Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => All things menopause => Topic started by: mimumonschein on November 28, 2016, 07:49:11 PM
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Hi my name is Mimu and I'm 55 years old. I still have a regular period but I have been bleeding most of the days in between since three months... The smear test and ultra sound test are negative. I had thrush symptoms but after different treatments it didn't help. Today my blood test shows that the iron level is high and that is why it's burning down there. My question is that is it menopause symptom to bleed almost every day and the iron blood level is high? What will be the treatment for this? This condition has started three months ago. Please advise me.
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Hi and welcome mimumonschein -
Your symptoms do sound like classic peri menopause and we can offer you support about this.
The burning around your ‘lady bits' will probably be vaginal atrophy and there is treatment for this e.g. Vagifem together with vaginal moisturisers.
Do read up all the information on this site to clued up. DG x
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Thank you for your reply, Emma.
I took Trophigil for 10 days which is like Vagifem in French version I think. Also I'm having three months treatment with:
duphaston (dydrogesterone) 10mg x 2 for 10 days.
Now my iron level is high and I'm still bleeding with burning sensation. I have been bleeding almost everyday since three months. I'm a bit worried.... is there any Progesterone cream to stop burning?
Thank you. From Mimu
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Who is Emma and why is she editing posts?
Dxx
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Dawncam - the thread got moved.
mimumonshcein - The Duphastan was given to help control your problems with bleeding. Erratic and problematic bleeding is typical for the peri meno stage.
Controlling the bleeding is probably your most important issue right now and I wonder if the Mirena would be a good option for you. What have your doctors suggested regarding the continuous bleeding? Have you been offered a Mirena?
It is oestrogen that will help with vaginal burning - I looked Trophigil up and I think it has some oestrogen, progesterone and live cultures - it seems to be a treatment against vaginal bacteria and if you are bleeding all the time then it's difficult to get rid of this bacteria. 10 days of this product would not be enough to reduce and control vaginal atrophy discomfort. Did you take this orally or vaginally?
Progesterone won't help your vaginal burning so I'm not sure why this product has progesterone???!!.
If you are bleeding continuously then this would unbalance the vaginal flora and natural secretions and make the area more prone to infections - so getting the bleeding under control is important.
Also local oestrogen wouldn't be as effective if you are bleeding - Vagifem, which is the main local oestrogen treatment here in the UK, is a little pessary that you insert into the vagina at night and it releases the oestrogen to restore the whole area - if you are bleeding this might get washed away.
To reduce the burning you need to get the bleeding under control first - avoid scented washes and use vaginal moisturisers e.g. Sylk or Multi Gyn Actigel, as these will help maintain a healthy vaginal flora. Also ask for vaginal oestrogen - Vagifem is the most popular - this needs to be used every night for 2 weeks and twice a week after that. If the burning is around the urethra then make sure you drink plenty of water, avoid caffein and acidic drinks like fruit juices and alcohol.
Go back to your doctor with a list of your questions and symptoms and ask about the Mirena and local oestrogen.
DG x
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Hi mimumonschein
:welcomemm: from me too!
There is information about control of heavy bleeding here on this site:
http://www.menopausematters.co.uk/periodtreatments.php
Are you in France then? It sounds like you may well benefit from a Mirena to control bleeding as Dancinggirl suggests, but I presume your doc will be following up if there are any concerns about having a high iron level?
In UK we do not use progesterone for vaginal problems but yes local oestrogen would be the thing - if in fact you are low in oestrogen. The heavy bleeding implies not although some unlucky women do start to get vaginal atrophy and bladder problems before peri-menopause starts and oestrogen declines overall (from what has been reported on here).
Hurdity x
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Hi dancinggirl and Hurdity,
Wow, what a great response thank you so much. My first question is can I get Vagifem online or should I ask my GP? This sounds good.
