Menopause Matters Forum
General Discussion => New Members => Topic started by: Optimist on November 12, 2016, 07:27:00 AM
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Hi all, I'm new to the site, posting as a new member but have been browsing now for quite a while. Fab site.
Please could anyone give me any advice as I'm feeling slightly mad with it all!
I'm peri (likely have been for years) but earlier this year, following 4 months period free I got terrible night sweats & hot flushes. I also have had a bad back for a year and recently started to get knuckle pain in the mornings. I was started on elleste duet 1mg, had been prescribed hrt reluctantly by very young gp. I was prior to hrt taking black cohosh & St. John's wort which was working very well sleep wise, no more hot flushes or night sweats. I asked to try hrt for mood swings and back and joint pain.
Joint pain and bad back gone within the first week, I felt amazing but then noticed I wasn't sleeping well on the oestrogen, night sweats returned then onto the progesterone! Omg tearful, mood swings from hell, 1st month bled for whole 12 days on it. Advised to keep trying to get in my stystem which I did but still not sleeping on oestrogen waking 4+ times to go to the loo (already been on oxybutinin for 5+ years) & an absolute nightmare after 10 days on progesterone again (very aggressive violent flashes of anger, tearful etc).
Spoke to gp in tears and she said she'd leave me another prescription to pick up after researching as I'm likely reacting to the pro part of the hrt. Picked up prescription and she's given me horse urine?! Prempak-c 0.625. I feel sick reading up on these as the way the urine is extracted from the pregnant horses is horrific.
What do I do??
Do I tell her what to prescribe me?? Was thinking patches and utrogestan? Or do I ask to try Femostan as least progesterone derived?? Help please, I'm very tearful and can't talk to anyone about it.
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I hated Prempak - I'd ask for Femoston 1/10 first as this is easy for the GP to prescribe and find in the book - most GPs don't know what Utrogestan is!!!. If Femoston doesn't suit you then try the separate oestrogen with Utrogestan but you'll need to print things out from this site to show them. Do look under treatments and print stuff out anyway to show the GP if necessary. It's trial and ego till you find the right HRT - Femoston is a very popular one as it suits many women very well. Problems with the bladder are a common meno symptom and HRt should help but you may also need local oestrogen as well - ask for Vagifem. Good luck. DG x
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Thank you, it's good to know there are other ladies out here who know what I'm going through and have trialled these medicines.
I'm getting to the stage where I feel my Gp will think, oh not, her again!
Think I will go for the Femoston as reading around the forum a lot of ladies appear to tolerate this.
I will print out the treatment pages, thanks for the tip.
I feel bloated a lot of the time also and appear to be putting on weight around my middle at a fast rate! Another hrt side effect no doubt?
I will get this sorted...... :)
Thank you for taking the time to reply.
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Gaining weight around the middle is a meno symptom not really to do with HRT. We all need to eat a lot less when the meno hits I'm afraid. Good luck DG x
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Hi Optimist
:welcomemm: - I do love your name :)
Sorry to hear about your problems with HRT and I agree with Dancinggirl and what you yourself feel re Prempak and Femoston, the latter which is the oral preparation in tablet HRT most like our own progesterone and the least testosterone derived.
You haven't said how old you are - but your worsening symptoms may also be that you need a higher dose if you are young especially. Also if you don't absorb the tablet HRT well then yes you might find your symptoms improve better on patch HRT and maybe also utrogestan. The other thing is that you will still expect to get normal pms taking cyclical HRT as your body adjusts to the progestogen and then stopping it, but you should feel better overall on it than off it. If not - it's the wrong type! You should give it 3 months though to allow the body to adjust.
Good luck and let us know how you get on :)
Hurdity x
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Thank you both, going back to the GP tomorrow to ask for femoston.
I'm almost 51....how did that happen ;D
I will give this one 3 months if progesterone part okay and hopefully that will do it!
Thank god for this forum is all I can say !!
Happy Sunday all.
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Hi Optimist
A lot of doctors start with elleste duet - it does the job well (provides oestrogen and norithisterone is very effective at protecting endometrium)suits a lot of people and it is cheap, so it is encouraged ;) (It is similar to when they start people on COC these days and give them microgynon).
