Menopause Matters Forum
Menopause Discussion => Other Health Discussion => Topic started by: Justjules on February 20, 2016, 09:29:57 AM
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As per my post yesterday, went to see GP, told her couldn't cope with these side affects any longer (6 weeks) so she said to come off them. She said to do half a tablet but then said maybe 3/4 might be better. She gave me a few 2mg diazepam to help. I went on a site that somebody recommended about withdrawn and it said you need to taper very slowly e.g for at least six weeks even if you've only been on them a month. I was on Citalopram for years and did this with them but then I wasn't having such severe side affects and anxiety at that time. I am now getting myself in a state thinking I just couldn't cope with another 6 weeks of feeling this bad...how am I going to come of these without turning into a complete head Case?.. I wish I had gone with my instinct and never started them in the first place...I am crying now with the worry. I now have anxiety about the anxiety....anyone else managed to come off them a bit easier and any tips? What if I still don't feel right after I stop them? I am frightened they have done something to my whole system now that isn't reversible. I know I am probably catastrophising as usual but so sick of feeling so bad. X
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Justjules,
I was on Sertraline but hated them. When i asked for a change to Citalopram i was told i could go straight from one to the other. I don't know if it was the right advice but i was ok. Would you be able to go back on Citalopram if you still need an AD?
JG
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No, JG, I had to come off them a while ago as there are contraindications now with my betablockers, sotalol. I don't want another one as I am too frightened now of the side affects.
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Then you just need to take it slowly and deal with the effects as they happen. It may be much easier than you think. In fact the Sertraline may have made you feel worse. Use the diazepam on your worst days and take comfort in the fact you have them if you need them.
Keep us posted xx
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Sending my best wishes to you
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I hope so. Thanks ladies. X
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Friend was on them at higher dose and just stopped taking them with little problem other than a bit of light headed feeling and headache. My mum gradually cut her dose and was fine.
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You could try stopping them and seeing if there are awful feelings? It *WILL* get better!
I have never been warned not to take ADs with betablockas :-\ - do you get on OK with the one you take? Let us know how you get on?
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I was on sertraline for nearly 2 years, a long time ago when I had PND. I didn't like how it made me feel, robotic and wired all the time (though not nearly as anxious as before taking it).
When I told my GP I wanted to come off it, he just swapped me to Prozac as that is much easier to come off (due to its very long half life, I think).
He told me to stay on Prozac for 6 weeks then taper off over 4 weeks. But about 4 weeks in, I forgot to pack the Prozac when I went on holiday, so I just went cold turkey off them (not to be advised though). Head felt a bit buzzy, but otherwise no side effects.
A couple of years ago I tried Sertraline again when I first started getting anxiety and mood swings, thanks to peri. It made me feel 10 times worse, I felt I was losing my mind and my anxiety shot through the roof. I persevered with it for 4 weeks, but just couldn't stand it any longer so swapped to Amitriptyline which was lovely.
My GP admitted that some people can't tolerate Sertraline and it can exacerbate their anxiety.
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CKLD, it's only contraindications with certain betablockers and certain ADs which has come to light apparently. I happily took them together for the best part of 10 years on and off and now apparently it can cause (rare) reactions with heart rhythm or sudden death!! It's Citalopram and sotalol that don't mix.
Well asked the pharmacist for advice but she said do what GP said and there shouldn't be any probs but then someone on here recommended a website for withdrawal that is supposed to be good and it said only taper 10% every six weeks....at that rate I'd still be on them for months! I will keep on with the 3/4 tab for a few days then half. Thankfully, I was only up to the 50mg dose for two weeks or so. I can't believe that each day I've felt worse than the last, it's getting me down now.
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Just to reassure you Justjules that sertraline sent my anxiety through the roof, and made me feel so ill that I had to take time off work. I could only stick the side effects for 4 weeks before giving up.
But it didn't do any permanent damage to my brain chemistry, I can promise you. Although I totally understand you worrying that it might, as the side effects can feel so extreme and nasty. It did take a little while for the horrible 'echoes' of how horrible it had made me feel, though.
