Menopause Matters Forum
General Discussion => This 'n' That => Topic started by: booboo on June 16, 2016, 04:52:07 PM
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He died 6 years ago and now he is being exposed for sexual abuse.. In these cases, I struggle to understand how a dead man can be proved guilty .. But also, if he was guilty why has it taken so long for people to come forward ..
I cant help but think there could/must potentially be many nervous men - from pop stars to tv personalities etc going back years...
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Yep. It's the way these issues are handled these days :-\. People should not be named unless proven guilty.
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I can view it from both sides in that if he /they are guilty then the victims understandably want some kind of recourse ( if that's the right word) - but also must be very difficult for the families of the exposed men...
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Just mentioned this on the Cliff Richard thread - I don't think abusers should be named if they have died. It's traumatic for the family & friends of the abuser whatever the circumstances, but if the abuser is alive, then action needs to be taken to prevent them harming anyone else. But if they have died, they are no longer a risk to anyone, so naming them serves no purpose in protecting people and only causes great pain to their families.
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A couple of things come to mind - (a) people seem to grasp at anything for a bit of scandal, these days
and (b) there's the old "sell your story to the media" thing - if it wasn't for the media, people would be left alone more, even after they've departed this world. We live in such a blame culture these days. :(
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The media has a lot to answer for ..
There is also a lot of greed & questionable motives of some..
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Can't help feeling really sorry for his widow. Surely after all these years this revelation could have waited until she had passed on.
If the alleged perpetrator is dead it's just the family that are punished, usually by the media.
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Very true breeze!
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It does seem incredibly cruel that little or no regard is given to the innocent wives,children etc of the suspects in these alleged offences.... I try to imagine how I would feel if I were in their position - it must be dreadful
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I watched the TV prog about this the other night and it did seem strange to me that CFs wife allowed their 14 year old "foster child" into bed with her and CF. She then left them alone and went off to make breakfast and the girl was abused.
I also thought her statement was very peculiar saying she was very sorry for the girls involved and hoped they would now find peace. Most women I know would say things like ..... I just cannot believe he did this, these are false accusations etc.
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I did not see that programme Pennyfarthing - but you are right! - what the wife of CF did/allowed and said, is not what I would call the norm...There are some very peculiar people about & not always just the men..
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is this saying that she was complicit or just knew and turned a blind eye? How odd :-\
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is this saying that she was complicit or just knew and turned a blind eye? How odd :-\
NO idea Babyjane but I do know if we had a teenage girl staying at our house and my OH invited her to join us in bed I would have no part of it!!
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I did not see that programme Pennyfarthing - but you are right! - what the wife of CF did/allowed and said, is not what I would call the norm
The "norm"........ :o
Not sure there is a "norm" about finding out your dead husband had been raping young girls. Perhaps she'd thought she had a good and happy marriage and was shocked by the accusations.
SO why didn't she say in her statement that she is shocked, she cannot believe it etc. Instead of apologising to the victims. Very strange.
I did not see that programme Pennyfarthing - but you are right! - what the wife of CF did/allowed and said, is not what I would call the norm
The "norm"........ :o
Not sure there is a "norm" about finding out your dead husband had been raping young girls. Perhaps she'd thought she had a good and happy marriage and was shocked by the accusations.
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I personally would not think inviting a 14 year old girl into my and my husbands bed " normal" but then maybe I am odd and don't realise it ..
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Maybe " the norm" was not a good description " acceptable" would have been more apt..
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All this is speculation which in turn leads to finger pointing.
I don't know where all these bedroom stories have come from but I could make a good guess.
Certain newspaper are 10% facts and 90% speculation. This leads to upset and damage.
I for one and think an 89 year old widow has enough to deal with, with these revelations, without having to deal with media tital tatal.
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They had an 'open marriage' apparently and she knew that the girl was alone with him. :-\ - there was a whole page in The Telegraphy this week :sigh:.
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Oh well it must be true then ::)
It's lucky newspapers don't prosecute people, we would all be in jail.
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:-\
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All this is speculation which in turn leads to finger pointing.
I don't know where all these bedroom stories have come from but I could make a good guess.