If it does not fit you, then you need to change something. It is customary to change one thing at a time, so that you know what is working and what is not. If you change lots of things together, then you will never know for sure what is working :bouncing: So what you do is change the progestogen, if you are having progestogen problems, let it settle for 3 months, then change the oestrogen/increase the oestrogen when you have oestrogen problems or not enough (or vice versa) until you get it right. :)
If you look above at Treatments/hrt preparations/ for perimenopause, you will see that elleste duet 1/10 is estrodiol and norithisterone and low dose, whereas prempak is conjugated estrogens, medium dose and norgestrel. So that is three changes all at once :o
So yes - go back to the GP and ask for Femoston 1/10.
If this is ok and the symptoms go away then come back again, then you may need to try a higher dose.
Hope it goes well with the doctor. Someone needs to write a blog on 'How to go back to your doctor and ask for the right thing, if you think s/he has got it wrong' :-\
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Excellent post dahliagirl - sound advice and so logical. DG x
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Thanks for the excellent advice, I'm so glad I found this forum.
I spoke to a male GP on the phone who actually knew more about HRT than the 2 women GPs I've seen!
Dhalia I wish I'd seen your post first as he's prescribed me Femseven sequi patches which has the Norgesterol progesterone. But is this what you meant as it's the same oestrogen as elleste duet but different progesterone. I'm feeling hopeful that the patches will work better for me. When I gave the prempak back to the pharmacist she was gobsmacked that they use pregnant mares for the conjugated oestradol ! (As was I).
I'll keep you posted with progress. I'm at the end of week 1 oestrogen tomorrow so thinking I should start week2 with the new patch as can't bear the thought of reacting so badly to the progesterone again if I finish the month out on elleste duet!
Is this okay?
Keep up the good work you're all doing by posting so well on here. Thank you 😊
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Ps meant to say, the GP said he couldn't prescribe femoston as not available in Uk. Guess this is a world wide forum?
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Femoston is a standard HRT available in the UK - the GP needs to have a proper look in his drug book!!!!
There is a UK version of this site which show the HRts available in the UK and there is a USA version that shows the HRTs avail be in America.
If you do need to try something different then you can print out the list from this site to show the GP:
http://www.menopausematters.co.uk/perimeno.php
You can probably just switch straight to the patches - the progesterone in these Femsevern is levonorgestrel and this might suit you better. It is join to be trial and error I'm afraid till you find one that suits you.
Hope you get on well with the patches - keep us posted. DG x
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Yes Femoston is available - I take it.
The patches have benefits over taking pills as they do not pass through the liver. Hope it goes well.
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Yes Optimist it would be fine to change straight over to the oestrogen patch from the oestrogen tablet - in fact is better to change now as you are then just changing one thing at once - but does mean that you will only do a week of the oestrogen patches before changing over to the combi ones - otherwise you will be out if sync with your cycle (that is if you have one). If you are sure your cycle has more or less gone (ie you are very late peri- or post-meno) then you could just start the whole thing from the beginning with the Femseven, and do two weeks oestrogen alone and then swap to the combi patches as per the packet. Depending on what your womb lining is doing though that would mean an extra week of oestrogen - which could make the bleed a little heavier - although this should all settle down after a few months....
Let us know how you get on !
Hurdity x
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Just a lone voice in the wilderness putting the case for prempac. I was on premique as it was the only hrt I could cope with. Despite its bad press, the prem* type hrts can be tolerated by a lot of women and they have been around forever which proves they are efficacious. Not saying that I agree with the method of production, but needs must etc.
Bramble
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Absolutely Bramble - finding a HRT that suits you is very important and if the Prempak/Premique HRTs were not OK to use then they wouldn't be on the market.
So many on this site rave about Utrogestan as the safest and most natural progesterone to use, however, my experience of using Utro was not particularly good and certainly more problematic than most other progesterones. This is why I always say we shouldn't undermine the type of HRT a women is prescribed by their doctors unless of course it is the wrong regime i.e. a peri meno women has been given a conti HRT. DG x
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Regarding different types of HRT - yes I agree we need to respect the type of HRT that women have been prescribed, but in many cases women come on here asking what are others thoughts and experiences of this, or with side effects - so that's when different thoughts come in.