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Thanks GRL for that reassurance. I am feeling dreadful still, mainly in the mornings as all us anxious folk do, felt so ill when I woke up on Saturday morning I was going to drag myself to a&e because I didn't think anxiety could make you feel that bad but then yesterday just did a lot of 'self-talk' when I woke up and told myself it would pass eventually and I'd just have to get on with it until it does. I am in work today after a real effort to get up during the worst part of the anxiety and am only just now coming round after sitting here feeling awful all morning. Apart from the fact that I looked knackered because I haven't had a full night's sleep for 6 weeks since starting the Sertraline, everybody must think I'm okay.
What's really hurt me today and caused me to feel ill when I first got in was that the other secretary (who is also a younger friend of mine, who I have supported through various rough patches over the years) had been exchanging emails (I have access to her inbox and need to check stuff now and again but obviously she isn't aware of it, she has mine too) with another colleague in the office saying that I wasn't 'pulling my weight' at work and 'I'd better be careful' as nobody knew what I was doing all day as she was picking stuff up that I had apparently left...... I was really shocked and could have just run out. I thought, how dare they.....they have no idea how this last 6 weeks have been hell and that I have struggled in work, struggled to be here, especially last week when I felt so ill but because she was off on leave I daren't be off, and yes, I hold my hand up, probably haven't been as productive as usual but she only works 3 days a week and she doesn't know just what I have got done or been doing!!! I am furious. There's obviously been some sort of office conversation when I'm not in on a Friday but some of the facts she has said are simply not true. One of the girls in the other office asked could she pick up some typing as she was bored and had nothing to do and now they think this girl was picking it up because I couldn't be bothered. Thankfully, when I was really bad and in a state last week when they were all out and called HR up to speak to, they fully supported how I felt but this 'friend' doesn't know about this or how bad I was feeling. She had put in the email "oh she is a worrier, she constantly thinks she's got cancer - she needs to get back on her happy pills".....if only they knew the hell that was HA and this age. I only hope she never suffers like this.
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That is un-professional. :bang:
Is she aware that you can access her e-mails and why are you in a position to do so? Is anyone in HR able to access company messages, if so then ask them to have a look-see. Point out that they need to deal with this type of office gossip and if the facility is available, should be checking each e-mail on a daily basis?
If you don't get any joy with HR then confront the person concerned. Take her out for a coffee on neutral ground? explain how ill you have been and thank her for supporting you whilst you have been poorly. See what her reaction is, at the very least she should blush and bluster.
Does HR at your place of work request Medical Reports from GPs? The Company for which I worked did so if a person was off sick for longer than 12 weeks.
:bighug:
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Yes, I am in a position to access her emails, and she can mine. We are both the secretaries to the employment team and sometimes one of the lawyers will ask us to check if something has been sent so we need access to each other's inboxes. I suppose the only thing they would say is that I shouldn't be looking at ones that don't concern me....so maybe I would be the one in trouble.
Not sure about medical report access by HR. HR know I have been to the drs etc.
To be honest CKLD, I can't cope with the extra stress at the moment with feeling so bad already.
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As hard as it is JJ, you would be better just to ignore this. Sometimes people don't realise that what they are saying is as hurtful as it is, and I do think that unless you've experienced mental illness yourself , it is easy to think that we can just snap out of it.
Take your time and think of yourself. Your job can wait and you have explained to HR what is happening so that is the important stuff done.
Xx
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I have used homeopathy for years now and started using after having to come off citalopram many years ago after the birth of my son. Because I couldn't sleep and was still emotional after finishing them they changed my thinking totally. They worked and I have used homeopathy for myself and my family for many years now. They have sorted me out with many physical and emotional issues. Have taken then in peri but can't get them to make me produce oestrogen so that's been a bummer!
They are good for detoxing and putting your reproductive system back in order and settling you down. Have felt safer over the years handing my health over to this type of treatment than medical as it allows me to be in control and not at the mercy of something else.
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Funnily enough Kate, I was seeing a homeopath before I had my meltdown pre-Christmas but because I missed a couple of appointments because she was unwell herself, I then got worse so went off to Drs and got the ADs..... I think I will be going down that route after this to re-balance me because although improvement was slow, it was beginning to work I think.