I think Trophigil was for vaginal atrophy but more likely anti-fungal treatment? I found it quite strong and it felt like it was burning more. I quite like to try Vagifem. I live in London but I went to the French Gynaecologist recommended by a friend. Now I'm back to my normal GP. To be honest with you, this burning and bleeding drive me crazy as this is already three months. Is it going like this all menopause years? I feel like I'm getting depressed, too.
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Hi mimumonschein - you get Vagifem on prescription from your GP. However, as I mentioned, you do need to get the bleeding under control, so discuss this with the GP. Don't use tampons if you are bleeding and don't use scented sanitary pads either - the perfume in these things can upset the flora balance and aggravate things.
Get the bleeding under control - a scan would be a good idea so hopefully the GP will refer you for that. A Mirena might be a good option and you can simply add in some oestrogen if flushes become a problem.
Drink plenty of water - the burning could be atrophy in the urethra as well so avoid acidic things that can make your urine burn. Sylk, Replens or Multi Gyn Actigel are great for helping the burning and discomfort.
Feeling slightly depressed is also normal - hormonal fluctations can affect mood and this should settle with HRT treatment. Go with info printed out from this site plus your symptoms and questions written out so you can get the best of your appointment with the GP. Good luck DG x
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Dear DG,
Your message helps me to understand my situation. Thank you very much. Apparently I do need to see a specialist about haemochromatosis as my iron level in blood is high. Also they found that I have three small fibroids in uterus but apprently not concerning. I will try to get the cream you recommended for burning and be careful with eating habits and washing with no perfumed or chemical stuff. You are the best From Mimu xx
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mimumonschein - fibroids can cause this type of problematic bleeding and in fact the Mirena is often put forward as an option as it can, and often does, shrink fibroids.
Do seek some specialist advice over everything if you can. I don't know whether you have mentioned your age? We all understand how difficult the peri meno stage can be - fluctuating hormones can be awful.
do keep us posted about your progress. DG x
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Hi dancing queen,
I am not a dancer but I used to do a lot of latin. I bought REPLENS last night. This is to apply inside but is there a cream just to apply not so deep inside? I am going back my GP and gynaecologist to control my bleeding. I'm 55 years old and starting to understand about the changes. Most important is that I have to keep my spirit high. I will keep posting my conditions here. Thank you very much.
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mimumonsschein - I like to use Sylk (I buy this online) as it is moisturising and you simply use a small amount on the end of your finger and apply up inside a bit and around the outside of the vagina. Sylk is made from natural ingredients, has a natural scent that is pleasant but is the only thing that doesn't irritate. I use it at least once a day usually after showering or washing - I also use Vagifem. Regular use of Vagifem helps to keep the skin healthy around the vagina (less likely to itch and burn) and can also improve bladder problems.
I have tried Replens and it was good but very expensive - it was also a bit messy for me and the benefits didn't last.
When I am aware that I may have a bit of infection emerging, I then use some Multi Gyn Actigel (I buy this online) as this will rebalance the vaginal flora and fight the infection - this will be a bit like the Trophigil you were given before, only a bit more effective.
We are here to support you and we really understand how the mood can drop with all these meno symptoms, so keep posting. DG x
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Hi DG, I have a period now and I have a small rash there and it's burning. I can feel little spots which are sore but every time I go to GP, They don't take it seriously because they are invisible. I really would like to go to the dermatologist and they must be able to see. Would it help to give me medication ? Or they give me the same kind of cream.... what is the best cream for the sore skin down there? What you suggested don't seem to help. My GP doesn't help me at all. I also need to go to the blood specialist because the high iron level in blood. Please advise me. Thank you, Mimu
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Oh Mimu - I am not an expert on all these things - my advice to you has been based on my own experience with these problems. Has your GP actually examined you when you have had this rash? Where are the spots? Are these spots like little blisters that heal up within a few days or just little lumps that are tender? Are they always in the same place? If you are generally sore then the Vagifem and vaginal moisturisers are the best option but it takes time for these treatments to take effect - there are no instant treatments.