Yes it is a question of what suits different women and if you are only going to use HRT for 5 years and you are under 60 - then yes just go for whichever helps you the best. If you are looking to take it when you are older or long term then other considerations come into play - which HRT has the lowest risk profile - and this is where research so far is favourable towards progesterone (Utrogestan) rather than synthetics and a transdermal route. Therefore women may well be prepared to put up with some adverse side effects for the sake of decreasing risk to long term health. Certainly that has always been the case for me - I have no idea whether I would tolerate other HRT types better - in fact I might get no side effects from Femoston or Provera - but as I am in my 60's and have been taking HRT for nearly 10 years - i do want to minimise cancer risk ( which of course is also down to lifestyle factors and genetics).
Again it is a case of there not being a blanket recommendation - although I doubt you will get many gynaecologists prescribing any of the PREM type HRT types - notwithstanding that they have been around for a long time!
Hurdity x
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Good points Hurdity. Just wanted to reassure Bramble. DG x
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:) xx
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Hi all, on day 7 of the oestrogen patch and today I have to change to the progesterone/oestrogen patch. Had to use 2nd patch as had a spa day for bday and patch was coming off after day 3, other than that feeling okay so far on oestrogen have been sleeping well, but waking early (approx 6 hours sleep) but not feeling too tired in daytime, hoping this will get better with continued use, only waking once to go to toilet....bonus! Bit worried about the progesterone but will see how it goes and let you know. My GP is ringing me today at 9am as would have been reviewing the 3 months on elleste duet, she didn't prescribe the patches, a male GP did after I'd refused the prempak. (I'm glad that works for some, I really wasn't in a good enough place to take it due to how the urine is harvested). I definitely feel better overall after a week on the patch, maybe as it's a slightly higher medium dose, nervous about the patches not sticking too well after a few days, have been putting on my buttock under my underwear to avoid rubbing etc, does anyone have any tips re this? Thanks for keeping this thread going, it's great to have all this advice x
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Hi - I haven't had patches, but I understand that the femseven are more likely to fall off. People make sure their skin is thoroughly dry and the patch thoroughly warmed to make sure they stick well in the first place. I have even heard of people using hairdryers.
The other combined patch available has norethisterone, like the elleste so probably best to get these to work.
I would like to try patches/transdermal, but no luck with the practice nurse so far ::) They are less likely to kill your libido ;)
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Hi Optimist - re the patches - I have always put them on butt cheek as the best place to avoid rubbing and keeping hidden. Also avoid knicker line, low waistbands of jeans etc. However I use Estradot which are tiny so easier to keep hidden. I have also heard that with Femseven but if they were no good they would not be still on the market.... I echo dahliagirl's advice - make sure the skin is clean and dry without any products and keep in place with warm hand for 30 secs. With mine I periodically have a quick feel to make sure it is still in place and to restick any edges that might have come loose. If you have to change them a bit more often then once a week then you might have to get an extra box but I can see this might be tricky in terms of the combi part! Anyway glad they seem to be working in terms of symptoms - long may this last :)
Hurdity x
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Hi Optomist
I am also new to the site - but just to let you know Femostan is available here- and I live in the country!!! however, in my local chemist was only available in tablets not in patches
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Thanks ladies. I'll persevere as so far feeling good and slept very well last night. I've been applying after drying well and hold on for at least a minute. It's the edges that seem to come a little unstuck after I've been to the gym, catching on clothes, so I suppose it's a case of checking like you've said and resticking. I saw that someone used Tegaderm a plaster over the top, so could get a stock of those in, just in case & apply towards end of week. It's great not having to take another tablet every morning. I will keep you posted as if these work hoping I've cracked it...😊 Only on day 2 of progesterone patch so early days yet.
Have been doing my mindfulness morn and eve also (great little app, "stop, breathe & think") would recommend. Thank you for your comments and good luck all.