Coldethyl, I know you're right - I just typed out the 'feelings' at lunch time and deleted them so felt better for at least getting them out. They're just ignorant and not worth any more stress. I am just disappointed because this is the second time this has happened at work with this 'friend'.
x
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This is bullying in the workplace. When you feel better maybe then confront this 'friend'; however, hopefully she is now 'off' your C.mas card list ;)
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It shouldn't have to be a long process homeopathy. I use someone who doesn't stick to classic homeopathy which can be slow using small doses. Check round for someone who uses LM and M potencies that will probably indicate their range of training. Homepathy is big in India and Germany so there are loads of diverse training and ways of administering the remedies. I have had overnight changes before.
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I will check Kate but she is a lecturer in homeopathy at the local uni too and seems to be well respected from what I've heard.
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I know this is gonna sound odd but I would never have acupuncture (which I've had for 20 yrs) from anyone trained through modern teaching systems they just seem to be modern versions tailored to suit the masses.
However that's not saying she doesn't know her stuff it's just that some people stick to classical diagnosis and it gives it a bad name in my opinion. I Had one of these types first and although it worked in some areas it didn't do in others and I found him unable to diverse. My homeopath I have had now for 11 years is much more diverse and has helped me at very difficult times in my life. Hope you get sorted . I'm always handing out remedies to family and friends!
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Kate, not sure I understand what you mean - I always thought that if they had the proper accreditations and belonged to the correct society of medical herbalists/acupuncturists or homeopaths registers in England and Wales and not just done it through some 1 year diploma etc. that these were the 'okay' ones so what makes your guy different - is it the way he has studied or has he studied in another country etc? Hope you don't mind me asking. x
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I would ask the same question. Acupuncture is acupuncture, hypnotherapy is hypnotherapy - homeopathy is ……… :-X
I couldn't tolerate acupuncture, it hurt too much. :'(. My Boss told me that I am not a suitable candidate for hypnotherapy so refused to 'do' any for me.
How do you feel this morning?
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Really bad again first thing. Got myself up and sorted for work and was determined to do without a diazepam but crumbled before I got out of the house because I felt so anxious and ill. Managed to drive to daughters 5 mins away as she then drives us to work and was in the middle of a panic attack of some sort but thought I'd be okay when I got to work. Takes me ages to 'calm down' once I get here and feel able to cope with the rest of the day. This is awful. I have read all sorts of scare stories during my lunch break about the bloomin withdrawals and was upset last night as the Pharmacist said I would need to withdraw slowly over 4 weeks! I've only been on the damned things 6!!! I am supposed to be going away to Spain for a nice 6 day break in the middle of March and now panicking that I won't be well enough to go as the flight is early morning - right when I am at my worst :'( I am not a good flyer at all so unless there is some miracle between now and then, it looks like I won't be going and I'm cross. I can't bear the thought of feeling like this for another 4 weeks....apparently, as you lower the dose as well, the worse the anxiety withdrawal is.
Strangely, I have woken up around 2:00am restless but feeling fine then drop off only to wake up again as usual around 5:00am feeling absolutely awful - why is it always that time and doesn't affect me earlier??? I am seriously fed up.
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Its like any thing in life you get good ones and not so good ones! Plenty of posts on here about no so good doctors!
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I would imagine that the panicky wake up at 5 is probably related to rising cortisol levels which everyone gets to get then up and going in morning, but when you are stressed they can be anxiety provoking as our levels are higher.
I don't think it's helping you reading horror stories online. Few people who get better quickly, come off quickly and have no side effects bother to post on forums. They are busy just getting on and enjoying life. You have to help your recovery by not doing these things - that way your high levels of stress hormones can come down a bit and you won't be reliant on Valium every day. It is hard and we all have really bad days ( I was sobbing all Friday evening for no apparent reason) but we can get better - if you keep thinking what if about your holiday, you will make it harder to cope for yourself. Just think that you will deal with it nearer time as you may feel much better by then anyway xx
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Hello Justjules.
I'm sorry you are having a rough time and you have my sympathy. I thought I'd tell you that I have the same problem with anxiety in that if I wake at night I'm always calm but come the start of the day I'm a flushing, quivering wreck. There's clearly some sort of chemical surge going on and like you I'm seriously fed up with it.