You say you have a period but in your previous posts you said you are bleeding all the time - what has your GP or gynae advised about this constant bleeding?
If you can see your gynae soon, then he/she is the one to advice about the bleeding and this rash.
Keep us posted DG x
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Hi DG, my bleeding is slightly better. I am just waiting for the result of my blood test. The iron level was high and I might have to go to the specialist.
I had a feeling that I have a thrush so I bought the canestan test kit and of course I have a thrush now. So is it normal to have Thrush most of the time in menopause as well? And I need to get this under control with Anti-biotics? Thank you, Mimu xx
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minimumonschein - thrush doesn't need antibiotics - in fact antibiotics will often cause thrush. If you have bacterial vaginitis then that sometimes requires antibiotics but the infection can easily return if the flora balance is wrong in the vaginal area. If you do have thrush then the over the counter Caneston treatment is all you need.
Using vaginal moisturisers and vaginal oestrogen can help prevent thrush and BV from developing in menopause. If you have been bleeding a lot then this will certainly create an environment where thrush and BV can develop so getting the bleeding under control and using Multi Gyn Actigel and/or Sylk together with Vagifem will help. Don't wash the vaginal area with scented products, don't wear tight trousers and eat plenty of yogurt to keep the gut flora healthy as this will help the flora in the vaginal area as well I think.
Looking after the ‘lady bits' in menopause is an ongoing challenge - I find using Sylk everyday really helps. DG x
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Hi mimumonschein
You might find this interesting reading as it identifies a link between vulval itching etc. and a high level of iron in the blood. Once you get this under control you may well find that the vaginal symptoms disappear http://ir.uiowa.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1253&context=pog
It specifically says this
"identified 3 case reports with
generalized pruritus as the major
symptom prior to diagnosis of
hematochromatosis on a Pub Med
search.2-4 To our knowledge this is the
only report where localized vulvar
pruritus has been the presenting
complaint prior to the evaluation and
diagnosis of hemochromatosis. Rather,
we were anticipating iron deficiency
anemia as a possible systemic etiology
for her persistent pruritus.1 As noted
with the prior case reports, the temporal
improvement in symptoms after near
normalization of her serum iron and
ferritin levels suggest that the pruritus
was primarily due to the underlying
hematochromatosis.3,4 Thus, these
cases demonstrate how extremes of
serum iron levels may correspond with
vulvar itching and irritation"
Taz x
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Thank you Taz2. I have been tested for iron level again but my GP would not send me to the specialist...
DG, the canestan test was positive and symptom is trichomoniasis??
But I have been tested negative for STI twice since August and I haven't had a sex as my condition is worrying. I'm going to another gynaecologist on Wednesday. To be honest I don't know what more tea I need... gynaecologist don't do thrush test or STI? I am going to walk in Gum clinic again but I'm quite fed up now. Nights are horrible...
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Having certain bacteria present in your vaginal area is very common and many women will be walking around with this with few, if any, symptoms. Bacteria from our gut will often cause this as we women are not designed very well - our anus is too close to the vagina. Eating lots of yogurt is thought help as it improve the positive bacteria in our gut - you can also use some plain yogurt for the vagina as well!!!!
When I had tests done at a GUM clinic many years ago they told me I had a bacteria present but said they don't bother to treat this as it is common for these bacterias to come and go. When meno hits the lack of oestrogen makes the whole area more sensitive and less able to fight infection. If I'm aware that I have a bit of infection then I use lots of Multi Gyn Actigel which is designed to treat and prevent vaginal infections. Maintaining a healthy environment with local oestrogen and vaginal moisturiser will make everything more comfortable and less prone to infection. Dg x
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DG,
I have been prescribed metronidazole for 7 days for BV. Can I mix it with taking duphaston (dydrogesterone) 10mg?