Ps my partner checked out this site...he said he's had his eyes opened to what some have to go through! He didn't understand completely but had a good insight now 😉X
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Hi Dancinggirl
Just read your post which I found interesting. I read the posts on the forums quite often, I always feel I am on the wrong type of HRT and worry that it is harmful and then feel like coming off the site with all the negative comments.
I have tried the gel and utrogestan, but couldn't get on with that regime. As you say different things suit different people.
xx
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On 2nd week of progesterone/eostrogen patch and feel so "flat", it's like I've forgone the ability to smile/feel happy/sad/attractive etc.!I'm wondering if I'm ever going to get this right. Absolutely no libido either which was actually okay on the tablets. The oestrogen only patch was okay, I was sleeping again! Just seem to react badly to the progesterone. Have been reading that some people cut the patches in half, can anyone recommend this if I was just to do this On the progesterone phase to see if it reduced feeling so low? Feel I need the oestrogen though to reduce joint pain so I'll be getting less of this if I cut the patch in half. Have also bought some tegaderm today and applied it over another patch I had to put on as the edges lifted water got in. It's bubbled!?! Not sure if it's the tegaderm or the patch that's bubbled can't see it well enough as it's in my butt! Any advice anyone please...starting to feel wretched again 😳
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Hi there
It's probably not a good idea to tape down the patch because as you say if the patch comes away underneath the tape you can't tell! Really best to just use it as it is but I know Femseven sometimes don't stick so well - so others have reported. Also if you cut the progestogen patch you may well not be getting enough to protect your uterus. Progesterone and the synthetics do have a dampening and/or sedative effect - some women get depressed on this stage too, or excessively tired. The only other alternative is to take separate progesterone and oestrogen because then at least you only take progestogens for 12 days per cycle and depending on how your bleed goes you might be able to reduce this slightly with the OK from your doc or perhaps lengthen your overall cycle as you become post-menopausal. You may well find that your body acclimatises to this progestogen and it is usually advised to wait 3 months before deciding whether or not it suits you.
Hope you are feeling better today :)
Hurdity x
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Not getting on well at all on the progesterone. Have had to use 4 patches also so far and only on 2nd week. Have started waking again at night, feel so down. Don't want my partner anywhere near me, haven't felt like this in a while. They just won't stay on either, exercising to try feel better/sleep or showering and the patch just lifts. I will persevere but already anxious about Christmas as know I'll be back on progesterone patch and dreading feeling so low. I have my brother and family coming up. I'm going to keep going on these but ask for a referral to the menopause clinic. Will also need some more patches, not sure what GP will say to that.
Sorry I'm moaning I know....just feel horribly flat and my day is only just starting.
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Get them really warmed up before you put them on, then try a hair dryer on low, to make sure once it is on, then press until it cools (2mins). Before you give up on them.
I never had any problems with levenorgestrel - used it for years in Ovranette. But it did make me spotty.
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Do not despair! Keep trying - and if they really don't stick then there is always Estradot which are really tiny and stick well - but the downside is you need a separate progestogen which does not come transdermally - unless you take the Utrogestan ( Progesterone) vaginally.
Hurdity x
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Thanks ladies, have been resticking this one down. Had a mini meltdown this morn and had to return from driving to work. Crying irrationally, didn't sleep well again. This is so not me and I can only think it's the progesterone. Only upside is that I will be switching to oestrogen tomorrow which I felt good on when starting the patches. I didn't realise you could get vaginal utrogeston Hurdity. Maybe that's another option to try with the estrodot patches (maybe they will stick better as smaller). Thanks ladies...hope to God I feel more like myself soon x
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Hi Optimist - just to say the Utrogestan (for use as part of HRT) is exactly the same (now only available as 100 mg capsules) whether taken orally or vaginally (the latter off licence). The vaginal capsules are available for fertility purposes and come as 200 mg - but are exactly the same! Many women just opt to use them vaginally and sometimes without telling their doc! There is no danger in this because more progesterone gets to your uterus than taken orally so not putting the endometrium at risk, unlike deciding on a shorter course of prog which would need checking.
Hope you feel better soon :)
Hurdity x
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Hi all, hope you are looking forward to Christmas.