Certain newspaper are 10% facts and 90% speculation. This leads to upset and damage.
I for one and think an 89 year old widow has enough to deal with, with these revelations, without having to deal with media tital tatal.
ITs not media tittle tattle breeze. The woman who was abused as a child was on TV the other night on a special programme where she was interviewed in depth, by, I think Julia Somerville. She went into much detail and they returned to the house and she was able to identify (from the street) all the rooms etc. Why don't you watch it on catch up and see for yourself?
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You have misunderstood my post. I am just concerned that his widow will be the focus of accusations because the alleged abuser is dead.
It's already happening on this thread.
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http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3647464/How-Clement-Freud-raped-m-CERTAIN-knew-happened-Maddie-Tortured-victim-groomed-paedophile-MP-age-14-says-wouldn-t-surprised-linked-disappearance.html
From today's news
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She was complicant ……….. no one 'normally' leaves a young girl in bed with her husband alone :-X. Particularly if the child wasn't related ……….
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Spelling error ::) - we went into our parents' beds until we were 10, I went into my aunt and uncle first thing in the morning as they helped raise me ………. but what has been said by the 'victim' seems to suggest it wasn't what normal parenting would consider 'usual'.
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None of us were there and we only have one side of the story.
I for one am not going to judge an 89 year old widow.
I don't have the right OR the information to do this.
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We obviously cannot ( should not) always believe everything that is printed in the papers/media - but in this instance there appears to be sufficient evidence to suggest there is truth in what has been reported...Particularly as the woman that alleged to having being the abused was interviewed on tv & the wife of CF was apparently present or aware when it all happened...
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I am not desputing the obvious facts of the case, but only the implication that his widow is somehow to blame.
As far as I can see there is no evidence for that, nor has it been implied by the victim.
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I am not sure if she is being " blamed" as such!! - but there is speculation and suspicion that she knew or maybe could have been aware of her husbands unacceptable behaviour .. It has been known for people to turn a blind eye - there were plenty that did just that whilst Jimmy Savile were alive ...
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Speculation can be a very dangerous thing. Many an innocent person has been tainted by associaction.
I prefer to wait for the facts.
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I agree Breeze " speculation " can be a very dangerous thing - but then so can " turning a blind eye" - whatever the outcome, facts/proven or not etc people get damaged,hurt and have to live with it..
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This may/not be pursued by the Prosecution Service.
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Err, what. How an earth can you prove what someone knew or did not know nearly 6 decades ago.
Also, what would be the charge. Naivety or trusting your husband :o
Wow bring on the thought police.
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This may/not be pursued by the Prosecution Service.
Which case are we talking about here?
The one against Mr or Mrs Freud?
Whoever it is, If the Prosecution Service do persue any case one would hope they are in full possession of the facts.
Gosh, they might even have more available to them than the Daily Mail had.
Mrs Freud is in her late 70s don't think she raped anybody.
She may have been naive but leave her alone for goodness sake.
I believe it said she was 89 Hasty.
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I have just finished watching the second part of the prog on CF which I recorded. One of his alleged victims had kept letters he had written to her when she was very young telling her he loved her etc. They were shown on camera and were on official House of Commons stationery.
They also traced friends and relatives of the alleged victims who backed up their stories.
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:thankyou: PF
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No one can physically prove that they have been raped/abused years ago - but the fact & reality is it does and has happened many times.. People kept quiet for fear of retribution & a variety of other reasons/circumstances ..There are also those that cry rape/abuse and claim it happened when it did not, or was consensual .... Of course its not always possible to have facts or proof in these cases/situations and its one persons word against another - even harder to prove if the alleged offender is deceased ...In the case of CF ( as JS) it appears there has been enough evidence to prove they were guilty of inappropriate acts with young ( non consenting) females ..... Maybe his wife was totally unaware, oblivious & maybe naively so - only she really knows and can answer that ....... I do sympathise with the genuine victims - but I also sympathise with the accused that are innocent and their families..
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Very balanced post booboo :great:
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My Meno brain does have its moments Breeze ::) - Sometimes it does not always convey/articulate in the way Intended..
Things said in text can be misread/ misconstrued - hence I don't post on FB or use twitter etc