Sorry, this is a kind of question I should have asked the doctor but I did tell her I'm taking dupaston Duphaston tablets 10mg (contain dydrogesterone, a synthetic progesterone, used to treat a variety of conditions resulting from a lack of endogenous). This helped me that I'm not bleeding all the time. And today I've been diagnosed with BV. (Not thrush or no STI)
I am always grateful for your advice.
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mimumonschein - I'm sure it's fine to take both. Where do you live? Duphaston isn't available in the UK any more unfortunately!!! Dydrogesterone is only available as part of a combined HRT called Femoston - it is a good progesterone as it is kinder and well tolerated by many women.
Eat lots of live yogurt - I assume Metronidazole is an antibiotic and you need to restore the flora balance in your gut after taking this. DG x
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Thank you DG. Yes I think Duphaston is great. I live in London but my friends are French so I went to a private gynaecologist at "Medicare France". I cannot pay a private gynaecologist anymore I still have the Duphaston treatment is for three months. DG, which live Yoghurt is the best? I do need to fight against BV after I finished the antibiotics course with metronidazole. And any other food against BV? Do you believe in holistic treatment or natural herbal treatment? Do you take any supplement? I appreciate for your advise. You are better than some doctors.. Mimu xx
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mimumonschein - I have tried just about every herbal or alternative remedy there is for reducing meno symptoms and I haven't found anything that works. Good diet, lots of brisk walking and plenty of relaxation are the best alternatives.
I am now 60 and do take some supplements e.g. calcium, Vitamin D, Omega 3 and Magnesium and, when I feel I need it, I take an Iron supplement.
Any natural yogurt will help the gut and give a good amount of calcium as well - we do need to look after our bones. Cut out as much sugar in your diet as you can and reduce caffein. Vitamin D deficiency is very common ( non of us get enough sunshine) so supplementation is now recommended throughout winter - lack of Vitamin D will result in low energy, low mood, aching joints and many other things.
Make sure you clean really well after opening your bowels - most BV will be caused by bacteria coming from your poo. As I mentioned before - using vaginal moisturisers helps to prevent bacteria taking hold.
Good luck Dg x
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Yes I do agree with you. I don't think any herbal remedy will help the menopause symptom. I'm lucky that I don't have more horrible symptoms like hot flush. Hormones just play with us. BV is horrible enough that I don't feel so attractive anymore. I have a hypertension and I'm taking medications since more than 10 years. I asked my mum and she didn't even know what menopause was. Lucky her.
I didn't know that the bacteria comes from my anus area. I have sometimes itchy bum as well. Multi-gym actigel prevents having BV? It's just so awful having the itchy and burning sensation all the time for 4 months now. I feel like the antibiotics are helping now but I know it will be the same as soon as I stop taking the medication. I'm scared.
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I still believe that your problem is linked to the high iron levels. It is one of the symptoms - vaginal problems. If you do have haemochromatosis it is vital that you are referred to a specialist for urgent treatment. Your heart and liver can be damaged by too much iron. Don't be fobbed off by your doctor - this needs sorting before you become really ill.
Taz x :hug:
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Thank you Taz. I have been tested again and my iron level was normal. Also blood count and liver related. I will then regularly check with the blood test. I do have a feeling that my problem with BV will go on so I must keep eye on it. But for the moment they cannot do any treatment. One thing they are going to check is that I will have a test with a camera to see where three fibroids are. They may be causing problem, too. Mimu
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It's good that your level is now ok. I do hope that you feel better soon.
Taz x :)
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Thank you Taz. I do appreciate your concerns.
DG, I an taking metronidazole for BV. This medication for trichomoniasis?? But the doctor who gave me this medication said I'm negative for trichomoniasis. My swap test was slightly positive for BV, so she is trying out this medication. The itchiy and burning symptom is better but somehow I know that it's not gone.... I am going to use Multi-Gyn Actigel if it needs to be. Is it the best cream? I have a feeling that my vaginal skin is becoming chronically sensitive. Does it help to go to the dermatologist and do the biopsy? Does antihistamine helps? Thing is that you cannot see anything down there.... ahhh help. I don't think I'm imaging it though. Thanks Mimu xx
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mimumonschein
Looking back over your posts, you described having continuous bleeding for some time - I think this constant bleeding may have started your current problems. The vaginal area and skin needs natural secretions and enough oestrogen to remain healthy and you may have had BV on and off for some time due to this constant bleeding.