Just an update and advice please if possible...on 4th week of patches (still using the Femseven) on oestrogen after the progesterone phase and felt so much more lively after stopping the progesterone one. No tears, but...haven't had a period. On day 5 oestrogen and on the tablets bled at the end of progesterone. I also have really bad back pain again and the knuckles on my right hand painful again.(this disappeared completely on the tablets). Have been sleeping well but tired a lot. Can only think that as I started on week 2 of oestrogen phase (having swapped from tablets) that maybe the patches will take longer to completely get into my system? Not sure how they work really.
I have another week on the oestrogen patch before swapping to prog again. The GP switched my patches to Everol sequi due to my meltdown on the levonorgestrel progesterone in Femseven but I've not started them yet. Was going to switch on Friday when due a change of patch, these are also twice weekly so may stick better.
TBH she said if these don't work to come off hrt altogether for a while and a menopause clinic referral will be done. I'm really going to try give these the full 3 months as I realise I've not been giving any one type a proper go but I just react so badly to the progesterone that my mind does t feel like it belongs to me.
Sorry long post...hope others are getting on well with whatever they're trialling 😊Xx
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Yes do give them the full 3 months before deciding! However if these don't work it may be that the combo type of patches do not suit you. Many of us on here have separate oestrogen patches (or gel) and progesterone - either Utrogestan or Provera - which means you take the progestogen for slightly fewer days and can also increase the oestrogen a little more if necessary without having to increase the protgestogen - as long as it is taken for the correct number of days.
Hurdity x
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Hi there, nearly Christmas!! :) :D :)
Just an update really...still not feeling great. On 2nd week of oestrogen (everol sequi patch since Friday), will be starting the progesterone patch this Friday and have to say dreading it! Hope I don't feel like a zombie again, even thinking I will put up with the irrational mood swings if I just feel like I've got a bit of life. Have had a headache everyday for the last 10 days so thinking it's my body getting used to the slight increase of oestrogen?
I am going to try my best to persevere the whole 3 months on patches but would really like to see some changes if I'm to stay on it...sure I read that the correct hrt is supposed to make you feel better not worse...??
Have a good week all...have recommended my mate and my sister to this brilliant forum xx
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Would anyone know why I'm getting back, neck and right hand knuckle pain again on the patches (was Femseven sequi now everol sequi same on both)? The patches dose of oestrogen is slightly higher than the tablets I was on (elleste duet 1mg) but I had no joint pain whatsoever which was part of the reason I've persevered with the hrt. Would anyone have any answers I'm losing the will to carry on with hrt especially as nearly back onto the progesterone patches which bring really bad pms side effects. Thank you in anticipation ☺️
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Sorry to hear you are still not feeling so good. I can't explain why you are getting joint pains - HRT usually helps with this as low oestrogen is one of the causes. However underactive thryoid I understand is also a cause and also various vitamin deficiencies. It could just be a coincidence and not at all due to the HRT. Try to be as positive as you can about HRT and concentrate on the fact that it will eventually make you feel much better - and think about enjoying your Christmas preparations and the festive season to come, if you can :).
Hurdity x
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Thanks Hurdity. I know I need to be more positive and I shall certainly try. Last day at work tomorrow until 3rd Jan so feeling a bit more "optimistic". Think maybe I've been expecting too much too soon. My bloods have always been okay as far as I'm aware and take lots of vitamins too. Think maybe I'm entering into pms zone early as I've missed a period so hopefully will feel bit better soon...
I'm going to shut up now as feel I'm constantly moaning but thank you for listening and helping me out with your advice. Have a fantastic Christmas 🎅🏼🎄🎁 x
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Yes you have a good Christmas too - and don't ever worry about moaning - that's what this forum is for - so we can offload to other like-minded and sympathetic women without bending the ears of our nearest and dearest. After all we can turn each other off with a click and we're logged out if we've had enough - which you can't do with friends and family ;D
Hurdity x
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Do you know your vit D status?
I have terrible pain in my neck and shoulders, hands and feet and hips too when mine goes low - in fact if I do not take the tablets for a couple of weeks. At one point, I was going to bed early because it hurt to hold my head up. It might be worth getting a pack of 25 microgram/1000 IU D3 ones to see if helps (usually about 1month - 6 weeks). My friend has been taking some liquid capsules and found them more helpful than the tablets.