Sorry I can't be of help but sending hugs.
K.
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:thankyou: Coldethyl …… I always forget about the cortisol levels >:(.
JJ - STOP googling ! your situation is totally different to anyone else's. You won't need to take too long to wean off and so what if you do? you'll already be feeling more in control - been there, done it, survived! ;-). I felt awful initially until I realised that I didn't become any worse each day and that the drop off dosage side effects didn't last any longer than 36 hours. PHEW!
What you fear is rubbish! why would you feel worse? You may find that original symptoms creep back but you won't feel worse! You probably feel awful right now because the holiday is in the back of your mind: been there too :sigh: your GP can give you something to ease flight-related anxiety.
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First slightly better morning in a long while today thank goodness. Woke up without the awful adrenaline rush (still got it around 5:00am but told it to sod off...). Only needed half a diazepam to get out of the house and apart from having little energy sat here at work, feel a bit better so hopefully on the way back up. Managing to eat as well after all these weeks of bananas and soup.
CKLD, I am my own worst enemy with the Googling, I know. I only 'look' to see if there's any 'advice' and then embroiled in the awful details and side affect stories.....
Coldethyl, I am doing my Mindfulness as much as I can and my deep breathing ;)
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Little steps!
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I'm sure you will give up totally on the sertraline, but I would like to say it made me much worse anxiety wise in the first few weeks but once it settles in it works so well. Psych Drs know that if they make you worse to start it is a sign it will work well ultimately.
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All the best with your medication. I was the opposite, mine worked well to start and now, after three months, has started causing me trouble.
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Sorry to hear that BJ - you take Citalopram don't you? I was great with that for many years.
I am still reducing the Sertraline - down to 25mg again but oh boy, what an awful day I've had at work - I feel like somebody pulled my plug out and let all the energy out of my body. Started yesterday when I got home from work, was fit for nothing and it's been the same today and I've been stupidly busy and kept having to eat something to keep my energy up. Resorted to a valium at lunch time as I felt wired as well.
Fed up with it all now. My therapist said I am suffering from adrenal fatigue with being stressed for so long so has recommended loads of supplements and a diet but it's going to take a while I think. I wish I could just book into a nice hotel for a month and just chill out!!!
Are you sure it's the ADs that are making you worse?
x
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can't think what else it could be. Side effects have returned and are cancelling out any benefit I had. Seeing my GP next week so will see what he says.
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Well had the worst day so far with the Sertraline. Sobbed all the way home from work in the car as I had to hold it in all day. Only dropped slowly to 25mg for last two or three days but this week, especially today, has been dreadful. Blood sugar dipping constantly, terrible agitation....have never typed so fast! Took a Valium on way home land one this morning but only got 5 left and terrified won't be able to have any more. See GP on Monday. They are the only thing that calm me down. Sat in loo at work deep breathing for 5 mins. Just don't know what to do. I am so frightened of the tablets now and how I am going to get off them. I have had anxiety in the past but this is much worse and different. I wish I could just have a proper course of Valium for a couple of weeks like I have in the past just to settle everything instead of just taking one here and there. Like my Mum said, 2mg doesn't do much. I can't feel like this much longer without some relief. I've been bad now since 11th January when I started the damned tablets. Any suggestions? All the relaxation stuff isn't doing anything.
Thanks. X
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Sorry things are so bad at the minute. I think the problem with taking a longer course of Valium is addiction issues aside, that you become psychologically addicted to them too and never deal with the issues that are affecting you. Anxiety is a bully and at the minute, you are paying the bully every day with a Valium here and there in the hope he'll go away but sadly, this only makes you feel less capable of dealing with stuff and reinforces the belief that you can't cope on your own. Some of the rubbishy symptoms will be the withdrawal but I'd bet that a lot of if is your own mind adding fear upon fear. We all do it- I'm having a rubbish few days with migraines and because I have a big party to organise next week I'm worrying if I'll be ok , if it will get better etc .. All this is doing is making my head worse and my worry bigger so I've come to bed to do some meditation. I think you have to just keep muddling on some days - if my head hurts next weekend it will be rubbish but I can try my best not to add to its chances - similarly, you may feel moe anxious until this is out of your system but fighting it will only make it worse. Where are you at with your therapy referral? X
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Coldethyl, i know what you mean about the dependency but it just gets to the point that nothing works to calm me down. It won't seem to pass on its own no matter what I do to distract it and yes, then I get into an even worse fear cycle I suppose. I have been in an anxious state in the past but never experienced the 'wired' feeling with so much agitation and then the shaky jitters and the speedy drop in blood sugar. I get worried that it is harming my body so adds to more worry. I am on the list for some more CBT but it could be months. In the meantime I carry on with my hypno NLP lady but it's bankrupting me!
