of nightmare periods which were extremely difficult to cope with (such heavy bleeding) and very painful. I had a melon sized fibroid that was causing the problems.
I definitely think you should have a good talk to your gynae about which bits to keep.
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Hi, Sweettooth!
I'm so sorry you're going through all this - it's incredibly tough for sure!
I can categorically confirm that YES, the symptoms DO go in cycles when you've had your ovaries removed in my experience. It certainly hasn't helped me mood wise either. I wish we knew why this is happening!
Sending you biggest hugs, you're a very brave lady. xxxx
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Gosh ladies, your stories are all so different, I guess the lesson here is I wouldn't know unless I had them taken out...I'm guessing even the gynae wouldn't know, all she will be able to do is say whether or not I can have HRT or not...and give me her opinion...
I hope all of you who are still struggling find some light at the end of the tunnel...it's not bloody fair we have to feel like this :'(
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TK u tempest, I keep thinking it will settle sometime. Have been reading some of your post and how awful it has been for you... just not fair. I do hope you feel better and better...you deserve it x