I found the pain got worse with my first hrt (elleste) and I changed. But with hindsight, I do wonder if the hormones are making some of the cells in your body work again and you are using up the free vitD that is available in the blood. Anyway, it is worth a punt as you usually need more than you think and this is the time of the year for low vit D levels.
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Hi Optimist :)
One of my low oestrogen symptoms was diagnosed as 'menopausal arthritis' - pain in my thumbs/index fingers, wrist, elbow, hips, knee and big toes relieved by HRT. However, one of the signs that my HRT dose is too high is lower back pain ::)
It seems like a constant juggling act to get the dose right but keep at it and you'll get there. X
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Thanks Dahliagirl and salad...love the names😊 Really interesting re the vit D and the higher oestrogen as the elleste I was on was 1mg but the Everol Sequi are 1.25mg I believe, so higher and since I've been on the patches that's when my aches and pains have returned.
I'll get some vit d gel capsules to try as I'm a firm believer in herbal supplements and vitamins. Have woken at 4am...wide awake! Switching to the progesterone patch today and feeling a little apprehensive but got lots to look forward to as family coming up today for Christmas.
Started running again yesterday also as not done any exercise for few weeks due to back pain again but trying to overcome that and as for poor fella...I appear to have gone right off him again but hoping that's the hormonal changes as I go through this emotional roller coaster.
Have a good Christmas 🎄 and thanks for helping out with your advice xx
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Update and really hope I'm not jinxing myself here but.......day 7 of progesterone/oestrogen patch and feel marvellous!
After switching from femseven sequi (wouldn't stick, horrible depression/no libido) changed to everol sequi patches (they stick really well) now just coming up to 2nd week of norethisterone progesterone patch and libido back, no low mood, no erratic moods so far (horrendous on tablet form of same progesterone). Had some cramping yesterday as missed a period on femseven sequi so hoping ?! I'll get a bleed at end of next week but certainly won't be upset if I don't!
Not so positive... really dry skin since switching to patches even though slightly higher dose of oestrogen, bad on hands, hair really dry also and getting knuckle/joint pain again but back ache seems to have cleared! On the tablets my skin/hair felt lovely, can anyone suggest anything for that? Do I need higher oestrogen?
Also getting quite vivid dreams and waking bit more on progesterone but hoping this will settle? Will just say I'm off work for the holidays so much more relaxed maybe this is helping with the side effects of the progesterone.
Also just bought some vit D3 as suggested so starting to take that to see if helps :)
Hope you all had a lovely Christmas xx
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Optimist - central heating and cold winds tend to really dry the skin out at this time of year - HRT can't really sort this. My skin seems to drink moisturisers through this time of year. Take some Omega 3 supplements or eat more oily fish to help skin hair and joints. HRT can help the skin but it can't fix everything. Pleased this new patch is working better for you. DG x
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Hi again, I appear to be having a meltdown. Feel awful day 3 of oestrogen patch and anxious, insecure, feel I'm losing my partner, can't sleep just want it to all go away. Been back at work a week, after a lovely relaxed time off over xmas. Back to feeling tired irritable and didn't want to see my partner over the weekend as felt so low. He's also started Putting the pressure on about sex again and I'm just not feeling it. Feel insecure that he's goading me to finish with him as he's had enough of this mad irrational irritable non sexual woman after 2 years of peri hell. What the hell is the matter with me? I'm tearful and can't sleep feel I've gone back after 4 months of trialling hrt to it not working at all. Joint pain on the patches worse again, been getting really hot again, not sleeping etc. Sorry I'm ranting and probably not making much sense but I feel sick to my stomach that I'm going to lose the good man I've not appreciated to all of this. Feel he's finally had enough.
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Optimist -
I really feel you are pinning all your hopes on HRT working miracles and sorting all your problems - HRT can only do so much.
Have you read Mindfulness by Mark Williams and Danny Penman? You are tying yourself in knots, trying to get things under control. I'm afraid in my experience it is a range of strategies that will eventually get life on an even keel.