Sorry you are also having a rubbish time with headaches. Hope you feel better soon.
X
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Have you had your blood sugars checked as a lot of your symptoms sound like what I get like when mine have gone low ( I am a diabetic) - it's always worth getting the basic bloods done if your feel anxious as thyroid , low iron and diabetes amongst other things can give you symptoms of anxiety like shaking, breathlessness, sweating and agitation.
I know what you mean about feeling wired as that is how my anxiety was over Christmas which I am putting down to to a downward shift in my oestrogen levels as I the day sweats took over at that time too. I took a couple of Valium over two days then and that was enough to let me regroup - I'm very reluctant to have them as my mum was hospitalised for withdrawal when I was a teenager because long term use had caused her more problems than the initial anxiety. I think part of your problem is that you have just got into a downward spiral of fear so are expecting to feel shocking as you come off and are scanning yourself for symptoms - we all do that when we are anxious but it is just adding to your anxiety tenfold - if you think back a few weeks , it was all your heart, then your pancreas , and now it's the effects of withdrawal that are consuming your thoughts. There is no easy answer other than to just try and relax and take one minute at a time - it will pass out of your system and then you can see what was the medication and what is you and your thought processes. It is hard and I wish we were all further along the road or recovery than we are, but we have to keep taking tiny steps even when things seem impossible.
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Hi Coldethyl. Had full bloods done the other month....all okay. Sugar level checked too last year. It's only been since the Sertraline and it does say that it's one of the side affects. Yes, you're right, I do concentrate on the feelings I get too much...too over sensitive to sensations that others would take as nothing to worry about, or so my daughter tells me, she's right really. I have never liked taking meds of any sort as I have always had a fear of side affects so this Sertraline has really got to me. Yes, my mum too was hooked on a Valium type drug when I was a teenager as they used to give them out like sweets in those days but she got herself off them and was saved by HRT she says.
Ah well, just have plod on and ride it out a day at a time like you say.
How is your headache now? Hope you are feeling a bit better.
X
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Headache slowly improving. I got myself in a pickle over it as it is ages since I've had such a bad migraine so of course stupid thoughts come in.. Stroke, brain tumour and so on. When I was seeing my CBT therapist she used to make me hyperventilate with her and she got exactly the same symptoms as me but she just attributed them to the biochemical blood imbalance caused by hyperventilating whereas I thought angina heart attack, stroke, MS and so on. It's partially why books on OCD often ask you to ask other people what they do/experience so you can build up a picture of what is normal.
I think that we have to learn that our bodies won't feel the sane as we did at 20 and before we became sensitised to their every twitch. Our hormone levels have altered so it is important that we do things like relaxation and good diet etc to help support ourselves. I seem to recall that you are post menopausal.. Would it be worth trying HRT if you'd rather not try any more ADs or are there reasons you can't?
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Good. Headaches are the one thing I don't seem to get thankfully but when I do yes, always has to be the worst possible thing of course. Yes, suppose we are going to get more and more strange aches and twinges as we age now...I am going to concentrate on sorting out some good supplements and a diet after talking to my therapist today and instead of reading books, do something that it suggests will work instead of just going on to the next book to see what that suggests. I have decided to take next week off and have a rest and give myself some headspace I think while I am having the withdrawals. X
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Sometimes if I've taken ADs for a few weeks I need a break of 24 hours because my head feels achy and woozy ::)
BJ - do you need to up the ADs for a few days? That's how I manage any 'low' feelings.