The antibiotic you have been given will possibly be a standard one for any infection within the BV range so I wouldn't worry about this. I think I suffered with BV for some time before I realised that it was the imbalance of my vaginal flora that was probably causing my vaginal issues.
I have found that Multi Gyn Actigel is very good at treating and preventing BV and I use this at the first sign of the itching or burning which indicates I might have an imbalance.
Finding the treatments that work for you is trial and error but constantly using ABs is not good. I would certainly recommend you ask you GP for Vagifem local oestrogen and use this as prescribed to help restore and maintain your vaginal area. I would also recommend you buy Sylk vaginal moisturiser as I find this brilliant at keeping things moist and comfortable on a daily basis. DG x
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Thank you, DG.
I do agree with you. Now I stopped bleeding but I developed BV symptom. I won't take antibiotics anymore after I finish this course. Also more cream I put it gets worse. I bought Sylk but it didn't really help as I don't really have a problem being dry. I am eating live yoghurt etc... my vaginal area is usually quite moist so I don't know if I am lacking Oestrogen.
Do you use Multi Gyn Actigel as moisturiser? I have seen Multi Gyn flora plus and also capsules .. do you think they help? Does GP prescribe Vagifem? I asked one NHS gynaecologist but she refused to give me Vagifem and just gave me a shower gel for psoriasis..... How do I know that I'm really lacking of Oestrogen if it's not dry around vaginal area? I have noticed that too much washing is bad too. It feels like my vaginal skin is irritated from so many different creams and medications. I am really quite ready to go to my friend's recommended gynaecologist in Paris. I have heard they are advanced in those issues. But No, it must be possible to treat my condition in England, too. I have been reading reports about women having BV for years. Does it stop one day? I am not in a relationship st the moment but it seems like I will never have a partner with my condition like this. :'( Mimu
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mimuminschein
I am not an expert on these things - I can only speak from my own experience. I have heard that the French are a bit ahead of us here tin eh Uk when it comes to treating menopause symptoms but you should be able to get the same type of treatment in the UK - it's just that most GPs and even gynaecologists are tn' very clued up about this type of problem.
There must be so many reason why one gets discomfort around eh vaginal area - mine is particularly related to my urethra which often burns but I also get general itching and soreness elsewhere. Over the many years I have suffered from this - I am 60 now and it problem started in my early 40s!!) I have devised various strategies that help to control the problems and I have told you all the ways I find works for me.
I wouldn't use Multi Gyn Actigel all the time (it is quite acidic but is effective for killing bacteria) and Sylk is fro a bit of lubrication and moisturisation.
It's the regime of using the Vagifem and Sylk regularly, avoiding scented products, drinking more water and far less caffein, emptying the bladder properly each time and cleaning well after opening the bowels etc. that help to reduce the chance of BV and other infections emerging and keeping everything generally more comfortable.
If I remember rightly, you are already in the your mid 50s, so must be coming towards the end of your peri meno phase so oestrogen will be dropping. Oestrogen deficiency does play havoc with our whole urogenital area and managing this can be difficult.
I don't know what else to advice at this stage - except try the Multi Gyn Actigel daily( as per instructions) for a couple of weeks - I like to use the tube with an attachment that allows you to squirt some up inside - then perhaps use this once a day 2-3 times a week as maintenance. Use Sylk after every shower and if things start to become dry then ask for Vagifem. Keep your regime for the ‘lady bit's simple and pure.
If, like so many of us, you are carrying a bit too much weight, then changing your diet and loosing some weight together with some good exercise like brisk walking - then this should help your blood pressure and also help to keep the gut and flora balance in your body more healthy. DG xxx