Feeling pressured about sex is the best way to put you off wanting it. We girls often need to feel relaxed and confident to feel sexy - if you don't feel sexy and attractive then it's very difficult to enjoy sex.
Have a really good look at your lifestyle - can you build in some relaxation time into your day? Do you eat regularly ?
Do you have a good bedtime routine to ensure a better nights sleep - e.g. NO TV in the bedroom, winding down before bed with a hot shower and good book? It's often the little things that can make a big difference. Dg x
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Do agree - Rome wasn't built in a day and all that.
And there is nothing like pressure to turn you off ??? Has he read the tips for men?
Do take care and look after yourself. Good food, exercise and sleep routine. Mindfulness, or a yoga class, or regular time walking the dog out helps. It is hard to decide if things like are working if you are under pressure. It will take time - it took a while to get there.
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Hi and thanks for replying. I do mindfulness few times a day, I go to the gym, run, walk etc. I've got a very stressful job that I'm trying to get under control. Always eaten well, very healthily. I'm getting hot flushes again which I hadn't had to date since trialling hrt, very anxious which isn't helping with the bf situ I suppose. I've not suffered with anxiety before and wonder why this is starting now. I've had a little bit of very light period last night then nothing again just bloated period type pains which I've never suffered with before. Just trying to work out in my head if I've been worse on hrt or not. Not sure what's the matter with me at the moment, not been like this before usually get on with whatever life throws at me. Feel sick to my stomach a lot at the moment. Hoping it will pass. I'm persevering and get what your saying re pinning all my hopes on hrt but thought you were supposed to feel better on it? I've never felt so crap tbh. Sure it'll pass. Thanks for listening and hope you're all okay x
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Just been reading some posts and wondering if I'm reacting to "coming off" the progesterone phase, as this time last month I had a mini meltdown on way to work and had to come home. Seems to be same time day 5 on oestrogen after progesterone? Anyone know if this is possible? Would be good to know I'm not completely bonkers 😊 X
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It may well that you have a reaction to the progesterone withdrawal still after 5 days - the synthetic progestogens stay around in the body for longer than progesterone itself. Provided you feel better again a couple of days later then it is likely to be that I should think - if it occurs at the same time in the cycle.
Hurdity x
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Thanks Hurdity, it's been an eye opener as started feeling much better again Tuesday day 5/6 on oestrogen. Feel really good still, more energy, happy. Will keep a really close eye, have been keeping a bit of a diary that's how I realised was same time. At least knowing there is a reason behind the madness helps...having never really experienced this before does make you feel slightly bizarre. Thanks for replying and hope you have a good weekend 😊 X
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Hi Optimist, you hopefully are feeling better now, but your experience of melt down on the progesterone and withdrawal phase does seem to be pretty similar to mine. I've just (on doc's instruction) stopped taking the Femoston in mid pack, and my head feels mine again, and the mad moods and bloating have reduced too. I think the overlay of a fixed dose of hormones on my fluctuating hormones was too much....I'm pretty sure I'll still need HRT but its reassuring to know that I haven't actually turned into this mad blob....its the tablets! And there's 3 pounds weight disappeared in 2 days.....so when I described bloating it really was....
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Hi all, thanks KatyB...I actually am feeling better overall on the hrt now than before. I'm on my 2nd month of patches near to starting my 3rd and I feel much calmer. My mood swings have almost stopped completely which is ultimately why I started the hrt. It's been a bit of a journey trialling the different types but I'm definitely better on the patches (everol sequi) than I was the on the tablets. Even though I couldn't tolerate the tablet form of norethisterone, on the patches I actually feel better on the dual phase than just on the oestrogen. I do get withdrawal symptoms when I switch from the prog/oestrogen to just the oestrogen but I'm learning to deal with it as overall I'm better on the hrt than I was without. I realise that when I started taking the hrt I was chasing an instant fix but thank god ive listened to you lovely ladies and have given this one time. I feel it's finally working, not perfect and I'm taking vit D and other vits alongside the hrt but feel I'm getting there. I've got lots of stuff going on that I feel the hrt has probably helped me cope with, I don't get so mad, I don't get irritated, no longer tired as sleeping better and feel I have much more energy. I'm starting to really enjoy life again after so long just thinking I was a "freakin head case" as suggested by my ex husband...ps there's always a good reason they're your ex 😬 . I hope others can take some good from my posts (looking back they're so erratic, up and down!!) and give it a really good chance to get into your system and start working its magic ☺️. I fully expect some minor blips but I feel I will deal with them calmly. Have a good week all xx
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That's absolutely brilliant news Optimist!! So good to hear that overall you are feeling better and also recognising that there will still be bad days but that on balance the HRT comes out as a plus - probably something in your user name that gives a guide to your outlook too :)
Also very helpful to have posted in the same thread - some members start new threads every time there is something to report on the same original issue - but this does make it hard to advise without having to research - and we are all busy (well some of us ::) )!
Long may this work for you!
Hurdity x
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Thanks Hurdity, without you and some of the other women and their comments I would've felt I was going mad!! I have recommended this site to so many people and will continue to do so.
It's not an easy journey this transition and it's good to know there is the support we need out there.
I'll update again another time but in the meantime I'll keep popping on and reading around the site....it's brilliant 😊X
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Delighted things looking better Optimist - I'm also recommending the site around....
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Hi ladies it's been a while but wanted to say hi and ask for a bit of advice.
Big hugs firstly to all that are having a bad time...it's pants and so many are struggling, wish I had a wand!!
I've felt really settled on the everol sequi, my moods stabilised completely and I've never felt so calm and my relationship with my 16 year old and my partner had got so much better. Had a lovely holiday (only 5 days) in Tenerife with OH then started vagifem on return due to dryness and rather embarrassing "wet myself" on my jollies!! (Drying my shorts in McDonald's...yep...several in Tenerife)! I've been on oxybutinyn for 3-4 years for bladder urgency which helps but thought I'd give vagifem a go after reading up about it and how this can be affected by low oestrogen levels.
This is where my problems have begun again!
Within 3 days moody, irritable, flashes of anger... thought i'll persevere... dryness stopped, sleeping better at night as not waking for a wee! But...could not reach orgasm with very patient OH, bloated, flatulance (not pleasant)...thought I'll persevere got to week 3 when start x 2 a week after initial loading dose of nightly then very sore breasts, mood swings from hell, hate poor OH, son remarked I was being horrible so have stopped it! Oh also night sweats from hell again.
7 days off and just about to start week 2 of prog/oestrogen patch and mood has calmed completely but have had horrible bleed after practically 6 months of no period (even though on sequi) and still don't want OH near me!
Can anyone help/advise please? What's happened??? I thought I struggled with progesterone (initially) but feel better in that part of the patches than oestrogen alone. Wondering if too much oestrogen???
I have a scan of my overies Monday as consultant wanted a check post 6 months on hrt to see if longtime cysts have grown.
What if they have and the GP says I have to stop HRT?
Feel I'm at risk of pushing OH away too as I'm keeping him at arms length..this time last month couldn't get enough of him??!
Any advice would be very gratefully received from you lovely ladies. I just want to go back to how I was pre vagifem. Have been awake since 4am !!
Have a lovely day xx
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Hi - if you have had no bleed for the last six months, could it be that you were not absorbing enough progestogen from the patch? That would account for the sudden big bleed.
The vagifem does not absorb much at all and is a tiny amount of oestrogen. There is a bit more absorption at the beginning if there is a lot of atrophy until the tissues plump up. Maybe it was enough to tip the balance, but it is unlikely to have been the cause.
It all sounds very frustrating for you, expecially if things were going so well. >:(
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Thanks Dhaliagirl. It is frustrating as my doctor said that a few more months period free I could change to the combi Everol which I was looking forward to as I'm much better on the prog/oestrogen weeks of the sequi hrt.
My mood has stabilised again and I can only think its due to not having the vagifem anymore (8 days free) as there was a marked difference. Bloating has gone too but waking at around 4-5 am again every morn!
Should I be speaking to my gp if there's a chance I'm not absorbing enough progesterone?
Must admit was loving not having periods and it does say 15% don't when on sequi?